Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread X: [****]

troyzer

Clegg wrote: »

I see that there's no Max Deegan again for Leinster A. Unless there's been an injury unannounced it looks like he's the 24th man for the senior side. Coaches must rate him highly.



15. Jack Kelly(U22) CAPTAIN
14. Adam Byrne
13. Jimmy O’Brien
12. Tom Daly
11. Michael Silvester(U21)
10. Ciarán Frawley(U22)
9. Hugh O’Sullivan(U21)
1. Peter Dooley
2. Ronan Kelleher(U21)
3. Vakh Abdaladze
4. Ross Molony
5. Mick Kearney
6. Josh Murphy
7. Scott Penny(U20)
8. Caelan Doris(U21)

16. Bryan Byrne
17. Ed Byrne
18. Jack Aungier(U21)
19. Ian Nagle
20. Oisín Dowling(U22)
21. Patrick Patterson(U21)
22. Harry Byrne(U20)
23. David Hawkshaw(U20)

I can't wait to see him in the international window.

salmocab

Looking at that A team it really strikes me that Adam Byrne is there and there has been no suggestion I’ve seen that he should be in the first 23. It must be really hard for him.

troyzer

salmocab wrote: »

Looking at that A team it really strikes me that Adam Byrne is there and there has been no suggestion I’ve seen that he should be in the first 23. It must be really hard for him.

I'm sure Lunster will have him next year.

Heymans

Thermoman12 wrote: »

Don’t like the way a New Zealand reject is blocking talented scrum halves coming through that had dreamed playing for their province since they were a kid then being forced to another club cuz a lad from a different country comes in and stays there for three years and now he’s somehow “Irish”, we don’t need jgp, he’s a good player but Irish rugby doesn’t need him, hope he goes back to New Zealand, imagine how you would feel if you were Nick McCarthy and had to move province because a non Irish player took your place

Too bad - they're the rules and you have to play by them even if you don't like them. Somehow I get the feeling that you don't like foreigners coming to our country and contributing to it full stop. Let me ask you a question - how do you feel about Irish citizensd that were born here but have brown skin? I bet in your eyes they are not really Irish people just blow ins. How does someone become Irish? - by joining the fight for the national cause be that on the rugby pitch or off it regardless of what country they come from or how long they have been here.

Heymans

molloyjh wrote: »

Dem foreigners, taking our jerbs.

Exactly.

mangobob

I must say I enjoyed the first episode of House of Rugby. Haskell is a gas man. Don't know if its been posted before but link is here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2LfwI6Cwrk (Leinster discussion starts from 7.40).

But I have to say I am starting to get a little bit uncomfortable with the hushed tones that many (both fans and neutrals alike) are using when talking about this Leinster team. Maybe its just my innate Irish inferiority complex reasserting itself, but questions I have seen on various fora like "who can possibly stop this Leinster juggernaut" and comments about a fifth star on the jersey being imminent seem a little bit OTT to me. I would even go so far as to say it's tempting fate. We are certainly a great team, but we are far from invincible. We have already lost to Scarlets and it wouldn't take much for us to lose to a Saracens or a Racing or even a Munster team that clicks on the day. We barely beat Racing last year in a match that for almost the entire duration was balanced on a razors edge. The result could easily have gone the either way and if it had, would we still be looking at ourselves now with the same unbridled confidence?

I don't even know what I am really trying to say here, except that I am beginning to feel worried by all of this surging hype being generated around this Leinster team. My head says its justified, both in terms of results to date and the quality of the team on paper. But part of me (the bruised and traumatised part that has endured being an Irish rugby fan since the 80's) is wondering if perhaps we are over-egging the cake slightly. There is a fine line between supreme confidence and arrogance, and that line is often much easier to see in others rather than ourselves.

All I know for sure is that regardless of injuries or omissions, Toulouse in Toulouse is going to be a monumental test. It's far from a foregone conclusion.

Buer

On any day, we could easily lose to any of the following: Saracens, Munster, Racing and even a fully fit Montpellier. We're an excellent team but rugby is played over 80 minutes between two teams of even numbers. Anything can happen. It wouldn't even be close to the biggest upset in the tournament for us to lose to any of the above.

We were strong favourites to win the final last season and we were losing that game with 7 minutes left against a team playing their 3rd choice outhalf and 2nd choice scrum half. We deserve to be the tournament favourites but I'd put our chances of retaining the title at less than 50%. A poxy draw and we could end up having to face one of the above teams away from home in a semi final (assuming we even get there). I would say it's a complete coin toss for us to win away to someone like Saracens.

Squidgy Black

mangobob wrote: »

I must say I enjoyed the first episode of House of Rugby. Haskell is a gas man. Don't know if its been posted before but link is here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2LfwI6Cwrk (Leinster discussion starts from 7.40).

