Brexit on Aviation

Jamie2k9

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

The point been its in Ireland interest to be part of an agreement with or without a deal at EU level, Leo appeared to ignore this fact and thinks all will be merry for us when it won't be.

When has he said all would be merry, not those exact words but even realitively close ?

Jamie2k9

Deleted User wrote: »

When has he said all would be merry, not those exact words but even realitively close ?

Not directly but he isn't exactly been straight with the Irish people about how bad things could be. A true leader would be preparing for both outcomes and been constructive with one of allies about solutions.

These daily sound bites from himself and Simon are not at all helpful and doing no favors for anybody.

What will his statement of "fact" achieve about overflights? Nothing. Has he instructed officials to plan for a no deal and new agreements are is he happy to see Irish people negatively impacted because he is to busy spinning a line instead of running the country.

Brennans Row

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Yet thinks Ireland can "have its cake and eat it"

I find that a bit rich . . . .

Just because the British voted to leave the EU on a whim without thinking through the consequences of the real economic world that they were part of since 1972.

When I say whim, I’m referring to those who voted to leave, was in part a protest against the London Establishment from the regions of Wales, the Midlands and North of England who for decades suffered imbalanced development.

I have no doubt in my mind if the vote was repeated tomorrow the result would be to remain.

The consequences to the British public is their problem but unfortunately they have made their problem ours too.

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

So who's interests does Leo have ours or Brussels?

Ah now you are talking like a “green” Englishman.

Our elected Taoiseach is putting our Irish national interests and as a member of the European Union their interests before those of Britain first.

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Not that it has a remote chance of happening.

No room for complacency, I would take the Taoiseach’s advice, in the event of a hard Brexit build up financial reserves beforehand.

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

HQ is irrelevant

But that is where they call the shots.

murphaph

A no deal crash out is the default position. As time ticks by it becomes ever more likely. There is zero unity in parliament or for that matter in the country. The UK (and us as collateral damage) is in quite serious danger.

ZX7R

What will happen about RAF interception flights of Russian militry air craft in our air space.
Have Leo or EU though about this.

faoiarvok

ZX7R wrote: »

What will happen about RAF interception flights of Russian militry air craft in our air space.
Have Leo or EU though about this.

Military flights aren’t a subject of the treaties referred to. There may be agreements on those affected by Brexit also, but I’m not familiar with them.

In general however, no agreement is required for military aircraft to operate in Irish-controlled airspace outside our territorial airspace.

ZX7R

ZX7R wrote: »

What will happen about RAF interception flights of Russian militry air craft in our air space.
Have Leo or EU though about this.

Besides us not having anything capable of doing it, have a think about why the U.K. do it willingly. They are actually defending themselves, they are hardly going to ignore one entire side to spite the EU. They are actually the target not us and not providing coverage would be a bit akin to leaving your back door open and the alarm off. It is laughable to think they are doing us the greater favour here.

ZX7R

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Besides us not having anything capable of doing it, have a think about why the U.K. do it willingly. They are actually defending themselves, they are hardly going to ignore one entire side to spite the EU. They are actually the target not us and not providing coverage would be a bit akin to leaving your back door open and the alarm off. It is laughable to think they are doing us the greater favour here.

I am well aware of the reasons why they do it, my question was to do if air space was restricted.
All it takes is one stupid statement make by politicians involved to open a big tin of whoopass

Hotblack Desiato

Brennans Row wrote: »

It could also throw a spanner in the works of DAA’s need for a second runway too.

Should increase traffic if EU travellers connecting to North America via LHR or MAN connect through DUB instead.

IAG (and Ryanair) will need to ensure that >50% of their shareholders are in the EU27.

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Not directly but he isn't exactly been straight with the Irish people about how bad things could be.

That's exactly what he did do, and you're slagging him off over it.

Jamie2k9

Brennans Row wrote: »

I find that a bit rich . . . .

Just because the British voted to leave the EU on a whim without thinking through the consequences of the real economic world that they were part of since 1972.

