Donald Trump is the President Mark IV (Read Mod Warning in OP)

Itssoeasy

I can see the GOP and those supporters using the sideshow bob defense of "die Bart die" being German and not wishing death on a kid.

Captain Obvious

More Georgia voter suppression. And the guy who is supposed to ensure it doesn't happen is the guy benefiting from it. Unreal.

Tillman told The Hill that the county voter registration and elections board "is in receipt of a list, provided by the Democratic Party of Georgia, of approximately 4,700 registered voters that the party claims requested absentee ballot forms via a mailer sent out by the party."

"After reviewing the list of names, there is evidence that the county received 48 of those voter absentee ballot request forms. All 48 of those forms have been processed,” Tillman said in a statement.

Professor Moriarty

pixelburp wrote: »

Come on: does anyone really think, in 2018, if this is indeed the bomber that it's going to change the rhetoric of the Info Wars style demographic one iota? I can already see the goal-post shifting, and hear the cognitive gear shifts; they'll scream about it being too obvious, convenient "I hate Dems" posters and so on. And who knows what Trump himself will claim, probably some of those conveniently ambiguous attacks on the believability of the accused.

For goodness, you have mental gymnasts even this side of the pond insisting that he couldn't be a bomber 'cos they weren't technically real bombs. I'd say that people would have to be killed, but even then... even then, American political discourse rejects any reality to discomforting to political prejudice.

Cuomo has stated categorically that these bombs were viable. He could be lying I suppose.

ancapailldorcha

spacecoyote wrote: »

Don't know if I'd class NI as a functioning democracy

Enough of the one-liners please.

Duck Soup

Cesar Sayoc, 56, from Florida arrested. Photo from previous arrest.

https://twitter.com/MylesMill/status/1055850259635683331

pixelburp

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Cuomo has stated categorically that these bombs were viable. He could be lying I suppose.

I'm sure he could well have, but my point still stands: we live in an era when conspiracy theorists and Flat Earthers alike feel emboldened and legitimised, while the sitting US President dissembles or spreads conspiracies about his own agencies. Partisanship now outweighs common sense and decency.

Hell, this whole incident could have been a slam dunk for any embattled President, let alone Trump; had he any self-awareness or empathy he could have stood in front of the nation, condemned the attacks in no uncertain terms with some generalised "while we may disagree with each other..." style speech. Nope.

Itssoeasy

Trump is live now.

Itssoeasy

"terrorising acts"

BabyCheeses

everlast75 wrote: »

Does this count?

https://twitter.com/BoingBoing/status/1055844596897452032

I do enjoy how you can have someone like this and people will say we have to wait and see. If someone gets injured in a car accident Trump supporters automatically assume it's a Muslim and they all need to be banned.

Itssoeasy

It's funny that he's saying violence must stop and saying the things he should say but we know damn well he doesn't believe a single thing he's saying.

Water John

Well Trump will be trying to limit the kick back at himself and the GOP.

pixelburp

Any head of state that calls its (free) press the "Enemy of the People", and continually speaks in a hostile fashion towards the 4th estate, should be castigated in no uncertain terms for being the catalyst of this whole sorry affair.

He made the Cult of Trump, he indulges in it every time he holds one of his big rallies - he should be made pay for its outcomes. He won't of course, but he should.

Gbear

"He can't win" seems a likely complaint from his adherents, but if he actually wants to make amends he needs to repudiate his previous insane fascistic comments about the press.

Hurrache

At that presser a while ago the press are pushing back at Trump shouting fake news at him when he tried to claim he gets attacked all the time. Are they starting to grow a pair?

everlast75

Gbear wrote: »

"He can't win" seems a likely complaint from his adherents, but if he actually wants to make amends he needs to repudiate his previous insane fascistic comments about the press.

i.e. Apologise, aka never gonna happen

Professor Moriarty

pixelburp wrote: »

I'm sure he could well have, but my point still stands: we live in an era when conspiracy theorists and Flat Earthers alike feel emboldened and legitimised, while the sitting US President dissembles or spreads conspiracies about his own agencies. Partisanship now outweighs common sense and decency.

Hell, this whole incident could have been a slam dunk for any embattled President, let alone Trump; had he any self-awareness or empathy he could have stood in front of the nation, condemned the attacks in no uncertain terms with some generalised "while we may disagree with each other..." style speech. Nope.

