Donald Trump is the President Mark IV (Read Mod Warning in OP)

StringerBell · 12-10-2018 9:28pm

On the House I think the Democrats will take control by about 6/7 seats. Comfortable, once they get that all important vote out.

I see the Republicans holding the Senate,and actually picking up a seat. Its just the wrong election cycle for the Dems to take the Senate given the seats up for grabs.

Take the House, worry about the Senate later.

StringerBell · 12-10-2018 9:28pm

Double post

TomOnBoard · 12-10-2018 9:45pm

StringerBell wrote: »

On the House I think the Democrats will take control by about 6/7 seats. Comfortable, once they get that all important vote out.

I see the Republicans holding the Senate,and actually picking up a seat. Its just the wrong election cycle for the Dems to take the Senate given the seats up for grabs.

Take the House, worry about the Senate later.

If the Dems take the House, they will stymie much of what needs full Congressional approval until 2021. They will launch investigations in every conceivable committee into all the things they've found wrong since Trump came to power. In that case, expect total gridlock in US politics, given the levels of anger and hatred that now pervade politics there. The White House will be largely powerless, unless it starts to build consensus in the Congress.

And, if another Democratic USSC Justice seat is vacated (Im thinking of Clinton's nominees Ginsburg and Breyer, both in their 80s here), a Republican Senate will fight tooth and nail to make it an even more Conservative 6-3 than the current 5-4.

Its gonna be a vicious couple of years ahead, and that's not gonna be nice for progress.

mcmoustache · 12-10-2018 10:07pm

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Taylor Swift comes out in support of the Democrats and is heralded as a hero.

Kanye West meets Trump and is bombarded with hate press.

You just couldn't make this up. What a world.

Bold Kayne.:rolleyes:

One person said something smart and another went on stupid rants. Are you surprised that the reactions would differ?

Sweetemotion · 12-10-2018 11:27pm

pixelburp wrote: »

Kanye West however? He's ... an eccentric, which is as polite as I can put it. Maybe his presence at the White House persuaded as many thousands to register, but I honestly doubt it - and it sure wasn't his open intention going by the waffling stream of consciousness he indulged in.

I wouldn't be so sure of that, especially after CNN's onslaught of him last night.

elli21 · 13-10-2018 12:00am

Sweetemotion wrote: »

I wouldn't be so sure of that, especially after CNN's onslaught of him last night.

There was no "Onslaught " of that poor lad (Kanye West) by MSN.That chap is clearly and has spoken honestley a troubled individual...he talked about his mental health problems....which are valid topics...

If anyone is to be brought into question over this ....for me It's the glee I seen in Jared and Ivanka's face When he went on a rant....It was ...yes we have to show we have black's on our side...Sad

TomOnBoard · 13-10-2018 12:37am

Don Lemon was dead right last night. He called out the White House for its use and indeed, abuse, of Kanye West, who is patently in need of help. It was embarrassing to see him being used by Trump et al just so they can appear amenable to minorities. Lemon was angry that West was used by Trump, who was clearly dumbstruck by what was happening before him, yet allowed West to continue. It must be particularly galling for African- Americans, whose voting rights are being monstrously suppressed by Republicans in Georgia, Texas and elsewhere, to see one of their own used as a 'Minstrel' in the nakedly white White House.

RIGOLO · 13-10-2018 7:08am

TomOnBoard wrote: »

Don Lemon was dead right last night. He called out the White House for its use and indeed, abuse, of Kanye West, who is patently in need of help. It was embarrassing to see him being used by Trump et al just so they can appear amenable to minorities. Lemon was angry that West was used by Trump, who was clearly dumbstruck by what was happening before him, yet allowed West to continue. It must be particularly galling for African- Americans, whose voting rights are being monstrously suppressed by Republicans in Georgia, Texas and elsewhere, to see one of their own used as a 'Minstrel' in the nakedly white White House.

So your saying Don Lemon is right in dealing with a person who may have some mental health issues, is to go on main stream media CNN , and call that person a 'token negro' , 'part of a minstrel show' , and say 'his mother would be embarrassed' .

Thats an interesting way your supporting the treatment of someone with mental health issues.

in other news
Bob Woodwards book 'FEAR' just got knocked off the NY Times non-fiction list by
FOXNEWS TUCKER CARLSON - Ship Of Fools

everlast75 · 13-10-2018 7:48am

RIGOLO wrote: »

So your saying Don Lemon is right in dealing with a person who may have some mental health issues, is to go on main stream media CNN , and call that person a 'token negro' , 'part of a minstrel show' , and say 'his mother would be embarrassed' .