But I have to say I am starting to get a little bit uncomfortable with the hushed tones that many (both fans and neutrals alike) are using when talking about this Leinster team. Maybe its just my innate Irish inferiority complex reasserting itself, but questions I have seen on various fora like "who can possibly stop this Leinster juggernaut" and comments about a fifth star on the jersey being imminent seem a little bit OTT to me. I would even go so far as to say it's tempting fate. We are certainly a great team, but we are far from invincible. We have already lost to Scarlets and it wouldn't take much for us to lose to a Saracens or a Racing or even a Munster team that clicks on the day. We barely beat Racing last year in a match that for almost the entire duration was balanced on a razors edge. The result could easily have gone the either way and if it had, would we still be looking at ourselves now with the same unbridled confidence?

I don't even know what I am really trying to say here, except that I am beginning to feel worried by all of this surging hype being generated around this Leinster team. My head says its justified, both in terms of results to date and the quality of the team on paper. But part of me (the bruised and traumatised part that has endured being an Irish rugby fan since the 80's) is wondering if perhaps we are over-egging the cake slightly. There is a fine line between supreme confidence and arrogance, and that line is often much easier to see in others rather than ourselves.

All I know for sure is that regardless of injuries or omissions, Toulouse in Toulouse is going to be a monumental test. It's far from a foregone conclusion.

I listened to the latest episode of The Rugby Pod last night, they were calling it the best club squad they've ever seen, saying it was better than the back to back HC team of 2010-2012. And that was all 4 of the lads on it, Cave/Goode/Hamilton/Rowe. Yes, we dismantled Wasps, but I don't think we've really been tested yet.

Dubinusa

Awful shame that Leavy is hurt and hasn't had an opportunity to play much this season. He'll most likely get a run in Nov. He can stake his claim during the autumn internationals.
We'll also get to see Deegan and Doris which I can't wait for. Fardy will also feature and perhaps a couple of academy players like Kelleher and Aungier.
But, the team needs to perform whilst the international players are away. They were awful imo last season.
This is a great chance to see the squad depth with academy lads in the mix.

slingerz

Buer wrote: »

On any day, we could easily lose to any of the following: Saracens, Munster, Racing and even a fully fit Montpellier. We're an excellent team but rugby is played over 80 minutes between two teams of even numbers. Anything can happen. It wouldn't even be close to the biggest upset in the tournament for us to lose to any of the above.

We were strong favourites to win the final last season and we were losing that game with 7 minutes left against a team playing their 3rd choice outhalf and 2nd choice scrum half. We deserve to be the tournament favourites but I'd put our chances of retaining the title at less than 50%. A poxy draw and we could end up having to face one of the above teams away from home in a semi final (assuming we even get there). I would say it's a complete coin toss for us to win away to someone like Saracens.

I'd suggest that Exeter & Scarlets would be in that list as well.

antietam1

Heymans wrote: »

Too bad - they're the rules and you have to play by them even if you don't like them. Somehow I get the feeling that you don't like foreigners coming to our country and contributing to it full stop. Let me ask you a question - how do you feel about Irish citizensd that were born here but have brown skin? I bet in your eyes they are not really Irish people just blow ins. How does someone become Irish? - by joining the fight for the national cause be that on the rugby pitch or off it regardless of what country they come from or how long they have been here.

That's a horrible assumption on your part, worthy of a ban really.

Clegg

Ah lads. It's one thing saying we're overhyped, which I actually think we are to an extent. But some of ye are taking it to the other extreme.

I'm looking at some of the sides
mentioned that could beat us and I just can't see it. Last season we beat Montpellier home and away with relative comfort and whilst Exeter were a tougher nut to crack we beat them twice as well. In all four games we handled their attack and showed they're too one dimensional to beat a team like Leinster.

The same goes with Munster and Scarlets. We've beaten Munster in 7 of our last 10 attempts; also 4 of the last 5 if you want a more recent record. Smashed them in Thomond last December and beat them with a shadow side a few weeks ago despite them fielding their strongest possible side. They're not at the required level yet either. And Scarlets were destroyed in both semi finals last season. They've gotten weaker up front since then as well. They didn't beat us once last season and scraped a home win against a depleted Leinster this season.

There's certainly the possibility of complacency creeping in this season and just the fact that the squad is that bit weaker with the departure of so many good players. But I think we're going overboard with the talk about who could beat Leinster. There's 1 or 2 sides that can do it. But recent history suggests that's it and not the 5 or 6 some are suggesting.

prawnsambo

mangobob wrote: »

I must say I enjoyed the first episode of House of Rugby. Haskell is a gas man. Don't know if its been posted before but link is here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2LfwI6Cwrk (Leinster discussion starts from 7.40).

Cheers for the link. Yeah, Haskell is larger than life really, full of chat and stories. Himself and SOB seem to be good mates, always meet up after matches apparently. And the hug from Tadhg Furlong.


