Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread X: [****]

Dubinusa · 09-09-2018 3:06am

Probably see Vdf, McGrath and Ringrose next week. Hopefully Dowling can make hay and develop this season as Fardy is out of contract and Nagle is subpar. I still think Molony can be a good 2nd row and Kearney is very physical but below average skill wise.
A decent Celtic league and a couple of Leinster caps should tell us how good Dowling is. I think he may be a decent player. How did Murphy play? I know Leo really rates him.

swiwi_ · 09-09-2018 6:20am

Dubinusa wrote: »

Probably see Vdf, McGrath and Ringrose next week. Hopefully Dowling can make hay and develop this season as Fardy is out of contract and Nagle is subpar. I still think Molony can be a good 2nd row and Kearney is very physical but below average skill wise.
A decent Celtic league and a couple of Leinster caps should tell us how good Dowling is. I think he may be a decent player. How did Murphy play? I know Leo really rates him.

The answer to your question is did Murphy play?

He got an early YC and that was his biggest contribution. Least effectual of the forwards and basically carried by Ruddock.

I don’t know enough about him to know if 6 is his best position etc and I think its maybe only the 2nd or 3rd time I’ve seen him play but he has his work cut out.

Clegg · 09-09-2018 9:11am

My initial impression of Murphy's performance is in line with Swiwi's. To me it looked like Deegan did more in 15 minutes than Murphy did in the 60+ minutes he was in the field. I'll have to look again to be sure though. Maybe he did a lot of dirty work that goes unnoticed if you're not looking properly. But for headline contributions there were none.

Clegg · 09-09-2018 9:23am

Our maul was very impressive for what was just the second game of the season. We marched deep into Scarlets territory a number of times. Shame we couldn't always convert that into points. Byrne's off day with the boot cost us there.

ionadnapokot · 09-09-2018 12:14pm

Richie_Rich89 wrote: »

Don't really think the situations are comparable. Nacewa switched from outhalf to the back three and was a roaring success. Where's Tomane going to switch to? Leinster already have James Lowe on the left wing

I really don’t think Tomane is a vgood 12.
Not a good distributor. Or defender.
Didn’t see the game yesterday - but he is most definitely at his best on the wing. & Played there for Australia.
Prob will score tries in po14 from centre.
Would want him on the bench for the big games. Luxury signing!

DonVito · 09-09-2018 2:52pm

Dubinusa wrote: »

Probably see Vdf, McGrath and Ringrose next week. Hopefully Dowling can make hay and develop this season as Fardy is out of contract and Nagle is subpar. I still think Molony can be a good 2nd row and Kearney is very physical but below average skill wise.
A decent Celtic league and a couple of Leinster caps should tell us how good Dowling is. I think he may be a decent player. How did Murphy play? I know Leo really rates him.

Dunne and Baird are bigger prospects than Dowling.

durthacht · 09-09-2018 3:42pm

ionadnapokot wrote: »

I really don’t think Tomane is a vgood 12.
Not a good distributor. Or defender.
Didn’t see the game yesterday - but he is most definitely at his best on the wing. & Played there for Australia.
Prob will score tries in po14 from centre.
Would want him on the bench for the big games. Luxury signing!

Your analysis is probably sound enough until your Trumpian "Luxary signing!" at the end.

The big games are probably not so relevant for Tomane, but where he can add value is all the games where the senior players will be away through international duty or the player management programme. Leinster need experience for those games which hopefully he can bring when he gets settled.

For the very big games the back line will be largely settled but even if Tomane is not there for those games, we need him for the vast bulk of the other games in the league. That doesn't make him a luxury.

ionadnapokot · 09-09-2018 4:31pm

durthacht wrote: »

Your analysis is probably sound enough until your Trumpian "Luxary signing!" at the end.

The big games are probably not so relevant for Tomane, but where he can add value is all the games where the senior players will be away through international duty or the player management programme. Leinster need experience for those games which hopefully he can bring when he gets settled.

For the very big games the back line will be largely settled but even if Tomane is not there for those games, we need him for the vast bulk of the other games in the league. That doesn't make him a luxury.

I’m fond of sweeping statements!
He will be of benefit to the squad. But
12 is not the place for him. Would have preferred if they signed a versatile 12 rather than a versatile winger.

thomond2006 · 09-09-2018 4:35pm

Buer wrote: »

I wouldn't want any of our top players anywhere near the Sportsground. Connacht treat it as their RWC final and our front liners have a history of phoning it in there. No critical player to start. That means Sexton, McGrath, Ryan, Furlong, Henshaw, Ringrose, Kearney for me. Still plenty of scope for a serious side.

