Peak Trans

Omackeral

KrustyUCC wrote: »

Yeah exactly

a cis woman is a woman who identifies as female and was assigned a female sex at birth

Assigned at birth. It's gas isn't it? You can probably bet there's people out there that get offended if staff at the hospital doing their baby scan ask them if they'd like to know the sex of the baby.

pc7

Bloody hell I feel old some days!

Omackeral

pc7 wrote: »

Bloody hell I feel old some days!

That's ageist.

KrustyUCC

Omackeral wrote: »

Assigned at birth. It's gas isn't it? You can probably bet there's people out there that get offended if staff at the hospital doing their baby scan ask them if they'd like to know the sex of the baby.

Yeah it's mad stuff

Nobody I know would identify themselves as a cis man or cis woman

mickuhaha

I think humans are dimorphic and that about one in 20,000 people are born either with a male XX or female xy chromosome most of these cases not all leave these people unable to contribute to producing offspring. Chromosomes can't be changed by scientists yet as far as I know. I think people shouldn't be allowed to alter natural body development untill they are adults and responsible for themselves.

hatrickpatrick

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Strangely enough, I've yet to see a man abused and criticised for referring to themselves as a man, or saying that they they prefer their sexual partners to be whatever biological sex. The vitriol and shaming is only ever aimed at women.

Oh don't worry, there are many SJW-types out there who actually suggest that having a preference for "cis" people as sexual partners makes one a transphobic piece of sh!t, and that if you identify as straight, that means you can't have any reservations about hooking up with a trans person who identifies as the gender you are attracted to, or you're just an asshole.

These are of course the same people who go on about consent classes and so on, which makes it particularly peculiar to hear them shaming people for not being sexually attracted to some people, but sure there you go.

Calhoun

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Oh don't worry, there are many SJW-types out there who actually suggest that having a preference for "cis" people as sexual partners makes one a transphobic piece of sh!t, and that if you identify as straight, that means you can't have any reservations about hooking up with a trans person who identifies as the gender you are attracted to, or you're just an asshole.

These are of course the same people who go on about consent classes and so on, which makes it particularly peculiar to hear them shaming people for not being sexually attracted to some people, but sure there you go.

With all the drama around the Scarlett Johanson role it makes it look like they are trying to build up a privileged class for themselves. Its like in their mind a trans person can play any character but only a trans person may play a trans role.

dexter_morgan

Bring back the gays!

hatrickpatrick

Calhoun wrote: »

With all the drama around the Scarlett Johanson role it makes it look like they are trying to build up a privileged class for themselves. Its like in their mind a trans person can play any character but only a trans person may play a trans role.

And ironically, they'll use the "privilege" argument to justify that. In other words, anyone can behave any way they want, except straight people, white people, male people, and especially people who possess more than one of the aforementioned birthmarks of Satan.

BattleCorp

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

if you identify as straight, that means you can't have any reservations about hooking up with a trans person who identifies as the gender you are attracted to, or you're just an asshole.

I'm an a55hole so.

_Kaiser_

BattleCorp wrote: »

I'm an a55hole so.

Metoo. Only interested in 100% natural women. I'm not even fond of tattoos

Nermal

Nermal wrote: »

I note the IT today with a glowing profile of a doctor who performs gender 'affirmation' surgery...

Shes coming on for an interview shortly with Dave Fanning on RTE Radio1. Its quality advertising for her business.
(He's covering Tubbs)

https://twitter.com/RTERadio1/status/1019267234600906753

JRant

A spokesperson from TENI on radio this morning taking about giving children (under 16) the legal right to change their gender with parental consent. If the parents don't agree then they coukd go get a court order.

Now he talked about this helping many children but it must be a vanishingly small amount. He also said the recommendations came from an independent panel. However that panel was chaired by the head of TENI, so hardly independent.

Malayalam

JRant wrote: »

A spokesperson from TENI on radio this morning taking about giving children (under 16) the legal right to change their gender with parental consent. If the parents don't agree then they coukd go get a court order.

Now he talked about this helping many children but it must be a vanishingly small amount. He also said the recommendations came from an independent panel. However that panel was chaired by the head of TENI, so hardly independent.

Had to look up what TENI meant. I see it is coming to Ireland then. Bill 89 (2017) passed in Ontario, Canada, allows for the removal of children from parents, or foster families, if they are not supported to change gender.

Michael Couteau, the Minister of Child and Family Services (Ontario), and who initially introduced the bill, said that he would consider parental discrimination on the basis of gender identity “a form of abuse when a child identifies as one way and a caregiver is saying ‘No, you need to do this differently.'”

