Brexit discussion thread IV

trellheim

Farage is elected - as an MEP ( ironically enough I grant you, but IS an elected representative). PS if the UK has a transition they'll have to decide what to do with the MEPs

breatheme

If the UK has a transition they better not get MPs. I'm sick of paying Farage to do nothing in Brussels.

Peregrinus

trellheim wrote: »

Farage is elected - as an MEP ( ironically enough I grant you, but IS an elected representative). PS if the UK has a transition they'll have to decide what to do with the MEPs

This is already decided. The UK will not be represented by MEPs during the transition. UK MEPs will leave the Parliament on Brexit Day (29 March 2019).

If the Article 50 period is extended, however, then the UK will be entitled to MEPs until whatever the new Brexit Day is. And that could be a problem, since European Parliament elections are due in May 2019.

Dymo

breatheme wrote: »

If the UK has a transition they better not get MPs. I'm sick of paying Farage to do nothing in Brussels.

That has to be a huge problem even legally.

ArthurDayne

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/aug/28/theresa-may-says-a-no-deal-brexit-wouldnt-be-the-end-of-the-world

Theresa May has played down David Hammond's warnings about a No-Deal Brexit, saying that it "would not be a walk in the park [...] but it would't be the end of the world".   

I think it speaks volumes of the shambles which is Brexit that its success / failure is being pegged to the standard of "the end of the world".  But this has been one of the principal Brexiteer tactics since the referendum -- if you set the bar at 'apocalypse' then anything can be considered a success.  The sharp devaluation of the Pound was one of the best examples:  "About time the Pound was devalued to stimulate exports!" bellowed the Brexiteers.  Yet when Mark Carney's speech caused a slight devaluation (which in Brexiteer World had previously been a good thing), he was decried as the 'High Priest of Project Fear'.  It's a depressing tactic which even more depressingly does seem to still be fooling a lot of people.

J Mysterio

'Wow'! Theresa May says the UK has secured a deal with six African countries... using the exact same terms that the EU has with them.

For one, I thought they could not conclude trade deals untill after Brexit and for two, the African countries are obviously not the strongest negotiators.

Nevertheless, hardly an amazing achievement considering that they have managed to 'keep one tiny portion of all the trade deals they are currently expectes to lose out on.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/theresa-may-uk-post-brexit-trade-deal-africa-visit-cape-town-leave-eu-a8510761.html

I don't expect many other nations to be so generous.

breatheme

The problem the UK will find when actually implementing those deals (if they ever do) is the rules of origin. They will have to move a lot of manufacturing back to the UK, and it is actually like that the opposite will happen: manufacturing will try its best to contain its supply chains within the EU.

If you had the stomach to read Chequers (I did on a long train ride) one of the (again, laughable) points it included was to treat goods made largely in either the UK or the EU as having the same origin. Again, cake. They can't have that if they're leaving.

Nody

J Mysterio wrote: »

'Wow'! Theresa May says the UK has secured a deal with six African countries... using the exact same terms that the EU has with them.

Not the exact same terms; May had to pony up 4 billion pounds for the countries to agree that UK can have same deal as EU after Brexit. These six countries has a total GDP of Poland as comparison and will offer no new access for UK companies compared to today...

It's all a very expensive PR move.

jm08

EU solidarity over the Irish Border situation reaffirmed again by Swedish minister on visit to London.

She also said the EU would not be dropping its insistence that there had to be a decision on Ireland before an overall withdrawal agreement.

“I have been to all the European affairs council meetings and the question of Ireland is there every time and every time people are united about this. We are very unified,” she said.

It will be raised again when the EU 27 meet in Salzburg on 18 September, she added.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/aug/28/irish-border-question-must-be-solved-by-uk-not-eu-says-sweden

serfboard

trellheim wrote: »

Farage is elected - as an MEP ( ironically enough I grant you, but IS an elected representative).

Yep - on a (UK) turnout of 36%.

Mind you, the turnout in Europe as a whole wasn't much better at 43%. Which, to me, explains why you get so many Eurosceptics and Far-right extremists in the EP - "The best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity" - to quote WB Yeats.

ancapailldorcha

One-liners deleted.

trellheim

The pilot schemes for registration for EU nationals are up and running. Irish nationals currently do not have to apply for registration but can do so if they wish ( although at 65 quid a go its a bit eye watering )

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45330727

and

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/status-of-eu-nationals-in-the-uk-what-you-need-to-know

Water John

The ITV Correspondent travelling with May in SA, suggested today at the end of his piece that, May was on the wrong Continent.
Basically time for her to be at home, solving the EU question.

trellheim

trellheim wrote: »

The pilot schemes for registration for EU nationals are up and running. Irish nationals currently do not have to apply for registration but can do so if they wish ( although at 65 quid a go its a bit eye watering )

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45330727

and

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/status-of-eu-nationals-in-the-uk-what-you-need-to-know

Seems cheap relatively to me to hedge against the risk of the UK Gov ****ing things up even worse for us here.