Plus the likes of Byrne, ROL, Porter etc. will learn far more in that game than at home against the Dragons.

The second stringers phoned it in last season there. I'd really love to see a proper matchup. I couldn't care less about the Dragons and I'll be at that game.

Zzippy · 09-09-2018 10:38pm

Buer wrote: »

I wouldn't want any of our top players anywhere near the Sportsground. Connacht treat it as their RWC final and our front liners have a history of phoning it in there. No critical player to start. That means Sexton, McGrath, Ryan, Furlong, Henshaw, Ringrose, Kearney for me. Still plenty of scope for a serious side.

Plus the likes of Byrne, ROL, Porter etc. will learn far more in that game than at home against the Dragons.

Connacht don't treat it like a RWC final, we did that in Edinburgh. We do enjoy beating whatever side you send to Galway, though...

Synode · 09-09-2018 11:13pm

Zzippy wrote: »

Connacht don't treat it like a RWC final, we did that in Edinburgh. We do enjoy beating whatever side you send to Galway, though...

Last time I went to Galway for the fixture we annihilated ye. Think it was 2016. Great weekend

its_phil · 09-09-2018 11:15pm

Buer wrote: »

Connacht treat it as their RWC final and our front liners have a history of phoning it in there.

More to do with Leinster fans thinking we treat their match like a RWC final and sending those fans packing to be honest.

Zzippy · 09-09-2018 11:29pm

Synode wrote: »

Last time I went to Galway for the fixture we annihilated ye. Think it was 2016. Great weekend

Those days make it all the sweeter when we annihilate ye back. Like this year... :P

Burkie1203 · 10-09-2018 7:28am

Zzippy wrote: »

Those days make it all the sweeter when we annihilate ye back. Like this year... :P

Took Connacht a whole season to put that performance together. It was the only final Leinster lost last season too

Buer · 10-09-2018 9:23am

its_phil wrote: »

More to do with Leinster fans thinking we treat their match like a RWC final and sending those fans packing to be honest.

I'm not trying to incite a reaction and my "RWC final" comparison is obviously hyperbole.

But I don't think anyone can doubt for a moment that Connacht have raised their game for the visit of Leinster (and Munster to an extent) over the years. If they played with the same intensity and focus for the entire season, they'd never be out of the ECC.

Again, not trying to provoke and I've seen the sentiment echoed by Connacht supporters on plenty of occasions. Personally, I hate playing Connacht. I don't think there are many Leinster fans who even come close to seeing the game as a handy fixture. It has never been one.

Zzippy · 10-09-2018 9:43am

Ah we've a fairly decent home record against Leinster but I'm sick of going to the RDS and coming away disappointed.
On a lighter note, my favourite memory of those clashes (apart from the wins) is Mike McCarthy being sent off for punching Leo Cullen in a shemozzle (Cullen definitely deserved it that day). But the higlight was the pitchside reporter on Setanta Sports (an Aussie whose name I can't recall) grabbing McCarthy for an interview immediately afterwards. His opening questiom: "Why'd ya do it Mike?"
You just don't get quality interviewing like that anymore...

Buer · 10-09-2018 9:52am

Zzippy wrote: »

Ah we've a fairly decent home record against Leinster but I'm sick of going to the RDS and coming away disappointed.
On a lighter note, my favourite memory of those clashes (apart from the wins) is Mike McCarthy being sent off for punching Leo Cullen in a shemozzle (Cullen definitely deserved it that day). But the higlight was the pitchside reporter on Setanta Sports (an Aussie whose name I can't recall) grabbing McCarthy for an interview immediately afterwards. His opening questiom: "Why'd ya do it Mike?"
You just don't get quality interviewing like that anymore...

That was in the days of non-citing for interpros. Cullen should have been red carded and suspended for a few weeks. Absolutely nailed Ian Keatley under the posts if it's the game I'm recalling!

Clegg · 10-09-2018 10:36am

It's a concern to me that Ian Nagle and Mick Kearney are the players we must call upon when the internationals are away and Fardy is being rested. We can't expect quality options at 4th and 5th choice level, but neither player is anywhere near good enough to be there anyway.

