Donald Trump is the President Mark IV (Read Mod Warning in OP)

Leroy42

RIGOLO wrote: »

Another great success for the Trump Administration Foreign policy.

And to think we had to listen to all the anti-Trumpers say he had been played for a fool and he got nothing out of the first meeting.
Its a peace negotiation, play the long game.

A historic milestone in bringing North Korea in from the cold.
The second day of a 3 day summit, which is the 3rd summit of hte year.
Signing an agreement which will lead to further dismantling of the NK nuclear facilities.

North and South Korea commit to 'era of no war'
https://edition.cnn.com/2018/09/18/asia/north-korea-south-korea-summit-intl/index.html

The two countries also pledged to:
Submit a joint bid to host the 2032 Summer Olympics.
Create rail and road links between North and South within the next year.
Stop military drills aimed at each other along the Military Demarcation Line, which divides the two countries, by November 1.
Remove 11 guard posts in the demilitarized zone by the end of the year.
Normalize the Kaesong Industrial complex and Kumgang tourism project as soon as the conditions allow.

I dont expect the anti-Trumpers to give the administration credit for this, no surprise there.

Trump Administration continues its march forward, America booming , trade imbalance being addressed and foreign policy bringing NK to the table... all huge wins and message for the GOP candidates come the mid-terms.

Sorry, when did Trump become the leader of either North or South Korea?

It very much looks like South Korea have been doing all the real work on this, whilst Trump has had a photo op.

It is a very welcome development, but I fail to see how you are giving Trump the credit for this.

StringerBell

Laura Coates was spot on this morning again, I'm on the phone but will come back to this later. She is excellent in general

BabyCheeses

RIGOLO wrote: »

Another great success for the Trump Administration Foreign policy.

And to think we had to listen to all the anti-Trumpers say he had been played for a fool and he got nothing out of the first meeting.
Its a peace negotiation, play the long game.

A historic milestone in bringing North Korea in from the cold.
The second day of a 3 day summit, which is the 3rd summit of hte year.
Signing an agreement which will lead to further dismantling of the NK nuclear facilities.

North and South Korea commit to 'era of no war'
https://edition.cnn.com/2018/09/18/asia/north-korea-south-korea-summit-intl/index.html

The two countries also pledged to:
Submit a joint bid to host the 2032 Summer Olympics.
Create rail and road links between North and South within the next year.
Stop military drills aimed at each other along the Military Demarcation Line, which divides the two countries, by November 1.
Remove 11 guard posts in the demilitarized zone by the end of the year.
Normalize the Kaesong Industrial complex and Kumgang tourism project as soon as the conditions allow.

I dont expect the anti-Trumpers to give the administration credit for this, no surprise there.

Trump Administration continues its march forward, America booming , trade imbalance being addressed and foreign policy bringing NK to the table... all huge wins and message for the GOP candidates come the mid-terms.

Trying to avoid the 1500 children that was lost eh?

Cheerful Spring

Leroy42 wrote: »

Sorry, when did Trump become the leader of either North or South Korea?

It very much looks like South Korea have been doing all the real work on this, whilst Trump has had a photo op.

It is a very welcome development, but I fail to see how you are giving Trump the credit for this.

That's a very unfair analysis. Trump one to one with Kim moved this progress along. When people were saying Trump was being played he still praised Kim and kept the communication channel open. Where if Trump was reactionary and bellicose like some in the media the talks could have ended.

Ludo

Not sure if mentioned earlier or not, but rumour has it that Ronan Farrow is now in possession of the infamous N-word tapes from The Apprentice (hillreporter.com and salon.com are the sources for this but they are not definite of it either). IF this is true does anyone thin it will make the slightest bit of difference? It SHOULD be the end of a presidency IF a tape appeared like this but I bet it will be forgotten within a few days if it does appear.
A lot of IFs in this story for now but maybe one to keep an eye on.

Pelvis

If I had the tapes I would probably wait until a few days before the elections in November to release them.

Gwen Cooper

Pelvis wrote: »

If I had the tapes I would probably wait until a few days before the elections in November to release them.

Unfortunately I don't think it will make any difference. Many Trump followers are proving time and time again that they don't care what Donald does or says, they will still vote for him, no matter what.

