Are you well off?

theteal

I just don’t understand the car thing. What has that got to do with wealth? Is it a “showing off” thing to some degree? It’s a depreciating consumer product. It’s just meant to get you from A to B. Why people over pay thousands for that is beyond me. Do your homework and put an emphasis on reliability. We’ve got 2 cars, cost a sum total of £4400 (mine 4 years ago, wife’s last year), both over 10 years old and I would wager that both will exist for the guts of be next 10 years.

Anyway, just to get on topic. We’re doing ok, not concerned about money (not motivated by it either) but there’s definitely not a lot left in the kitty come end of the month. Main expenses are mortgage, childcare and train ticket (although that’ll be stopping soon, getting sick of the London commute, that ~£4K can go to better use). Everyone is healthy (my ACL still a bit iffy) and we have a right old giggle most of the time.

Malari

somefeen wrote: »

There's truth in that wibbs. I realised a while ago that rich people actually handle their money better.
If you come from a poor background most of the time your attitude towards money is warped.

.....

With that ingrained in you, as soon as you start earning decent money its spend spend spend.

I don't know...it's not true for me. I didn't come from a very poor background but my parents were definitely squeezed middle - earning just too much to qualify for any benefit but having to pay out a lot more on bills, etc in the long run. They worked hard and everything was budgeted for carefully.

I inherited that from them. In college I could make £100 last forever :pac: And I was surrounded by people from wealthy backgrounds on grants, who didn't have to think about money at all.

It took a while for me to get out of that mindset when I started earning. I paid off loans quickly and was always saving, even when I didn't know what I was saving for. My husband had to encourage me to occasionally buy a treat for myself as I always denied myself nice things out of habit!

We are comfortable now, but I've worked hard to get here. I don't mean long hours, but I'm diligent and I have a good work ethic. I care about my customers and that inspires the kind of loyalty that really helped the company in the recession.

Of course I'm very happy to have a nice house, a fast car, holidays and meals out, but I don't ever take for granted that my happiness really stems from family, love, health, fun and work-life balance.

Wibbs

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Is this an Irish thing?


Reading through the threads, cars seem to define Irish people.

Not just Ireland AV. Cars have long been seen as a moving and socially visible "marker of success" and to a large degree "freedom". They advertise status. In the early days it was often just by having one. At my maternal grandfather's funeral I remember an elderly neighbour telling me with some admiration that my grandfather "had the first car on the road", and this was in a "good" suburban area.

Without being extremely crass you can't just go around telling people of your faaaabulous wage, career, lifestyle, house, but a car can do that for you, though often just as crassly. They can be essentially jewellery on wheels for many. That's a little less in play today, what with so many cars out there, finance and pretty high status cars going for little enough on the used market(in the past they usually fell into rusty heaps by that stage). The latter is offset by reg plate snobbery, where people will beggar themselves to get that new year plate. Even if it means driving a "lesser" overall status car. EG buying a new Dacia instead of an old Mercedes. In the past even "supercars" could fall into this. I've a few car mags from the early 70's and in the small ads you can find five year old Ferraris for around the same price as a new specced up(has a radio ) Ford Cortina. Though in the 70's a five year old Ferrari was a mobile rust generating device so there's that.

It's a fascinating subject how the car became a status and fashion item in such a short time. And consumer and consumable item too. When the Ford Model T came along, the car of the people, one of the ad campaigns was "the only car you'll ever need". That didn't last long. Even though the cars being made of vanadium steel(which resists corrosion far better than basic steel) often did.

jimbobaloobob

Geuze wrote: »

Note that although the media keep saying self-employed don't qualify for any welfare payments, this is wrong, they can apply for JSA like any employed person.

I never knew that thank you

Frynge

Years and years ago I asked my grandfather how he made all his money and he told me that it was during the great depression in new York city when he had absolutely nothing left that he found a Nickle on the ground. He used that 5 cent coin to buy an apple and then spent the entire day polishing said apple so that at the end of the day he sold the apple for a dime.

The next day he bought two apples and polished all day long before selling them in the evening for two dimes.

He had repeated this process for a number of week and had amassed a fortune of $2.67.

Then his father in law died and left him six million dollars.

anewme

somefeen wrote: »

There's truth in that wibbs. I realised a while ago that rich people actually handle their money better.
If you come from a poor background most of the time your attitude towards money is warped.