I agree completely. My 'He could be lying I suppose' remark was sardonic.

Captain Obvious

Seems the guy has been working up to this. Previously making threats on Twitter.

https://twitter.com/RochelleRitchie/status/1055867631461416962

Duck Soup

Thirteenth bomb confirmed to have been intercepted in Sacramento, California, addressed to Senator Kamala Harris.

Duck Soup

Sayoc at a Trump rally in 2017 in Orlando, Florida.

Duck Soup

Amazingly, Sayoc's Twitter account (under a pseudonym) is still open.

https://twitter.com/hardrock2016

Headshot

Duck Soup wrote: »

Sayoc at a Trump rally in 2017 in Orlando, Florida.

A great poster boy for Trumps "Politics"

The democrats need to take a big advantage of this

FatherTed

I can't make up my mind if this guy was a Trump supporter:

https://twitter.com/thereal_mo01/status/1055844641952665600

Captain Obvious

Duck Soup wrote: »

Amazingly, Sayoc's Twitter account (under a pseudonym) is still open.

https://twitter.com/hardrock2016

Wait til they find his inevitable reddit account.

circadian

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Wait til they find his inevitable reddit account.

It'll be buried amongst several alt accounts in the bowels of T_D. I doubt his Reddit account would stand out amongst the rest on that sub.

Duck Soup

FBI Director Christopher Wray at the Justice Dept press conference: "These were not hoax bombs."

I think Wray is getting ahead of the curve, before Trump starts spouting off about the threat "not being real".

Itssoeasy

When was one of these devices sent to senator Kamala Harris(or addressed to her at least) ?

everlast75

Itssoeasy wrote: »

When was one of these devices sent to senator Kamala Harris(or addressed to her at least) ?

Yep. Booker too.

Think its about 15 or so now...

Itssoeasy

Hopefully Trump will take the hint from the fact to the FBI director and Attorney general being there. As the Director of the FBI said these devices "weren't hoaxes."

mcmoustache

FatherTed wrote: »

I can't make up my mind if this guy was a Trump supporter:

https://twitter.com/thereal_mo01/status/1055844641952665600

Mmm. It's a bit inconclusive...

Itssoeasy

everlast75 wrote: »

Yep. Booker too.

Think its about 15 or so now...

I heard about Booker earlier but MSNBC put up the graphic and showed Kamala Harris and I'd not seen her name mentioned before. I wonder if Jeff sessions is there because he knows he's out as AG more than likely and is going out on the right side of this mess.

everlast75

everlast75 wrote: »

At 3:14am.. like any sane president would do.

Either there is a big story about to break, or the criticism over his rhetoric is starting to affect him*



*Unlikely as that is

https://twitter.com/matthewamiller/status/1055898146096713728?s=19

Itssoeasy

Van jones was praising Jeff sessions earlier. Jaysus lads that's not something that happens often.

Manic Moran

Long ballots are typical. We vote on bloody everything. Unless you’re trying to say that California is trying to suppress folks by way of long ballots,

Should the Bay Bridge (singular) increase tolls? On the ballot in nine counties. Should BART take out a bond to improve infrastructure? Also on the ballot in nine counties, only six of which have BART service. I get to vote on board members for the unified school district, the water resources board, mayor, city council, county council. State representative, state senator, congressional representative, congressional senator, Sheriff isn’t up for election in my county this year, but is in a neighboring one. No judges on next month’s ballot for me, or prosecutor, but they are commonly found. Should the current parcel tax to aid the East Bay Regional Parks District be extended? (County measure FF) Should the State Government be authorized to determine whether or not California will use Daylight Savings Time? (That one, Prop 7, doesn’t say whether or not we should change our clocks, it only gives the government authority to make the decision one way or the other). I even get to vote on whether or not ambulance drivers are to be on call when on their meal breaks. (Prop 11).

You get the idea. We get to vote on a hell of a lot, and when there are elections for positions, we can also have a hell of a lot of candidates which have to go on the paper. There is nothing nefarious about a long ballot in the US. It’s annoying as all hell, because we get bombarded by advertising for them all, and then we have to do a heck of a lot of research, but it’s normal.