I thought Deegan made an impact when he came on. He has a lanky build but hits the line fast and makes a lot of metres when he really shouldn't be able to. Quality player that'll only get better.

Zzippy · 10-09-2018 10:36am

Buer wrote: »

That was in the days of non-citing for interpros. Cullen should have been red carded and suspended for a few weeks. Absolutely nailed Ian Keatley under the posts if it's the game I'm recalling!

That's the one. Filthy elbow from Cullen. Always tarnished my opinion of him afterwards.

Heymans · 10-09-2018 10:49am

Can we not let Ferg take those close in kicks - Byrne has a way of missing the easy ones and planting the harder ones from further out. Thought Conan had a quiet game as did Murphy but didn't think Deegan was an improvement barring one carry where he made 5 yards - to be saying he was better than Murphy for his whole time on the pitch compared to one basic carry is lobsided analysis. Thought Henshaw was immense - in the thick of it the whole game and offering himself for carries which he inevitably made ground on.

Buer · 10-09-2018 11:35am

Clegg wrote: »

It's a concern to me that Ian Nagle and Mick Kearney are the players we must call upon when the internationals are away and Fardy is being rested. We can't expect quality options at 4th and 5th choice level, but neither player is anywhere near good enough to be there anyway.

I think we're in a unique situation whereby our two locks are the Irish starters and then Fardy will also sit out the odd game due to the foreign player situation.

Molony is our 4th choice lock, I think that's largely accepted. He went off to captain the young lads at the weekend but I'd expect him to be involved tomorrow if we had an injury to any of our 3 front liners.

As far as 5th and 6th choice locks go, Nagle and Kearney are fine for me. I thought Kearney made a positive impact in both his sub appearances to date. He was physical and stopped people dead on the gain line several times. Nagle had a poor second half but I thought he was pretty good in the first half, to be honest. He's probably just filling a jersey until another lock comes through but I'm not too concerned with him being in that role at the moment. I don't think many teams can call upon a 6th choice lock that's better. He's going to feature very little this season overall so it's not much of a concern in my mind.

Buer · 10-09-2018 11:44am

Heymans wrote: »

Can we not let Ferg take those close in kicks - Byrne has a way of missing the easy ones and planting the harder ones from further out. Thought Conan had a quiet game as did Murphy but didn't think Deegan was an improvement barring one carry where he made 5 yards - to be saying he was better than Murphy for his whole time on the pitch compared to one basic carry is lobsided analysis..

I suppose the thinking is that we have to let Byrne develop as a kicker if he's going to be our first choice long term. It's frustrating as he was having a decent game (that tackle on his own line was top drawer) but it's very hard not to focus on those misses that ultimately were the difference between winning and losing. There was a 3rd penalty in opposition 22 which we went to touch on which was surely a result of Ruddock losing confidence in his goal kicker.

These kicks aren't simple tap over shots but they're bread and butter for any goalkicker who has designs on being a high level kicker. They're the type of kick that has regularly sullied his kicking career to date. His missed conversion after Tracy's try in the opening week was a similar spot again.

It becomes harder to break the kicking yips once it becomes a regular occurrence. I don't know if he is working with anyone for the psychological aspect of the game as he's technically a very good kicker and is well capable of nailing trickier shots as seen with his two touchline conversions.

Heymans wrote: »

Thought Conan had a quiet game as did Murphy but didn't think Deegan was an improvement barring one carry where he made 5 yards - to be saying he was better than Murphy.

I thought our carrying up front was very poor overall on the night and it was a significant reason for us struggling at times to break the Scarlets down. I don't recall one really strong carry from any forward where he put the Scarlets on the back foot and scrambling back into position to give JPG and Byrne a shot at opening them.

stephen_n · 10-09-2018 12:20pm

Yeah Nagle actually impressed me in the first half, first time I’ve seen him show anything in attack. Even a nice pick and go with an offload at one stage. Kearney seems to have regained some of his physicality, which has been lacking. I’d be happy enough with Kearney and Moloney starting for the weakened team, going on what we have seen so far. I would have thought Ross Byrne working directly with Richie would have improved his kicking over the summer, it’s very strange though that it’s neatly always the easier one he misses. Maybe a psychological thing with him.

Squidgy Black · 10-09-2018 12:52pm

Kearney's not actually a bad 2nd row, he just has complete brainfarts regularly. If he could cut out the handling errors and the odd daft penalty he would be a decent pro14 option.