Pelvis

Gwen Cooper wrote: »

Unfortunately I don't think it will make any difference. Many Trump followers are proving time and time again that they don't care what Donald does or says, they will still vote for him, no matter what.

Trump followers are a lost cause. It's a case of getting democrats off their arses to vote, as well as swing voters.

pixelburp

Just to re-post what was mentioned in passing, the administration has lost track of another 1,500 migrant children. Now, the spokesperson from the Department defended this situation, claiming they had no legal responsibility after the children were 'settled', and that ... "these children are not 'lost'. Their sponsors - who are usually parents or family members and in all cases have been vetted for criminality and ability to provide for them - simply did not respond or could not be reached when this voluntary call was made."

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/18/us/politics/us-migrant-children-whereabouts-.html

RIGOLO

Its interesting that the anti-Trumpers are more concerned with a tape that no one even knows exists ..

than the real and substantive progress being made on a major geo political issue for the Asia-Pacific region and the stabilising of NK nucleaur program.

With one anti-Trumper even going so far as to imply Trump had nothing to do with the successfull NK-SK developments.

I think thats embarassing for the new liberal left.
It shows what their agenda really is, ie no real or geniune interest in issues, just get Trump.
I think the resistance is weakening, like a boxer who has tired themselves out by simply raining soft blows on a stronger opponent without ever having landed a KO, the left has punched itself out....

Ludo wrote: »

Not sure if mentioned earlier or not, but rumour has it that Ronan Farrow is now in possession of the infamous N-word tapes from The Apprentice (hillreporter.com and salon.com are the sources for this but they are not definite of it either). IF this is true does anyone thin it will make the slightest bit of difference? It SHOULD be the end of a presidency IF a tape appeared like this but I bet it will be forgotten within a few days if it does appear.
A lot of IFs in this story for now but maybe one to keep an eye on.

Gwen Cooper wrote: »

Unfortunately I don't think it will make any difference. Many Trump followers are proving time and time again that they don't care what Donald does or says, they will still vote for him, no matter what.

Pelvis wrote: »

If I had the tapes I would probably wait until a few days before the elections in November to release them.

Leroy42 wrote: »

Sorry, when did Trump become the leader of either North or South Korea?
It very much looks like South Korea have been doing all the real work on this, whilst Trump has had a photo op.
It is a very welcome development, but I fail to see how you are giving Trump the credit for this.

Leroy42

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

That's a very unfair analysis. Trump one to one with Kim moved this progress along. When people were saying Trump was being played he still praised Kim and kept the communication channel open. Where if Trump was reactionary and bellicose like some in the media the talks could have ended.

It was posted it response to a post stating that this development was another triumph for Trump.

I am not saying that Trump did not play a role, but that is all he did. SK was the main driver of this, and the fact that NK reached its target of Nuclear weapons meant US had little option but to open dialogue.

As I stated, it is a welcome development and if Trump needs to take credit for it to keep the thing moving in the right direction then I for one am happy with that. A normalisation of NK is to the betterment of the world world.

badtoro

Unfortunately, I don't believe any tape with Trump using yhe N word will make a whit of difference to the people who vote for him. It might "outrage" the usual suspects but that's about it, they weren't going to vote for him anyway.

everlast75

RIGOLO wrote: »

Its interesting that the anti-Trumpers are more concerned with a tape that no one even knows exists ..

than the real and substantive progress being made on a major geo political issue for the Asia-Pacific region and the stabilising of NK nucleaur program.

With one anti-Trumper even going so far as to imply Trump had nothing to do with the successfull NK-SK developments.

I think thats embarassing for the new liberal left.
It shows what their agenda really is, ie no real or geniune interest in issues, just get Trump.
I think the resistance is weakening, like a boxer who has tired themselves out by simply raining soft blows on a stronger opponent without ever having landed a KO, the left has punched itself out....

Its interesting that the pro- Trumpers are not concerned about the 1500 children who are missing...

cantwbr1

everlast75 wrote: »

Its interesting that the pro- Trumpers are not concerned about the 1500 children who are missing...

Family Christian values only apply to white middle class American children

pixelburp

RIGOLO wrote: »

Its interesting that the anti-Trumpers are more concerned with a tape that no one even knows exists ..

