A/R/Tist in the Spotlight - Swashbuckler

kerrylad1

Question 1,I see you played soccer in Limerick,what team and level did you play at.what position,and we're you any good.Question 2,you run out the ul bank,did you ever have to jump in a bush to empty the Bowl'sQuestion 3,if there was one race,you could go back in time,and win a gold for Ireland what race would it be.

Swashbuckler

adrian522 wrote:

I guess I must just be lazy and most other runners I know must be lazy too.

It saddens me that out of everything you've read in this chat that's the conclusion you've come to. And that skyblue liked it? Was the point of this thread completely missed?

skyblue46

Ah now don't be like that. I've maintained a view all through this debate that some people are restricted by natural ability be that 50 mins or 45. Murph saying every reasonably fit bloke can do a 4 hour marathon is something I agree with...a 35 min 10k I think is going a bit far. I've not been behind the bush about what I think. Some people can do 35, others will not no matter how perfect their training plan is.

skyblue46

Also the topic kept the 3 of us engaged for quite a bit of our run this morning :pac:

Swashbuckler

skyblue46 wrote:

Ah now don't be like that. I've maintained a view all through this debate that some people are restricted by natural ability be that 50 mins or 45. Murph saying every reasonably fit bloke can do a 4 hour marathon is something I agree with...a 35 min 10k I think is going a bit far. I've not been behind the bush about what I think. Some people can do 35, others will not no matter how perfect their training plan is.

I never suggested anyone was lazy. I interpreted from the original question that what was implied was how much does talent play in me reaching a really fast time and my point was it doesn't and anyone who's willing to work hard will get there. Given enough time I think 35 is achievable for most people. But anyway it has been taken up differently. So be it.

Swashbuckler

ariana` wrote:

Thanks P & S for the great debate! Some interesting angles from both of you (ever the diplomat i am ). As you rightly identified the question was two-fold - some runners just seem to make it look easier to make gains or to take long breaks when the weather isn't favourable for example and then pick up where they left off. I took a break when i had my last baby, the "baby" who is now 3 and loves telling me he not a baby, and i'm still eating the dust of my friend who i had been faster than prior to taking that break

Thanks Ariana. Yeah some runners are just lucky that the gains come quick. I'm not sure if I'm one of those haha. I've had the blessing of personalized coaching in the last 9 months so that has helped. It definitely helps to have specific tailored advice along the way. Stick with it though. I can see the gains you've made and they'll continue to come. Tough days like the ten miler you had yesterday will stand to you in the long term.

ariana` wrote:

And the other thought behind the question you hit on below... and i appreciate the encouraging replies. Some times it feels like a slog to see results, thankfully an enjoyable slog most of the time

Yeah definitely a slog sometimes. One piece of advice or comment I'd have here is that the people I know who do a lot of interval training and sessions seem to find it a leas of a slog. The people I know that do those long marathon blocks find it more sloggish. Haha

Swashbuckler

kerrylad1 wrote:

Question 1,I see you played soccer in Limerick,what team and level did you play at.what position,and we're you any good.Question 2,you run out the ul bank,did you ever have to jump in a bush to empty the Bowl'sQuestion 3,if there was one race,you could go back in time,and win a gold for Ireland what race would it be.

No level whatsoever. Company team as well as night owls and five a side. Played with Regional B for a while. That was the second last ankle twist. Played on the wing and central midfield. Was OK but nothing special. A hard worker for the team.

Haha no.. Never... I've never had a bowel mishap on a run.

London Olympics 2012 10k. Just to spoil the Mo Farah party.

kerrylad1

Swashbuckler wrote: »

No level whatsoever. Company team as well as night owls and five a side. Played with Regional B for a while. That was the second last ankle twist. Played on the wing and central midfield. Was OK but nothing special. A hard worker for the team.

Haha no.. Never... I've never had a bowel mishap on a run.

London Olympics 2012 10k. Just to spoil the Mo Farah party.

