The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter thread V3

Christy42

Foxtrol wrote: »

Few people would say Rodgers was the best QB on that roster when he was drafted, which was a caveat to my post.



With the limited number of practices there is little time to give backup QBs much time with the starters, especially when they aren’t expected to see game time or the team is in contention. They can shadow the game plan process but teams aren’t going to build one around them, like they would if the rookie was the starter.



They can iron out some bugs but then in year 2 (or whenever they’re dropped in) they’re basically rookies who then have to get up to speed with live NFL action. It’s a year of ironing out bugs vs a year of NFL experience and a QB that can help the team while on their rookie deal.

I don’t see how your claim that ‘all QBs are better served’, even looking just at last year do you really feel all of Mayfield, Allen, Darnold would be in a better situation going into next season if they had never had a snap last season?

I meant the QB was better served. I think the time off the pitch served Rodgers well. It might not be best for the team this season/coach (in general as they may get fired not going for a win now approach and leaving the better qb on the bench). That Rodgers couldn't justify a first team spot has little do with whether or not playing now was good for Rodgers at the time. I just mean that I would be happy with a qb that good even if he didn't play for a year or two.

Yes they will be going into season 2 as rookies essentially. So what, they have had practice against NFL level corners and with other NFL qbs/coaches/schemes so they are not complete rookies.

Hopefully they will have a long career. I am looking at a full career at though Brady/Mahomes have had incredible seasons coming in y2. Brady especially would have had a far worse career IMO had there not been starters better than him at the time as it forced him to work on his flaws (speed of release he mentioned as a big flaw in those days in an interview) instead of whatever schemes that Kansas city team (or whoever) were playing.

Honestly. Yeah I think Allen would have been far better off sitting out for his long term prospects. Wentz as well. Outside of injuries has flaws in his throw that could be ironed out but likely won't as he focuses on game to game.

Mayfield might be an exception we will see.

Itssoeasy

eagle eye wrote: »

Itssoeasy wrote:

Also, I agree with joe theisman about having Dwayne Haskins starting week 1 would not be good for him as it could have lasting damage to him both physically and mentally.

Why would him starting be any different to any other rookie QB?

Well, because I think unless a rookie QB is the second coming of joe Montana will a bit of time adjusting to life in the NFL and life in general not be a good thing ?

Also, Dwayne Haskins may be as you say a generational QB and if he is well the redskin fans can throw a party. He has also only started 14 games in college and has had less than six hundred attempts in total. That's a very small sample size and unless the redskins o-line is as watertight as Stevie wonder's band then Dwayne Haskins could possibly get up close and personal with the field conditions of many NFL stadiums. I think unless the redskins can be confident they can protect the kid then don't start him week 1 or at all this coming season.

SHOVELLER

Nice wee trip at the weekend to Richmond, VA and as we were drinking in the area strolled over to the Redskins training facility. The place is not exclusive to the Redskins though as there was a wedding there Saturday!

jack presley

Sure the Redskins only use that facility for the few weeks of training camp. Their in-season training is done in Ashburn.

Snyder got the city of Richmond to build it (at their expense) under the condition that the team uses it for training camp for X no of years. The rest of the year it’s used for all sorts.

Itssoeasy

I've been rewatching some games from last season and for some reason I can't shack the belief that the 49ers will make the playoffs this coming season. I can feel it in my waters as they say. I've no good reason for thinking it but I can't get rid of it.

Itssoeasy

I've been rewatching some games from last season and for some reason I can't shack the belief that the 49ers will make the playoffs this coming season. I can feel it in my waters as they say. I've no good reason for thinking it but I can't get rid of it.

adrian522

Itssoeasy wrote: »

I've been rewatching some games from last season and for some reason I can't shack the belief that the 49ers will make the playoffs this coming season. I can feel it in my waters as they say. I've no good reason for thinking it but I can't get rid of it.

Which games were you watching? The 49ers don't really have a secondary which will be a bit of an issue.

D9Male

If you had asked me to name teams that didn't need to bring in an expensive FA running back in the offseason, the 9ers would have been near the top of the list.

Matt Breida 5.3 yards per carry
Mostert with 7.2 yards per carry
Jerick McKinnon returning from injury
Kyle Juszcyk still doing his thing.

When you consider the gaps at safety in particular, it is weird that they didn't pull the trigger on a safety. They were sniffing around Earl Thomas, and had the sap space, so I don't really get it.

Something about Lynch makes me uneasy.

Foxtrol

D9Male wrote: »

If you had asked me to name teams that didn't need to bring in an expensive FA running back in the offseason, the 9ers would have been near the top of the list.