And it's interesting that within your condescension, you refuse to engage or debate on national matters, be it the nomination of Kavanaugh, or the latest mishandling of 1000+ migrant children to choose just two recent examples.

Or indeed your refusal to acknowledge the words of the President you're obviously lavishing praise upon. Nothing to add about last weeks claim about 3,000 deaths being a Democrat fiction? I mean you're obviously obsessed with 'The Left' being on deaths door - I would have thought this angle was catnip.

Once more you try to play high minded games over 'geo politics' or economic whataboutery, and refuse to talk about the actions of the President, his cabinet or administration. Spoofing of the highest order by way of adolescent hagiography.

weisses

pixelburp wrote: »

And it's interesting that within your condescension, you refuse to engage or debate on national matters, be it the nomination of Kavanaugh, or the latest mishandling of 1000+ migrant children to choose just two recent examples.

Or indeed your refusal to acknowledge the words of the President you're obviously lavishing praise upon. Nothing to add about last weeks claim about 3,000 deaths being a Democrat fiction? I mean you're obviously obsessed with 'The Left' being on deaths door - I would have thought this angle was catnip.

Once more you try to play high minded games over 'geo politics' or economic whataboutery, and refuse to talk about the actions of the President, his cabinet or administration. Spoofing of the highest order.

Don't waste your time being sensible ... Facts and truth is not what he is interested in .... Its all gibberish and waffle when reading his posts .. I provided plenty of facts, countering his nonsense ....I yet have to receive a reply

Zubeneschamali

badtoro wrote: »

Unfortunately, I don't believe any tape with Trump using yhe N word will make a whit of difference to the people who vote for him.

True, they all knew he was a racist in 2016.

But it will further enrage his opponents, and get them out for mid-term elections, which are usually lower energy affairs than in Presidential years.

There is some evidence that republican voters are now overconfident, having to some extent bought into Trumps baloney about how things are going great, best ever. https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2018/09/republican-voter-turnout-2018-midterms-donald-trump

Penn

A tape of Donald using the n-word, or r-word, or anything of that ilk won't matter a jot to his supporters.

However, it will look extremely bad for the US President on a global scale, will force top GOPers into pretending to be disgusted and horrified by what he said, and will result in SHS having to try work her way around it on the podium without actually apologising for it because obviously no apology will be forthcoming from Trump, who will then use it as the media dragging up old stuff to make him look bad, Fake News, they're the enemy etc.

weisses

I find the whole N word discussion farcical tbh ... as long as black people uses it as popular slang in a large proportion of rap songs, the whinging about the word being racist is ridiculous ..... Never realized i was a racist when singing along with NWA

Sonics2k

weisses wrote: »

I find the whole N word discussion farcical tbh ... as long as black people uses it as popular slang in a large proportion of rap songs, the whinging about the word being racist is ridiculous ..... Never realized i was a racist when singing along with NWA

Context is extremely important, and even then it's a touchy one.

Leroy42

weisses wrote: »

I find the whole N word discussion farcical tbh ... as long as black people uses it as popular slang in a large proportion of rap songs, the whinging about the word being racist is ridiculous ..... Never realized i was a racist when singing along with NWA

Wow.

Its all about context. Singing along with a song is very different than using it when degrading another person.

It really isn't that difficult.

weisses

Leroy42 wrote: »

Wow.

Its all about context. Singing along with a song is very different than using it when degrading another person.

It really isn't that difficult.

Fact is that black people use the word all the time rap songs are just 1 example.... If its such a inappropriate word used during the dark days of slavery I would think the people who affects it most would not want to use it to start with

Its black people themselves who are partly responsible the N word is still around us today

If the N word is racist, contextual use is a mute argument imo

Pelvis

weisses wrote: »

Its black people themselves who are partly responsible the N word is still around us today

I have no words. I'll let Ice Cube explain...

Penn

weisses wrote: »

Fact is that black people use the word all the time rap songs are just 1 example.... If its such a inappropriate word used during the dark days of slavery I would think the people who affects it most would not want to use it to start with

Its black people themselves who are partly responsible the N word is still around us today

If the N word is racist, contextual use is of no matter

White people using the word: harkens back to a time when white people used the word to signify that black people were lesser human beings

Black people using the word: display of solidarity and familiarity with each other, of their origins and ancestors, and of shared struggles they face even today with regards racism.