Thats an interesting way your supporting the treatment of someone with mental health issues.

in other news
Bob Woodwards book 'FEAR' just got knocked off the NY Times non-fiction list by
FOXNEWS TUCKER CARLSON - Ship Of Fools

If you were to accept your premise i.e. that those comments were inappropriate because Kayne has mental health issues, you are stating that he has mental health issues. If so, its wrong that Trump is taking advantage of someone like that.

If the premise is wrong i.e. that Kanye doesn't have mental issues, then you're criticism of Lemon is nonsense.

As for Tucker, let's see how long that will stay no 1 on the charts.

Incidentally, did you have a comment to make on the overall thrust of the book Fear, and the idea that Trump doesn't have a notion of what he is doing?

aloyisious · 13-10-2018 8:56am

Re the US economy and the US dollar, does anyone from the US think that Don should be given control of the Fed as an institute in order to get the US economy into the shape he personally thinks it should be, or would it be a bad step handing the economy over to a single person's control?

He's stated several times in recent months that he would like to relieve the Fed of it's independence and take control of it as it's way of doing it's business is not to his liking.

As the presidency is liable to be handed over to different political parties, would you agree with the PRESIDENCY being given extra control of the economy [through the Fed] without any control on what he/she could do with the means and methods of affecting the US national economy, aside those of taxation?

Dannyriver · 13-10-2018 8:57am

pixelburp wrote: »

I have no time for celebrities - least of all any who profess a dalliance into politics, 'cos their levels of 'woke'ness can be truly nauseating - but if someone like Taylor Swift making a public plea persuaded tens of thousands to register to vote? That's clearly a good thing. No democracy should discourage vote registration; more (young) people voting is always a good result in any democracy; and the conversation shouldn't be tainted by what party or creed she came out in favour of.

Kanye West however? He's ... an eccentric, which is as polite as I can put it. Maybe his presence at the White House persuaded as many thousands to register, but I honestly doubt it - and it sure wasn't his open intention going by the waffling stream of consciousness he indulged in.

Are there other professions you feel should also forfeit their right to political opinion once they join that particular rank?

Dannyriver · 13-10-2018 9:00am

everlast75 wrote: »

If you were to accept your premise i.e. that those comments were inappropriate because Kayne has mental health issues, you are stating that he has mental health issues. If so, its wrong that Trump is taking advantage of someone like that.

If the premise is wrong i.e. that Kanye doesn't have mental issues, then you're criticism of Lemon is nonsense.

As for Tucker, let's see how long that will stay no 1 on the charts.

Incidentally, did you have a comment to make on the overall thrust of the book Fear, and the idea that Trump doesn't have a notion of what he is doing?

That s the elephant in the room

RIGOLO · 13-10-2018 11:51am

everlast75 wrote: »

RIGOLO wrote: »

So your saying Don Lemon is right in dealing with a person who may have some mental health issues, is to go on main stream media CNN , and call that person a 'token negro' , 'part of a minstrel show' , and say 'his mother would be embarrassed' .

Thats an interesting way your supporting the treatment of someone with mental health issues.

in other news
Bob Woodwards book 'FEAR' just got knocked off the NY Times non-fiction list by
FOXNEWS TUCKER CARLSON - Ship Of Fools

If you were to accept your premise i.e. that those comments were inappropriate because Kayne has mental health issues, you are stating that he has mental health issues. If so, its wrong that Trump is taking advantage of someone like that.

If the premise is wrong i.e. that Kanye doesn't have mental issues, then you're criticism of Lemon is nonsense.

As for Tucker, let's see how long that will stay no 1 on the charts.

Incidentally, did you have a comment to make on the overall thrust of the book Fear, and the idea that Trump doesn't have a notion of what he is doing?

I never said what my premise was one way or the other on whether Kanye does or doesnt have mental health issues.
You need to re read my post and the one I quoted in it.
I just thought it interesting that another poster would in a single post , both support Don Lemon (calling Kanye a 'token negro', part of a minstrel show, and an embarrassment to his mother) and also say Kanye has mental health issues.
That seems to be a position at odds with itself.
Ive not said wheter I think he does or not have mental health issues.

