Ahed Tamimi - a young woman to admire

Odhinn

Brae100 wrote: »

Israel colonising Palestinian land? The surrounding Arab states launched a war on Israel in 1967 and tried to annihilate it. Israel defended itself and won.

Yep. And currently Israel is colonising land outside its legal borders.

Robbietherobber wrote:

o what your saying is this point doesn't align with your view so you're just going to ignore it.

No, its just a pointless reference to past events that can be summed up as "But the Arabs...."

Elmer Blooker

SnakePlissken wrote: »

... if Israel were to disband the buffer zone, tear down those walls, and accept Palestinians as free neighbors, does anyone believe they won't be massacred by suicide bombings and mass stabbings as was the norm in Israel during the 90's. The Israeli's aren't cruel through malice, but warranted fear.

Some of Israel's best friends are suicide bombers, stabbers and head choppers.
Israel even patches them up in their hospitals so that they can go back and do their grisly work in Syria.
As always aid for jihadists is disguised as "humanitarian".
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/priti-patel-sought-cash-for-golan-heights-hospital-treating-syrian-jihadists-8x859ttp7

SnakePlissken

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

Some of Israel's best friends are suicide bombers, stabbers and head choppers.
Israel even patches them up in their hospitals so that they can go back and do their grizzly work in Syria.
As always aid for jihadists is disguised as "humanitarian".
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/priti-patel-sought-cash-for-golan-heights-hospital-treating-syrian-jihadists-8x859ttp7

This doesn't answer the question I posited.

gandalf

SnakePlissken wrote: »

For those unfamiliar with where I took my username, Snake Plissken is a character from the John Carpenter movie Escape from New York, a movie about a walled, hellish, open air prison, and so I don't for a moment deny the Gaza strip is near identical and I certainly empathise with its many innocents, but if Israel were to disband the buffer zone, tear down those walls, and accept Palestinians as free neighbors, does anyone believe they won't be massacred by suicide bombings and mass stabbings as was the norm in Israel during the 90's. The Israeli's aren't cruel through malice, but warranted fear.

It's a chance they will have to take. We took it here with the GFA and on the whole NI is now peaceful with the exception of the absolute extremists. If the Israelis started to treat the Palestinians as equals and not in the apartheid fashion we see today I think the whole situation there would deescalate.

We just have to look at the topic at hand to highlight this situation.

If an Israeli slaps a soldier they get a warning, if a Palestinian does they do time in Prison. That same Israeli has been charged in the past with throwing stones at soldiers, if a Palestinian does so it normally results in a headshot.....

I think the main result of the walling off of the Palestinians is to dehumanise them further to Israeli society and to facilitate the OTT and in reality quite murderous treatment of protesters. I don't shy away from the fact that those in power in the PA are extremists but when you treat the general population like 2nd or 3rd class citizens then you drive them to extremists. We know from our own history here actions like that by a state swells the ranks of "terrorists/freedom fighters" (delete as appropriate depending on your stance) and in the long term is counterproductive and will not lead to peace.

Berserker

Edison Incalculable Tomato wrote: »

You can have a mentality of wanting to avoid escalation, aiming for proportionate responses to acts of aggression. Or you can have the mentality of wanting to annihilate your enemy. Imprisoning a 16 year old girl for a slap is definitely indicative of the latter.

That may be the case if this was a one off incident but this young lady is a known activist who has previous history with the authorities. On watching the video, the only aggression I see is from this young lady. Hard to criticise the behaviour of the soldiers who were subject to repeated assaults. Don't know about you but I'd struggle to keep calm if someone started kicking and punching me like that.

RobbieTheRobber

Odhinn wrote: »

No, its just a pointless reference to past events that can be summed up as "But the Arabs...."

Sorry what?

Are you saying we should ignore the history of Palestine and Israel when discussing the future or current situation of Israel and Palestine?

Odhinn

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Sorry what?

Are you saying we should ignore the history of Palestine and Israel when discussing the future or current situation of Israel and Palestine?

