Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker **Spoilers from post 2076**

sonic85

I'm not a Star Wars head by any stretch of the imagination - I'd probably be classed as a casual viewer but can someone tell me has Leia always been a Jedi? Where did this come from - is there a source for this?

expectationlost

JJ left the Finn secret unsaid (mystery box!) but there this that scene at the end with Lando which seemed wierd and strangely scripted if this is canon > https://ew.com/movies/2019/12/21/the-rise-of-skywalker-companion-book-lando-final-scene-twist/

Tony EH

The Golden Miller wrote: »

Hayden Christensen?

Who?

Nah. Sebastian Shaw played Anakin Skywalker.

No idea who this Christian Haydensen is. :pac:

The barber of chewbacca

I enjoyed it as a "movie" in a visual bubblegum type of way. But the overall payoff of this trilogy failed to materialise for me.

Driver & Ridley's performances were good. I enjoyed Lando, Chewie and even C-3P0.

The soundtrack was basically a greatest hits of the great John Williams, which I'll never complain about!

The finale completely failed to land

TFA was a solid start to build from and I thought TLJ was excellent in parts and equally bad in others. But the lack of an overall vision really hampered the last 2 movies. Finn was wasted (his reformed stormtrooper story could have been compelling - a bigger story was touched upon in RoS). Poe seemed like nothing more than an afterthought.

And Rey... I can't fault Ridley and thought her performances were excellent. In TFA she was a super force user. Her ability to master it so quickly needed to be explained. Because of that, the Rey "Nobody" of TLJ made no sense to me. The way they retconned/resolved that made no sense either!!

I think where was a good story in there somewhere. Following JJ's mystery box in TFA could have worked IF they had a coherent plan for the whole trilogy. It was salvagable after TLJ but unfortunately they failed to it in RoS.

Tony EH

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Johnson does 100% commit to killing Luke the way he does. It’s an essential moment for the film: since it’s about broadening the definition of heroism and finally breaking the cycles / bloodlines / destinies that have dominated the series (hence why this film’s Rey backtrack is such a dumb move), Luke has to go. But he goes out completely on his own terms: he knows he has just one more role to play, and commits to this one final act to protect and save the people whose stories aren’t finished yet. As I’ve said elsewhere before, the way it closes with a visual that ends Luke’s journey - directly echoing that moment when he first stared into the dual-sunset - is also a beautiful piece of purely cinematic closure.

Luke going out would have been fine, but for the way they did it, which was absolute shite. Him dying from a force overload was possibly the worst way for him to go.

In any case, it was obvious to everyone that the mouse was going to knock off every character from the original films, because everyone knew that they were only in these sequels to get the older bums on the seats. It worked too, as 'The Force Awakens' wouldn't have made half the money it did with Harrison Ford, Mark Hamill and Carrie Fisher returning.

But, while the world and his wife felt no surprise at these characters getting bumped off. The manner of their exit was ineptly handled to say the least. Solo goes out like a chump and Skywalker didn't pay attention to Force health and safety regulations.

Awful shite altogether.

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

As with many things in this film, its Abrams’ lack of nerve or creativity to run with the ideas overtly set-up by Johnson that makes this such a half-hearted mess. He just returns to the well to hit the same beats we’ve seen before, and it’s deeply unsatisfying as a result. Not to mention the Luke scene here is the ****ing worst.

I haven't seen this thing yet, but from what I hear, it's another flashy load of bollocks from the JJ Abrams handbook and the slaps in the face for Johnson's movie ranks of an unbelievable pettiness.

These sequels not only piss all over the original film's story, they even piss all over it's own extremely limited yarn because the two directors weren't interested in following up each other's ideas.

What an absolute travesty.

Tony EH

sonic85 wrote: »

I'm not a Star Wars head by any stretch of the imagination - I'd probably be classed as a casual viewer but can someone tell me has Leia always been a Jedi? Where did this come from - is there a source for this?

I can't claim to be a "Star Wars head" myself, but, the answer is no...kinda. Supposedly, because she is Luke's sister, the force is "strong" with her and there's slight hints that she might be so called "force sensitive" in 'Return of the Jedi'. But that was about it.

This is why her surviving space and flying in the Leia Poppins scene in 'The Last Jedi' comes across a utterly laughable. Not only because physically it's absurd, even for a Force power, but because there's been no build up for her to have earned such a power of that magnitude.