When I say whim, I’m referring to those who voted to leave, was in part a protest against the London Establishment from the regions of Wales, the Midlands and North of England who for decades suffered imbalanced development.

I have no doubt in my mind if the vote was repeated tomorrow the result would be to remain.

The consequences to the British public is their problem but unfortunately they have made their problem ours too.




Ah now you are talking like a “green” Englishman.

Our elected Taoiseach is putting our Irish national interests and as a member of the European Union their interests before those of Britain first.



No room for complacency, I would take the Taoiseach’s advice, in the event of a hard Brexit build up financial reserves beforehand.



But that is where they call the shots.

I can't really respond without going way off topic but taking his advise of a financial buffer, the same guy who was against it only 12 months ago for tax cuts but had to back down because of political pressure.

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Should increase traffic if EU travellers connecting to North America via LHR or MAN connect through DUB instead.

IAG (and Ryanair) will need to ensure that >50% of their shareholders are in the EU27.



That's exactly what he did do, and you're slagging him off over it.

He was purely aiming it at the UK, he didn't mention a single thing about Ireland.

Irish Steve

OK, I've been watching this thread for a number of days, as there are aspects of what's going on at the moment that are likely to affect what happens in the aviation sector.
That said, I am going to suggest, with emphasis, that this thread needs to be confined to the possible effects of Brexit on Aviation.

This is not After Hours, and it's not the Politics forum, some of what's being posted here would be more appropriate to threads that are running in both of those areas.

So, going forward, political posts, or other off topic issues that are not related to aviation may well be deleted.

trellheim

Aviation because of its strong connecting nature will be affected by Brexit - licensing, security, customs, immigration, trade deals, standards, consumer protection, shareholding - pretty much everything.

It beggars belief that its not locked down yet.

Just asking the question - what are airlines doing on schedules ? e.g. have Ryanair a schedule in the system beyond end March 2019 ?

Chris_5339762

Can't book DUB - LGW in April anyway, and interestingly enough, not on the 31st March either.

Scoondal

My travel insurance company will not cover flight cancellations due to Brexit.
I am travelling to Asia in April 2019. I have booked a slightly higher fare via Amsterdam.
Is the government too fixated on Northern Ireland and not giving attention to other possible fall-out from a no-deal Brexit agreement ?
With seven months to go, it seems the consequences of a no-deal Brexit have not been planned for.

Scoondal

Scoondal wrote: »

My travel insurance company will not cover flight cancellations due to Brexit.
I am travelling to Asia in April 2019. I have booked a slightly higher fare via Amsterdam.
Is the government too fixated on Northern Ireland and not giving attention to other possible fall-out from a no-deal Brexit agreement ?
With seven months to go, it seems the consequences of a no-deal Brexit have not been planned for.

You have to remember that the government like most businesses don’t make public everything they are doing and planning. Like any clever person you always start with a worst case scenario and work backwards, that way you are always prepared.

Scoondal

Deleted User wrote: »

You have to remember that the government like most businesses don’t make public everything they are doing and planning. Like any clever person you always start with a worst case scenario and work backwards, that way you are always prepared.

I understand what you say.
My point was really that the uncertainty about aviation regulations and travel insurance is already causing airline customers to make different routings than they may have made last year. Advance bookings for airlines are important because they will need to reduce the fares on seats for routes that aren't selling well or else cancel the flights or route.

Twenty Grand

Scoondal wrote: »

My travel insurance company will not cover flight cancellations due to Brexit.
I am travelling to Asia in April 2019. I have booked a slightly higher fare via Amsterdam.
Is the government too fixated on Northern Ireland and not giving attention to other possible fall-out from a no-deal Brexit agreement ?
With seven months to go, it seems the consequences of a no-deal Brexit have not been planned for.

7 month? They have less than 3 months to come up with a comprehensive plan.

Not a hope of a easy Brexit now.

Scoondal

Twenty Grand wrote: »

7 month? They have less than 3 months to come up with a comprehensive plan.

Not a hope of a easy Brexit now.

