Future of Ryanair

Wanderer78

Resverathrole wrote: »

Ultimately they don't deserve it. They didn't have the courage or shrewdness to create the business model. They're just pawns who decided, themselves, to work for RA. It's the O'Learys of this world that motivate people to make something of themselves.

so would you say, workers, possibly all workers should be treated poorly in order to achieve business success, and is this a good model to have a healthy society?

Resverathrole

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

but not majorly.

bigly?

PlaneSpeeking

Resverathrole wrote: »

Gee, tell me more.

Ah it was years ago - we had practically weekly overtime, made a fortune and then one of the union reps got shifty for some reason and decided no one was doing over time - ever.

Picketed the place and everything - I strolled on it, past intimidation; insults; eggs and a water balloon filled with (I chose to believe) warm apple juice.

Cancelled my subs, told them to do one and for a few weeks later the rep would casually turn up to the break room, or at my desk and "remind me" that "solidarity is strength" and various soundbites like that crap. Even said "it's a dangerous place out there without backing...." (it was the War Pensions Office, hardly the mean streets!!!)

Was like a piss poor bargain basement Goodfellas with idiots in the roles. Actually found it amusing tbh. Never been in a union since nor intended to.

Resverathrole

Wanderer78 wrote: »

so would you say, workers, possibly all workers should be treated poorly in order to achieve business success, and is this a good model to have a healthy society?

When you say treated poorly, do you mean not paid enough?

It's good for society to have a variety of didn't business models. Then when these companies compete, they're kept on their toes.

Wanderer78

Resverathrole wrote: »

When you say treated poorly, do you mean not paid enough?

It's good for society to have a variety of didn't business models. Then when these companies compete, they're kept on their toes.

does money solve all of human needs?

different thinking is most certainly good, not just in business, but we most definitely need successful businesses such as ryanair in order to succeed, but is treating employees poorly a good thing for the successes of these business? kept on their toes, what do you mean by this? do you believe things such as 'increasing worker insecurity' are truly good for the economy?

blinding

Resverathrole wrote: »

Ultimately they don't deserve it. They didn't have the courage or shrewdness to create the business model. They're just pawns who decided, themselves, to work for RA. It's the O'Learys of this world that motivate people to make something of themselves.

How much Irish state Aid did Ryanair get to take it to where it is ?

2smiggy

blinding wrote: »

How much Irish state Aid did Ryanair get to take it to where it is ?

how much ? you seem to know

El Tarangu

blinding wrote: »

How much Irish state Aid did Ryanair get to take it to where it is ?

I don't know. How much taxes have they paid over the past 30 years - billions?

PlaneSpeeking

El Tarangu wrote: »

I don't know. How much taxes have they paid over the past 30 years - billions?

Easily - plus whilst I'm no expert, nowhere that I can see does it say the company was set up with any funds other than provided by the founders and a share option.

Wanderer78

PlaneSpeeking wrote: »

Easily - plus whilst I'm no expert, nowhere that I can see does it say the company was set up with any funds other than provided by the founders and a share option.

would providing a publicly funded, publicly educated work force count as public funding?

PlaneSpeeking

Wanderer78 wrote: »

would providing a publicly funded, publicly educated work force count as public funding?

No.

Wanderer78

PlaneSpeeking wrote: »

No.

fair enough

blinding

El Tarangu wrote: »

I don't know. How much taxes have they paid over the past 30 years - billions?

Big Business in Ireland is extraordinarily good at paying very little Tax . It’s Small Biddy and Small Paddy that promptly pays their tax and don’t have the facility to avoid it either .

And strangely enough the Irish government ministers will be all over you if you are extraordinarily good at avoiding tax e.g. Bono .

Hitman3000

blinding wrote:

How much Irish state Aid did Ryanair get to take it to where it is ?

None because it's illegal under EU rules.

Hitman3000

Wanderer78 wrote:

would providing a publicly funded, publicly educated work force count as public funding?

Nope, now if the workers were indentured slaves educated at the expense of the state you may have a point.

blinding

Hitman3000 wrote: »

None because it's illegal under EU rules.

How long are those rules in force ?

How long have Ryanair been around ?

Hitman3000

blinding wrote:

Big Business in Ireland is extraordinarily good at paying very little Tax . It’s Small Biddy and Small Paddy that promptly pays their tax and don’t have the facility to avoid it either .

Big business is very good at using schemes set up by government to lessen their tax burden. However that big business provides Biddy and Paddy with jobs that allows them engage in economic activity paying tax being one of them, buying goods and services which in turn helps provide other jobs.

blinding wrote:

And strangely enough the Irish government ministers will be all over you if you are extraordinarily good at avoiding tax e.g. Bono .

Can't stand Bono but any of his music sales or concerts here are subject to tax. Like it or not he is one of our most famous citizens internationally and a lot of people pay attention to what he says.