As far as I've heard too, and don't quote me on this, is that scene exists purely because Kathleen Kennedy insisted that Leia have her Force moment. If that was the case, it's no wonder that it looks ridiculous, to say the least. No only is it stupid looking, the fact that not a single person says WTF? when she cruises back to the spaceship alive, remains one of that film's most awful, awful scenes and one of the most ludicrous scenes I've ever seen in a movie.

The Megaphone

Runaway hit highest gross beating The force Awakens

Small gripe this, but when redeemed Anakin came back as a force ghost, we were given a youthful Hayden Christensen (digitally remastered edition) - so how come we got the haggard bin raking tramp ghost version of Luke this time around!

I was expecting to at least see the cleaner cut manifestation that fought Kylo in TLJ!

For continuity, it would have sat better as that’s obviously how Luke saw himself!

Sad Professor

expectationlost wrote: »

JJ left the Finn secret unsaid (mystery box!) but there this that scene at the end with Lando which seemed wierd and strangely scripted if this is canon > https://ew.com/movies/2019/12/21/the-rise-of-skywalker-companion-book-lando-final-scene-twist/

That Lando scene is pure JJ. You can bet he came up with it on set between takes and had it shot and printed before leaving it to the LucasFilm story group to figure out what it meant. It was the same on Lost. Several of the mysteries in the pilot JJ made up on set while trying to figure out who the characters were.

J Mysterio

Runaway hit highest gross beating The force Awakens

Peatys wrote: »

Being 40, it doesn't really matter what i thought of this film, i might as well give an opinion on Ben & Holly. I brought my 11 yr is nephew and he loved it.

Sudden Valley wrote: »

As a kids movie it works really weell even the Kylo Rey relationship. As an adult that relationship (which I blame Rian Johnson for continuing and growing in the second movie) is pretty icky.

What is this shıt? Star Wars isn't just for kids! And anyway... What? You have a child and you lose your critical faculties? Aggravating.

S.M.B.

expectationlost wrote: »

JJ left the Finn secret unsaid (mystery box!) but there this that scene at the end with Lando which seemed wierd and strangely scripted if this is canon > https://ew.com/movies/2019/12/21/the-rise-of-skywalker-companion-book-lando-final-scene-twist/

I assumed it was some clunky setup of some upcoming spin off show which annoyed me but I think it'll be more irksome if that was Landos actual daughter.

Tony EH

The Megaphone wrote: »

Small gripe this, but when redeemed Anakin came back as a force ghost, we were given a youthful Hayden Christensen (digitally remastered edition) - so how come we got the haggard bin raking tramp ghost version of Luke this time around!

I was expecting to at least see the cleaner cut manifestation that fought Kylo in TLJ!

For continuity, it would have sat better as that’s obviously how Luke saw himself!

The Force ghost thing was always a load of arse, from the very beginning. There have been certain "rules" laid down and then broken, even by the guy who laid them down in the first place.

Force ghosts are supposed to be a relatively new force discovery, made by Qui Gon and said as much in 'Revenge of the Sith'. There aren't any others except for Ben and Yoda. So, even Anakin showing up at the end of 'Return of the Jedi' looked a bit stupid. Plus, this was supposed to be only a "light side" power (although each side of the Force having specific powers was always another pile of shite as well). So, Lucas said that Anakin appeared because at the end of his life, he'd turned back to the way of the Jedi. So, his mass murdering, psychopathic ways were all instantly forgiven.

Later, when Lucas retconned 'Return of the Jedi' with those terrible special editions, he included Hayden Christiensen in the force ghost scene. His excuse for this was because Anakin died when he became Darth Vader and darksiders cannot commune with the living. Only lightsiders can. :rolleyes:

This eliminated Lucas' original stance that Anakin had turned back to the light, when he rejected his Darth Vader persona and whacked the Emperor.

It's all a load of old bollocks.

Sure, even Han Solo can come back now. What a mess.

sonic85

Tony EH wrote: »

there's been no build up for her to have earned such a power of that magnitude.