If you give €200 euro to someone who's barely scraping by they're likely to blow it on something.
I reckon its because that money won't make a difference in the long run so you may as well get some luxury out of it that you wouldn't afford otherwise and continue scraping.
You need to spend extra money as soon as you get it because otherwise it just gets absorbed by all the necessities.

With that ingrained in you, as soon as you start earning decent money its spend spend spend.

I find the opposite is true, certainly in my experience.

I fiend some people have no value on money, especially if they've never struggled with money. When it's hard earned, people appreciate it more.

All this your health is your wealth etc is true but life is always easier when you don't have money troubles on top of everything else. Fears that your house could be taken, your family don't eat, red letters through the door , these are the type of things that push people over the edge. Don't forget how many people took their lives during the recession on account of money. It's not worth it, but when you're broke, it can be a dark dark place.

Being comfortable to me now is knowing whatever happens, the house is mine. If the boiler goes or something unexpected and it's 2k, so what, the rainy day fund is there. When you've been poor, knowing that you have that back up life so much easier.

Now when I say I've no money(coming up to month end) it means I can't afford to pay anything else this month and I'm not dipping into my savings as I've obviously overspent somewhere else, where before I've no money meant I've no money whatsoever and that's a scary place to be.

TheQuietFella

tempnam wrote: »

As the title says, are you well off? - i.e. are you comfortable, financially; do you have nice things like a big house, nice car, decent holidays every year, do you own property etc.?

If so, how did you get to your current situation?

Work, work, work and more work! No one else is going to do it for you!

Dakota Dan

Frynge wrote: »

Years and years ago I asked my grandfather how he made all his money and he told me that it was during the great depression in new York city when he had absolutely nothing left that he found a Nickle on the ground. He used that 5 cent coin to buy an apple and then spent the entire day polishing said apple so that at the end of the day he sold the apple for a dime.

The next day he bought two apples and polished all day long before selling them in the evening for two dimes.

He had repeated this process for a number of week and had amassed a fortune of $2.67.

Then his father in law died and left him six million dollars.

Hell on wheels, Thomas Durant quote?

Debtocracy

In Ireland, people need to communicate one of two things before saying they’re financially comfortable:

I came from a poor background (usually a harsh middle-class background)
I’m not flashy like my neighbour next door.

In other words, I’m well off but don’t criticise me because I used to be very poor and I’m very humble.

Avatar MIA

TheQuietFella wrote: »

Work, work, work and more work! No one else is going to do it for you!

Hah! Inheritance. The reason more than many would admit. :pac:

Avatar MIA

Wibbs wrote: »

Not just Ireland AV. Cars have long been seen as a moving and socially visible "marker of success" and to a large degree "freedom". They advertise status. In the early days it was often just by having one. At my maternal grandfather's funeral I remember an elderly neighbour telling me with some admiration that my grandfather "had the first car on the road", and this was in a "good" suburban area.

Without being extremely crass you can't just go around telling people of your faaaabulous wage, career, lifestyle, house, but a car can do that for you, though often just as crassly. They can be essentially jewellery on wheels for many. That's a little less in play today, what with so many cars out there, finance and pretty high status cars going for little enough on the used market(in the past they usually fell into rusty heaps by that stage). The latter is offset by reg plate snobbery, where people will beggar themselves to get that new year plate. Even if it means driving a "lesser" overall status car. EG buying a new Dacia instead of an old Mercedes. In the past even "supercars" could fall into this. I've a few car mags from the early 70's and in the small ads you can find five year old Ferraris for around the same price as a new specced up(has a radio ) Ford Cortina. Though in the 70's a five year old Ferrari was a mobile rust generating device so there's that.

It's a fascinating subject how the car became a status and fashion item in such a short time. And consumer and consumable item too. When the Ford Model T came along, the car of the people, one of the ad campaigns was "the only car you'll ever need". That didn't last long. Even though the cars being made of vanadium steel(which resists corrosion far better than basic steel) often did.

I get that. However, in Holland as one example, they don't particularly rate expenses cars. A relation of mine lives outside Amsterdam (seriously well off) and they consider fancy car owners, 'probably a drug dealer'.



They also ensure they don't use fancy bikes in Amsterdam because they know they'll be a target for robbery by drug addicts.



Maybe there's a lesson there and maybe they are more secure in themselves. Similar to the landed wealthy here where they'd often rock up in a dated land rover.



For the record I drive a fancy car, but because I love cars :pac:

Malari

Debtocracy wrote: »

In Ireland, people need to communicate one of two things before saying they’re financially comfortable:

I came from a poor background (usually a harsh middle-class background)
I’m not flashy like my neighbour next door.

