Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread X: [****]

elliot_st

Former Former wrote: »

Kelleher signing going to happen according to this

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/connacht-winger-cian-kelleher-will-return-to-leinster-next-season-1.3750487

not a surprise.

MattD

Think that would confirm that one of if not both of Dave and Ferg aren't going to be around next season.

Even if Larmour and Rob get a rest after the world cup, Lowe, Tomane, B Daly, A Byrne, Ferg, Dave and the academy would have been well enough to start the season with.

elliot_st

Rob's contract is out at the end of the season too, as is Daly/Byrne.

Was Tomane's contract length confirmed anywhere?

troyzer

elliot_st wrote: »

Rob's contract is out at the end of the season too, as is Daly/Byrne.

Was Tomane's contract length confirmed anywhere?

RTÉ had it at two years when it was originally announced.

elliot_st

Ages as of start of next season:

Rob Kearney(33) - Signed central contract until 2019 WC.
Fergus McFadden(33) - Signed contract in 2018.
Dave Kearney(30) - Signed contract in 2018.
Joe Tomane(29) - Signed 2yr contract in 2018.
James Lowe(27) - Signed 3yr contract in 2017.
Barry Daly(26) - Signed contract in 2017.
Adam Byrne(25) - Signed contract in 2017.
Cian Kelleher(25) - Signing this summer.
Hugo Keenan(23) - Academy Yr 3.
Jordan Larmour(22) - Signed contract in 2018.
Jack Kelly(21) - Academy Yr 3.

Buer

Kelleher signing makes sense in terms of depth if we are set to lose 1-2 guys from our current options. If Kearney moves on, Larmour is going to be seeing more time with Ireland and there will be a knock on impact. From the above, it would look like McFadden and DK are going to be around next season. I'd be surprised if Daly doesn't stay too although, given his age and late introduction to professional rugby, he might be eager to maximise his earnings if something is on the table elsewhere.

Whilst he'll give an option, I don't see him adding much at this point. Hopefully a season working with Lancaster will bring him along because, currently, he's a slightly lower tier Adam Byrne in my eyes. They're roughly similar from an attacking perspective (Kelleher better in broken field but Byrne far better attacking kicks from his half backs and offloading) and neither are great defenders although there is a notable gap between their relative ability under a high ball.

Zzippy

Stheno wrote: »

You can. I just put zzippy on ignore and can no longer see his posts.

If only mods had this luxury... :pac:

Dubinusa

Utterly weird move. He's doing well in Galway.
He's going to miss out on the big matches bar injuries.
I prefer Barry Daly, so I hope he stays. Kelleher would be behind Larmour, lowe,A.B and Dk if he signs.
He's going to regret this move imo.

elliot_st

Dubinusa wrote: »

Utterly weird move. He's doing well in Galway.
He's going to miss out on the big matches bar injuries.
I prefer Barry Daly, so I hope he stays. Kelleher would be behind Larmour, lowe,A.B and Dk if he signs.
He's going to regret this move imo.

he wont be behind DK.

FellasFellas

Kelleher will be ahead of Byrne and DK. Daly will get re signed definitely, he was going to be capped in last years and this years November windows were it not for injury.

sydthebeat

Dubinusa wrote: »

Utterly weird move. He's doing well in Galway.
He's going to miss out on the big matches bar injuries.
I prefer Barry Daly, so I hope he stays. Kelleher would be behind Larmour, lowe,A.B and Dk if he signs.
He's going to regret this move imo.

when selecting from the above for 3 back three positions, he would get plenty of game time. Larmour will be in camp a lot too, as Lowe may possibly be in 2020 as well

Former Former

elliot_st wrote: »

he wont be behind DK.

If he was here this season, he would be (if DK could ever stay fit)

The Kelleher signing to me suggests that Rob K is retiring or heading to France when he gets back from Japan.

LostArt

Have heard that Sexton's definitely out

elliot_st

LostArt wrote: »

Have heard that Sexton's definitely out

hardly a surprise at this stage.

going to be a serious test of the squad.

Former Former

Deleted User wrote: »

The Kelleher signing to me suggests that Rob K is retiring or heading to France when he gets back from Japan.

Even if he's not, we still need cover.

Larmour is going to be away with Ireland more and more, Tomane will only be here next season and won't be renewed, McFadden has another year or two at most in him, DK is made of glass and I don't know if we have any good wingers in the academy.

Get him in next season, see if he's any use and it will probably be the following season when he's most needed.

Former Former

Former Former wrote: »

Even if he's not, we still need cover.

Larmour is going to be away with Ireland more and more, Tomane will only be here next season and won't be renewed, McFadden has another year or two at most in him, DK is made of glass and I don't know if we have any good wingers in the academy.

I think Tomane is a centre primarily who can step in at wing and occupies the same role in the team as ROL.

As others have said - this is a piece of recruitment with 2021 in mind and the books might potentially be a bit full now next season albeit with probably 1 or 2 moving on or retiring the following season.

It gives Kelleher a year to get to grips with the setup before he is going to be fully needed.

elliot_st

Tomane is not needed really.

Buer

Deleted User wrote: »

I think Tomane is a centre primarily who can step in at wing and occupies the same role in the team as ROL.

