Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2018/2019 [Mod note 31-Aug-18]

TheDoc

Headshot wrote: »

I suspect it was a board signing and Jose doesn't know what the **** to do with him.

Very much Jose's signing.

Castles was only on Second Captains this week where he said as much. Was outlining that while he would be very open to selling him for good money and using it to reinforce better, hes conscious that as his biggest signing ever, there would be blowback for him not working out

bucketybuck

Headshot wrote: »

I suspect it was a board signing and Jose doesn't know what the **** to do with him.

I bet he knows what he wants to do with him...

adox

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Funny how it was the players fault at Chelsea when Jose got sacked.

Then the next season Chelsea won the league with the same players.

Some serious denial going on here.

The same squad that won the league the year before?

Hardly comparable.

beno619

bangkok wrote: »

A great confidence booster to the 2 lads right there

They should probably use it as motivation to go work on penalty kicks.

GSPfan

Pogba can fook off but I’ll tell you now if we persist with Jose it might be 2 or 3 years and about half a billion before we have a team he thinks can win a league.

pjohnson

GSPfan wrote: »

Pogba can fook off but I’ll tell you now if we persist with Jose it might be 2 or 3 years and about half a billion before we have a team he thinks can win a league.

With Jose gone it will be 2-3 years and half a billion before we can challenge for the league.

bucketybuck

GSPfan wrote: »

Pogba can fook off but I’ll tell you now if we persist with Jose it might be 2 or 3 years and about half a billion before we have a team he thinks can win a league.

If we sack him it will be at least 3/4 years and about half a billion before we have a team that can win the league.

nullzero

Zeek12 wrote: »

Couple of potential banana skins ahead in the coming week.

Away to West Ham who are starting to show some form.

Our record not great in this fixture.
2 wins out of last 6 in PL.

And then Valencia in the Champions League....

We could really do without this latest Pogba sideshow

West ****ing ham always treat any game against us like a cup final, shower of cvnts, definitely a defeat there I'd say.

Champions league could be a struggle, the optimistism of last week has vanished all of a sudden.

BoardsMember

When Liverpool fans want Mourinho to stay at United forever it tells it's own story. Mourinho is a busted flush, he won't win anything with United because he can't get the best out of the players he has, nor can he decide what his best team is, or settle on any consistent formation. He's going round and round in circles.

GSPfan

pjohnson wrote: »

With Jose gone it will be 2-3 years and half a billion before we can challenge for the league.

Nope. Chelsea have proven that theory wrong.

GSPfan

bucketybuck wrote: »

If we sack him it will be at least 3/4 years and about half a billion before we have a team that can win the league.

Nope. Chelsea have proven that theory wrong.

How Soon Is Now

Couldn't give a **** what we do at this stage because let's face it Mourinho is done he won't be here next season.

Pogba will be gone next summer at the latest.

We won't win a thing this season if anything at all maybe a late run in the fa cup.

Be doing well to be finishing 5th.

Sir Alex was one only things holding this club together. Look at the ****ing state of things since he left its actually embarrassing stage we have gotten to.

Thats no exaggeration.

pjohnson

GSPfan wrote: »

Nope. Chelsea have proven that theory wrong.

The side that won the league the year before Jose was sacked? When did this lot last win the league? I'll think you'll find its much further than a year ago.

BoardsMember

BoardsMember wrote: »

When Liverpool fans want Mourinho to stay at United forever it tells it's own story. Mourinho is a busted flush, he won't win anything with United because he can't get the best out of the players he has, nor can he decide what his best team is, or settle on any consistent formation. He's going round and round in circles.

Busted flush, I missed you

Rayne Wooney

GSPfan wrote: »

Nope. Chelsea have proven that theory wrong.

Because they already had a team that won the league.

Turtwig

pjohnson wrote: »

The side that won the league the year before Jose was sacked? When did this lot last win the league? I'll think you'll find its much further than a year ago.

I suppose though to be fair if it wasn't for City going bananas on most other seasons your points total would likely have won the league.

Drumpot

nullzero wrote: »

Changing managers in September after losing a league Cup game after the keeper had a brain fart and Derby County had a once in a life time penalty shoot out performance isn't likely. "neutrals" will love it but ultimately the next league game is what matters most. If we're adrift in February or March then he could go, but not now.

Hard to find some sense here at the moment. Very good post.

Nothing changed tonight. Plenty of seasons a stronger united team lost in league cup to a minnow. The league and champions league is all that matters. Even if united won the league cup it wouldn’t make any difference to how this season will be judged.