In other words, I’m well off but don’t criticise me because I used to be very poor and I’m very humble.

In contrast to those who aren't as comfortable as they would wish but insist that anyone who is must have got help along the way, as per OP.

893bet

I think I am well off incomparison to most, academically, financially and personally.

Some self made but the reality is the opportunities only come most people ways due to their parents. Yeah a small percentage can make their own luck 100 % but I owe much of my luck to the hard work of my parents in facilitating my education.

Aglomerado

Think I'm doing ok. Single woman, decent wage, own house with a small mortgage I'm currently overpaying. 6 year old car. Some savings.
Public sector job so time off to go away for a holiday/ few nights/ gig/ spend time with family & friends is relatively easy to get.
Not interested in new cars on PCP or otherwise. But I don't laugh at those who are, if they enjoy having a 182 outside the door that's their enjoyment.
Probably a cliché but I value my free time more than money.

NeonCookies

Money is a definite struggle for us although we're housed and fed so lucky really. But I'm hopeful it won't always be this way. We worked abroad for a good few years early/mid 20s, in decent jobs so got a double whammy of fantastic life and work experience. Came back to Ireland to focus on our educations and just this week I've finished my doctorate.

Late 20s now, and starting to see people who worked solidly since graduating and have built decent salaries buy houses etc which we're nowhere near so it can feel like we're "behind" but I have to remind myself that everyone has different priorities. One friend did tell me that the only reason they were able to buy was that her partner got a sizeable inheritance, so there can definitely be factors that add to the perception of being well off.

Ms2011

I wouldn't say we are well off but we have some comforts.
We bought a doer upper for cash so we have no mortgage or rent expenses but there is always something to be done in the house.
We have 2 cars, one we own out straight, one on PCP.
We can live on one wage allowing me to stay at home with our 2 kids but we haven't been away on holiday since 2014.
Swings and roundabouts really, we wouldn't have money to throw around but we have everything we need.
As for your health being your wealth in this country you need wealth for your health learned that when I got sick last year.

Claw Hammer

I only live in a semi-D so am not well off. I know a lot of people who are well off, some got no help, paid for their own education after second level in a common or garden school and achieved prosperity through work and investment. Others got the helping hand along the way, private schools, paid for third level, assistance with getting established in business or profession, substantial inheritances to boot. For something well-off is an accident of birth, for others it is the fruits of hard work and investment. Nobody becomes well-off through work alone.

Viscount Aggro

In my area of Dublin, two parents pulling in 100K+ salaries is the norm.
Land Rovers are standard fare. Its "keeping up with the Jones" - who are they anyway?
I dont buy into all that south Dublin crap.
Having said that... if I lost my job tomorrow, it would have no affect on my lifestyle..

GreeBo

garv123 wrote: »

PCP and finance for cars lets lots of people look well off these days, when really they haven't a pot to piss in.

Id rather own a 13/14 car than overpay for a new one monthly

13/14?
Im "well off" and my nice car is a 3rd hand 09

monkeysnapper

GreeBo wrote: »

13/14?
Im "well off" and my nice car is a 3rd hand 09

Ha ha I read that and felt same .

My car has cruise control , aircon , rear sensors , looks like a brand new car and drives like a brand new car . ...bought for €2200 4 years ago ....living the dream!!!!!!!!!!

smurfjed

Hey I have a full time maid and gardener, does that make me "well off" or just lazy?

Roger_007

smurfjed wrote: »

Hey I have a full time maid and gardener, does that make me "well off" or just lazy?

Is that one person or two?

smurfjed

Two

Avatar MIA

smurfjed wrote: »

Hey I have a full time maid and gardener, does that make me "well off" or just lazy?

Yeah, yeah.... let us know when you're well off enough to support a mistress!

Pac1Man

I bought some asparagus today.

Avatar MIA

Pac1Man wrote: »

I bought some asparagus today.

Wee know, can smell it from here.

smurfjed

let us know when you're well off enough to support a mistress!

Get married to someone half you age plus a couple and it removes the need for a mistress

Pac1Man

Pac1Man wrote: »

I bought some asparagus today.

When you move up to avocado on toast, let us know.

mariaalice

Who was it that said the definition of wealth is not having to look at the price of the wine in a restaurant.

We're grand but its just the natural flow of life you become better off the children are grown up and gone, no mad mortgage and so on.

mariaalice

Pac1Man wrote: »

I bought some asparagus today.