Contextual use matters greatly. As Ice Cube said recently on Bill Maher's show (after Bill Maher used the n-word the previous week) (Edit: as posted by Pelvis above), the word is like a knife, and it can be used as either a weapon or a tool. When other black people use it, there's a familiarity there, a bond. When white people use it, it's like a weapon, because that is what the word has historically, and still is, used as by white people to denigrate black people.

The fact they use it in rap songs does not matter one tiny little bit. The fact it's still used widely by black people does not matter one tiny little bit. White people using that word is just wrong.

So yes, a video of the President of the United States (which has a large black population), saying the n-word (and let's face it, not while singing his favourite NWA song) would be huge news. It might not shift people's opinions of him one way or the other, as his supporters will still support him, and his opposers will still oppose him. But it will be hugely embarrassing for him if a video of him using the word was released.

Ludo

Leroy42 wrote: »

Wow.

Its all about context. Singing along with a song is very different than using it when degrading another person.

It really isn't that difficult.

The very fact you had to type that sentence to explain a simple concept to someone is worrying. I'm gonna assume he was trolling as any other scenario involves my estimation of people going even lower.

Professor Moriarty

weisses wrote: »

Fact is that black people use the word all the time rap songs are just 1 example.... If its such a inappropriate word used during the dark days of slavery I would think the people who affects it most would not want to use it to start with

Its black people themselves who are partly responsible the N word is still around us today

If the N word is racist, contextual use is a mute argument imo

Having been subjected to racism in England many years ago, sometimes in the form of Paddy the Irishman jokes, I'm very conscious of context. I often hear Irish people tell 'Irish' jokes. I don't like it as it perpetuates a stereotype but I leave it unchallenged. However, when an English person tells an 'Irish' joke in my company (rare occurrence these days) I immediately challenge the person. Regarding Trump using the N word, imagine a recording of Theresa May telling a Paddy the Irishman joke? I do think context is very important.

kunst nugget

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

I often hear Irish people tell 'Irish' jokes. I don't like it as it perpetuates a stereotype but I leave it unchallenged.

That one always kind of baffles me I must say.

Gbear

kunst nugget wrote: »

That one always kind of baffles me I must say.

I'm baffled that people give a ****e either way.

It's one thing if someone threatens you and is using racist slurs in anger.

It's another if ye're having a laugh.

I'd want to be very comfortable with a black person to do race-based jokes with them given the capacity to offend, but the notion that it's some sort of moral dilemma is absurd hand-wringing nonsense.

Some people just take themselves far too seriously.

And the upshot of this is that you have people hiding behind "liberals" being **** craic as the reason they get annoyed when they make genuinely offensive racist comments or insults.

Which is exactly what will happen with Trump if the comments come out, as it has done for his previous offensive comments.
It's a lot easier to play the "locker room talk" card about being a pig when you have humourless self-important types kicking up a stink over nothing.

Labeling the trivial as offensive kills nuance.

Professor Moriarty

Gbear wrote: »

I'm baffled that people give a ****e either way.

It's one thing if someone threatens you and is using racist slurs in anger.

It's another if ye're having a laugh.

I'd want to be very comfortable with a black person to do race-based jokes with them given the capacity to offend, but the notion that it's some sort of moral dilemma is absurd hand-wringing nonsense.

Some people just take themselves far too seriously.

And the upshot of this is that you have people hiding behind "liberals" being **** craic as the reason they get annoyed when they make genuinely offensive racist comments or insults.

Which is exactly what will happen with Trump if the comments come out, as it has done for his previous offensive comments.
It's a lot easier to play the "locker room talk" card about being a pig when you have humourless self-important types kicking up a stink over nothing.

Labeling the trivial as offensive kills nuance.

Why do you think most black people are offended when white people use the N word?

everlast75

Its very simple.

Black people find it offensive when white people say it.

So I don't say it.

I don't care if "they say it".

I know its offensive so I don't use it.

I can make it through life without saying it. I expect all white people could too.