No, I'm saying that past aggression by arab states doesn't justify the colonisation of Palestinian land now.

s7ryf3925pivug

Berserker wrote: »

That may be the case if this was a one off incident but this young lady is a known activist who has previous history with the authorities. On watching the video, the only aggression I see is from this young lady. Hard to criticise the behaviour of the soldiers who were subject to repeated assaults. Don't know about you but I'd struggle to keep calm if someone started kicking and punching me like that.

What was more damaging to Israel? Annoying nuisance slaps to a soldier? Or international condemnation for brutal treatment of a 16 year old girl styled like a westerner after her cousin was severely injured?

They want to escalate things, crush and destroy their enemies. This is the business of every western nation because of the knock on effect that is to swell terrorist groups. They need to be held to account, not be allowed create martyr after martyr.

Berserker

Edison Incalculable Tomato wrote: »

What was more damaging to Israel? Annoying nuisance slaps to a soldier? Or international condemnation for brutal treatment of a 16 year old girl styled like a westerner after her cousin was severely injured?

What brutal treatment are you on about? The soldiers smiled at her first and they didn't react when she kicked and slapped them. You can see that in the video. She looked like a lunatic.

s7ryf3925pivug

Berserker wrote: »

What brutal treatment are you on about? The soldiers smiled at her first and they didn't react when she kicked and slapped them. You can see that in the video. She looked like a lunatic.

Child imprisonment is brutal.

Brae100

Ahed Tamimi has advocated killing Jews. She has supported murderers. Her family are known as "Pallywood". They stage events so that they can video them for propaganda. Her uncle and Aunt organised the suicide bombing that killed 15 innocent civilians and injured hundreds others. But knock yourself out defending her.

hatrickpatrick

Brae100 wrote: »

That's an interesting concept in warfare. Let your enemies keep attacking you. When you win, just reset and let them try again.

Stealing land belonging to civilians, and imposing a government which is not recognised by the majority of those civilians, is literally never justified, ever, for any reason. Ever. Only if those civilians freely consent to Israeli rule, would the Israeli government have a right to make or enforce literally any policies at all with regard to how that land is zoned, administered, etc.

skepticalme

Berserker wrote: »

What brutal treatment are you on about? The soldiers smiled at her first and they didn't react when she kicked and slapped them. You can see that in the video. She looked like a lunatic.

Looks like there's a longer video which is not as popular.
This article claims the soldier slapped her first.

https://mondoweiss.net/2017/12/tamimi-slapped-talking/

Madagascan

Edison Incalculable Tomato wrote: »

Berserker wrote: »

What brutal treatment are you on about? The soldiers smiled at her first and they didn't react when she kicked and slapped them. You can see that in the video. She looked like a lunatic.

Child imprisonment is brutal.

Child killing by her family is cruel.
Her Aunt murdered 8 children.
Her family in total 22 people.
She wants the Palestinians to stab and blow up Israelis.

Kivaro

Brae100 wrote: »

Ahed Tamimi has advocated killing Jews. She has supported murderers. Her family are known as "Pallywood". They stage events so that they can video them for propaganda. Her uncle and Aunt organised the suicide bombing that killed 15 innocent civilians and injured hundreds others. But knock yourself out defending her.

Madagascan wrote: »

Child killing by her family is cruel.
Her Aunt murdered 8 children.
Her family in total 22 people.
She wants the Palestinians to stab and blow up Israelis.

Something unusual about these posters (besides the post count).
Where was the suicide bombing that injured hundreds?
Her Aunt murdered 8 children. Really? Where?

Methinks that you both thou protest too much.
In other words, I don't believe a word you both are saying.

Madagascan

gandalf wrote: »

SnakePlissken wrote: »

For those unfamiliar with where I took my username, Snake Plissken is a character from the John Carpenter movie Escape from New York, a movie about a walled, hellish, open air prison, and so I don't for a moment deny the Gaza strip is near identical and I certainly empathise with its many innocents, but if Israel were to disband the buffer zone, tear down those walls, and accept Palestinians as free neighbors, does anyone believe they won't be massacred by suicide bombings and mass stabbings as was the norm in Israel during the 90's. The Israeli's aren't cruel through malice, but warranted fear.