Good honest answers as usual.I must change my diet,ha ha.I've the farmers fields here in ballyneety ruined.I was like urself,played 2a to 4b.But I was useless.

skyblue46

Swashbuckler wrote: »

I never suggested anyone was lazy. I interpreted from the original question that what was implied was how much does talent play in me reaching a really fast time and my point was it doesn't and anyone who's willing to work hard will get there. Given enough time I think 35 is achievable for most people. But anyway it has been taken up differently. So be it.

I interpreted the lazy comment as something tongue in cheek tbh.

I suppose the question of working hard is like how long is a piece of string.....in that different people will have different views on where hard begins.

skyblue46

kerrylad1 wrote: »

Good honest answers as usual.I must change my diet,ha ha.I've the farmers fields here in ballyneety ruined.I was like urself,played 2a to 4b.But I was useless.

Mental images I don't need to be seeing of a Sunday morning!

Swashbuckler

skyblue46 wrote:

I suppose the question of working hard is like how long is a piece of string.....in that different people will have different views on where hard begins.

I think we can all reach similar level. Some might take longer than others. Maybe that's where the talent lies. But Ill never limit myself with my goals. Low 30s for a 10k is a ridiculous target to be honest, but why not aim for it? Same applies to you or anyone. I don't make any excuses. I'll rarely miss a run and I'll work endlessly towards my goals. That's hard work. I could easily sit here and say the fast local lads are just naturally gifted. I'll never be as fast as them. But I won't. I'll work my ass off to reach their level.

Lazare

That was a great debate, well done all.

I know it's likely semantics but I think the idea of 'talent' is a myth. It's all genetics. Genetics is a spectrum, some people are born with adaptations that allow them to excel, at whatever field. Or rather, born with the tools to allow them excel.
The best sommeliers are born with an excellent sense of smell and taste, the best guitarists are born with rhythm. The best athletes are born with an excellent aerobic system. It all requires hard work though, which is also genetic.
The best are called talented, but in reality, they've just lucked out on the genetic lottery.


Genetics plays a role in everything.

Every one of us was born with above average running genes compared to the sedentary.

I agree with skyblue, we all have different glass ceilings, depending on where we fall on that above average genetic lottery spectrum.

Remember though, whether your glass ceiling is a 55 min 10k or a 4:30 marathon, most people's glass ceiling is the couch.

Murph_D

Another thing genetics gives you is form, body type, whether or not you are injury-prone - it all adds to how hard you can work, how your body reacts, how quickly you adapt and recover.

I don’t think the talent debate is a cop out - it’s being realistic, as is taking other variables like gender, age, etc into account when setting goals and measuring progress.

35m 10k is pushing it for the ordinary runner though. Duanington is resilient, works his ass off, has beautiful form, isn’t too ancient, and even he hasn’t got there yet!

Good discussion.

Swashbuckler

Lazare wrote:

Remember though, whether your glass ceiling is a 55 min 10k or a 4:30 marathon, most people's glass ceiling is the couch.

I genuinely don't think anyone has a glass ceiling of 55min 10k but I get your point.

Murph_D wrote:

35m 10k is pushing it for the ordinary runner though. Duanington is resilient, works his ass off, has beautiful form, isn’t too ancient, and even he hasn’t got there yet!

Davey had some bad luck in fairness. He'll be running 35min in his sleep this time next year all going well. Skyblue also has a 35min 10k in him. He just doesn't realise it yet. Haha

skyblue46

Haha...I realise it's possible. I do, and I will continue to work hard as long as I can. Not sure I can ever do too well on the lifestyle changes though. I also have to accept limits some of which are physical.

Huzzah!

The Sports Gene by David Epstein is a good book on the topic of nurture v nature.

Good thread, Swash. Thanks for taking the time to answer the questions posed.

Swashbuckler

Alas my time in the spotlight has come to an end. Cheers for all of the questions. I didn't think I'd get so much from this but it really got me thinking about a lot of stuff so thanks everyone. I'll be setting up a separate thread for the next victim..... Haha

skyblue46

Hey thanks for doing it. Great honest answers and plenty of details. You took it up a few levels from my Sunday supplement type one line answers! :pac:

Swashbuckler

skyblue46 wrote:

Hey thanks for doing it. Great honest answers and plenty of details. You took it up a few levels from my Sunday supplement type one line answers!