Other way around with Tomane. Never played centre before Montpellier where he split his time fairly evenly between centre and wing.

After the pretty brutal start to his Leinster career at 12, he played his next 3 games on the wing so I wonder if they've decided to focus him out wide more in his natural position.

elliot_st

elliot_st wrote: »

Tomane is not needed really.

The jury is still out on Tomane. We haven't seen anything close to his best and I can't help but feel he was really lacking in confidence before he got injured.

I think he could have a lot to offer and it would be very good for Leinster if he was able to capture his prior form and build his confidence within the setup.

He may end up not working out, but I think he has enough talent and experience that he should be given as much opportunity as possible to show what he can do.

Buer

Buer wrote: »

Other way around with Tomane. Never played centre before Montpellier where he split his time fairly evenly between centre and wing.

After the pretty brutal start to his Leinster career at 12, he played his next 3 games on the wing so I wonder if they've decided to focus him out wide more in his natural position.

I hear what you are saying but I think Leinster signed him as a centre / back three in that order as that was our primary need coming into the season.

We don't have enough of a sample size to say with confidence where his preferred position is. I think the problem for Tomane is two fold.

Firstly he wasn't fit when he got here. Not a lack of effort on his part, just the philosophy around size and conditioning in France is drastically different to what is emphasised in Leinster. He got a knock in one of the warm up games which cost him a few weeks of pre season also.

Secondly I think he was really lacking in confidence. He drew immediate comparisons with Nacewa who was a departing legend of the club. He was coming in to play centre outside one of the most exacting and demanding out halves in world rugby, playing an intricate brand of rugby with a lot of pressure put on centres off set plays. Leinster also had a new backs coach and I think there was a perfect storm there for Tomane to struggle to find his feet.

Whether his move to wing was as a result of performances or squad needs is a point of debate, but I stand by my assertion that we've yet to see what Tomane can do and if he finds form / confidence and a run of fitness I think he has the ability to change a lot of minds.

Seems like a nice chap so I hope he does it.

Clegg

The reaction to Tomane from certain corners is rather disappointing. He had a tough start, but writing him off after a few poor performances is silly.

Poisonous even.

jonok28

Clegg wrote: »

The reaction to Tomane from certain corners is rather disappointing. He had a tough start, but writing him off after a few poor performances is silly.

Poisonous even.

I'll admit I have been very critical of Tomane, I was at a few of the games at the start that he played in and I just thought he had very poor body language and was making silly mistakes and turning over the ball at an alarming rate but I think he got fitter as he played and started to turn it around a bit and was really starting to string a few good performances together before the injury.

I think we expected him to come in and make the same impact Lowe, Fardy or Nacewa made and that was probably an unfair level of expectation to put on his shoulders. Hopefully when he returns he can up his game and continue to improve.

troyzer

jonok28 wrote: »

I'll admit I have been very critical of Tomane, I was at a few of the games at the start that he played in and I just thought he had very poor body language and was making silly mistakes and turning over the ball at an alarming rate but I think he got fitter as he played and started to turn it around a bit and was really starting to string a few good performances together before the injury.

I think we expected him to come in and make the same impact Lowe, Fardy or Nacewa made and that was probably an unfair level of expectation to put on his shoulders. Hopefully when he returns he can up his game and continue to improve.

I'd be along these lines as well. I thought he had a very poor game at Toulouse but he looked much better against Kings and Treviso before getting injured.

Giving him time in those squad games will do him a lot of good to get used to the system.

arsebiscuits1

Clegg wrote: »

The reaction to Tomane from certain corners is rather disappointing. He had a tough start, but writing him off after a few poor performances is silly.

Poisonous even.

He has played 9 times for Leinster. It is insane the amount of people dismissing a player after that little game time.

I think people are forgetting that the only game in which you could definitively say he was a liability was the Cardiff game (his debut) he didn't exactly light up the other ones but he was far from a liability.

Unfortunately he appears to have fallen into the "it's fashionable to not rate him" category which Gibson Park was consistently in until the Scarlets game last season.

Richie_Rich89

With O'Loughlin, O'Brien and Reid producing the goods at 12, based purely on merit, Tomane should have slipped back to fourth or fifth choice in the position. Cullen will want to perpetuate Leinster's reputation as a place where overseas players are well looked after, so it remains to be seen whether Tomane is afforded preferential treatment.

Former Former

Kelleher move confirmed by the weshties apparently:
https://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2019/0108/1021906-cian-kelleher-to-return-to-leinster-next-season/

troyzer

Richie_Rich89 wrote: »

With O'Loughlin, O'Brien and Reid producing the goods at 12, based purely on merit, Tomane should have slipped back to fourth or fifth choice in the position. Cullen will want to perpetuate Leinster's reputation as a place where overseas players are well looked after, so it remains to be seen whether Tomane is afforded preferential treatment.

Not even a mention of Henshaw, Ireland's starting 12.

What is wrong with you?

thomond2006

Please.

Wegians89

troyzer wrote: »

Not even a mention of Henshaw, Ireland's starting 12.

What is wrong with you?

He was part of the swap deal with Kelleher, presume he’s coming home too