What exactly will sacking Jose achieve? And why does anybody think Zidane would want to take over this squad? Go for the champions of Europe to the most expensive bunch of under achievers who outlast managers with zero flack on their shoulders.

People might be fed up but sacking Jose doesn’t change the clubs cluster f*ck top 4 is ok Strategy. Do people trust the same gobsh*tes who have presided over 6 painful years to make a better call then Jose and actually support the replacement?

And will people stop saying Jose spent hundreds of millions , he didn’t. He doesn’t give the club a shopping list and get all the players he wants. The club was doing a great job signing useless players long before Jose joined. Big clubs have their own internal criteria for signing players. Woodward even alluded to it on one of his recent chats when he spoke of the clubs mixture of youth that he’s so proud of but people neglect to see that most clubs challanging for top honors have experienced quality , settled Squads and rely little on youth for success.

Look at our defence! Two English defenders who can’t even get into the English team for the World Cup.. Didn’t Jose want one or two experiences centre halves? Matic won the league and Pogba shows up when the stars align. That’s great. Who else has the league winning experience? Oh yeh, perisic, oh no he was too old so we dodged a bullet cause we have martial Or rashford (20 Year old!) or mata to hammer down that spot that the man of the street knows we needed to upgrade.

We have a useless ceo when it comes to the footballing side of the club. We have a complimentary useless transfer strategy that for all we know is more focused on getting players to bump up the commercial aspect of the club with on field importance as a secondary benefit. How do I know this ? Because he said it. He said the commercial side isn’t affected by on field performances. What’s the marketable value of United’s most expensive signing? Now what’s the marketable value of Liverpool or city’s most popular players? Pogba is worth more on marketability alone and it’s no coincidence.

I’m fed up of people thinking sacking Jose equates to better when the signs are quite ominous when we consider what we are left with and who will be deciding on the clubs strategy going forward. I really hope the fans turn on the owners and we will finally see them under pressure.

Man united will be the only club Jose couldn’t win a league or champions league at... I find it funny in a sad way that people are more happy to presume it means he’s the problem..... Once again the owners who still have circa £470
Million of debt straddled around our knecks will get off while fans rejoice in another era where the cycle continues...

Drumpot

GSPfan wrote: »

Nope. Chelsea have proven that theory wrong.

So what’s Woodward’s excuse so? Why does it work at Chelsea and not united? You can’t blame Jose for 6 years of disappointment......

bucketybuck

GSPfan wrote: »

Nope. Chelsea have proven that theory wrong.

GSPfan wrote: »

Nope. Chelsea have proven that theory wrong.

I'd point out the differences between that title winning Chelsea side and the current 4 years of failure United side, but they are so obvious I find I can't be bothered.

LiamoSail

nullzero wrote: »

Changing managers in September after losing a league Cup game after the keeper had a brain fart and Derby County had a once in a life time penalty shoot out performance isn't likely. "neutrals" will love it but ultimately the next league game is what matters most. If we're adrift in February or March then he could go, but not now.

I'd say a change in September is more likely than February or March.

In September a season can still be turned around by another man, it can't in February though.

Given the likelihood of a CL qualification clause, if the decision is made in February to change the manager, they'd likely wait until CL qualification is mathematically impossible before doing anything as it would save a fortune.

bucketybuck

Changing a manager in September doesn't make any sense.

Unless...its obvious that the situation is only going to end with him departing at some point this season. In which case its better for all concerned to just get it done.

I'd rather the club allowed Mourinho carte blanche to actually build his goddamn team the way he wanted, but they didn't allow him that and so they may as well pull the plug sooner rather than later.

DM_7

Drumpot wrote: »

Hard to find some sense here at the moment. Very good post.

Nothing changed tonight. Plenty of seasons a stronger united team lost in league cup to a minnow. The league and champions league is all that matters. Even if united won the league cup it wouldn’t make any difference to how this season will be judged.

What exactly will sacking Jose achieve? And why does anybody think Zidane would want to take over this squad? Go for the champions of Europe to the most expensive bunch of under achievers who outlast managers with zero flack on their shoulders.

People might be fed up but sacking Jose doesn’t change the clubs cluster f*ck top 4 is ok Strategy. Do people trust the same gobsh*tes who have presided over 6 painful years to make a better call then Jose and actually support the replacement?

And will people stop saying Jose spent hundreds of millions , he didn’t. He doesn’t give the club a shopping list and get all the players he wants. The club was doing a great job signing useless players long before Jose joined. Big clubs have their own internal criteria for signing players. Woodward even alluded to it on one of his recent chats when he spoke of the clubs mixture of youth that he’s so proud of but people neglect to see that most clubs challanging for top honors have experienced quality , settled Squads and rely little on youth for success.