Alex Payne obviously not going to miss out on the European rugby now that it's gone from Sky, fair play to him for getting something going. Looks like it could be a good format. Will look out for it regularly now.

I watched that podcast the other night, I loved when Haskell started talking about getting another sponsor for air flights and then there was a surreptitious cut in the middle of it...!

Watch it from 22:40

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

I watched that podcast the other night, I loved when Haskell started talking about getting another sponsor for air flights and then there was a surreptitious cut in the middle of it...!

Watch it from 22:40

Yer man on the left wasn't up for a joke at all

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Yer man on the left wasn't up for a joke at all

Ah he had his commercial hat on him, sponsors can be touchy about that kind of thing and Guinness have their claws all over rugby at the moment.

Still got a chuckle from me at the time!

So many rugby podcasts on the go now, we should start a boards.ie rugby podcast. We can invite guests from the provincial discussion boards like Munster fans and Leinster fans and get the auld rivalry back into full swing.

Zzippy would get callus on his fingers from handing out cards!

stephen_n

This team is potentially the best team ever in the Heineken Cup. However potential doesn’t guarantee anything or win games. There is a lot of hype coming of thumping a very poor Wasps team. Though that is also based on the last 12 months when that team has excelled in both Europe and the Pro 14. The hype will mean little or nothing to the team though. They have their goals and their own expectations. The reality is though that we are currently the best club side in Europe and are most definitely the team to beat. That doesn’t mean we will win, but that we definitely should be favorites to. That’s something very hard to wrap the Irish psyche around but it is the case.

salmocab

It doesn’t matter what hype you see in the papers or on social media etc so long as the players aren’t losing the run of themselves which is something that I doubt this group or their coaches are likely to do.

Faugheen

Really like that team. Hopefully a big game for Larmour. It’s probably his biggest FB test yet.

prawnsambo

salmocab wrote: »

It doesn’t matter what hype you see in the papers or on social media etc so long as the players aren’t losing the run of themselves which is something that I doubt this group or their coaches are likely to do.

What I'm afraid of is when they actually play the perfect game they're all looking for. That's when the laurel resting will set in.

Buer

Clegg wrote: »

Ah lads. It's one thing saying we're overhyped, which I actually think we are to an extent. But some of ye are taking it to the other extreme.

I'm looking at some of the sides
mentioned that could beat us and I just can't see it. Last season we beat Montpellier home and away with relative comfort and whilst Exeter were a tougher nut to crack we beat them twice as well. In all four games we handled their attack and showed they're too one dimensional to beat a team like Leinster.

We beat Montpellier by a single score at home and they blew a certain try in the closing stages when Nagusa butchered an overlap. They were pretty indifferent when we played them down there relative to their performance on the opening day. We played very well and got a deserved win but the game itself was rather flat.

I think Exeter are a little overrated. They're the perennial underdogs and beloved by the media. But that shouldn't disguise the fact that they're performing well in a pretty mediocre league and have never come close to being competitors in Europe. They're very hard to break down and are exceptionally well coached but Leinster should not lose to them.

We're a better side than sides like Montpellier but on a given day they that could absolutely beat us in a knockout game as could any of the teams I mentioned. That doesn't mean they're better than us, just that we're having a lot of smoke blown up us despite there being teams well capable of getting past us. Stick us in an away knock out game against those sides and it's going to be anyone's game. Racing were viewed very similarly to Montpellier ahead of the final and, despite their significant injury issues, were minutes from beating us.

Gonad

Can anyone confirm when Lowe is Irish qualified ?

I thought he was inside the 3 year quota but BOD on off the ball just said he is 5 years ?

Edit sorry they addressed it later in show

It’s 3 years

Clegg

Buer wrote: »

Clegg wrote: »

Ah lads. It's one thing saying we're overhyped, which I actually think we are to an extent. But some of ye are taking it to the other extreme.

I'm looking at some of the sides
mentioned that could beat us and I just can't see it. Last season we beat Montpellier home and away with relative comfort and whilst Exeter were a tougher nut to crack we beat them twice as well. In all four games we handled their attack and showed they're too one dimensional to beat a team like Leinster.

We beat Montpellier by a single score at home and they blew a certain try in the closing stages when Nagusa butchered an overlap. They were pretty indifferent when we played them down there relative to their performance on the opening day. We played very well and got a deserved win but the game itself was rather flat.

I think Exeter are a little overrated. They're the perennial underdogs and beloved by the media. But that shouldn't disguise the fact that they're performing well in a pretty mediocre league and have never come close to being competitors in Europe. They're very hard to break down and are exceptionally well coached but Leinster should not lose to them.