Matt Breida 5.3 yards per carry
Mostert with 7.2 yards per carry
Jerick McKinnon returning from injury
Kyle Juszcyk still doing his thing.

When you consider the gaps at safety in particular, it is weird that they didn't pull the trigger on a safety. They were sniffing around Earl Thomas, and had the sap space, so I don't really get it.

Something about Lynch makes me uneasy.

I can understand Coleman being deemed a luxury by some but with McKinnon still coming back from a very serious injury it is hard to bank on him being ready at the start of the season or to be the same player. Shanahan claimed that the loss of McKinnon ruined a lot of his game plan for the year, as the other RBs just didn’t have the same ability, and this signing is insurance against a repeat. $3.6m for Coleman is hardly that expensive.

Safety, and the secondary as a whole, is the big question for the team. I had hoped that they’d get Thomas but the deal he received just isn’t the type that the 49ers are making and given our injury profile paying big money to another guy who can’t seem to stay fit would not be ideal.

The front office made the same gamble on the Edge position last year and after that blowing up in their face they invested heavily this offseason. Hopefully it isnt a repeat.

el Fenomeno

Jared Lorenzen passed away today. He was only 38. That's really sad.

OOnegative

el Fenomeno wrote: »

Jared Lorenzen passed away today. He was only 38. That's really sad.

https://www.foxnews.com/sports/jared-lorenzen-very-sick-battles-health-issues.amp

Poor man, won a SuperBowl ring as Eli’s backup if i’m correct.

Hococop

He got very heavy at the end of his career, I think he was trying to lose the weight but might have taken a toll on him, rip

raze_them_all_

Gronk is definately retired, seriously slimmed down and down big muscle mass

The_Honeybadger

raze_them_all_ wrote: »

Gronk is definately retired, seriously slimmed down and down big muscle mass

He is down 10-20lbs according to the man himself, still looks to be in tremendous shape. He probably is done but I would not be shocked to see him at some point next season if the Pats need him.

Oat23

https://twitter.com/MiamiDolphins/status/1146775232927227904?s=19

Rap Sheet reported he had his arm amputated at the scene of the accident and that looks to have been confirmed by his agent. Christ.

helimachoptor

Shocking stuff

Foxtrol

The_Honeybadger wrote: »

He is down 10-20lbs according to the man himself, still looks to be in tremendous shape. He probably is done but I would not be shocked to see him at some point next season if the Pats need him.

Not close for an NFL TE. He wont be able to click his fingers and get back up to playing weight. He was seen as injury prone before and with a mid-season comeback he'd break within the first few snaps between the weight loss and lack of practice.

For his own safety he should stay retired and it looks like thats what he is planning. Hopefully fans can respect his decision and not try to hound him to come back in the unlikely event that the Patriots are struggling.

https://twitter.com/SoCalBillsMafia/status/1144658205550583810?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1144658205550583810&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thescore.com%2Fnfl%2Fnews%2F1791922

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

That's one of the most shocking injuries I've ever heard. Must have been absolutely horrific for them to have to amputate at the scene.

The_Honeybadger

Foxtrol wrote: »

Not close for an NFL TE. He wont be able to click his fingers and get back up to playing weight. He was seen as injury prone before and with a mid-season comeback he'd break within the first few snaps between the weight loss and lack of practice.

For his own safety he should stay retired and it looks like thats what he is planning. Hopefully fans can respect his decision and not try to hound him to come back in the unlikely event that the Patriots are struggling.

https://twitter.com/SoCalBillsMafia/status/1144658205550583810?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1144658205550583810&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thescore.com%2Fnfl%2Fnews%2F1791922

Not suggesting he can just click his fingers but a couple of months of intensive training would see an elite athlete him back up to speed. The Pats season doesn’t start until thanksgiving anyway

He probably is done though like I said. I doubt fan pressure would have anything to do with it, it would be more from the team if they thought he could still offer something. I’m sure they will figure it out either way, it’s the Pats after all.

Foxtrol

The_Honeybadger wrote: »

Not suggesting he can just click his fingers but a couple of months of intensive training would see an elite athlete him back up to speed. The Pats season doesn’t start until thanksgiving anyway

He probably is done though like I said. I doubt fan pressure would have anything to do with it, it would be more from the team if they thought he could still offer something. I’m sure they will figure it out either way, it’s the Pats after all.

The season is only around 5 months long which doesn't really allow for 'a couple of months of intensive training'.

Since the time he retired and against all evidence fans have talked up the potential for him to come back, just like you have repeated. Obviously it will be the team's decision if they look for a return but the constant talk of it from fans, even before the season starts or some hypothetical Patriot's slump, just keeps it in the news cycle. Leave the lad enjoy retirement until he says otherwise.

eagle eye

Foxtrol wrote:

Not close for an NFL TE. He wont be able to click his fingers and get back up to playing weight.