As to Don Lemons comments, I think they were a disgrace, irrespective of whether or not Kanye has mental health issues
CNN didnt seem to mind Kanye 10 years ago when he was giving out about Bush and prison reform.
Going on main stream news and calling someone a 'token negro, part of a minstrel show ' , that just shows how low the left have gone in their standards.

batgoat · 13-10-2018 12:04pm

RIGOLO wrote: »

I never said what my premise was one way or the other on whether Kanye does or doesnt have mental health issues.
You need to re read my post and the one I quoted in it.
I just thought it interesting that another poster would in a single post , both support Don Lemon (calling Kanye a 'token negro', part of a minstrel show, and an embarrassment to his mother) and also say Kanye has mental health issues.
That seems to be a position at odds with itself.
Ive not said wheter I think he does or not have mental health issues.

As to Don Lemons comments, I think they were a disgrace, irrespective of whether or not Kanye has mental health issues
CNN didnt seem to mind Kanye 10 years ago when he was giving out about Bush and prison reform.
Going on main stream news and calling someone a 'token negro, part of a minstrel show ' , that just shows how low the left have gone in their standards.

That's how everyone viewed it without the assistance of cnn. West's behaviour is frankly bizarre, including weird attacks on the 13th amendment. He mentioned that he was "misdiagnosed" with bipolar and I think it's fair to question if the white house are taking advantage of a mentally unwell celebrity.

pixelburp · 13-10-2018 12:27pm

Dannyriver wrote: »

Are there other professions you feel should also forfeit their right to political opinion once they join that particular rank?

'forfeit their right'? Get a grip, not saying anything of the sort. Especially as I clearly say how it's still a good side-effect that a celebrity's publicity stunt causes an uptick in voter registration. But I don't particularly hold the opinions of cosseted US celebrities in any great esteem, nor respect the slavishness with which their opinions on race, sex or politics are reported. They're people with experiences just like anyone else, but why should their opinion be held to be more valid or legitimate on something compared with those on the front-lines of these things? Oh sure, the current US President is a TV celebrity, so it's not that surprising the media hangs off the every word of a famous celebrity, but that in of itself shows there's a problem with the political structures.

Timberrrrrrrr · 13-10-2018 12:37pm

pixelburp wrote: »

'forfeit their right'? Get a grip, not saying anything of the sort. Especially as I clearly say how it's still a good side-effect that a celebrity's publicity stunt causes an uptick in voter registration. But I don't particularly hold the opinions of cosseted US celebrities in any great esteem, nor respect the slavishness with which their opinions on race, sex or politics are reported. They're people with experiences just like anyone else, but why should their opinion be held to be more valid or legitimate on something compared with those on the front-lines of these things? Oh sure, the current US President is a TV celebrity, so it's not that surprising the media hangs off the every word of a famous celebrity, but that in of itself shows there's a problem with the political structures.

My personal opinion after seeing that car crash that was Trumye/kanump (yes i decided i will call it one or the other) is that Trump decided he needed a celebrity "face" to generate votes/publicity.

The sad thing is he doesn't realize that he himself has been used in the very same manner by the rep party.

StringerBell · 13-10-2018 1:23pm

Kid rock was there too, they were having a signing of a new bill. To do with music, can't think of the name of it right now but it's basically to help artists get their royalties easier if I remember correctly.

The Kanye thing was bizarre of course, but it was always supposed to be. I used to love Kanye, musically he was/is a genius but something has been off about him for a long time now. I would genuinely worry for his mental health, not just based off his Rodman/Kim relationship he is being used for with Trump.

Dannyriver · 13-10-2018 1:39pm

pixelburp wrote: »

'forfeit their right'? Get a grip, not saying anything of the sort. Especially as I clearly say how it's still a good side-effect that a celebrity's publicity stunt causes an uptick in voter registration. But I don't particularly hold the opinions of cosseted US celebrities in any great esteem, nor respect the slavishness with which their opinions on race, sex or politics are reported. They're people with experiences just like anyone else, but why should their opinion be held to be more valid or legitimate on something compared with those on the front-lines of these things? Oh sure, the current US President is a TV celebrity, so it's not that surprising the media hangs off the every word of a famous celebrity, but that in of itself shows there's a problem with the political structures.

you wrote 'I have no time for celebrities - least of all any who profess a dalliance into politics, 'cos their levels of 'woke'ness can be truly nauseating'

You might want to rephrase your original post to 'I have no time for people who treat celebrities opinions on politics who have experiences like anyone else as somehow more valid or legitimate.'

Your original text suggests that you have a problem with celebrities expressing opinions.

By the way I agree I don t understand why people treat celebs opinions so sacrosanctly. But i do appreciate the likes of Willie Nelson or the Dixie Chicks who give an opinion even though they know they ll be despised in their audience demographic for doing so.