He continued, “If it’s abuse, and if it’s within the definition, a child can be removed from that environment and placed into protection where the abuse stops.”

The new law now requires a parent or legal guardian to “direct the child or young person’s education and upbringing in accordance with the child’s or young person’s creed, community identity and cultural identity.”

https://www.theblaze.com/news/2017/06/05/new-law-allows-government-to-take-children-away-if-parents-dont-accept-kids-gender-identity


This is what happens when people run to suckle at the teat of the state for every thing - give me my rights! etc - eventually the state becomes the first parent of our children.

The Bishop Basher

Canada used to appeal to me as somewhere I would live..

It's becoming less and less appealing these days..

Must be the global capital of political correctness gone too far..

BoJack Horseman

Stunning and brave.

Cabaal

Rennaws wrote: »

Canada used to appeal to me as somewhere I would live..

It's becoming less and less appealing these days..

Must be the global capital of political correctness gone too far..

Maybe Trump's America interests you more?

King of Kings

Cabaal wrote: »

Maybe Trump's America interests you more?

honestly yes.

Cabaal

King of Kings wrote: »

honestly yes.

Can I interest you in a property thats for sale in the Republic of Gilead?

The Bishop Basher

Cabaal wrote: »

Maybe Trump's America interests you more?

No thanks..

That's too far the other way..

I'm not a fan of extremes on either side..

King of Kings

Cabaal wrote: »

Can I interest you in a property thats for sale in the Republic of Gilead?

..im sure there is a joke there that im missing...

Ri_Nollaig

Cabaal wrote: »

Can I interest you in a property thats for sale in the Republic of Gilead?

Why has it always become a case of one extreme or the other?

Is there any room for a bit of moderate cop on, a realisation that yes, transgender people do exist and deserve as much rights as any one else but no, they should not be getting any special or different treatment to anyone else either.

This idea of forcing it on children! WTF?
Perhaps a child is transgender but until that child is an adult and can make their own decisions, I am sorry, they are going to have to stay that way.

Cabaal

Ri_Nollaig wrote: »

Perhaps a child is transgender but until that child is an adult and can make their own decisions, I am sorry, they are going to have to stay that way.

The child or teenager is making the decision.

As for the part of highlighted in bold, you can apply the same to gay children/teenagers. they'll just have to be straight until they are an adult eh?

ohnonotgmail

Ri_Nollaig wrote: »

Why has it always become a case of one extreme or the other?

Is there any room for a bit of moderate cop on, a realisation that yes, transgender people do exist and deserve as much rights as any one else but no, they should not be getting any special or different treatment to anyone else either.

This idea of forcing it on children! WTF?
Perhaps a child is transgender but until that child is an adult and can make their own decisions, I am sorry, they are going to have to stay that way.

who is forcing it on children?

Cabaal

Cabaal wrote: »

The child or teenager is making the decision.

As for the part of highlighted in bold, you can apply the same to gay children/teenagers. they'll just have to be straight until they are an adult eh?

in all fairness, what surgery or similar permanent treatment is a gay teenager likely to be offered as a result of their identifying as gay early in life?

hardly in any way a valid comparison to the point debated and fairly cheap pointscoring

Ri_Nollaig

Cabaal wrote: »

The child or teenager is making the decision.

As for the part of highlighted in bold, you can apply the same to gay children/teenagers. they'll just have to be straight until they are an adult eh?

Well this is back to a "moderate approach"
Yes, let them [children/teenagers] dress as girls if they want (or vice-versa) but NO they should not be allowed any irreversible treatments, either chemical or surgical.

Ri_Nollaig

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

who is forcing it on children?

read post #415

The Bishop Basher

Cabaal wrote: »

The child or teenager is making the decision.

They're too young to make irreversible life changing decisions especially given the fact that the data that shows so many revert back to their original gender in adulthood.

Cabaal wrote: »

As for the part of highlighted in bold, you can apply the same to gay children/teenagers. they'll just have to be straight until they are an adult eh?

Gay kids tend to remain gay. Trans kids often revert back to their natural gender.

I don't get why homosexuality is so often brought up in connection with Transgenderism.

Is there a link we don't know about ? Is there a higher incidence of homosexuality among transgender people ?

ohnonotgmail

Ri_Nollaig wrote: »

read post #415

i dont see anywhere in that about forcing young people to be trans

The Bishop Basher

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

i dont see anywhere in that about forcing young people to be trans

Starting gender reassingment on a kid as young as 3 or 4 is an adult forcing a kid to be trans in my view..

Ri_Nollaig

King of Kings wrote: »

..im sure there is a joke there that im missing...