Hitman3000

blinding wrote:

How long are those rules in force ?

1957 treaty article 107(1)

blinding wrote:

How long have Ryanair been around ?

33 years.

Turnipman

I suspect that what the blind one is on about is the favour (or 'stroke' if you prefer) that the late Seamus Brennan performed for Ryanair when he was Minister for Transport, way back in 1989.

From memory, he stopped Aer Lingus from introducing a service from Dublin to Stansted and awarded the licence to Ryanair. That saved Ryanair from bankruptcy.

Hitman3000

Turnipman wrote:

From memory, he stopped Aer Lingus from introducing a service from Dublin to Stansted and awarded the licence to Ryanair. That saved Ryanair from bankruptcy.

It also allowed genuine competition.

murpho999

blinding wrote: »

Big Business in Ireland is extraordinarily good at paying very little Tax . It’s Small Biddy and Small Paddy that promptly pays their tax and don’t have the facility to avoid it either .

And strangely enough the Irish government ministers will be all over you if you are extraordinarily good at avoiding tax e.g. Bono .

These posts make me laugh.

Firstly big companies are major employers here who give small Paddy and small Biddy their jobs and that should be considered more than the actual tax they pay. They are not a burden on the state.

Secondly, Bono, it's not him avoiding tax but the company he has with U2 and they are registered as a business in Holland and they'd pay corporate taxes there.

However, Bono would pay his own personal taxes in Ireland as he is a resident.

Turnipman

Hitman3000 wrote: »

It also allowed genuine competition.

Absolutely.

So the obvious follow-up question has to be: how much did it cost the Irish taxpayer to bail the union-run Aer Lingus (and some of its pension schemes) out in later years?

end of the road

Hitman3000 wrote: »

It also allowed genuine competition.

competition or not, it was absolutely wrong for the minister to do what he did.

PlaneSpeeking

end of the road wrote: »

competition or not, it was absolutely wrong for the minister to do what he did.

Explain ?

Hitman3000

end of the road wrote:

competition or not, it was absolutely wrong for the minister to do what he did.

Was it? What law was broke and why didn't AL launch a legal challenge If one was?

Turnipman

Hitman3000 wrote: »

Was it? What law was broke and why didn't AL launch a legal challenge If one was?

It could be argued that he interfered improperly in the operations of a state-owned company. Mind you, bearing in mind the make up of the Aer Lingus board back in those dark days, everyone would have laughed themselves sick at such a suggestion!

PlaneSpeeking

Hitman3000 wrote: »

Was it? What law was broke and why didn't AL launch a legal challenge If one was?

I'm sure any second EOTR will return with a definitive answer to the question. :rolleyes:

Hitman3000

Turnipman wrote:

It could be argued that he interfered improperly in the operations of a state-owned company. Mind you, bearing in mind the make up of the Aer Lingus board back in those dark days, everyone would have laughed themselves sick at such a suggestion!

Giving the licence to AL could have been seen as state aid to a state company. Uncompetitive.

Hitman3000

PlaneSpeeking wrote:

I'm sure any second EOTR will return with a definitive answer to the question.

I won't hold my breathe just to be on the safe side.

PlaneSpeeking

Hitman3000 wrote: »

I won't hold my breathe just to be on the safe side.

Best not! Purple is SO last year!!!! :D:D

Turnipman

Hitman3000 wrote: »

Giving the licence to AL could have been seen as state aid to a state company. Uncompetitive.

But you've no problems whatsoever with him awarding it to wealthy citizen Tony Ryan without a tender competition?

Needless to say, no favours were sought or given.

Hitman3000

Turnipman wrote:

But you've no problems whatsoever with him awarding it to wealthy citizen Tony Ryan without a tender competition?

Whether I have a problem or not is irrelevant sometimes the ends justify the means. AL had a monopoly RA's existence broke this, allowing ordinary citizens the chance to fly not just the wealthy.

richiepurgas

Turnipman wrote: »

I suspect that what the blind one is on about is the favour (or 'stroke' if you prefer) that the late Seamus Brennan performed for Ryanair when he was Minister for Transport, way back in 1989.

From memory, he stopped Aer Lingus from introducing a service from Dublin to Stansted and awarded the licence to Ryanair. That saved Ryanair from bankruptcy.

Right, he also ordered Aer Lingus off the Dublin to Liverpool route and had a rant when he was asked live on Morning Ireland if Ryanair donated to FF.

Resverathrole

richiepurgas wrote: »

and had a rant when he was asked live on Morning Ireland if Ryanair donated to FF.

Tell me more.

Turnipman

https://www.rte.ie/archives/2015/0707/713260-ryanairs-first-flight/

Them were the days, joxer! No females allowed on Ryanair flights (other than as flight attendants), back in those halcyon days when women knew their place!