Imreoir2

Deleted User wrote: »

Seems cheap relatively to me to hedge against the risk of the UK Gov ****ing things up even worse for us here.

If all EU nationals in the UK register, it would raise 1/4 Billion for the UK government. Maybe that is the Brexit dividend May keeps talking about?

LeinsterDub

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Seems cheap relatively to me to hedge against the risk of the UK Gov ****ing things up even worse for us here.

Did you included the risk the UK government uses the list against in your hedging calculations?

Dymo

This African trade deal is going to give all Brexiters so much hope, there's going to be no stopping them now.

I can't wait for the express headline tomorrow, ignore all the facts about the deal.

An Ciarraioch

In light of the UK debate of immigration, interesting to note that our annual figures on the matter were published today - 62% of arrivals in the last 12 months have a third-level education, so whether that differs compared with the UK is unclear, but evidently Ireland is succeeding in attracting the most-skilled immigrants:

https://cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/er/pme/populationandmigrationestimatesapril2018/

Rhineshark

An Ciarraioch wrote: »

In light of the UK debate of immigration, interesting to note that our annual figures on the matter were published today - 62% of arrivals in the last 12 months have a third-level education, so whether that differs compared with the UK is unclear, but evidently Ireland is succeeding in attracting the most-skilled immigrants:

https://cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/er/pme/populationandmigrationestimatesapril2018/

Two years ago at least, the UK had the highest proportion of third-level educated EU immigrants in the EU at over 50%. Ireland was second at 44%.

An Ciarraioch

Rhineshark wrote: »

An Ciarraioch wrote: »

In light of the UK debate of immigration, interesting to note that our annual figures on the matter were published today - 62% of arrivals in the last 12 months have a third-level education, so whether that differs compared with the UK is unclear, but evidently Ireland is succeeding in attracting the most-skilled immigrants:

https://cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/er/pme/populationandmigrationestimatesapril2018/

Two years ago at least, the UK had the highest proportion of third-level educated EU immigrants in the EU at over 50%. Ireland was second at 44%.

Just found the Telegraph article here:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/08/mapped-how-britain-has-the-highest-level-of-skilled-migration-in/

Leroy42

I thought the UK could not negotiate any trade deals until after they left?

Sam Russell

Leroy42 wrote: »

I thought the UK could not negotiate any trade deals until after they left?

But is it a trade deal? I think it looks like foreign aid.

Sassygirl1999

Sam Russell wrote: »

But is it a trade deal? I think it looks like foreign aid.

it does look like foreign aid yes I agree
Definitely

Bit cynical

Peregrinus wrote: »

This is already decided. The UK will not be represented by MEPs during the transition. UK MEPs will leave the Parliament on Brexit Day (29 March 2019).

If the Article 50 period is extended, however, then the UK will be entitled to MEPs until whatever the new Brexit Day is. And that could be a problem, since European Parliament elections are due in May 2019.

Ireland appears to be pushing for an extension.

trellheim

Ireland appears to be pushing for an extension.

Ireland is not the country that must ask for one

J Mysterio

Bit cynical wrote: »

Ireland appears to be pushing for an extension.

The UK really need to hand in their homework, but they still haven't quite understood the lesson, despite the cheatsheet being provided to them.

Bit cynical

trellheim wrote: »

Ireland is not the country that must ask for one

Stricktly speaking, anyone can ask for one; it just needs agreement from all member states including the UK. In practice, assuming the UK won't do the asking, Ireland would approach Barnier and other member states and try to get consensus among the EU27. Having done this, Barnier would then request the extension from the UK.

Infini

Bit cynical wrote: »

Ireland appears to be pushing for an extension.

The only thing the government have said is that they'd be in favour of it if the UK requested it and if they had a realistic chance of an agreement or resolution if they did.

J Mysterio

Damning lead story on Independent UK website



https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/uk-trade-deal-africa-theresa-may-trip-post-brexit-eu-rollover-a8511871.html

Nate--IRL--

Of those countries, South Africa was Britain’s largest trade partner in 2017, buying £2.4bn worth of exports, followed by Namibia (£39m), Botswana (£24m) and Mozambique (£11m). Lesotho and Swaziland purchased less than a million pounds worth of exported goods from Britain each.

But it's going to cost.... :drumroll:

Speaking in Cape Town, the prime minister announced an additional £4bn of UK investment in African economies, with the hope of further match investment from the private sector to come.

Farcical.

Nate