But I was reading today in the UK Daily Mail that they already have a "NEW" plan : David Davis will become an interim Prime Minister and after Brexit Boris Johnson will take over.
I know that you might think I am crazy, but Google Daily Mail today.
This is what Ireland must deal with !

L1011

The current Westminster maths won't allow that to happen and if there's an election before then there will either be a totally hung parliament or a Labour led government

Twenty Grand

I refuse to read the Daily Fail.

Here's the most recent Brexit headlines that come up in my Google search.


The Guardian
More than 100 seats that backed Brexit now want to remain in EU
1 day ago

Politico Europe
Counting the cost of Brexit inaction
18 hours ago

The Guardian
‘They don’t know what they’re doing’: Leave-voting Swansea turns on Brexit
1 day ago

Bloomberg.com
Both Sides of Brexit Can Finally Agree: It's a Joke
2 days ago

BBC.com
Brexit: Farmers and meat processors' no-deal warning
15 hours ago

The Economist
No confidence over Brexit - Brexit and public opinion
1 day ago

The headlines haven't changed since the vote.
Not a snowballs chance of them changing before the October deadline. Britain will crash out with no deal.

Scoondal

Scoondal wrote: »

I understand what you say.
My point was really that the uncertainty about aviation regulations and travel insurance is already causing airline customers to make different routings than they may have made last year. Advance bookings for airlines are important because they will need to reduce the fares on seats for routes that aren't selling well or else cancel the flights or route.

That’s politics for you and until recently the U.K. weren’t even negotiating at all let alone seriously. Hardly our governments fault if the other side sit like sullen teenagers refusing to communicate in anything other than grunts.

Hotblack Desiato

Scoondal wrote: »

But I was reading today in the UK Daily Mail

sigh

Nijmegen

Scoondal wrote: »

My travel insurance company will not cover flight cancellations due to Brexit.

After all the talk this shows you where the rubber meets the road, really. If you can't get insurance for an event, it's because that event is deemed to be a damn near certainty.

Nijmegen

Nijmegen wrote: »

After all the talk this shows you where the rubber meets the road, really. If you can't get insurance for an event, it's because that event is deemed to be a damn near certainty.

As I pointed out early in the topic, airlines in the U.K. have already changed their T&Cs to reflect the potential for a hard Brexit to protect themselves. It’s not surprising to see insurance companies saying similar.

sandbelter

Some more insight if there's a no deal Brexit.  But it looks as if EI may have to cease BHD-LHR flights if there is no deal.
No Deal
[font=nta, Arial, sans-serif]EU-licensed airlines would lose the ability to operate wholly within the UK (for example from Heathrow to Edinburgh) "[/font]
"Source: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/flights-to-and-from-the-uk-if-theres-no-brexit-deal/flights-to-and-from-the-uk-if-theres-no-brexit-deal

Tenger

They could license FlyBE to operate those services. But then again I think they already have AerLingus UK Plc set up from when they had a London base.
This subsidiary could hire the parent company to operate the flights?

Locker10a

Tenger wrote: »

They could license FlyBE to operate those services. But then again I think they already have AerLingus UK Plc set up from when they had a London base.
This subsidiary could hire the parent company to operate the flights?

Yeah I recall EI had previously held a UK AOC, although this may wel have expired

cml387

Well the EU have published their plans in the event of a no deal Brexit.

UK airlines would be allowed to operate in and out of the EU (provided reciprocal arrangements were made by the UK).

However UK airlines would be barred from intra-EU flights .

theguzman

cml387 wrote: »

Well the EU have published their plans in the event of a no deal Brexit.

UK airlines would be allowed to operate in and out of the EU (provided reciprocal arrangements were made by the UK).

However UK airlines would be barred from intra-EU flights .

Bad news for Easyjet if it came to pass, they would have to reflag to an EU country for intra-EU operations.

Jamie2k9

theguzman wrote: »

Bad news for Easyjet if it came to pass, they would have to reflag to an EU country for intra-EU operations.

Easyjet Austria with over 100 aircraft moved already but still go back a few months ago and we had project fear saying flights would be grounded. Far from it!