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St. Patrick's Principal resigns. See mod warning post #61
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Wicklow Will wrote: »In relation to the Church of Ireland, the only required and permissible means, in accordance with the Constitution of the Church of Ireland, for membership for a person of school-going age is a baptismal certificate.
Great post and hits the point of all this perfectly..
On a recent visit for a funeral, I watched the eulogy being made but it wasn't the person making the eulogy that I was watching. It was this picture, hanging on the wall, behind their head which showed a tree. One half of the tree was covered in foliage and looked healthy while the other half was dying. I forget the message but it gave the impression that those who had paid their "membership fees" were represented by the healthy side of the tree while those who hadn't paid were represented by the dead half. Having grown up in the parish I found this difficult to believe and was honestly shocked to find out that this was indeed what was meant by the tree..
It seems no-one told recedite (which is fair enough
) or the rector (which is definitely not fair enough), that membership of the church of Ireland comes with being baptised. Nothing less, nothing more. There is no payment. It's not run like a club.
I grew up there, i'm still on the records, as are my kids who grew up through the school and the parish.
<SNIP> <SNIP> ripped up a petition on my daughter. They all wanted to make their confirmation in their own clothes but <SNIP> adopted his usual tyrannical stance and demanded that they all wear uniforms. I suggested to my daughter that she collect signatures on a petition and hand them in requesting that they wear their own clothes. She took the time and trouble to do this and handed it to <SNIP> at a conformation class.
He ripped it up in front of her and dismissed it and they were forced to wear their uniforms for no good reason other then the rector said so.
Of course the policy changed again the following year when the rectors daughter was making hers but hey ho. He gets to make the rules.
Anyway, my daughter's a bit like me. She has her own beliefs and doesn't really go in for this religion stuff. But that moment ended any relationship she, and we, had with that church.
The stories I hear seem to be as endless as the ego. I'm particularly concerned this week to hear that the youth worker has some "fundamentalist" views on homosexuality.
The list of questions i'd want answered if i was an active parishioner are growing by the day.. <SNIP> seems to be adopting a head in the sand approach. I'm not sure the gravity of the situation has dawned..
What has happened to St Patrick's ?0 -
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I didn't get the memoIt seems no-one told recedite (which is fair enough) or the rector (which is definitely not fair enough), that membership of the church of Ireland comes with being baptised.
But no matter. On a recent holiday to Transylvania, I was impressed by the Eastern Orthodox Church of Western Moravia, and duly converted. I could produce a letter of affiliation signed by Reverend Dracula, if necessary.
As it happens, the nearest school ethos available in Ireland is the CoI. And according to the new legislation (as of last week) that gives my kids priority admission to any CoI primary school.
Its actually better than being a CoI member, because I get to choose between St. Pats NS and Delgany NS; I can apply to either one. Not being in the CoI, I am not subject to any restrictions relating to internal CoI parish boundaries.
Any questions should be addressed to my solicitor directly.0 -
I didn't get the memo
But no matter. On a recent holiday to Transylvania, I was impressed by the Eastern Orthodox Church of Western Moravia, and duly converted. I could produce a letter of affiliation signed by Reverend Dracula, if necessary.
I'd love to see the reaction if you handed that in for the craic..
Its actually better than being a CoI member, because I get to choose between St. Pats NS and Delgany NS; I can apply to either one. Not being in the CoI, I am not subject to any restrictions relating to internal CoI parish boundaries.
I agree. You have the best of all worlds.
As someone who was raised in the tradition but never sat easy with religion, i've always appreciated the free thinking ethos and open and diverse culture I enjoyed both as a pupil and when my kids attended St Patrick's.
Ironically though, this new law wouldn't have made any difference back then as there was no requirement for affiliation at the time.. Anyway, it's needed now and it's introduction is well timed
It'll make a really huge difference to the Temple Carrig hopefuls who have been dutifully lined up to be counted every Sunday at morning roll call, I mean service..
But honestly, up to now and anytime in the last 40 years, an atheist kid would have felt just as at home as a Roman Catholic kid, or any other kid and that speaks volumes about a school.
It's a shame we need laws to force the board to apply what should be common sense policies that benefit the entire community but it is what it is..
They need to get back to a point where non CoI applicants are not only admitted but are welcomed and included in a very real way and not in a way that the church and the board are just paying lip service for the sake of it.
They've lost all of their most experienced and talented people. They have many mountains to climb.