This is one of the things that really annoyed me about TROS. Rey blurted out at one stage that Leia trained her and it showed Leia battling Luke in a forest and besting him. Where was the build up to any of that? It felt like a lot of stuff in this movie was just pulled out of somebody's ass

ebbsy

sonic85 wrote: »

This is one of the things that really annoyed me about TROS. Rey blurted out at one stage that Leia trained her and it showed Leia battling Luke in a forest and besting him. Where was the build up to any of that? It felt like a lot of stuff in this movie was just pulled out of somebody's ass

Sums up the whole series since it came back, apart from Rogue One, which was a good film.

silverharp

there is a conspiracy theory that RT are fixing the audience score at 86% so that it is not lower than The Force Awakens, it does seem oddly stubborn at that number when Metacritic user score have it basically half positive and half negative.

BrookieD

Just back from seeing the film. LOVED IT. and my kids loved it. I was telling the wife that when i was a kid my granddad took me to see Return of the Jedi however the Savoy was showing a triple header with A New Hope and Empire which i got to see. My nan went bonkers as we were very late for the ruined Sunday lunch that was to be had. the point was i remember this as clear as day and for the last few years on Xmas eve we go see Star Wars in the local cinema. Today marked the end of my saga and it hit the mark for me and my boys!

Did i want fan service and did i get it. yes i did, in spades, we loved it all and while i see in previous post a fair amount of feedback both positive and negative I just had memories of days gone as a kid going to see Jedi and now my 16 & 10 yr old boys have some memories of seeing some fun films where good guys won the day.

Came home and The Force Awakens was on TV, will watch this and will watch A New Hope this evening while getting ready for Santa tomorrow.

Thats my little bit of feedback, could not have wanted more. :-)

Burty330

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Johnson does 100% commit to killing Luke the way he does. It’s an essential moment for the film: since it’s about broadening the definition of heroism and finally breaking the cycles / bloodlines / destinies that have dominated the series (hence why this film’s Rey backtrack is such a dumb move), Luke has to go. But he goes out completely on his own terms: he knows he has just one more role to play, and commits to this one final act to protect and save the people whose stories aren’t finished yet. As I’ve said elsewhere before, the way it closes with a visual that ends Luke’s journey - directly echoing that moment when he first stared into the dual-sunset - is also a beautiful piece of purely cinematic closure.

As with many things in this film, its Abrams’ lack of nerve or creativity to run with the ideas overtly set-up by Johnson that makes this such a half-hearted mess. He just returns to the well to hit the same beats we’ve seen before, and it’s deeply unsatisfying as a result. Not to mention the Luke scene here is the ****ing worst.

Luke Hamill himself disagrees with everything you just said , as does about every other SW fan on the planet.

Burty330

The White Wolf wrote: »

As I said I've no problem with TLJ and is a fine film in itself. I also didn't think much of ROS. Abrams and Rian only did the job they were hired to do.

My issue is with Disney and their anger towards the fans even though its their own lack of planning that's the main failure here.

No . its a crap film and an even worse entry in what was meant to be the middle piece of a trilogy.
It was so bad it ultimately ruined the the final film in the trilogy. The damage it done could not be undone.

Its hardly a matter of opinion anymore that TLJ is a load of rubbish.

Sonics2k

Tony EH wrote: »

Who?

Nah. Sebastian Shaw played Anakin Skywalker.

No idea who this Christian Haydensen is. :pac:

I always felt bad for Haydensen in this way. He did a decent job, but the writing and direction was piss poor in his two movies. Same can be said for McGregor as Obi-Wan.

If there's one thing that can be said about those two, they were bloody fantastic swordsmen and the final lightsaber duel is probably the best of them all.

sonic85 wrote: »

I'm not a Star Wars head by any stretch of the imagination - I'd probably be classed as a casual viewer but can someone tell me has Leia always been a Jedi? Where did this come from - is there a source for this?

It was never ever explicitly said, they just kinda jammed it in to the Rise of Skywalker that Luke had trained Leia in the force as part of his academy because she was force sensitive. It was a nice idea and does kind of make sense that he'd train her, but aside from the 30 second segment it's not in the previous stories.

cdgalwegian

I've never really paid attention to the shenanigans surrounding the making of movies, only what the end product is. In relation to Johhson's Last Jedi- that Abrams supposedly had to 'fix': before the script emerged and money had to be fronted, an outline would have had to be presented for approval, prior to the script development. How come it wasn't shredded, and Johnson told to cop on, and go back to the drawing board, or fired- because of 'creative differences'- and someone else sought?

