Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread X: [****]

antietam1

Edinburgh away, tough.

AbusesToilets

AbusesToilets wrote: »

Leinster, for whatever reason, play a far better style of rugby than the national team. The have similarities in their structure, but they much better in attack and utilising space.

Much, much weaker opposition.

The Lost Sheep

AbusesToilets wrote: »

Leinster, for whatever reason, play a far better style of rugby than the national team. The have similarities in their structure, but they much better in attack and utilising space.

More space and time to play, weaker opposition etc

AbusesToilets

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Much, much weaker opposition.

I think that's a touch simplistic view of it. They run better support lines and use the forwards more effectively with ball in hand too, tho some of that is probably personnel related.

The Lost Sheep

AbusesToilets wrote: »

I think that's a touch simplistic view of it. They run better support lines and use the forwards more effectively with ball in hand too, tho some of that is probably personnel related.

No it isnt. Provincial rugby is slower/more space to do things and the international players are better than the leinster players.

AbusesToilets

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

No it isnt. Provincial rugby is slower/more space to do things and the international players are better than the leinster players.

That's not an absolute. You're talking about the knock out stages of the HC. There's been many games that were played at an international intensity, as stated by the Ayers themselves.

The Lost Sheep

AbusesToilets wrote: »

That's not an absolute. You're talking about the knock out stages of the HC. There's been many games that were played at an international intensity, as stated by the Ayers themselves.

Many games is stretching it.

AbusesToilets

AbusesToilets wrote: »

I think that's a touch simplistic view of it. They run better support lines and use the forwards more effectively with ball in hand too, tho some of that is probably personnel related.

It's not really. National teams tend to be more stacked and they are almost always far more motivated. Pulling on your countries colours is actually a big deal for a lot of people and you have a much greater sense of responsibility to perform.

That can get diluted - but no where near as fast as the pro/club game does. We're a little spoiled in that the provinces are quite home grown - but if you think a bunch of merc's in France could care less about the local club you are largely mistaken. It's gotten so bad that the French national team don't give a damn anymore either.

Pride or at least 'Proudness' is a powerful motivator.

Richie_Rich89

It's down to slightly differing coaching philosophies between Smith and Lancaster. Lancaster coaches his teams to be "comfortable in chaos", playing what's in front of them, which leads to a more fluid, but somewhat less accurate style. Smith's big into detail and clarity and playing to structure, which leads to greater accuracy, but more rigidity and less adaptability.

Richie_Rich89

durthacht wrote: »

Cullen had a disappointing campaign as coach four years ago followed by success. He's clearly a terrible coach.

Lancaster had a disappointing campaign as coach four years ago followed by success. He's clearly a brilliant coach.

Terrific argument.

Lancaster's World Cup went awfully, but he has four consecutive 2nd place finishes in the 6N to his name as well. He never managed to quite get over the line, but he was always consistently very good.

What does Cullen's record look like when he's the head man without someone else to do the coaching for him?

2014/2015 MOC plus Cullen
Euro semi

2015/2016 Cullen on his own
Last place in pool, win one from six

2016/2017 Cullen plus Lancaster
Euro semi

He's to be commended for recognising his limitations, and looking to address the issue, but the picture is stark. His coaching record is horrendous.

Of course that's not to say the current set-up isn't working excellently. Cullen has found his niche. But all the evidence points to Leinster's revival being almost exclusively down to Lancaster.

salmocab

Almost exclusively down to Lancaster? That’s utter crap, You really do post some nonsense and I genuinely can’t decide if you believe it or are you a crank that just likes to provoke people with contrarian views.

sydthebeat

salmocab wrote: »

Almost exclusively down to Lancaster? That’s utter crap, You really do post some nonsense and I genuinely can’t decide if you believe it or are you a crank that just likes to provoke people with contrarian views.

Probably a bit from column a and a bit from column b.

It's only the sea gulls here though that give his BS any energy (and generally the only one who can read them too)

Former Former

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/pro14/robbie-henshaw-a-doubt-for-leinster-s-champions-cup-quarter-final-1.3830230

No Henshaw for the QF by the sounds of it. Luke McGrath back training though

Clegg

Sounds like Leavy will be back too which is great news. Really strengthens the pack. Losing Henshaw is a blow as he'd be the one to reign in McCloskey.

Luke McGrath returning could allow us to field Lowe as well.

Interested Observer

Good thing COB has shown up so well, would be a big game for him to come into but he's well able imo. Leavy back is great, he'll obviously start at 7. I've a feeling Lowe might have fallen slightly out of favour after his red card so wouldn't be shocked if he's left out, and to be fair Dave Kearney has shown up really well recently along with Byrne.

salmocab

Interested Observer wrote: »

Good thing COB has shown up so well, would be a big game for him to come into but he's well able imo. Leavy back is great, he'll obviously start at 7. I've a feeling Lowe might have fallen slightly out of favour after his red card so wouldn't be shocked if he's left out, and to be fair Dave Kearney has shown up really well recently along with Byrne.

Lowe will miss out because Fardy is needed with Toner out and JGP is playing great on top of MC Grath just coming back.

Buer

It will be interesting to see if they look at COB. ROL has performed well previously but he's not a 12 really despite covering there previously. It would be a massive vote of confidence in COB if he got the nod for this one. He would have his hands full opposite McCloskey though.

The back row selection will be a curious one. Hopefully Leavy can get 60 minutes under his belt this weekend which would put him in a good position for the following week and potentially starting.

Ideally, I'd go with a back row of Ruddock, Leavy and Conan with SOB on the bench. I think the front five pick themselves at this point.