It's a chance they will have to take. We took it here with the GFA and on the whole NI is now peaceful with the exception of the absolute extremists. If the Israelis started to treat the Palestinians as equals and not in the apartheid fashion we see today I think the whole situation there would deescalate.

.

It would not with people avowing to massacre you.
This conflict can not be compared to N.I.
The Palestinians will only finally end this when all Jewish people in Israel are dead.

Madagascan

Kivaro wrote: »

Brae100 wrote: »

Ahed Tamimi has advocated killing Jews. She has supported murderers. Her family are known as "Pallywood". They stage events so that they can video them for propaganda. Her uncle and Aunt organised the suicide bombing that killed 15 innocent civilians and injured hundreds others. But knock yourself out defending her.

Madagascan wrote: »

Child killing by her family is cruel.
Her Aunt murdered 8 children.
Her family in total 22 people.
She wants the Palestinians to stab and blow up Israelis.

Something unusual about these posters (besides the post count).
Where was the suicide bombing that injured hundreds?
Her Aunt murdered 8 children. Really? Where?

Methinks that you both thou protest too much.
In other words, I don't believe a word you both are saying.

Well as a probably supporter of a Terrorist group like Hamas I don't really care what you think.
So there!

Madagascan

Correction.
Her cousin was the mass murderer.
2001 Sbarro massacre.

JohnMc1

Odhinn wrote: »

Yep. And currently Israel is colonising land outside its legal borders.

To the Victor goes the spoils. Palestine attacked Israel. Israel counter attacked, won and assimilated the land. Happens all the time in war. There was a lesson to be learned there.

SnakePlissken

Kivaro wrote: »

Her Aunt murdered 8 children. Really?

She was complicit, are you incapable or just unwilling to do a quick google search proving exactly this?

Greyfox

Madagascan wrote: »

The Palestinians will only finally end this when all Jewish people in Israel are dead.

That's the same thing as a lion fighting a little zebra and saying the zebra won't stop till the Lion is dead... we both know the Lion is the only winner the same way as we both know Israel are the only side that can win.

hatrickpatrick

JohnMc1 wrote: »

To the Victor goes the spoils. Palestine attacked Israel. Israel counter attacked, won and assimilated the land. Happens all the time in war. There was a lesson to be learned there.

And as a species, following World War II and all of the international agreements and laws which followed, we're supposed to have moved on from the "to the victor go the spoils" mentality, and more to a "what a plurality or a majority of the people decide happens to a region, is what happens to that region" mentality.

Israel claims ad nauseum to count itself among the modern, civilised, democratic countries of the world. It has to respect this new paradigm of democratic consent to sovereignty, or else it has to accept that it will be considered a backwards country and not the modern civilised democracy it wants to label itself. It's that simple.

The reason Israel draws more ire than other countries with conflicts like these is that you never hear a country like Sudan or North Korea for example, claim to be "one of us" as far as modern civilised democracy goes. They don't court the West as allies or claim to be "the only democratic country in their region". And if they did, you sure as f*ck wouldn't have a country like the US accepting this, without a radical change in behaviour from that regime.

Israel wants to - and is allowed by Western governments to - count itself among the civilised world without behaving like it. That's why it infuriates so many people.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Madagascan wrote: »

Correction.
Her cousin was the mass murderer.
2001 Sbarro massacre.

Was that the female solicitor bomber?.

I was in Israel for both the first and second Intifada, and narrowly escape more than one bombing during the second.

Brae100

Kivaro wrote: »

Something unusual about these posters (besides the post count).
Where was the suicide bombing that injured hundreds?
Her Aunt murdered 8 children. Really? Where?

Methinks that you both thou protest too much.
In other words, I don't believe a word you both are saying.

What is unusual about me and my post count? I'm an Irish atheist and I am often critical of Israel's tactics. I just hate this one sided view of the Palestine issue. The Tamimi family are propagandists who are steeped in terrorism. They undertake these actions to fool gullible eejits.