The RTE reporter (who has since been castrated and his balls fed to the sharks) even makes an explicit reference to "Waterford businessmen" in his report!

Turnipman

Turnipman wrote: »

even makes an explicit reference to "Waterford businessmen" in his report!

Says Turnipman. :pac:

Turnipman

Deleted User wrote: »

Says Turnipman. :pac:

You want me to become transgendered? :eek:

I'll do a lot for freedom of expression, but that's a snip too far!

Donald Trump

Deleted User wrote: »

Says Turnipman. :pac:

Did you just assume its identity?

:eek:




Ze is allowed to make its own decisions ya feckin' intolerant prick :pac:

dfx-

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

If Ryanair were to go bust or significantly change their model (and I severely doubt this industrial relations strife will result in anything like that) then another company would come in and fill the void. For sure, they changed the face of the airline industry. But the idea that they remain crucial to maintenance of the new landscape is flawed.

The past is the past, so saying 'don't forget what Ryanair did for cheap flights' is no longer an argument against poor employer practices or lacking customer service. The issues should be debated on their own merits.

At present I think people would be slightly mad to be booking trips with them as industrial actions seem to only be increasing across their network.

Best post in the thread. It doesn't matter anymore about how the prices used to be higher. If Ryanair was to disappear, there are plenty of other non-striking low cost carriers now able to step in. And there's no chance of them giving up Dublin to easyjet or Norwegian anytime soon.

It's great to see employment through fear have its tables turned when staff can just leave into a better job with a better airline.

Earleybird

dfx- wrote: »

Best post in the thread. It doesn't matter anymore about how the prices used to be higher. If Ryanair was to disappear, there are plenty of other non-striking low cost carriers now able to step in. And there's no chance of them giving up Dublin to easyjet or Norwegian anytime soon.

It's great to see employment through fear have its tables turned when staff can just leave into a better job with a better airline.

Completely agree. Doubt there's a poster on Boards who doesn't have a negative story about Ryanair; personally I'd be delighted to see them decimated and replaced. Won't happen, certainly not in the short term, but we can dream.

Brendan Bendar

Earleybird wrote: »

Completely agree. Doubt there's a poster on Boards who doesn't have a negative story about Ryanair; personally I'd be delighted to see them decimated and replaced. Won't happen, certainly not in the short term, but we can dream.

Why would you like that,buddy?

zom

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Why would you like that,buddy?

When you grow too big, you (usually) stop to listen to your customers and by having strong position on the market you push your ideas instead (vide Microsoft).

Hitman3000

Earleybird wrote:

Completely agree. Doubt there's a poster on Boards who doesn't have a negative story about Ryanair; personally I'd be delighted to see them decimated and replaced. Won't happen, certainly not in the short term, but we can dream.

Have travelled with RA about 30 times in the last 10 years. I guess I'm lucky the worst that happened was a 40 minute delay due to fog.
Now AL I have only flown with 2 had booked a d paid for another flight but they cancelled the flight. Loosing the cost of the accommodation left a sour taste wouldn't consider them again.

Resverathrole

Hitman3000 wrote: »

Now AL I have only flown with 2 had booked a d paid for another flight but they cancelled the flight. Loosing the cost of the accommodation left a sour taste wouldn't consider them again.

Is that spelled right?

Hitman3000

Do you tink it's impoortent, is the speling so badd yuo can't figreu out wat is bing saad?

Brendan Bendar

zom wrote: »

When you grow too big, you (usually) stop to listen to your customers and by having strong position on the market you push you ideas instead (vide Microsoft).

Looks like FR haven’t fallen to that trap,buddy.

They hear low fares.” When you grow too big You(usually) stop to listen to your customers”

What does that mean, my friend, seems incongruous to this poster.


As a matter of interest what ideas are FR pushing?

Strange post.

Earleybird

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Looks like FR haven’t fallen to that trap,buddy.

They hear low fares.” When you grow too big You(usually) stop to listen to your customers”

What does that mean, my friend, seems incongruous to this poster.


As a matter of interest what ideas are FR pushing?

Strange post.

Almost as strange as the amount of condescending mates, buddy's, friends, pals that you can string into your posts, son.

zom

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

As a matter of interest what ideas are FR pushing?.

"Random" seating is the first comes to my mind. Everyone knows it splits people for purpose. So now you have to wait as long as possible before you do online check-in to minimize distant you will get split.

Earleybird

zom wrote: »

"Random" seating is the first comes to my mind. Everyone knows it splits people for purpose. So now you have to wait as long as possible before you do online check-in to minimize distant you will get split.

And the continual denying that they were deliberately splitting people up. I've never seen a run like it....

Brendan Bendar

Earleybird wrote: »

Almost as strange as the amount of condescending mates, buddy's, friends, pals that you can string into your posts, son.

I’ll take that as a nooooooo