Pasta primavera is very nice made with fresh asparagus.

jester77

Being well off for me is not just a monetary value. I would say I am lucky in the sense that I never have to worry about paying bills.

I would consider myself well off when it comes to the time I can spend with my family. I have a well paying job close to home with zero stress, lots of time off and lots of flexibility regarding hours I work and where I work: office, home or some random remote place on the other side of the world. I could get a better paying job but the extra workload is not worth my personal time or energy.

Cina

Considering that buying a new car is probably one of the worst financial decisions you can feasibly make, I'd say most people who do so aren't wealthy.

Beasty

[Deleted User] wrote: »

When you move up to avocado on toast, let us know.

Just finished some of that

I've more dogs than I have debt

I've more cats than dogs

I've more cars than cats

I've more houses than cars

I've more bikes than houses (although I stopped counting them when I got into double figures (bikes, not houses!))

Oh and I have as many World Cup winners medals as I have houses. That's one house and one WC winners medals for each child, so they are likely to be well off in due course

Cina

Cina wrote: »

Considering that buying a new car is probably one of the worst financial decisions you can feasibly make, I'd say most people who do so aren't wealthy.

Mmmmm

€40k car new will depreciate maybe €20k over the first 3 years, we'll say 60% so €24k so it's cost someone €8k/annum.

A 3 year old version of the same car will cost someone say €24k off a garage forecourt, let's say they keep it 3 years and they get €12k for it when they part company, it's cost them €4k/annum in depreciation.

There's not a huge difference really.

I doubt the difference is reflected in their financial IQs or actual wealth, assets etc etc. they won't be half as savvy financially as the folk in the older car. they might well be earning more money, be better educated and have more disposable income though.


Are the cheapest, ****tiest cars out there driven by the most savvy?

Malari

Cina wrote: »

Considering that buying a new car is probably one of the worst financial decisions you can feasibly make, I'd say most people who do so aren't wealthy.

That really depends on what car you buy, what kind of finance deal you get and how long you intend to keep the car, surely.

Lux23

No, I live in Dublin.

theboringfox

Myself and partner have two well enoughpaying jobs but nothing too high. We managed to move from Cork to Dublin without pay cuts. That had biggest impact on feeling of being comfortable. I still don't feel well off. Cost of housing and rate of taxes mean I still worry about money...But I'm a worrier anyway. I really feel for lot of people scraping by each month. Horrible position.

sbsquarepants

mariaalice wrote: »

Who was it that said the definition of wealth is not having to look at the price of the wine in a restaurant.

.

I'm loaded so - I haven't looked at the price of wine in a restaurant for years......Not since the last time I ate out in a restaurant actually:mad:

Bredabe

Yes, for about 5 minutes while they calculate the money for my 'summer shift'.
After that:o:o

Pat Mustard

I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany.

Cina

Augeo wrote: »

Mmmmm

€40k car new will depreciate maybe €20k over the first 3 years, we'll say 60% so €24k so it's cost someone €8k/annum.

A 3 year old version of the same car will cost someone say €24k off a garage forecourt, let's say they keep it 3 years and they get €12k for it when they part company, it's cost them €4k/annum in depreciation.

There's not a huge difference really.

I doubt the difference is reflected in their financial IQs or actual wealth, assets etc etc. they won't be half as savvy financially as the folk in the older car. they might well be earning more money, be better educated and have more disposable income though.


Are the cheapest, ****tiest cars out there driven by the most savvy?

an extra €4k per annum isn't a lot?

Jaysus, I consider myself to be on good money and financially stable but €4k is still a good bit of money to be losing every year, that's for sure.

And no, the general sweet spot for a card is around three years old as cars depreciate the most in value in their first three years.

Cina

Cina wrote: »

an extra €4k per annum isn't a lot?

Jaysus, I consider myself to be on good money and financially stable but €4k is still a good bit of money to be losing every year, that's for sure.

And no, the general sweet spot for a card is around three years old as cars depreciate the most in value in their first three years.

It's all relative.
As I said, the folks in the newer car are quite likely earning more money to start with. Not everyone financing a car is in the poverty trap that folk on here would have you believe.
Driving a €40k car from new will cost you, there's no avoiding that.

I wouldn't be worrying about the sweet spot for everything tbh

superman28

I grew up with loads of money all around me,,, my school friends had yachts and holiday homes in the K club etc.. etc.. everyone lived in a fairly massive obnoxious houses.. had cleaners,, nannys,, holiday homes in Marbella,, etc. etc.. one lad's dad even had a private jet that he didn't own but leased so had access to.