We're a better side than sides like Montpellier but on a given day they that could absolutely beat us in a knockout game as could any of the teams I mentioned. That doesn't mean they're better than us, just that we're having a lot of smoke blown up us despite there being teams well capable of getting past us. Stick us in an away knock out game against those sides and it's going to be anyone's game. Racing were viewed very similarly to Montpellier ahead of the final and, despite their significant injury issues, were minutes from beating us.

I felt our performance at home to Montpellier wasn't fully reflected on the scoreboard. Thought we were comfortably the better side for the majority of the game.

Like I'm not saying we're miles better than everyone. That's clearly not the case. And I'll always be a bit uncomfortable on the prospects of beating a French side away. But of the teams mentioned above I think Leinster can beat them relatively comfortably bar Racing and a rejuvenated Saracens.

Clegg

The media is absolutely going overboard with the hype for Leinster. But I'm quite certain that the squad won't let that affect them. I listened to an interview with Isa Nacewa recently where he was saying that he kept in contact with a lot of the squad. They were asking him what they could do to improve as players. They're still doing all they can to get better. They want to succeed and are taking steps to get there. And guys like Cullen and Lancaster will definitely keep them humble and driven.

If you look at the squad only Sexton, Rob Kearney, McFadden and SoB remain from the 09-13 glory years. The rest are guys who have come through the system wanting to replicate what their predecessors and heroes did. They already have once but I think they'll want to build a dynasty like those that came before.

It will be very hard to retain the Champions Cup and I'm not sure we'll do it this year. But I just think we're selling Leinster short with the talk of Munster, Montpellier or Exeter being able to beta them.

Is Adam Byrne after going back as far as we think or is the emergence of top class players more to do with his relegation?

He's gotten a few caps this season, but he's also stuck behind a player (Lowe) who I think would be first choice for Ireland right now and another player (Larmour) who made massive headlines last season and looks to be very close to the 23 or even starting 15 of the no.2 team in the world.

I could well see him moving and carving out a serious career, but he may have time during the international windows to get back into the conversation. Thought he looked a more rounded player through his earlier performances this season so would be great to get more of a look at him.

Clegg

On this showing Scarlets don't have a hope in Europe. Well beaten by an average Leicester side.

salmocab

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Is Adam Byrne after going back as far as we think or is the emergence of top class players more to do with his relegation?

He's gotten a few caps this season, but he's also stuck behind a player (Lowe) who I think would be first choice for Ireland right now and another player (Larmour) who made massive headlines last season and looks to be very close to the 23 or even starting 15 of the no.2 team in the world.

I could well see him moving and carving out a serious career, but he may have time during the international windows to get back into the conversation. Thought he looked a more rounded player through his earlier performances this season so would be great to get more of a look at him.

Personally I suspect he wasnt as good as we thought/hoped he was. Excellent going forward, very capable of filling a highlight reel. Add to that he’s a big strong very athletic player, then people got excited and maybe were a bit blind to his weaknesses.

Squidgy Black

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Is Adam Byrne after going back as far as we think or is the emergence of top class players more to do with his relegation?

He's gotten a few caps this season, but he's also stuck behind a player (Lowe) who I think would be first choice for Ireland right now and another player (Larmour) who made massive headlines last season and looks to be very close to the 23 or even starting 15 of the no.2 team in the world.

I could well see him moving and carving out a serious career, but he may have time during the international windows to get back into the conversation. Thought he looked a more rounded player through his earlier performances this season so would be great to get more of a look at him.

Byrne mainly plays at 14 so I don't think Lowe is really direct competition for him, more so that Lowe is possibly taking the spot at 11 from one of the other guys who have shifted to 14.

Former Former

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Is Adam Byrne after going back as far as we think or is the emergence of top class players more to do with his relegation?

He's gotten a few caps this season, but he's also stuck behind a player (Lowe) who I think would be first choice for Ireland right now and another player (Larmour) who made massive headlines last season and looks to be very close to the 23 or even starting 15 of the no.2 team in the world.

I could well see him moving and carving out a serious career, but he may have time during the international windows to get back into the conversation. Thought he looked a more rounded player through his earlier performances this season so would be great to get more of a look at him.

Yeah Lowe has arrived and Larmour has emerged, but Byrne is also behind McFadden, Tomane, Dave Kearney, Barry Daly and probably Rory O'Loughlin. That's a fair queue to get past, even with Daly being injured.

He needs a serious turnaround. He only played the first game this season so it doesn't seem like the coaches are even that bothered looking at him.

He got over hyped on the basis of some great attacking displays but his all round game just isn't there.

molloyjh

Buer wrote: »

I think Exeter are a little overrated. They're the perennial underdogs and beloved by the media. But that shouldn't disguise the fact that they're performing well in a pretty mediocre league and have never come close to being competitors in Europe. They're very hard to break down and are exceptionally well coached but Leinster should not lose to them.

Could this very thing be said about Glasgow too?