Ever hear of somebody come back from a serious injury?
I'm not sure Gronk will ever play again but there have been quiet rumours that he is giving his body a rest and we might see him late in the season.

Foxtrol

eagle eye wrote: »

Ever hear of somebody come back from a serious injury?
I'm not sure Gronk will ever play again but there have been quiet rumours that he is giving his body a rest and we might see him late in the season.

What does serious injury have to do with it? Even for a lot of bad injuries players will try to keep or even gain muscle in the areas where they aren't injured due to the time it takes to get back, whereas in comparison Gronk has completely slimmed down, which as the point of my original post is not close to tremendous shape for an NFL TE.

And there are similar 'quiet rumours' that his family were trying to get him to quit for a while due to fears for his health and it seems like the guy is enjoying his retirement now.

Of course he could change his mind and come back but recent photos and his comments last month make that look far less likely than the were before.

Oat23

He'll come back late in the season as a slot receiver. Calling it now. :pac:

el Fenomeno

I wouldn't say he's exactly wasting away or anything...

The_Honeybadger

Foxtrol wrote: »

The season is only around 5 months long which doesn't really allow for 'a couple of months of intensive training'.

Since the time he retired and against all evidence fans have talked up the potential for him to come back, just like you have repeated. Obviously it will be the team's decision if they look for a return but the constant talk of it from fans, even before the season starts or some hypothetical Patriot's slump, just keeps it in the news cycle. Leave the lad enjoy retirement until he says otherwise.

Depends on when he starts training. I very much doubt anything I say on here will impact whether he comes back or not so you can relax! And I really don’t think he is that out of shape it would be easy for someone like him who has trained all his life and has elite genetics to add bulk quickly.

As a Steelers fan I’d be delighted to see the back of him but I did enjoy watching him play, phenomenal player.

Mysterypunter

Jared Lorenzen dies, had weight struggles, ESPN yesterday have people paying tribute, calling it a tragedy, and then they cover the Nathans hot dog eating competition.

jack presley

Well that didn't take long

https://twitter.com/theScore/status/1149774811058585600


EDIT - seems to be because of the incident at his father's funeral in April so not a new incident.

krustydoyle

Is that the incident where he threatened to kill the funeral home staff and burn down the place?

Oat23

krustydoyle wrote: »

Is that the incident where he threatened to kill the funeral home staff and burn down the place?

God, I can't wait for hard knocks.

Itssoeasy

krustydoyle wrote: »

Is that the incident where he threatened to kill the funeral home staff and burn down the place?

? I mean had he not form in being nuts you'd put it down to grief of losing his father but he'd have fit perfectly with the raiders of stabler and Hendricks.

Foxtrol

The chance of a kicker holdout ends with Gould agreeing a 2 year deal with 49ers, with an option to extend it to 4 years.

Oat23

I'm happy he got the long term security. At the very least the rules of the tag should be changed in the next CBA, but I'd be in favour of it being removed completely. Most of the time it's very unfair to players.

Foxtrol

Oat23 wrote: »

I'm happy he got the long term security. At the very least the rules of the tag should be changed in the next CBA, but I'd be in favour of it being removed completely. Most of the time it's very unfair to players.

I’m against the franchise tag as a concept but this is an example of it working in the way that it should, to provide leverage to a team when trying to make a fair deal with a player that they see as being key to them.

Much worse are the many examples where it is used to keep a player at below what their market rate should be, with the team knowing well that there is little to no chance that they will come close to what the player is worth/demanding.

Oat23

:pac:

Leslie91

Melvin Gordon holding out in SD... eh I mean some city a bit north of SD. Those F%$£ers are such cheapskates be ready to see him sit the whole year.

Foxtrol

Leslie91 wrote: »

Melvin Gordon holding out in SD... eh I mean some city a bit north of SD. Those F%$£ers are such cheapskates be ready to see him sit the whole year.

Rumours Zeke will hold out as well. Not surprising RBs are starting to catch on to it. They really get screwed with the current situation so need to force things when they have a little leverage.

Guffy

I don't think that they can sit for the year, if they want to exit their rookie deals i mean. Don't they need to be available for half the year anyway?

Foxtrol

Guffy wrote: »

I don't think that they can sit for the year, if they want to exit their rookie deals i mean. Don't they need to be available for half the year anyway?

Depends on how much they think they team what they are willing to risk.