I imagine Lowe will be the one to miss out again due to requirements elsewhere with Toner out and Luke McGrath trying to get match fit. I would hope for a starting back line of JGP, Sexton, Larmour, COB, Ringrose, Byrne, Kearney. The race for the 23 jersey will be very tight with McFadden, DK, Reid, ROL, Daly and Tomane all in the shake up for it. I think ROL has an edge there due to his ability to cover wing and centre, though. I wouldn't be surprised to see any one of them in the jersey though.

Richie_Rich89

Tomane back in harness as well. Presumably he'll start versus Ulster if he's in the run-on team in Murrayfield. The need to get some continuity going into the QF means it's necessary to pick as many of the first choice players as possible.

Interested Observer

Buer wrote: »

It will be interesting to see if they look at COB. ROL has performed well previously but he's not a 12 really despite covering there previously. It would be a massive vote of confidence in COB if he got the nod for this one. He would have his hands full opposite McCloskey though.

I actually forgot about ROL. Also a good option.

Exclamation Marc

Buer wrote: »

It will be interesting to see if they look at COB. ROL has performed well previously but he's not a 12 really despite covering there previously. It would be a massive vote of confidence in COB if he got the nod for this one. He would have his hands full opposite McCloskey though.

I hope they do have faith in him as COB v McCloskey would be a fascinating battle. Would also be very interested to see him play with Ringrose (for more than 3 minutes). If he kicks on, I'd be interested whether theyd consider him starting with Garry and Henshaw dropping back to 15 if/when Kearney moves on (which I'm not hoping for any time soon).

Richie_Rich89

When he was fit, Tomane was second choice 12 behind Henshaw, second choice left wing behind Lowe, and vying with McFadden to be second choice right wing behind Larmour. There's no reason to believe he's slipped behind anyone in any of those three positions in his absence. Previous good displays by Adam Byrne and Rory O'Loughlin didn't count for anything when Tomane was being preferred to them even though his displays were distinctly underwhelming. So I expect him to continue where he left off. Definitely in the XXIII, and probably starting, given Henshaw and/or Lowe could be unavailable.

Richie_Rich89

Buer wrote: »

It will be interesting to see if they look at COB. ROL has performed well previously but he's not a 12 really despite covering there previously. It would be a massive vote of confidence in COB if he got the nod for this one. He would have his hands full opposite McCloskey though.

The back row selection will be a curious one. Hopefully Leavy can get 60 minutes under his belt this weekend which would put him in a good position for the following week and potentially starting.

Ideally, I'd go with a back row of Ruddock, Leavy and Conan with SOB on the bench. I think the front five pick themselves at this point.

I imagine Lowe will be the one to miss out again due to requirements elsewhere with Toner out and Luke McGrath trying to get match fit. I would hope for a starting back line of JGP, Sexton, Larmour, COB, Ringrose, Byrne, Kearney. The race for the 23 jersey will be very tight with McFadden, DK, Reid, ROL, Daly and Tomane all in the shake up for it. I think ROL has an edge there due to his ability to cover wing and centre, though. I wouldn't be surprised to see any one of them in the jersey though.

It'll be either:

11. Lowe, 12. Tomane, 13. Ringrose, 14. Larmour, 15. Kearney; 23. Byrne/O'Loughlin/Kearney/McFadden

or:

11. Tomane, 12. O'Loughlin, 13. Ringrose, 14. Larmour, 15. Kearney; 23. Byrne/Kearney/McFadden

Burkie1203

Richie_Rich89 wrote: »

Lancaster's World Cup went awfully, but he has four consecutive 2nd place finishes in the 6N to his name as well. He never managed to quite get over the line, but he was always consistently very good.

What does Cullen's record look like when he's the head man without someone else to do the coaching for him?

2014/2015 MOC plus Cullen
Euro semi

2015/2016 Cullen on his own
Last place in pool, win one from six

2016/2017 Cullen plus Lancaster
Euro semi

He's to be commended for recognising his limitations, and looking to address the issue, but the picture is stark. His coaching record is horrendous.

Of course that's not to say the current set-up isn't working excellently. Cullen has found his niche. But all the evidence points to Leinster's revival being almost exclusively down to Lancaster.

Leo spent a season or more undoing the damage inflicted by Matt O'Connor. That cannot be under estimated. A lot of younger players have spoken about how they felt excluded and Sexton spoke about how standards had slipped.

D14Rugby

Can we please stop quoting. Just a load of nonsense.

Burkie1203

D14Rugby wrote: »

Can we please stop quoting. Just a load of nonsense.

If i want to respond to some one I will

If you dont like it, tough. But stop telling people to stop quoting. Please.

Shefwedfan

D14Rugby wrote: »

Can we please stop quoting. Just a load of nonsense.

It's a forum, people can discuss what they want....Not sure when this started but I see this regular telling people not to quote, trying to put down a poster.....


If you have a problem then click on the report button.....your opinion is not superior to someone else's

Shefwedfan

Any chance Sexton will get a run this weekend?

Would like to see him and McGrath get a run together

Interested Observer

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Any chance Sexton will get a run this weekend?

Would like to see him and McGrath get a run together

I'd say there's no chance at all, would be fairly unprecedented. I can see the logic though.

Shefwedfan

Interested Observer wrote: »

I'd say there's no chance at all, would be fairly unprecedented. I can see the logic though.

It’s more wishful thinking

arsebiscuits1

Edinburgh away is as good a fixture as we could have hoped for before the quarters. Their pack wont give an inch and they're in a dog fight of their own for the playoffs with a very tough run in.

Great chance to get the injured heads (except McCarthy) back on the pitch.

I think COB can and should start the quarter final in the absence of Robbie. The Leinster young guns have a history of stepping up when required and he's as talented as we've seen in recent years. We haven't produced a 12 of his quality in a long long time.

Obviously he's not the finished article. But I think he has a very high ceiling and knock out rugby is a good way of getting him there