Luas hopping, Dutch gold drinking Shane Ross goes after motorists licences again.

drunkmonkey

He's at it again from his public transport served high horse..

"It will be graduated, the more you break the speed limit the more you’ll be punished – there will be higher penalty points, certainly.”

"Motorists who break the speed limit could also find themselves banned from driving after just one offence."

http://www.thejournal.ie/graduated-speeding-laws-4163815-Aug2018/

So 1 offence and you could be off the road, again a disproportionate attack on people not served by the Luas or Dublin bus.

colm_mcm

Don’t see the problem with that tbh.

satguy

Why can't he just take a leaf out of Enda Kenny's book, and just do nothing.

Thibus

If you don't want a penalty then don't speed. It's fairly straight forward.
If it helps to brings road deaths down then that's brilliant.
Seems to me that there is something in the news about people being killed on the roads every couple of days lately

bear1

So the more you break the speed limit the higher the punishment.
Which is already standard practice in many eu countries.
And this is bad how?
The politicians in this country are screwed if they do something and screwed if they don't.

Kevin Finnerty

I'd be in favour, I'll reserve judgement until I see his actual proposals.

KERSPLAT!

Sounds reasonable to me.

Mr.Crinklewood

Don't see anything about the law just being applied to Dublin.

I'm assuming you heard this wrong and this is nationwide.





On,and one offense of speeding could also kill people.

Allinall

Are the people that don’t live near the LUAS or bus stops allowed to drive faster that the rest?

New one on me.

uck51js9zml2yt

Why is he promoting alcohol?

Atlantic Dawn

It should be salary based, a days salary as fine.

drunkmonkey

Allinall wrote: »

Are the people that don’t live near the LUAS or bus stops allowed to drive faster that the rest?

New one on me.

It's about the punishment being life changing for someone outside Dublin, Shane Ross could lose his licence in the morning and life wouldn't change for him, he's got the most comprehensive public transport system in the country outside his door.
He's like a little gourier throwing stones and running off knowing none will ever hit him.

An "attack" for crying out loud. There are signs all over the place stating the speed limit, just don't speed. It isn't difficult.

Allinall

drunkmonkey wrote: »

It's about the punishment being life changing for someone outside Dublin, Shane Ross could lose his licence in the morning and life wouldn't change for him, he's got the most comprehensive public transport system in the country outside his door.
He's like a little gourier throwing stones and running off knowing none will ever hit him.

I live near the LUAS, and would be very much in favour of a graduated fine and points system for speeding.

Does that make me a gourier (sic) ?

KERSPLAT!

drunkmonkey wrote: »

It's about the punishment being life changing for someone outside Dublin, Shane Ross could lose his licence in the morning and life wouldn't change for him, he's got the most comprehensive public transport system in the country outside his door.
He's like a little gourier throwing stones and running off knowing none will ever hit him.

Don't break the speed limit and you won't have an issue, wherever you live.

Collie D

Prison sentences or fines or any other punishment affect somebody's life too. By OP's logic these shouldn't be enforced either.

As the saying goes: If you can't do the time...

sydthebeat

Will this apply to our "yellow reg" speedsters too?

whomitconcerns

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

It should be salary based, a days salary as fine.

It's up to a week here in London.. If your on the motorway you can really get hammered!

Hitman3000

drunkmonkey wrote:

It's about the punishment being life changing for someone outside Dublin, Shane Ross could lose his licence in the morning and life wouldn't change for him, he's got the most comprehensive public transport system in the country outside his door. He's like a little gourier throwing stones and running off knowing none will ever hit him.

I live outside Dublin ,10 miles from the nearest town. Driving for over 20 years. Got caught speeding 18 years ago. Never happened again. Not really hard to obey the law. Makes the road safer for everyone.

Dravokivich

drunkmonkey wrote: »

It's about the punishment being life changing for someone outside Dublin, Shane Ross could lose his licence in the morning and life wouldn't change for him, he's got the most comprehensive public transport system in the country outside his door.
He's like a little gourier throwing stones and running off knowing none will ever hit him.

Then people should respect their privilege to drive.

Victor

Graduated fines mean that rich people are punished as opposed to seeing fines as occasional fees they need to do something.

drunkmonkey wrote: »

It's about the punishment being life changing for someone outside Dublin

Collisions can be life changing for several people at the same time.

AndrewJRenko

whomitconcerns wrote: »

It's up to a week here in London.. If your on the motorway you can really get hammered!

No drink driving penalties over there?

drunkmonkey

Dravokivich wrote: »

Then people should respect their privilege to drive.

The point is we don't all have the same privilege when caught and lose our licence. His job as minister for transport should be to ensure we all have a functional public transport system that doesn't only work for Dubliners.

I'd think this is a great idea if I had Luas or Dublin bus near me, sure what about losing your licence I can just get the tram to work, might even have a few Dutch gold on the way home.

KERSPLAT!

drunkmonkey wrote: »

The point is we don't all have the same privilege when caught and lose our licence. His job as minister for transport should be to ensure we all have a functional public transport system that doesn't only work for Dubliners.