Zeke has 2 years left on his rookie deal and then given the cheap franchise tag for a RB he could easily get tagged twice. With the damage that position takes he mightn't be in a fit state to get a payday by the time he became an FA. If he is willing to risk a year he might as well hold out as early as he can, while he still has a lot of value, as it is pretty much too late to wait until you're tagged.

The_Honeybadger

Is it not the case that if they hold out in full they won’t accrue the year and will be in the same position in 2020, having missed out on 5-7m salary?

Completely understand their frustration. RB’s are getting screwed and the Gurley deal and subsequent arthritic knee is going to make teams very wary of giving these guys big second contracts.

Christy42

The_Honeybadger wrote: »

Is it not the case that if they hold out in full they won’t accrue the year and will be in the same position in 2020, having missed out on 5-7m salary.

Completely understand their frustration. RB’s are getting screwed and the Gurley deal and subsequent arthritic knee is going to make teams very wary of giving these guys big second contracts.

Will they really miss out? I mean by not playing they are probably extending their career by a year (as long as they don't do it too often) and if nothing else the salary cap will go up.

The_Honeybadger

Christy42 wrote: »

Will they really miss out? I mean by not playing they are probably extending their career by a year (as long as they don't do it too often) and if nothing else the salary cap will go up.

But there is no point sitting out if they don’t accrue the year they would just be kicking the issue down the road and forgoing salary in their prime. It was different for Bell who was on the tag.

Very few teams are paying RB’s. Gurley, Bell, Johnson all have big contracts, I can’t think of too many others. And Gase came out and basically admitted that if he was in charge at the time Bell would not have gotten that contract. It’s an undervalued position because you can find serviceable guys in the middle rounds and FA for peanuts.

Foxtrol

The_Honeybadger wrote: »

But there is no point sitting out if they don’t accrue the year they would just be kicking the issue down the road and forgoing salary in their prime. It was different for Bell who was on the tag.

That’s the whole gamble and it depends on how the likes of Zeke value themselves and how the assess the leverage they have over their team. Risking missing out on accruing a year on a rookie deal doesn’t matter if the team is forced into a position where they have to give them a long-term deal now.

The_Honeybadger

Foxtrol wrote: »

That’s the whole gamble and it depends on how the likes of Zeke value themselves and how the assess the leverage they have over their team. Risking missing out on accruing a year on a rookie deal doesn’t matter if the team is forced into a position where they have to give them a long-term deal now.

Oh yeah of course, if the team caves then that’s great for the player. Unlikely though, in Gordon’s case at least. They have some big guys to lock up in the coming years and I’m not sure if Gordon is a big priority for them.

I could see the cowboys maybe paying Elliot but probably not until next off season.

Foxtrol

The_Honeybadger wrote: »

Oh yeah of course, if the team caves then that’s great for the player. Unlikely though, in Gordon’s case at least. They have some big guys to lock up in the coming years and I’m not sure if Gordon is a big priority for them.

I could see the cowboys maybe paying Elliot but probably not until next off season.

That’s why agents will have to be careful about picking their battles and timing when a player holds out.

Gordon is an interesting one as they do have guys that’ll be looking for money soon but their window with Rivers is coming to an end (if it hasn’t already) and Gordon will be asked to continue or even grow as contributor this coming season if they are to be successful. From his perspective I can see why he would hold out now as he is looking down the barrel of being tagged at least for the following season, which would put him at 28 getting to FA. He likely isn’t a priority now but may become one if he sits out and they start losing some games. They could even be out of it by the time he’d have to show to accrue a season.

The_Honeybadger

Fair point, that’s his plan most likely. He is a serious talent and I hope he gets what he wants.

mikemac2

From hero to zero. Until March this year Alex Collins was the starting running back for the Ravens.

Hell he even got a little celebrity attention for his Irish dancing celebrations and he visited a dance school in Dublin. All around good guy and a fan favorite

In March he was stoned and crashed his car into a tree and fell asleep after the crash. This was a mile from the practice facility. A passerby called it in and police found marijuana and a handgun. That is not so serious, just misdemeanors in Maryland.

He admits to having more guns and drugs at his home, dumbest criminal ever. :rolleyes: Police got a search warrant and sure enough found two rifles and more drugs. Multiple felony charges now

The Ravens swift cut him

Now he has broken his leg and undergone surgery

He will never be seen in the league again

Oat23

No idea how Hill got away without a suspension.They have him on tape threatening his girlfriend like. Insane.


https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1152216611820118017

Guffy

Fúcking disgrace from nfl

Hazys

It'll be a bigger disgrace and embarrassment for the NFL when Hill beats the crap out of his GF or kid again sometime in the future because we know that its inevitable, a leopard cheetah never changes his spots.

eagle eye

I'm speechless, in shock. I just, well can we sack everybody involved in this decision.