Her aunt and uncle were absolutely complicit in the terrororist attack that resulted in the death of 15 innocent people and injured more than hundred people, including children. Here's the simple wiki page. If you look a bit deeper you will see what her family are really like.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sbarro_restaurant_suicide_bombing

Brae100

Here she is, Shirley Temper as she has become known as, advocating stabbing and bombing Jews.

http://www.israellycool.com/2018/01/03/watch-shirley-temper-ahed-tamimi-calls-for-stabbings-and-suicide-bombings/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

end of the road

JohnMc1 wrote: »

To the Victor goes the spoils. Palestine attacked Israel. Israel counter attacked, won and assimilated the land. Happens all the time in war. There was a lesson to be learned there.

nope. israel went on a land grab. to the victor goes the spoils isn't valid as it is against international law to land grab. anything outside the 1948 borders does not belong to israel and never will.

Brae100

In this article you will also see photos of her at the wedding of her terrorist uncle and Aunt who were behind the Sbarro bombing and also other examples of their support for terrorism.

https://legalinsurrection.com/2017/12/media-should-stop-whitewashing-ahed-tamimis-terror-supporting-family/

hatrickpatrick

end of the road wrote: »

nope. israel went on a land grab. to the victor goes the spoils isn't valid as it is against international law to land grab. anything outside the 1948 borders does not belong to israel and never will.

"To the victor go the spoils" is a mentality which is archaic, barbaric and has no place in a modern, civilised, self-styled Western democracy. Israel can either adopt the ethical and moral cornerstones of modern civilisation or it can put up with not being counted as part of it. What it can't do, and what it's trying to do, is have both - behave like a backwards, barbaric society while claiming to be "the only democracy in the middle east" and acting in a self-righteous" we're one of the good guys" manner, expecting to be treated as a part of the civilised world and not as one of the rogue actors.

To put this in a simpler fashion, Israel is like someone who wants to be allowed to sit at the decent peoples' table without acting like a decent person. They can't have both. Their insistence that they can, and the fact that America, a supposed moral arbiter, is enabling them in this hypocrisy, is what makes them so infuriating - more so than other countries who practise similar human rights abuses but don't prance around saying "we're one of the good guys!"

Brae100

end of the road wrote: »

nope. israel went on a land grab. to the victor goes the spoils isn't valid as it is against international law to land grab. anything outside the 1948 borders does not belong to israel and never will.

1967 was not a land grab. The Arab states surrounding Israel launched an all out war against Israel with the sole intention of wiping Istael off the map. Israel defended itself and won. It took land during this war and then gave most of it back in the hope for peace. The Arabs didn't care. Time and Time again, Israel has offered to return the land in exchange for peace. The Arabs aren't interested.

Simple example. An IDF soldier murders a Palestinian, he is court martialed and sent to jail. A Palestinian murders an Israeli and his family are given a bounty and a monthly stipend. Wtf?

Greyfox

Brae100 wrote: »

1967 was not a land grab. The Arab states surrounding Israel launched an all out war against Israel with the sole intention of wiping Istael off the map. Israel defended itself and won. It took land during this war and then gave most of it back in the hope for peace

Well the arab states never agreed to the creation of Israel, what did people think was going to happen if you tell people they have to leave there homeland and live somewhere else? Why should Muslims be punished for what Hitler did? We both know Israel didn't give land back and have continued to take more and more land and to throw more and more people out of there homes, we both know how much Israel has expanded since it's creation.

why are irish people so interested in israel

never understood it

end of the road

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

"To the victor go the spoils" is a mentality which is archaic, barbaric and has no place in a modern, civilised, self-styled Western democracy. Israel can either adopt the ethical and moral cornerstones of modern civilisation or it can put up with not being counted as part of it. What it can't do, and what it's trying to do, is have both - behave like a backwards, barbaric society while claiming to be "the only democracy in the middle east" and acting in a self-righteous" we're one of the good guys" manner, expecting to be treated as a part of the civilised world and not as one of the rogue actors.

To put this in a simpler fashion, Israel is like someone who wants to be allowed to sit at the decent peoples' table without acting like a decent person. They can't have both. Their insistence that they can, and the fact that America, a supposed moral arbiter, is enabling them in this hypocrisy, is what makes them so infuriating - more so than other countries who practise similar human rights abuses but don't prance around saying "we're one of the good guys!"

i agree. at least (slowly but surely) people are seeing through their act.