I'd think this is a great idea if I had Luas or Dublin bus near me, sure what about losing your licence I can just get the tram to work, might even have a few Dutch gold on the way home.

Is not losing your license an option?

I agree regarding public transport but how this can be seen as anything but a good idea is beyond me.

Mr.Crinklewood

drunkmonkey wrote: »

It's about the punishment being life changing for someone outside Dublin, Shane Ross could lose his licence in the morning and life wouldn't change for him, he's got the most comprehensive public transport system in the country outside his door.
He's like a little gourier throwing stones and running off knowing none will ever hit him.

In your opinion who would have the biggest life changing consequences of speeding?

- The victim?

- The driver?

- The victims family?

-:The drivers family,


If this law reduces speeding then it will be an effective law .

Turnipman

Hitman3000 wrote: »

I live outside Dublin ,10 miles from the nearest town. Driving for over 20 years. Got caught speeding 18 years ago. Never happened again. Not really hard to obey the law. Makes the road safer for everyone.

Similar to my experience.

Although I still resent the fine that I got for going down the Finglas Bypass at 55 kph at 07.00 on a bright Sunday morning without another car or pedestrian in sight. I blame the Garda Commissioner for not cancelling my speeding fine! There's not much point in being the boss of a corrupt police force, if it's not equally corrupt for every citizen!

Hitman3000

Turnipman wrote:

Similar to my experience.

20 quid fine. No points at the time.

Turnipman

Mr.Crinklewood wrote: »

In your opinion who would have the biggest life changing consequences of speeding?

- The victim?

- The driver?

- The victims family?

-The drivers family,

If this law reduces speeding then it will be an effective law .

That's an enormous logical jump in the discussion whereby you are now positing that every incidence of speeding will leads to a victim.

Hurrache

drunkmonkey wrote: »

So 1 offence and you could be off the road, again a disproportionate attack on people not served by the Luas or Dublin bus.

So many things wrong with that one sentence.

Firstly, it's aiming to be proportionate, that's the point.

Secondly, people served by the Luas and bus have been known to break speed limits too and will also fall under the same proposed laws. I bet that blows your mind.

AndrewJRenko

drunkmonkey wrote: »

The point is we don't all have the same privilege when caught and lose our licence. His job as minister for transport should be to ensure we all have a functional public transport system that doesn't only work for Dubliners.

I'd think this is a great idea if I had Luas or Dublin bus near me, sure what about losing your licence I can just get the tram to work, might even have a few Dutch gold on the way home.

It is just slightly unreasonable to suggest that there is ever going to be equivalent access to public transport in urban and rural areas. With limited funds available for investment, it is not unreasonable to maximise returns/benefits in high population areas.


It is more than slightly unreasonable to hold this up as a reason for not progressing with anti drink driving legislation.

Damien360

This makes common sense.

I would like to see :

Bigger fine for more speed with reference to zone. So 130 in a 50 is a huge fine and 130 in a 120 zone is normal fine. This is what is being discussed.

But, as usual, the only people that will pay are those employed. I can't see OAP's and those on social welfare paying the bigger fines. The government will fear the grey vote and there will be get out clauses in this and the whole thing will fall apart.

mickdw

I wouldn't be in favour of something that allows instant loss of licence if X over the limit. I have no points currently however I will admit given an empty, dry motorway, I will likely be over the speed limit. To bring in legislation to take away your licence in one go would certainly change driving habits of many but I wouldn't be in favour.
If one is deemed to be law abiding doing 120 on a wet crowded motorway driving a 20 year old micra that is running out of nct, I believe there is room for some tolerance re speed in good conditions without it automatically being claimed to be dangerous so while graduated Penalty is a reasonable idea, I certainly like to see a requirement for court appearance before licence could be lost so that circumstances could be argued.
In addition, if graduated penalty is introduced, surely minor offences will be treated as such and given only a small cash fine.

drunkmonkey

Hurrache wrote: »

So many things wrong with that one sentence.

Firstly, it's aiming to be proportionate, that's the point.

Secondly, people served by the Luas and bus have been known to break speed limits too and will also fall under the same proposed laws. I bet that blows your mind.

Your missing it, the punishment isn't proportional. Yes they both lose their licence but the after effects are completely different depending on your location.
So it's not fair to say they face the same punishment if convicted.

drunkmonkey

Turnipman wrote: »

That's an enormous logical jump in the discussion whereby you are now positing that every incidence of speeding will leads to a victim.

And to add that richer drivers cause more victims by some of the logic here.

Hurrache

So you want something built into the law that if you live beside a busstop the law doesn't apply to you the same way to those on a route?

Ridiculous. But the Healy-Raes will be in touch soon looking for your vote.

If you get banned and can't use public transport, you've only yourself to blame.

RacoonQueen

I love the way OP thinks that public transport in Dublin is actually any good.

Hurrache

RacoonQueen wrote: »

I love the way OP thinks that public transport in Dublin is actually any good.