Itssoeasy

Manic Moran wrote: »

Long ballots are typical. We vote on bloody everything. Unless you’re trying to say that California is trying to suppress folks by way of long ballots,

Should the Bay Bridge (singular) increase tolls? On the ballot in nine counties. Should BART take out a bond to improve infrastructure? Also on the ballot in nine counties, only six of which have BART service. I get to vote on board members for the unified school district, the water resources board, mayor, city council, county council. State representative, state senator, congressional representative, congressional senator, Sheriff isn’t up for election in my county this year, but is in a neighboring one. No judges on next month’s ballot for me, or prosecutor, but they are commonly found. Should the current parcel tax to aid the East Bay Regional Parks District be extended? (County measure FF) Should the State Government be authorized to determine whether or not California will use Daylight Savings Time? (That one, Prop 7, doesn’t say whether or not we should change our clocks, it only gives the government authority to make the decision one way or the other). I even get to vote on whether or not ambulance drivers are to be on call when on their meal breaks. (Prop 11).

You get the idea. We get to vote on a hell of a lot, and when there are elections for positions, we can also have a hell of a lot of candidates which have to go on the paper. There is nothing nefarious about a long ballot in the US. It’s annoying as all hell, because we get bombarded by advertising for them all, and then we have to do a heck of a lot of research, but it’s normal.

I mean when you think about it it makes sense to vote on as many elections or like you say everything and anything that needs to be voted on at the one time. But sixteen pages is mental though. I'd say they are people today annoyed(there always is) about having a presidential election and referendum on one day here in Ireland.

Leroy42

Long ballots are not the point Manic. The voters selection was changed!

Long ballots maybe increase the complexity to both the system and the voter but surely makinga selection should mean just that.

prawnsambo

Duck Soup wrote: »

Amazingly, Sayoc's Twitter account (under a pseudonym) is still open.

https://twitter.com/hardrock2016

That's not his main one. You'll find that one under the accounts he follows. Hint, he cleverly used the same avatar. Another name though; Julus Cesar Milan

mcmoustache

prawnsambo wrote: »

That's not his main one. You'll find that one under the accounts he follows. Hint, he cleverly used the same avatar.

Suspended now.

2 Scoops

Putting aside that this idiot could have killed multiple people, the irony is he's done irreparable damage for the mid terms elections at literally the worst possible time. He'll be made an example out of and rightly so, political violence of any kind should not be tolerated. I'm not tone deaf enough to suggest his acts are comparable to recent events or the rising heat between political divisions, if he gets put away for life some good might come out of it to calm the discourse. No matter peoples differences intimidation or violence must not tolerated under any circumstance.

In an ideal world Trump, Democratic leaders and some media heads should get together in a show of revolve and reinstate that their differences can only be settled through discourse and the ballot box. That's the only way Trump comes out of this in a positive light, but judging from his tweets earlier that I rolled my eyes at that's not going to happen. You can't put direct blame on anyone in this situation for the actions of others, but it's not black and white. Some of Trump's rhetoric has been very bad.

prawnsambo

mcmoustache wrote: »

Suspended now.

Looks like a few twitter accounts are being suspended. Came across another one that had engaged in deflection and it was suspended in the last half hour or so. Wonder have Twitter realised that they could be in trouble after ignoring obvious death threats from this nitter?

TomOnBoard

Manic Moran wrote: »

Long ballots are typical. We vote on bloody everything. Unless you’re trying to say that California is trying to suppress folks by way of long ballots,

Should the Bay Bridge (singular) increase tolls? On the ballot in nine counties. Should BART take out a bond to improve infrastructure? Also on the ballot in nine counties, only six of which have BART service. I get to vote on board members for the unified school district, the water resources board, mayor, city council, county council. State representative, state senator, congressional representative, congressional senator, Sheriff isn’t up for election in my county this year, but is in a neighboring one. No judges on next month’s ballot for me, or prosecutor, but they are commonly found. Should the current parcel tax to aid the East Bay Regional Parks District be extended? (County measure FF) Should the State Government be authorized to determine whether or not California will use Daylight Savings Time? (That one, Prop 7, doesn’t say whether or not we should change our clocks, it only gives the government authority to make the decision one way or the other). I even get to vote on whether or not ambulance drivers are to be on call when on their meal breaks. (Prop 11).

You get the idea. We get to vote on a hell of a lot, and when there are elections for positions, we can also have a hell of a lot of candidates which have to go on the paper. There is nothing nefarious about a long ballot in the US. It’s annoying as all hell, because we get bombarded by advertising for them all, and then we have to do a heck of a lot of research, but it’s normal.