Brae100 wrote: »

1967 was not a land grab. The Arab states surrounding Israel launched an all out war against Israel with the sole intention of wiping Istael off the map. Israel defended itself and won. It took land during this war and then gave most of it back in the hope for peace. The Arabs didn't care. Time and Time again, Israel has offered to return the land in exchange for peace. The Arabs aren't interested.

Simple example. An IDF soldier murders a Palestinian, he is court martialed and sent to jail. A Palestinian murders an Israeli and his family are given a bounty and a monthly stipend. Wtf?

israel took land and were pressured to return it because it belonged to other countries which are or were "friends" of the west. small bits they did return, most they haven't. it could have very easily retreated back within it's 1967 borders if it had been truely "defending" itself from a supposed "all out war" but it didn't because it saw an opportunity for a land grab.
an IDF soldier murders a palestinian and he may be court martialed and jailed. there is absolutely no guarantee of it and it seems in most cases this doesn't actually happen.

Brae100

Greyfox wrote: »

Well the arab states never agreed to the creation of Israel, what did people think was going to happen if you tell people they have to leave there homeland and live somewhere else? Why should Muslims be punished for what Hitler did? We both know Israel didn't give land back and have continued to take more and more land and to throw more and more people out of there homes, we both know how much Israel has expanded since it's creation.

Sinai? Jordan? Jesus, do a little bit of reading. The Israelis aren't saints, but this eulogising of the Arabs is a pain in the hole.

Brae100

end of the road wrote: »

i agree. at least (slowly but surely) people are seeing through their act.




israel took land and were pressured to return it because it belonged to other countries which are or were "friends" of the west. small bits they did return, most they haven't. it could have very easily retreated back within it's 1967 borders if it had been truely "defending" itself from a supposed "all out war" but it didn't because it saw an opportunity for a land grab.
an IDF soldier murders a palestinian and he may be court martialed and jailed. there is absolutely no guarantee of it and it seems in most cases this doesn't actually happen.

Israel was attacked and they won. They made peace with Egypt and gave back the Sinai almost immediately. Gaza and the West Bank have always been up for negotiation, bit the Arabs aren't interested in peace. They just want to destroy Israel. As Golda Meir said, "Peace will come when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us."

There are no winners here, but the ignorant support for terrorists over a liberal democratic state is a bit baffling.

Brae100

[Deleted User] wrote: »

why are irish people so interested in israel

never understood it

It's mainly to do with Irish Republican association with what appeared to be a similar cause. Libya fed arms to the Ra, and there was also a close association between Republicans and Fatah, especially under Yasser Arafat. Other Western countries don't give Hamas and Fatah such an easy pass.

end of the road

Brae100 wrote: »

Israel was attacked and they won. They made peace with Egypt and gave back the Sinai almost immediately.

they were effectively forced to give it back.

Brae100 wrote: »

Gaza and the West Bank have always been up for negotiation, bit the Arabs aren't interested in peace.

nope, gaza and the west bank belong to the palestinian state. they are not up for negotiation, israel must remove itself and stop their illegal occupation.

Brae100 wrote: »

They just want to destroy Israel.

given that that isn't going to happen, it's irrelevant.

Brae100 wrote: »

As Golda Meir said, "Peace will come when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us."

perhapse she should have took her own statements on board. same with the current israely government.

Brae100 wrote: »

There are no winners here, but the ignorant support for terrorists over a liberal democratic state is a bit baffling.

there is no support for terrorists. we are condemning terrorists. it just so happens that one lot of terrorists claim that the state they represent is a liberal democratic state.

Brae100

Amia Panicky Morning wrote: »

Was that the female solicitor bomber?.

I was in Israel for both the first and second Intifada, and narrowly escape more than one bombing during the second.

Hi Mak, I just saw your post. No, the Sbarro suicide bombing was carried out by a male, whose name eludes me. But it was orchestrated by Ahlam Tamimi and her husband. Not cousins, but uncle and Aunt.