Water John · 13-10-2018 2:00pm

Have the Govn't and Trump said or done anything in relation to the aftermath of Hurricane Michael? Haven't seen it being mentioned.

Duck Soup · 13-10-2018 2:58pm

The vague rumblings are that Mueller is starting to wind down his probe. The suggestion is that the Trump interview is one of the last to-do items (and unless Team Trump is blazingly stupid, they would have always kept Trump at least one remove from any Russian shenanigans).

I've no doubt that right-wing political commentators will suggest it's because there's nothing to see. Nothing was uncovered. But I think it's a bit more practical than that. After the mid-terms, Jeff Sessions is toast. The new AG will be fully White House compliant and will throw in not only every impediment to the Mueller investigation, but also attempt to partially or wholly block publication of the report. And this is where the Kavanaugh confirmation starts to pay back. If the legal and political wrangling require refereeing, then Kavanaugh has a more generous interpretation of executive power than any justice alive.

I think Mueller has sat down with his team and formulated a plan to tie everything up before the mid-terms. The report will doubtless come out after the voting is over, but it'll be there with a nice big red bow on it, ready for delivery.

Water John · 13-10-2018 3:16pm

The questions sent to Trump may only be partial. They relate to before the Presidency, only AFAIK.
Obstruction of Justice may be a different module.

pixelburp · 13-10-2018 3:18pm

Well is there still time for a midterms October Suprise?

And on the Sessions issue, is there actually any evidence or tattle that he's for the chopping block? Trump seems perfectly capable of firing at any stage and damn the timing; plus while he has publicly attacked his AG (in of itself an abnormal tactic for any politician), he attacks everyone, so don't immediately buy into the idea that he's biding his time.

Igotadose · 13-10-2018 4:57pm

Trump's new hero: Robert E. Lee. Hey, he like, won for awhile. Then lost. And, hey, he was a slave owning racist and more recent biographies remove the veneer from him. But, there are good people on both sides, yinno?

https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/411237-trump-robert-e-lee-was-a-great-general

No gutter too low for Trump to dive into.

TomOnBoard · 13-10-2018 7:04pm

batgoat wrote: »

That's how everyone viewed it without the assistance of cnn. West's behaviour is frankly bizarre, including weird attacks on the 13th amendment. He mentioned that he was "misdiagnosed" with bipolar and I think it's fair to question if the white house are taking advantage of a mentally unwell celebrity.

As was so predictable, Trump used Kanye's cringe-worthy visit to the White House to puff out his claim to the "black vote" at last night's rally, among a range of other fan- stoking drivel. No depths to which he will not go! :eek:

Captain Obvious · 13-10-2018 7:58pm

Far right elements seem to be getting more brave.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/far-right-proud-boys-kick-punch-people-in-new-york?ref=scroll

Members of a far-right group called the “Proud Boys” got in a violent encounter in New York on Friday night after a speech from Gavin McInnes, the group’s leader, with videos showing more than a dozen members of the group kicking and punching people on the ground.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/brett-kavanaugh-vote-man-threatens-shoot-congress-supreme-court-florida-republicans-a8571586.html

A Florida man has been accused of threatening to shoot members of Congress and their families if Supreme Court nominee Brett Kavanaugh is not confirmed.

Authorities said James Royal Patrick Jr posted a series of threatening messages on social media last week, one of which said, "Getting ready if Kav is not confirmed . . . whoever I think is to blame may God have mercy on their soul," according to a statement from the Polk County Sheriff's Office.

There was a poster concerned about a woman from the left pushing a politicians son during a protest. I guess what's considered violent for the left is a lot less violent than what is violent for the right.

TomOnBoard · 13-10-2018 8:16pm

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Far right elements seem to be getting more brave.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/far-right-proud-boys-kick-punch-people-in-new-york?ref=scroll

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/brett-kavanaugh-vote-man-threatens-shoot-congress-supreme-court-florida-republicans-a8571586.html

There was a poster concerned about a woman from the left pushing a politicians son during a protest. I guess what's considered violent for the left is a lot less violent than what is violent for the right.

New depths of latent violence are being plumbed daily. Here's Pennsylvania Republican gubernatorial candidate Scott Wagner:

“Governor Wolf, let me tell you, between now and November 6th, you better put a catcher’s mask on your face because I’m gonna stomp all over your face with golf spikes....”

Now, I'm sure its not all on one side, and that Dems have their own ignominious moments, but FFS, where in any normal handbook of politicking are techniques like this recommended?