We'll see.0 -
I see the rector has issued another letter.
https://www.greystonesguide.ie/canon-fodder/
Seems there's a season for everything and this is the season for us all to shut up apparently.
I believe a lot of people are too frightened to speak up in case they upset the rector and lose a coveted place in one of the schools so often used to threaten people and keep them in line.
The longer this debacle rumbles on the more apparent it has become that St Patrick's is being run, to some extent, under a culture of silence and fear..
Sound familiar anyone ?
Well thankfully I don't share these concerns as my kids are raised however I do feel a connection with the parish and i have grave concerns about things i've witnessed and heard and so i'd like to ask the questions so many are asking quietly in the background..
I don't believe people want platitudes, sound bites and patronising bible quotes..
They want answers..
- Like why has an incredibly talented and experienced principal who has happily served the school so well for so many decades, been left feeling like she had no option left but to resign ? What did it take to get her to that point ?
- Why does this letter ignore the fact that she resigned because she felt she had no other option ? You could be forgiven from reading that letter that all these resignees danced away merrily into the sunset. They didn't.
- Why did an equally talented and respected vice principal resign ? Did he also feel forced out and most importantly, did his religion have anything to do with it ?
- if it did, was this sanctioned by the Archbishop ?
- Why did the school secretary leave ? Did she feel forced out ?
- Why did the church office secretary leave ? Was she forced out ?
- Is it true that people have left the church over homophobic comments made by the parish youth worker ?
- When did the CoI introduce a club type membership system with fees and has the Archbishop approved this ?
- What happens to those who don't pay their fees. Apart from public shaming from the pulpit, do they just get off peak access to the church or something
- When did the CoI become a fundamentalist, evangelical church and has the archbishop approved this massive shift in direction ?
- Why is the Rector refusing to baptise people based on his own assumptions regarding their intentions ? When was he granted this right and has the archbishop approved this ?
- Why is the Rector refusing to marry people based on his own assumptions regarding their intentions ? When was he granted this right and has the archbishop approved this ?
- Why is the Rector making unilateral decisions about which families get places in either school.. When was he granted that power and by whom ?
- Why are members of the board and teachers continuing to resign ?
- Why did we turn down an extra teacher which was "unprecedented" according to the minister, Richard Bruton ?
- Why have the admission criteria for Temple Carrig been amended by stealth to favour CoI children since the patronage was awarded ?
- Why have I heard of at least 5 people leaving the church and the parish in the last week alone and is this trend indicative of a wider problem in the church ?
- And finally where does Christianity come into any of this because recent actions on behalf of the parish seem utterly devoid of any level of Christianity to me. I've personally witnessed some appalling behavior which I won't get into here but it has been on a number of occasions, each of which were distasteful, ego driven and incredibly self serving.
It's a shame to see a once thriving and happy parish find itself in this quagmire. It's such a mess.
I know so many of these people personally and I know they work with honesty, integrity and to the best of their ability to make the parish what it is but their efforts are being undermined from within.
Templecarrig and St Patrick's admission policies are just a symptom of a much deeper and a far more sinister problem in Greystones.
Fundamentalism and evangelism have found their way to St Patrick's so it seems to be a case of be born again or be away with you.
They're giving the CoI a bad name and destroying generations of great work that has gone on before them. They're damaging relations with the community and driving away people who've been faithful to the Church for many generations.
The damage done is already immense and the only people left to fix the problem seem to be those that have caused it. As any good manager will tell you, always hire people that are better then you. Poor managers do the opposite.
They've pushed out all the loyal stalwarts, the talent, the experience and all the good will that they had at their disposal..
Not to mention the much needed moolah..
Watch this space..0 -
I see the rector has issued another letter.
https://www.greystonesguide.ie/canon-fodder/
Seems there's a season for everything and this is the season for us all to shut up apparently.
I believe a lot of people are too frightened to speak up in case they upset the rector and lose a coveted place in one of the schools so often used to threaten people and keep them in line.
The longer this debacle rumbles on the more apparent it has become that St Patrick's is being run, to some extent, under a culture of silence and fear..
Sound familiar anyone ?
Well thankfully I don't share these concerns as my kids are raised however I do feel a connection with the parish and i have grave concerns about things i've witnessed and heard and so i'd like to ask the questions so many are asking quietly in the background..
I don't believe people want platitudes, sound bites and irrelevant bible quotes..
They want answers..
- Like why has an incredibly talented and experienced principal who has happily served the school so well for so many decades, been left feeling like she had no option left but to resign ? What did it take to get her to that point ?