Btw, as a completely different aside, are you the guy I see jogging around Balgriffin with an unusual gait?

skepticalme

Brae100 wrote: »

Israel was attacked and they won. They made peace with Egypt and gave back the Sinai almost immediately. Gaza and the West Bank have always been up for negotiation, bit the Arabs aren't interested in peace. They just want to destroy Israel. As Golda Meir said, "Peace will come when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us."

There are no winners here, but the ignorant support for terrorists over a liberal democratic state is a bit baffling.

Isn't it the case that Israel attacked first. Everything I read says this but Israeli supporters always claim that israel was attacked.

Brae100

end of the road wrote: »

they were effectively forced to give it back.

No they weren't. Since when did Israel ever give a **** about what anyone else thought? They could have legally kept Sinai but gave it back voluntarily in the hope for peace.

nope, gaza and the west bank belong to the palestinian state. they are not up for negotiation, israel must remove itself and stop their illegal occupation.

Since when? What is this Palestinian State? Was this not all sorted out years ago when the Israel and Jordan were established?

given that that isn't going to happen, it's irrelevant.

You are saying here that there can never be peace. So, let's just kill all the Jews? Is that your solution?

perhapse she should have took her own statements on board. same with the current israely government.

So you're having a pop at Golda Meir now? You're siding with Hamas and Fatah over Golda Meir? Take a look at yourself.

there is no support for terrorists. we are condemning terrorists. it just so happens that one lot of terrorists claim that the state they represent is a liberal democratic state.

You are absolutely supporting terrorists. This thread is about Ahed Tamimi. She is a terrororist supporter and her family are steeped in terrorist activity. The state of Israel is a secular, democratic state, which recognises gay rights, equal rights for everyone. The only state in the area that eapouses such rights. But for some reason, the far left doesn't like this?

hatrickpatrick

Brae100 wrote: »

Israel was attacked and they won. They made peace with Egypt and gave back the Sinai almost immediately. Gaza and the West Bank have always been up for negotiation, bit the Arabs aren't interested in peace. They just want to destroy Israel. As Golda Meir said, "Peace will come when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us."

There are no winners here, but the ignorant support for terrorists over a liberal democratic state is a bit baffling.

Again, it's about civilian consent. The majority of the people living in the occupied territories have never consented to Israeli sovereignty over those territories, ergo Israel's imposition of authority in those territories, and everything that goes along with that - allowing Israelis to move onto land there which belongs to others, policing it, etc - is entirely illegitimate. Who won what is irrelevant, the only thing that matters is that a majority of the people do not accept or consent to Israeli authority in that region. Such is the civilised world we're supposed to live in now, post Geneva convention, post WWII. That Israel continues to act in a way which is inconsistent with the values of "liberal democracy" and yet its supporters insist on calling it a "liberal democracy" as you have done, is precisely why so many are hostile towards it.

Let me ask you a question: Would you have counted the British government as a proper democracy during the period in which Catholics in Northern Ireland were systematically discriminated against and gerrymandered to prevent their having any influence on the democratic process? And while attacks by security forces against civilians were defended, covered up and even in some cases praised? I certainly wouldn't. The British government pre-GFA was not a "democratic" government in the true sense of the term, once Northern Ireland is included in its remit.

Kivaro

Brae100 wrote: »

....
The state of Israel is a secular, democratic state, which recognises gay rights, equal rights for everyone. The only state in the area that eapouses such rights. But for some reason, the far left doesn't like this?

I'm afraid you are delusional.
And to ironclad Israel's apartheid regime in the country, a new nation-state law was passed by them last week. It declared itself a Jewish state. To say that the country is secular is to ignore the reality.

Equal rights for everyone?
The new law establishes Hebrew as Israel’s official language, and downgrades Arabic to a “special status.” It makes the almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel second class citizens. The new law also states that “the right to exercise national self-determination” in Israel is “unique to the Jewish people.”
Now, that is not being very inclusive, is it?

And to finally legalise the land grab of Palestinian homes and land, the new law establishes “Jewish settlement as a national value” and mandates that the state “will labor to encourage and promote its establishment and development.”

Many Jewish people in Israel and prominent Jews in America denounced the new law as racist and undemocratic.

s7ryf3925pivug

I was aware of that law too. Also aware it caused some Jewish figures to voice criticism who usually have not. Worth mentioning that over 50% of Jews polled in Israel said it should have treated people of all religions equally.