Doesn't seem to realise there's still parts of Dublin served neither by Dublin Bus, Irish Rail or the Luas.

biko

drunkmonkey wrote: »

So 1 offence and you could be off the road, again a disproportionate attack on people not served by the Luas or Dublin bus.

I hope one day people will realise this island is more than just one city :rolleyes:

On topic, don't speed.
They are not doing this to piss you off, they are doing so you won't kill other people around you.

Hitman3000

RacoonQueen wrote:

I love the way OP thinks that public transport in Dublin is actually any good.

It may not be great, but outside Dublin in the rest of the country it's terrible or non existent.

AndrewJRenko

Hitman3000 wrote: »

It may not be great, but outside Dublin in the rest of the country it's terrible or non existent.

Have you heard about Irish Rail and Bus Eireann?


Have you heard about the Rural Transport schemes?

drunkmonkey

biko wrote: »

They are not doing this to piss you off, they are doing so you won't kill other people around you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1ouqZ9noyQ

Hitman3000

AndrewJRenko wrote:

Have you heard about Irish Rail and Bus Eireann?

Have you heard BE and closing several of its stops between Galway and Dublin?

AndrewJRenko wrote:

Have you heard about the Rural Transport schemes?

None around where I live.

nim1bdeh38l2cw

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Have you heard about Irish Rail and Bus Eireann?


Have you heard about the Rural Transport schemes?

Have you looked at an Irish Rail route map lately?

AndrewJRenko

Hitman3000 wrote: »

Have you heard BE and closing several of its stops between Galway and Dublin?

What were the usage numbers on the closed stops?

Hitman3000 wrote: »

None around where I live.

They are pretty much everywhere: https://locallink.ie/

Mr.Crinklewood

Turnipman wrote: »

That's an enormous logical jump in the discussion whereby you are now positing that every incidence of speeding will leads to a victim.

Where did I say that every incident of speeding leads to a victim?

I deliberately used the word victim to highlight the instances where there is a victim.

I didn't refer to instances where there are no victims. (Although the driver is still wrong in these instances )

I assumed people would get this from my post,however being pedantic I suppose I should change two things :-

- use the word "potential "

-use the word "victims"

- use the word "killed"

- use the word "injured "

Hitman3000

AndrewJRenko wrote:

What were the usage numbers on the closed stops?

Enough that there was a protest of a hundred people on the 6 one news last week

AndrewJRenko wrote:

They are pretty much everywhere:

Maybe they are but again not in the area I live in. Everyone here both young and old are car dependant.

drunkmonkey

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

They are pretty much everywhere: https://locallink.ie/

Did you even look at the route map and time schedule, better still can you even find it?
Explain to me how you get from Clonoulty to work in Roscrea for 9 without a car?
It's 10km shorter distance than Greystones to Swords which you can take the dart to. So the person losing their licence in the public transport area can survive without a car but the rural person will lose their job as they can't get to work. You think that's fair and equal punishment, I certainly don't.
Level the playing field then bring in all the laws you want but don't unfairly punish one guy over the other.

AndrewJRenko

Kenna Mango Windsock wrote: »

Have you looked at an Irish Rail route map lately?

Yeah, I have - have you looked at usage numbers?


https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/railway-line-is-costing-550-per-passenger-to-run-1.2867906

Turnipman

Mr.Crinklewood wrote: »

Where did I say that every incident of speeding leads to a victim?

I deliberately used the word victim to highlight the instances where there is a victim.

I didn't refer to instances where there are no victims. (Although the driver is still wrong in these instances )

I assumed people would get this from my post,however being pedantic I suppose I should change two things :-

- use the word "potential "

-use the word "victims"

- use the word "killed"

- use the word "injured "

Not for a second did I think that you had accidentally used the word "victim" - I merely thought that you had made a post so cringingly stupid that you needed to be pulled up on it.

Have you ever heard the old adage "when you're explaining, you're losing"?

drunkmonkey

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Yeah, I have - have you looked at usage numbers?


https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/railway-line-is-costing-550-per-passenger-to-run-1.2867906

Have you looked at the prices, I paid €65 euro for my last return ticket, for less time on a train than it takes to get from Greystones to Ballybriggin which is €10.90 return.
What's the minister for transport doing about that, feck all that's what he's doing.

KERSPLAT!

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Did you even look at the route map and time schedule, better still can you even find it?
Explain to me how you get from Clonoulty to work in Roscrea for 9 without a car?
It's 10km shorter distance than Greystones to Swords which you can take the dart to. So the person losing their licence in the public transport area can survive without a car but the rural person will lose their job as they can't get to work. You think that's fair and equal punishment, I certainly don't.
Level the playing field then bring in all the laws you want but don't unfairly punish one guy over the other.

The punishment is equal, the fact that you, or someone, lives in an area not better served by public transport is nothing to do with laws regarding speeding and having your license revoked. Again, don't speed, don't lose your license. It's astonishing that you can't grasp this basic concept. If you break the law you better be ready to bear the consequences should you lose your license.