Well, that's real local democracy in action, isn't it? There are very few places where people get to choose the answer to such questions. Elsewhere, the bungs & back-handers from the toll operator to local public officials would decide the question.

The downside may well be an over-confusing balloting process. This means that greater security of the process is needed and possible rigging must be dealt with harshly. That case of Ted Cruz appearing following a decision to vote Democrat across the board appears to be an appalling failure or else an egregious manipulation.

Manic Moran

Leroy42 wrote: »

Long ballots are not the point Manic. The voters selection was changed!

Long ballots maybe increase the complexity to both the system and the voter but surely makinga selection should mean just that.

I agree with you as far as that goes, but length and complexity of the ballot have nothing to do with it. Both you and Seamus have stated that it serves an intentional suppression effect.

everlast75

Before last night's really, there were chants of CNN sucks.

During rallies after Clinton was targeted, they chanted "lock her up"

After Dobbs floated the false flag theory, the President repeated that conspiracy theory.

After the fbi confirmed they were real bombs, this is where some of his supporters went to...

https://twitter.com/11thHour/status/1055988302749163520?s=19

Leroy42

There really is nothing you can say or do to talk to people like that. They are prepared to make up anything in order to preserve the feeling that they are right. People have mentioned a cult, and in many ways it is very like religion. One has a belief and any and all information needs to be twisted in order to fit in with that belief.

I just think that reporters such as that should merely ask that person why they claim to want to MAGA yet are so unconcerned with a direct attack on politicians within the country? What would they want done if ISIS tried to same thing against the GOP for example?

Leroy42

2 Scoops wrote: »

Putting aside that this idiot could have killed multiple people, the irony is he's done irreparable damage for the mid terms elections at literally the worst possible time. He'll be made an example out of and rightly so, political violence of any kind should not be tolerated. I'm not tone deaf enough to suggest his acts are comparable to recent events or the rising heat between political divisions, if he gets put away for life some good might come out of it to calm the discourse. No matter peoples differences intimidation or violence must not tolerated under any circumstance.

In an ideal world Trump, Democratic leaders and some media heads should get together in a show of revolve and reinstate that their differences can only be settled through discourse and the ballot box. That's the only way Trump comes out of this in a positive light, but judging from his tweets earlier that I rolled my eyes at that's not going to happen. You can't put direct blame on anyone in this situation for the actions of others, but it's not black and white. Some of Trump's rhetoric has been very bad.

A mild rebuke there 2Scoops. Trump has been appalling on this. One can argue all day about what level of blame lies with him and his rhetoric, but the craven and conspiratorial way that he has dealt with this, despite of course having direct knowledge of the ongoing invetigation let us not forget. This is not some nobody in Nowheresvile looking at a picture of the moon landing he found on the internet.

This is the POTUS, and he has been kept up to date on the exact nature (or should be) of what is going on. So to come out with a conspiracy when the FBI has pretty much determined the reality is all on him.

What happened to his concern about the people on the front line, his beloved first responders? Why no calls for them to be praised in all of this? Why no prayers that nobody got killed handling them? That no public got caught up in this? Because to do that would mean accepting that this was extremely serious.

The only thing he has said is that every resource is being given. That is just a way to try to make him look strong, that he is doing something. Absolutely no care for the people targeted, the general public or the democracy of the US.

Yet again, we have an act of terrorism undertaken on American soil, by a white American and yet Trump is almost completely silent save for making up crazy conspiracy stories.

And this is a person that you continue to support as the leader of the US? This person that clearly cares nothing about the US, only about the country he wants?

No other democractic politician in the world would have handled this the way Trump has. And that is not because I believe that all of them are better that Trump, but that the voters in their countries have not allowed themselves to sell out their own country for the cheap thrills of a few rallies.

I can understand Trump, don't like or agree with him, but I understand it. Its his supporters, and their willingness to sell their defence of the USA for a few laughs and some memes that disgust me.

Leroy42

Manic Moran wrote: »

I agree with you as far as that goes, but length and complexity of the ballot have nothing to do with it. Both you and Seamus have stated that it serves an intentional suppression effect.

With everything else that is patently wrong with the system over there do you really think that the ballots have been designed to aid the process?

A 16 page ballot would be fine, a little tiresome, but if that is what is needed to cover everything then so be it. But why create a system whereby not only do you have to go through the 16 pages but then check if the system actually recorded the selection you made rather than one somebody else wants? It is completely and totally insane.