Rjd2 · 14-10-2018 12:17am

Igotadose wrote: »

Trump's new hero: Robert E. Lee. Hey, he like, won for awhile. Then lost. And, hey, he was a slave owning racist and more recent biographies remove the veneer from him. But, there are good people on both sides, yinno?

https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/411237-trump-robert-e-lee-was-a-great-general

No gutter too low for Trump to dive into.

He was praising Grant in his home state for beating a formidable general in General Lee. That was the point of the speech, you can loath Lee's side but like Rommel admit he was a formidable foe that needed someone special to beat him which Grant clearly was.

Credit to Miles Kahn a Samantha Bee producer (so raging right winger) to correct this and not go down the Think Progress/Krassenstein brothers cheap clickbait style actions. As Miles points out there is more than enough to criticise Trump for on a daily basis anyhow.
https://twitter.com/mileskahn/status/1050953048036712448

Rjd2 · 14-10-2018 12:30am

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Far right elements seem to be getting more brave.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/far-right-proud-boys-kick-punch-people-in-new-york?ref=scroll

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/brett-kavanaugh-vote-man-threatens-shoot-congress-supreme-court-florida-republicans-a8571586.html

There was a poster concerned about a woman from the left pushing a politicians son during a protest. I guess what's considered violent for the left is a lot less violent than what is violent for the right.

Both sides have dangerous supporters so not sure anyone can really take the moral high ground. Scalise was shot last year and there has been plenty of intimidation of Republicans elsewhere whether from Antifa or others. Then you only recently had a Democrat staffer leak the addresses and phone numbers of GOP people.

So the amusing spectacle of both sides over the last few years, republicans previously and the dems now both trying to claim the moral high ground while never owning up to there crazies is infuriating.

On Mc Innes?

Guy is trash and has always been, but I dunno if he has much influence these days. I hope not anyhow.

Rhineshark · 14-10-2018 7:22am

Rjd2 wrote: »

Both sides have dangerous supporters so not sure anyone can really take the moral high ground. Scalise was shot last year and there has been plenty of intimidation of Republicans elsewhere whether from Antifa or others. Then you only recently had a Democrat staffer leak the addresses and phone numbers of GOP people.

I dunno - don't recall the details of the last one offhand, but the democrats seem far more willing to call out their own side. I don't remember any "very fine people on both sides" crap regarding the shooting. And regarding say sexual assault, Franken stood down. The republicans went down all guns blazing for theirs.

So the amusing spectacle of both sides over the last few years, republicans previously and the dems now both trying to claim the moral high ground while never owning up to there crazies is infuriating.

Not even so much that Dems have the high ground as the GOP seem to keep trying to burrow through to China to keep the bar low enough for Trump's behaviour in particular, but also that of some pro-Rep nominees/runners (eg Moore) to be ignorable.

Honestly it's a bit of a false equivalence at the moment. This is not calling the Dems squeaky saints, it's pointing out just how bad the GOP have gotten under Trump's influence.

Leroy42 · 14-10-2018 9:51am

Rjd2 wrote: »

He was praising Grant in his home state for beating a formidable general in General Lee. That was the point of the speech, you can loath Lee's side but like Rommel admit he was a formidable foe that needed someone special to beat him which Grant clearly was.

Credit to Miles Kahn a Samantha Bee producer (so raging right winger) to correct this and not go down the Think Progress/Krassenstein brothers cheap clickbait style actions. As Miles points out there is more than enough to criticise Trump for on a daily basis anyhow.
https://twitter.com/mileskahn/status/1050953048036712448

So yet again, Trump makes a speech that people need to come on to try and give their impression of what he really meant. For a man that tells it like it is surprising just how often he doesn't mean what he actually said.

But lets look at what he said. He was praising a confederate general, a person that fought against the US state and in aim of keeping slavery. They were defeated, thankfully, as that lead to the USA of today. The USA that all these supporters cheer and love and want to make great again.

So was the making these comments in order to say that while he may have been a good general in terms of the military, he was on the wrong side of the fight and luckily for everyone that the other side were better and on in the end? Was he making them to show that talented people can be wrong? That despite his other virtues he should only be talked about in terms of how wrong he was and the threat he posed to the USA? That far from being a hero, looking back now he must be seen as a terrorist against the USA?

Or are we supposed to think that Trump was giving a lecture on the great military minds of the past?

No, he was playing to the audience. An audience that continues to idolise these people and wish that their side had won.

And this is not the first time that he has clearly shown admiration for the confederates. It is almost as if, if you were to take him at his words and deeds, that the man considers the Confederation was a just cause. Almost like both sides had a good argument.

Donald Trump is the President Mark IV (Read Mod Warning in OP)

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