As regards the girl, it very obviously is about propaganda. [The term PR refers to propaganda in a civilian context. I think propaganda is the appropriate term here.] My main point is that Israel is feeding that propaganda by imprisoning a 16 year old girl and that has a knock on effect around the world. It is brutal to imprison a 16 year old for something like this too though, regardless of whom her family is.

And yeah describing Israel as liberal is at best very uninformed.

Odhinn

JohnMc1 wrote: »

To the Victor goes the spoils. P...........

The aqquistion of territory by force is explicilty forbidden in international law.

Brae100 wrote:

Simple example. An IDF soldier murders a Palestinian, he is court martialed and sent to jail.

What universe does that happen in?
"An Israeli army officer who fired the entire magazine of his automatic rifle into a 13-year-old Palestinian girl and then said he would have done the same even if she had been three years old was acquitted on all charges by a military court yesterday."

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2005/nov/16/israel2

PlaneSpeeking

Odhinn wrote: »

The aqquistion of territory by force is explicilty forbidden in international law.





What universe does that happen in?
"An Israeli army officer who fired the entire magazine of his automatic rifle into a 13-year-old Palestinian girl and then said he would have done the same even if she had been three years old was acquitted on all charges by a military court yesterday."

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2005/nov/16/israel2

Jesus even for the Grauniad that's crap.

Odhinn

PlaneSpeeking wrote: »

Jesus even for the Grauniad that's crap.

Sorry..........?

PlaneSpeeking

Odhinn wrote: »

Sorry..........?

One sided, puerile garbage.

"little girl" my a**e. When asked to put down her schoolbag - did she ?

Why was she there? What role did the father or others play in her actions ?

These questions were not answered or even asked.

Your "side" has been well established over multiple threads so there is no way a questioning attitude will be taken here. Shame.

Odhinn

PlaneSpeeking wrote: »

One sided,(......)e. Shame.

Funny guy.



The facts are well established

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4440490.stm

PlaneSpeeking

Odhinn wrote: »

Funny guy.



The facts are well established

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4440490.stm

No they're really not.

end of the road

skepticalme wrote: »

Isn't it the case that Israel attacked first. Everything I read says this but Israeli supporters always claim that israel was attacked.

that's my understanding of it also.

Brae100 wrote: »

No they weren't. Since when did Israel ever give a **** about what anyone else thought? They could have legally kept Sinai but gave it back voluntarily in the hope for peace.




Since when? What is this Palestinian State? Was this not all sorted out years ago when the Israel and Jordan were established?





You are saying here that there can never be peace. So, let's just kill all the Jews? Is that your solution?





So you're having a pop at Golda Meir now? You're siding with Hamas and Fatah over Golda Meir? Take a look at yourself.





You are absolutely supporting terrorists. This thread is about Ahed Tamimi. She is a terrororist supporter and her family are steeped in terrorist activity. The state of Israel is a secular, democratic state, which recognises gay rights, equal rights for everyone. The only state in the area that eapouses such rights. But for some reason, the far left doesn't like this?

they couldn't have legally kept anything. the only land they are legally entitled to is that within the borders as set out in 1948 they were effectively pressured to give Sinai back by the US

the state of israel is a non-secular, democratic in name only state, which does not recognise equal rights for everyone. it recognises equal rights for those they believe to be the right type of citizen. supposibly recognising gay rights does not automatically make a country a decent and moral nation. and given the IDF blackmail gay palestinians, i'm not sure israel can truely be said to recognise gay rights.

PlaneSpeeking

end of the road wrote: »

that's my understanding of it also.



they couldn't have legally kept anything. the only land they are legally entitled to is that within the borders as set out in 1948 they were effectively pressured to give Sinai back by the US

the state of israel is a non-secular, democratic in name only state, which does not recognise equal rights for everyone. it recognises equal rights for those they believe to be the right type of citizen. supposibly recognising gay rights does not automatically make a country a decent and moral nation. and given the IDF blackmail gay palestinians, i'm not sure israel can truely be said to recognise gay rights.

I'd love to see a link to your proof of that!