So we know that there is active voter suppression. We know that there is aggressive gerrymandering. Why now that in some cases the postal ballots system is flawed. Yet you think it is somehow unthinkable, and by your response, unbelievable, that that ballots themselves were not designed in such a way as to favor one type of politician over another?

I fail to see how you can be so calm about it. When the thoughts of illegals voting was made up by Trump, and lets all remember that he simple made it up, many people were happy to see peoples private info shared with the Fed government to investigate.

But when shown evidence of actual voting fraud, whether intentional or simply system flaw, you seem almost resigned to it.

Manic Moran

Leroy42 wrote: »

With everything else that is patently wrong with the system over there do you really think that the ballots have been designed to aid the process?

A 16 page ballot would be fine, a little tiresome, but if that is what is needed to cover everything then so be it. But why create a system whereby not only do you have to go through the 16 pages but then check if the system actually recorded the selection you made rather than one somebody else wants? It is completely and totally insane.

So we know that there is active voter suppression. We know that there is aggressive gerrymandering. Why now that in some cases the postal ballots system is flawed. Yet you think it is somehow unthinkable, and by your response, unbelievable, that that ballots themselves were not designed in such a way as to favor one type of politician over another?

I don't know how they are designed in that particular county. Around here, the names are placed completely randomly and they force you to slow down and actually pay attention, straight ticket voting is plain impossible. They are still very long ballots. If you are going to be submitting something electronically or otherwise, I think it is a very good thing to check over the answers. When do you ever submit a form without going over it at least a second time?

If there is a coding error, either deliberate or accidental, which changes the ballot, that is a definite problem. That, however, seems not to be the case here.
https://www.texastribune.org/2018/10/26/texas-voting-machines-2018-straight-ticket-midterm-elections/

The bottom line: Voting machines aren’t malfunctioning. The secretary of state’s office is advising Texans to check their ballots and to double-check all votes cast before submitting their final ballot.

https://www.star-telegram.com/news/politics-government/election/article220602105.html

“The “enter” button on a Hart eSlate selects a voter’s choice. The selection wheel button on a Hart eSlate allows the voter to move up and down the ballot,” Ingram’s advisory stated. “It is important when voting on a Hart eSlate machine for the voter to use one button or the other and not both simultaneously, and for the voter to not hit the “Enter” button or use the selection wheel button until a page is fully rendered.

“A voter should note the response to the voter’s action on the keyboard prior to taking another keyboard action. It is also important for the voter to verify their selections are correct before casting their ballot.”

Election officials say voters should carefully review their ballot — and take as much time needed — before hitting the button to cast their vote.

You can make an argument that the equipment needs to be made more user-friendly. You can also make an argument that people just aren't taking their time. It's a problem which is possible with even a pen and paper

everlast75

The voting system appears to have fundamental problems.

There should be a neutral committee set up to oversee the elections in each county/state.

The idea that the guy at the top of the ballot paper oversees the election in which he is running is wrong.

Gerrymandering should be done away with once and for all.

Sunday voting should be allowed. All other attempts at voter suppression should be roundly criticised by both sides of the aisle.

I cannot see how americans, who claim that they live in the best country in the world, cannot see that the ability to vote is fundamental to how great a country is?

amandstu

Has anyone got an opinion as to what degree (in an ideological way) Trump feeds off his base vs how it feeds off him?

I was struck by the "GOD GREAT Spirit Blessings" under your president and mine on the side of the Magabomber's van...

Does he believe that c*** or did he just lift it from somewhere?

Itssoeasy

amandstu wrote: »

Has anyone got an opinion as to what degree (in an ideological way) Trump feeds off his base vs how it feeds off him?

I was struck by the "GOD GREAT Spirit Blessings" under your president and mine on the side of the Magabomber's van...

Does he believe that c*** or did he just lift it from somewhere?

I think it's a symbiotic relationship between Trump and his Base. He exploits their fears and misgivings about many things in America whether well founded or not and they see him as a validation of those fears.

alchemist33

Duck Soup wrote: »

FBI Director Christopher Wray at the Justice Dept press conference: "These were not hoax bombs."

I think Wray is getting ahead of the curve, before Trump starts spouting off about the threat "not being real".

He did tweet about it, putting the word "bombs" in quotation marks, so the curve is already that far around.