Cheers for nominating me. I got a lot out of it to be honest.

OOnegative

Excellent read all week, thanks for the honest and insightful answers.

ariana`

Absolutely excellent, thanks P.

kerrylad1

As said above.Thanks for this.

Swashbuckler

I meant to say before I finish up if anyone ever has any questions that they think I could help with feel free to ask on here or PM . I'm far from an expert but there I'll always have an opinion and I love helping people when it comes to running. Haha. So please don't hesitate.

Swashbuckler

Well I don't really intend on reopening the thread with this debate but....

1. My mentality is a very positive one so the source of the comment was coming from a "don't limit yourself" mindset.
2. Never have I ever said anyone is lazy. In fact my opinion is quite the opposite. I have nothing but admiration for people who get up off their ass every day to go running. My wife has often laughed at how I comment on random people running while we drive somewhere. Nothing but respect.
3. Disagree with my opinion all you want but you suggested I implied people were lazy. That's just plain wrong.
4. I'd suggest if you've been training for years and you're at 42mins for 10k then it's not because of lack of talent. It's for another reason.

Swashbuckler

Seems like the original comment I replied to has been deleted so please ignore

adrian522

Swashbuckler wrote: »

Well I don't really intend on reopening the thread with this debate but....

1. My mentality is a very positive one so the source of the comment was coming from a "don't limit yourself" mindset.
2. Never have I ever said anyone is lazy. In fact my opinion is quite the opposite. I have nothing but admiration for people who get up off their ass every day to go running. My wife has often laughed at how I comment on random people running while we drive somewhere. Nothing but respect.
3. Disagree with my opinion all you want but you suggested I implied people were lazy. That's just plain wrong.
4. I'd suggest if you've been training for years and you're at 42mins for 10k then it's not because of lack of talent. It's for another reason.

Fair enough. but to my mind 35 mins is top 5% in most races.

If it's not laziness and it's not lack of talent then what is it?

As I said I couldn't run 1km at 35 min pace, it's just way beyond my capabilities so I'm not sure if you believe that everyone is capable of that but id say you have a high degree of natural talent, more so than most.

You say 42 mins as if it's a poor time but I'm actually quite proud of it. I may take a few seconds off here and there but there is no way I will ever come close to 35 mins for 10k. That's just being realistic.

Swashbuckler

adrian522 wrote:

If it's not laziness and it's not lack of talent then what is it?

Could be any number of factors which I wouldn't comment on because I don't know you.

adrian522 wrote:

As I said I couldn't run 1km at 35 min pace, it's just way beyond my capabilities so I'm not sure if you believe that everyone is capable of that but id say you have a high degree of natural talent, more so than most.

I doubt it's beyound your capabilities. I was running 43min 10k January of last year. I font have a high degree of talent. I'm lucky that I have someone coaching me so pretty much all of my training is tailored. That's the main difference. Not talent.

adrian522 wrote:

You say 42 mins as if it's a poor time but I'm actually quite proud of it. I may take a few seconds off here and there but there is no way I will ever come close to 35 mins for 10k. That's just being realistic.

I didn't say it was a poor time. I don't understand how you keep getting these negative connotations from what I'm saying. Again, you're missing the point.

adrian522

I obviously am missing the point as I don't know what the point is.

I'll keep plugging away trying to chip the seconds away but there are very few people who can make the gains you've made or run those times . I'd call that talent but you obviously disagree.

Murph_D

Probably calls for a separate thread? It’s a good discussion to have, maybe worth widening out.

AuldManKing

Totally missed this and all the other recent interviewees

As for Swashbuckler - you watch Love Island.

I'm unfollowing you on Strava, taking you off my speed dial and removing your poster from my wall.

Swashbuckler

AuldManKing wrote:

As for Swashbuckler - you watch Love Island.

Ah you know, tis on in the background and I pay no attention to how Meghan and Wes are getting on as a couple. Haha

Back in Black

Completely missed this until now but really enjoyed reading through it over a mug of coffee. Very honest answers and fair play for doing it.