Its a reference to Handmaids tale, and exactly the problem with modern politics or any discussion of it seems.
You either agree with an agenda or you are laterally the enemy.

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

i dont see anywhere in that about forcing young people to be trans

Read it again?

Its also the whole topic of this thread or are you just trying to be flippant.

ohnonotgmail

Rennaws wrote: »

Starting gender reassingment on a kid as young as 3 or 4 is an adult forcing a kid to be trans in my view..

Ri_Nollaig wrote: »

Its a reference to Handmaids tale, and exactly the problem with modern politics or any discussion of it seems.
You either agree with an agenda or you are laterally the enemy.



Read it again?

Its also the whole topic of this thread or are you just trying to be flippant.

maybe you are using "forcing" in a totally different way to the rest of us. I dont see parent deciding that kids are trans and forcing them to change.

King of Kings

Ri_Nollaig wrote: »

Its a reference to Handmaids tale, and exactly the problem with modern politics or any discussion of it seems.
You either agree with an agenda or you are laterally the enemy.



Read it again?

Its also the whole topic of this thread or are you just trying to be flippant.

sorry Im in bed when its on . wife watches it though

Neyite

Cabaal wrote: »

The child or teenager is making the decision.

As for the part of highlighted in bold, you can apply the same to gay children/teenagers. they'll just have to be straight until they are an adult eh?

I don't think that's what they are saying.

What's wrong with parents fully supporting their child to be whoever they want to be, to reinforce that no matter what gender they feel they are, they are loved and supported no matter what -but- that irreversible surgeries or medications that affect puberty wait until the child is an adult and able to make an informed decision on it.

I've nothing against Trans folk whatsoever. I fully support their rights and I fully support their right to live life the way they want as whoever they want. But I do have serious concerns when society is leaping on gendered play as a marker for trans and pushing parents and children on a gender changing pathway where there is only ONE way and all other considerations are pushed aside and you are accused of being transphobic.

It's not transphobic to not label my three year old as transgender when he was mad for Princess Sophia, My Little Pony and Mia, and loves sparkly stuff. A few years on, it's all about football or creepy crawlies and Avengers. And if in a few years, that changed again, we will get on board with whatever he likes. I never found out the sex on my scans. It never mattered to me or his dad whether he was a boy or girl. If he came home and said he was gay or trans he's still our kid and still that amazing person that's lit up our lives. But just like I wouldn't let him get a face tattoo at 14, I would not let him take puberty blockers or get surgery until he was old enough to fully comprehend the irreversible body modifications he wanted to do and that he fully understands the limitations of those modifications. After that, and he knows what it's about, he would have my full support.

It's not helpful nor true to convince children that a neo vagina is exactly the same as one that you'd have if you were born a girl. It's not. It can never be. Adults have a responsibility to be truthful to their teens here. Children take things literally. And when Trans advocates are telling children that they can literally change sex, and be exactly like another child of that gender and anyone who tells them otherwise is against them and transphobic that's falling far short of the reality of sex changes.

The Bishop Basher

Neyite wrote: »

I never found out the sex on my scans. It never mattered to me or his dad whether he was a boy or girl.

Likewise, I remember staring down in awe just after my second daughter was born for what must have been about 10 seconds before someone mentioned the word girl.. I didn't notice and I didn't care. It was just a person and like you we would accept them no matter what way they are..

Straight, Gay, Trans, whatever..

But we also have a duty to protect them and sometimes that means protecting them from doing things that they regret later in life and be unable to reverse. It doesn't mean we can stop them but we can certainly guide them. If they still wanted to change gender at an age where I know they've matured enough to make that call, I'd do everything I could to support them and make it happen.

Ri_Nollaig

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

maybe you are using "forcing" in a totally different way to the rest of us. I dont see parent deciding that kids are trans and forcing them to change.

Didn't mention anything about parents either.

Post #415 , refers to a law that means if a child decides to "change gender identity" and the parents don't entertain the idea, can mean that they lose custody.

That sounds like "forced" to me.
Perhaps you think otherwise, fair enough and while I don't know how far "supporting their gender identity" means, whether that is just leaving them be or actively trying to change sex, i.e. if the child says they want an operation and the parent says no. What happens then? Does that mean the state can intervene?

_Dara_

Cabaal wrote: »

The child or teenager is making the decision.

As for the part of highlighted in bold, you can apply the same to gay children/teenagers. they'll just have to be straight until they are an adult eh?

But being a certain sexuality is passive. It requires nothing to be done and the child has breathing room to figure things out. They don’t have to be straight until they become an adult.

ohnonotgmail

Ri_Nollaig wrote: »

Didn't mention anything about parents either.