If you go to a private school and live in a neighborhood that has indoor heated swimming pools,, thats all you know.. You never think about how much our parents or their parents must be earning to pay for all of this..

Now as an adult with my own kids and my own modest job,, that kind of lifestyle looks like a pipe dream. Out of 20 of us,, maybe 1 can afford to live it up like they did when they were brought up.

But we are very happy as we are.. i've now been downgraded to "middle class"... its not that bad..

Cina

Augeo wrote: »

It's all relative.
As I said, the folks in the newer car are quite likely earning more money to start with. Not everyone financing a car is in the poverty trap that folk on here would have you believe.
Driving a €40k car from new will cost you, there's no avoiding that.

I wouldn't be worrying about the sweet spot for everything tbh

Actually I think the point originally was the fact that new cars are an example of those who cannot manage their finances well, much like the fanciest phones on bill pay etc. A lot of people, regardless of their financial situation, do love getting the shiny new toy and as long as they can do it by paying the money on a monthly basis instead of all at once, then they will happily do it instead of actually doing the smart thing and saving their cash.

I'm not really saying it's to do with intelligence by the way, I think it's more to do with the society we live in now and the sense of entitlement we've all become accustomed to. I know so many people who can't save a penny because they've such a big outlay on their cars, phones, utilities etc. People simply are not as good at saving as they used to be, we want the shiny new thing.

Lyle Lanley

I don't have a house or a car, but I've not been stuck for money either. Can afford to go for a beer or a meal whenever I want. I've also visited 4 continents in the last year, lived on three. I guess it's all about priorities really.

Definitely nobody is looking at my life and thinking "he's doing well for himself" but people are looking and thinking "**** I wish I lived that life". That said, they don't see the bad sides of it. They want to live the life they think I live, not the one I actually have!

Giraffe Box

No.

Cina

Cina wrote: »

Actually I think the point originally was the fact that new cars are an example of those who cannot manage their finances well..............

I dunno, I reckon that's a strange theory.
One of my uncles married but never had kids, himself and his wife got a new car every 2 or 3 years. All of their peers had kids and drove older cars for years and years or maybe bought a new one and knocked 10 + years out of it.

My uncle was well able to manage his finances and I reckon for every one in a new car that can't manage their finances well there's at least one person in a new car that can.

ie .......... the age of your car isn't indicative of your financial management skills or financial resources.

Cina

Augeo wrote: »

I dunno, I reckon that's a strange theory.
One of my uncles married but never had kids, himself and his wife got a new car every 2 or 3 years. All of their peers had kids and drove older cars for years and years or maybe bought a new one and knocked 10 + years out of it.

My uncle was well able to manage his finances and I reckon for every one in a new car that can't manage their finances well there's at least one person in a new car that can.

ie .......... the age of your car isn't indicative of your financial management skills or financial resources.

I'm clearly not talking about everyone here. Obviously you can always find examples where it's not the case. Your uncle being one.

rent a small apartment but in a decent area

got rid of the car

eat out a good bit and eat well at home too

travel abroad a few times a year between holidays and long weekends, squeeze a few weekends away in ireland too

dont want and couldnt afford kids

have a good pension planned, getting better at savings

dont have a lot left over at the end of the pay packet but sure thats no measure of anything once its not a minus.

wouldnt swap with too many ppl tbh

CIP4

I thought I was doing ok but after reading this thinking my car might be a bit toonew and flashy so must mean I am bad with money

Ah no I am about 2 years out of college got a job straight away have worked my way up the ladder fairly quickly with a bit of hard work but mainly with luck and right place and right time. I have a pension set up my employer matches contributions I think that’s important even if you only put a small bit in at the start. Save a good percentage of my net wage but always think I could improve it a little. I do try to keep track of spending / saving although wouldn’t track smaller purchases.

Bought a two year old car at the start of the year but it was a reasonably expensive one while I might not run out and spend that kind of money on a car in the next few years I do really enjoy it and tbh I don’t squander money on much else have always been into nice car and after a though day at work stil get a bit of buzz sitting into it to go home.

Priority at the moment is save for a house but just turned 24 so reckon I will wait another two years before buying should have a good deposit saved by then.

So overall I think I am doing well for my age and being only two years out of college and live a fairly comfortable life don’t really want for anything and have a decent rainy day fund. I do believe in saving hard when younger as it has to make things easier as you get older.