- Why does this letter ignore the fact that she resigned because she felt she had no other option ? You could be forgiven from reading that letter that all these resignees danced away merrily into the sunset. They didn't.
- Why did the vice principal resign ? Did he also feel forced out and most importantly, did his religion have anything to do with it ?
- if it did, was this sanctioned by the Archbishop ?
- Why did the school secretary leave ? Did she feel forced out ?
- Why did the church office secretary leave ? Was she forced out ?
- Is it true that people have left the church over homophobic comments made by the parish youth worker ?
- When did the CoI introduce a club type membership system with fees and has the Archbishop approved this ?
- What happens to those who don't pay their fees. Apart from public shaming from the pulpit, do they just get off peak access to the church or something
- When did the CoI become a fundamentalist, evangelical church and has the archbishop approved this massive shift in direction ?
- Why is the Rector refusing to baptise people based on his own assumptions regarding their intentions ? When was he granted this right and has the archbishop approved this ?
- Why is the Rector refusing to marry people based on his own assumptions regarding their intentions ? When was he granted this right and has the archbishop approved this ?
- Why is the Rector making unilateral decisions about which families get places in either school.. When was he granted that power ?
- Why are members of the board and teachers continuing to resign ?
- Why did we turn down an extra teacher which was "unprecedented" according to the minister, Richard Bruton ?
- Why have the admission criteria for Temple Carrig been amended by stealth to favour CoI children since the patronage was awarded ?
- Why have I heard of at least 5 people leaving the church and the parish in the last week alone and is this trend indicative of a wider problem in the church ?
- And finally where does Christianity come into any of this because recent actions on behalf of the parish seem utterly devoid of any level of Christianity to me. I've personally witnessed some appalling behavior which I won't get into here but it has been on a number of occasions, each of which were distasteful, ego driven and incredibly self serving.
It's a shame to see a once thriving and happy parish find itself in this quagmire. It's such a mess.
I know so many of these people personally and I know they work with honesty, integrity and to the best of their ability to make the parish what it is. But it is being destroyed from within.
Templecarrig and St Patrick's admission policies are just a symptom of a much deeper and a far more sinister problem in Greystones.
Fundamentalism and evangelism have found their way to St Patrick's so it seems to be a case of be born again or be away with you.
They're giving the CoI a bad name and destroying generations of great work that has gone on before them. They're damaging relations with the community and driving away people who've been faithful to the Church for many generations.
The damage done is already immense and the only people left to fix the problem seem to be those that have caused it. As any good manager will tell you, always hire people that are better then you. Poor managers do the opposite.
They've pushed out all the loyal stalwarts, the talent, the experience and all the good will that they had at their disposal..
Not to mention the much needed moolah..
Watch this space..
I could have written this post myself! I’m currently a disaffected member of St Patricks parish and can say that you’re spot on with your questions! You’ve got the right angle on the core problems. I’d love to see the answers, if any were forthcoming, although I suspect you’d only get more of same ‘canon fodder’ - justification for actions taken (inexcusable and inexplicable as they appear). Sad to say, my disaffection with the present regime is such that I will be another casualty as I cannot continue worshipping there and by doing so make a hypocrite of myself whilst lending tacit support to the ministry of this Rector. My family has been Anglican as far back as we can trace its lineage (eight generations) so it is a sad day when I have to admit this to be the case. There’s something rotten in the state of Denmark, me thinks!0 -
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From what I know of the structures within the CoI, it is considerably more decentralised than the RCC. The rector serves at the invitation of the parish, and is not imposed on them by the archbishop. Therefore he must have a certain level of support from the active parishioners.
Agreed but that support is now in question and as the rector appears to be incompetent, it requires the archbishop to step in and resolve the issue.
The problem is the archbishop is equally incompetent.
So where do you go from there
There should be a vote of confidence in the rector but unfortunately it doesn't work that way.The issue of inactive parishioners being disadvantaged due to active parishioners controlling the flow of state funded education is only part of the problem IMO. The bigger issue is everyone else in the wider community being disadvantaged.
I couldn't agree more and they are already being disadvantaged.
The BoM has been cleared out of anyone that might oppose him. The Roman Catholic staff have been pushed out. The extra teacher has been refused and we now have a situation where 22 out of this years 24 admissions are active and affiliated members of the parish as approved by David.
Sectarianism is alive and well in Greystones in 2018.
It won't be long before these admission policies take effect in Temple Carrig as he's trying the same tricks there..0 -
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