Post #415 , refers to a law that means if a child decides to "change gender identity" and the parents don't entertain the idea, can mean that they lose custody.

That sounds like "forced" to me.
Perhaps you think otherwise, fair enough and while I don't know how far "supporting their gender identity" means, whether that is just leaving them be or actively trying to change sex, i.e. if the child says they want an operation and the parent says no. What happens then? Does that mean the state can intervene?

how is that forcing kids to be trans when it is based on " if a child decides"?

Feisar

I know it can be damaging to affix gender roles and all that, "boys don't cry etc." however I'm glad I was of that era rather than this new crap.

Must add a caveat and say I think trans is a mental illness rather than a physical issue however what the hell would I know.

ohnonotgmail

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

how is that forcing kids to be trans when it is based on " if a child decides"?

How can you not see what the posters are saying?

It is forcing the parents to encourage their child to change gender despite the fact that the child isn't mature enough to make the decision. Failure to do so, and thus reinforcing the decision in the childs mind (against the parent's wishes), will result in losing custody.

A child who would be likely to change their mind without reaffirmation is now allowed and encouraged to essentially make life altering decisions at a time when they aren't ready or capable.

Annasopra

Rennaws wrote: »

Starting gender reassingment on a kid as young as 3 or 4 is an adult forcing a kid to be trans in my view..

What do you mean by gender reassignment?

Annasopra

Ri_Nollaig wrote: »

Didn't mention anything about parents either.

Post #415 , refers to a law that means if a child decides to "change gender identity" and the parents don't entertain the idea, can mean that they lose custody.

That sounds like "forced" to me.
Perhaps you think otherwise, fair enough and while I don't know how far "supporting their gender identity" means, whether that is just leaving them be or actively trying to change sex, i.e. if the child says they want an operation and the parent says no. What happens then? Does that mean the state can intervene?

No. We are not talking about any surgery on children here at all.

ohnonotgmail

Deleted User wrote: »

How can you not see what the posters are saying?

It is forcing the parents to encourage their child to change gender despite the fact that the child isn't mature enough to make the decision. Failure to do so, and thus reinforcing the decision in the childs mind (against the parent's wishes), will result in losing custody.

A child who would be likely to change their mind without reaffirmation is now allowed and encouraged to essentially make life altering decisions at a time when they aren't ready or capable.

how can you not read the follow the thread? this is the post i responded to initially

Ri_Nollaig wrote: »

Why has it always become a case of one extreme or the other?

Is there any room for a bit of moderate cop on, a realisation that yes, transgender people do exist and deserve as much rights as any one else but no, they should not be getting any special or different treatment to anyone else either.

This idea of forcing it on children! WTF?
Perhaps a child is transgender but until that child is an adult and can make their own decisions, I am sorry, they are going to have to stay that way.

I still have not seen any evidence of it being forced on children.

Ri_Nollaig

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

how is that forcing kids to be trans when it is based on " if a child decides"?

Seriously? Not sure if this is trolling at this point.

Cabaal

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

I still have not seen any evidence of it being forced on children.

That doesn't matter,

it fits some people's agenda to claim children are being forced even if they have no evidence to support the claim.

Franz Von Peppercorn

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

how is that forcing kids to be trans when it is based on " if a child decides"?

We pretty much don’t accept that children have full agency in all other cases, they can’t legally drink, vote, have sex, run a business, drive etc. Deciding on transformative surgery isn’t something we should allow children alone to accept.

Calhoun

Yes indeed would be completely against type for a group who threaten feminists with rape and want to enact laws to remove children from parents to force their agenda on people.

You only have to look at the fairly militant backlash on the recent Scarlet Johansan stuff to show right on thinking they are. Or the digs on boards ect because folk don't agree with them .

ohnonotgmail

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

We pretty much don’t accept that children have full agency in all other cases, they can’t legally drink, vote, have sex, run a business, drive etc. Deciding on transformative surgery isn’t something we should allow children alone to accept.

but how is that forcing it on kids to be trans as another poster said?

Annasopra

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

but how is that forcing it on kids to be trans as another poster said?

Its not. Some posters here are throwing out nonsense about forcing.

ohnonotgmail

Calhoun wrote: »

Yes indeed would be completely against type for a group who threaten feminists with rape and want to enact laws to remove children from parents to force their agenda on people.

You only have to look at the fairly militant backlash on the recent Scarlet Johansan stuff to show right on thinking they are. Or the digs on boards ect because folk don't agree with them .

we still have people on this thread describing trans people as having a mental illness. and getting away with it as well. so its not just a question of "not agreeing"