Relikk

cdgalwegian wrote: »

I've never really paid attention to the shenanigans surrounding the making of movies, only what the end product is. In relation to Johhson's Last Jedi- that Abrams supposedly had to 'fix': before the script emerged and money had to be fronted, an outline would have had to be presented for approval, prior to the script development. How come it wasn't shredded, and Johnson told to cop on, and go back to the drawing board, or fired- because of 'creative differences'- and someone else sought?

That's one of the things that has always baffled me. How that screenplay got green-lit, and how there weren't at least some dissenting voices within Lucasfilm telling the producers that it's not going to go down well with some fans, I don't know.

The Megaphone

Runaway hit highest gross beating The force Awakens

My next gripe - can someone explain to me how ‘light space skipping’ works as in how did the tie fighters track them? And how did they know when to come out of light space at the same time?

The more I think about this film, the more it annoys me how they break established rules for the sake of CGI special effects!

Relikk

The Last Jedi introduced hyperspace tracking.

The Megaphone

Runaway hit highest gross beating The force Awakens

Relikk wrote: »

The Last Jedi introduced hyperspace tracking.

But that was based aboard a capital ship, not a fighter!

Sad Professor

cdgalwegian wrote: »

I've never really paid attention to the shenanigans surrounding the making of movies, only what the end product is. In relation to Johhson's Last Jedi- that Abrams supposedly had to 'fix': before the script emerged and money had to be fronted, an outline would have had to be presented for approval, prior to the script development. How come it wasn't shredded, and Johnson told to cop on, and go back to the drawing board, or fired- because of 'creative differences'- and someone else sought?

TLJ had by far the smoothest production in the history of the franchise. The script was finished months before shooting began, which was almost unheard of. Johnson kept Kennedy/Disney in the loop during all stages of its development. He involved the LucasFilm story group to a huge extent, meeting with them regularly to bounce ideas off them. JJ also read the script and said he wished he had written it. The film and its script were fully approved by everyone and was finished ahead of schedule. The only person who really had issues with it was Hamill and his approval wasn't a requirement. If it was TFA's script wouldn't have got the green light either.

Loafing Oaf

Burty330 wrote: »

Luke Hamill himself disagrees with everything you just said , as does

Mark Skywalker?:P

The Golden Miller

In short, the problem with the new films is they are the continuity of the Anakin Skywalker story, and Anakin never showed up at any point. What was the point?

Sudious said he had every Sith behind him, they lived in him. Anakin in his purest form, at full potential, was more powerful than every Sith who ever lived combined.

J Mysterio

Runaway hit highest gross beating The force Awakens

The Golden Miller wrote: »

In short, the problem with the new films is they are the continuity of the Anakin Skywalker story, and Anakin never showed up at any point. What was the point?

Sudious said he had every Sith behind him, they lived in him. Anakin in his purest form, at full potential, was more powerful than every Sith who ever lived combined.

Anakin came good, and so was no longer a Sith.

CinemaGuy45

Total flop and a financial loss for Disney

The Megaphone wrote: »

But that was based aboard a capital ship, not a fighter!

matthewmurdock

Biggest problem was TLJ left so few narrative threads it left to be expanded upon and concluded in Episode 9.

I count 1 narrative thread with any potential to go anywhere, which was the Rey and Kylo bond, which they utilised.

As a standalone film I think TLJ isn't too bad at all, some things it does very well in fact. However as the middle film in a Star Wars trilogy, it is an abomination.

Star Wars fan in a minority here as, apart from Attack of the Clones, I really enjoyed all the films.
Hated this one. The dialogue was absolutely shocking. Whatever you can say about TLJ, it had memorable and meaningful dialogue.
Pacing all over the shop, the scene between Ford and Driver lost its weight amid the madness.
The conclusion was bizarre, I still can’t figure out why Jedi were talking to Rey while the last Skywalker was there in a pit. Kylo/Ben spent his adult life talking to Vader’s mask yet Anakin couldn’t speak to him? Missed a big trick there.
Plot holes all over the place, fair enough, it’s Star Wars, but the film also contradicted itself.
Funny how the entire plot was leaked online and by Burger King though.

Driver and Ridley did well with a bad script.