Look at our defence! Two English defenders who can’t even get into the English team for the World Cup.. Didn’t Jose want one or two experiences centre halves? Matic won the league and Pogba shows up when the stars align. That’s great. Who else has the league winning experience? Oh yeh, perisic, oh no he was too old so we dodged a bullet cause we have martial Or rashford (20 Year old!) or mata to hammer down that spot that the man of the street knows we needed to upgrade.

We have a useless ceo when it comes to the footballing side of the club. We have a complimentary useless transfer strategy that for all we know is more focused on getting players to bump up the commercial aspect of the club with on field importance as a secondary benefit. How do I know this ? Because he said it. He said the commercial side isn’t affected by on field performances. What’s the marketable value of United’s most expensive signing? Now what’s the marketable value of Liverpool or city’s most popular players? Pogba is worth more on marketability alone and it’s no coincidence.

I’m fed up of people thinking sacking Jose equates to better when the signs are quite ominous when we consider what we are left with and who will be deciding on the clubs strategy going forward. I really hope the fans turn on the owners and we will finally see them under pressure.

Man united will be the only club Jose couldn’t win a league or champions league at... I find it funny in a sad way that people are more happy to presume it means he’s the problem..... Once again the owners who still have circa £470
Million of debt straddled around our knecks will get off while fans rejoice in another era where the cycle continues...

None of that explains why Frank Lampard can get his team passing the ball to each other between and through lines while United can't string 5 passes together with a front 6 costing in the region of 200 millon (Lingard was actually free).

We all know the club structures are not good enough but the debt is not the reason for that. The football side of the club must improve so crazy **** like Di Maria bought and sold in a year or Memphis bought and sold in 18 months does not happen. That is on Woody AND the people there before him, alongside him. There is nothing to suggest more money available to spend on players would actually be spent properly.

Jose does not have the team playing well this season, right now few if any of his signings are showing potential to bring the club forward with him, that is scary. He deserves to be questioned as much as his team or the people overseeing the clubs finances.


On finances:

You keep pointing to the commercial and on field success quote as if it is the club dismissing success as any sort of goal. That was clearly not the intention, it was made within the context of reporting on finances to display strength of same even where on field success does not happen. It is a perfectly reasonable thing to talk about in financial reporting.

Here are some specific quotes about desire to win trophies:


https://twitter.com/sistoney67/status/1044543633947529216?s=19


https://twitter.com/sistoney67/status/1044558100789960704?s=19

GSPfan

Can we still mathematically get top 4? Well then we still have a manager.

The End.

How Soon Is Now

GSPfan wrote: »

Can we still mathematically get top 4? Well then we still have a manager.

The End.

We all know what's ahead of us for rest season think even Jose knows himself.

Couple good results covering over the vast majority of failures that will surround our season.

What's point in even waiting at this stage.

Rossi IRL

I see the media are starting to make something over Pogba leaving his seat before the end.

What they fail to say is that Shaw and Pereira who were sitting with him also left at the same time.

Common sense would say they were just going to make it down to the dressing room for the end of the match.

Drumpot

DM_7 wrote: »

None of that explains why Frank Lampard can get his team passing the ball to each other between and through lines while United can't string 5 passes together with a front 6 costing in the region of 200 millon (Lingard was actually free).

We all know the club structures are not good enough but the debt is not the reason for that. The football side of the club must improve so crazy **** like Di Maria bought and sold in a year or Memphis bought and sold in 18 months does not happen. That is on Woody AND the people there before him, alongside him. There is nothing to suggest more money available to spend on players would actually be spent properly.

Jose does not have the team playing well this season, right now few if any of his signings are showing potential to bring the club forward with him, that is scary. He deserves to be questioned as much as his team or the people overseeing the clubs finances.


On finances:

You keep pointing to the commercial and on field success quote as if it is the club dismissing success as any sort of goal. That was clearly not the intention, it was made within the context of reporting on finances to display strength of same even where on field success does not happen. It is a perfectly reasonable thing to talk about in financial reporting.

Here are some specific quotes about desire to win trophies:


https://twitter.com/sistoney67/status/1044543633947529216?s=19


https://twitter.com/sistoney67/status/1044558100789960704?s=19

I don’t completely disagree with everything you said DM.

But look at the bad signings made before Jose. LVG has publicly stated the club wouldn’t sign the quality players he wanted. I wonder if fellani and mata were priorities of Moyes.. There is a pattern of players being bought not necessarily taking into account what the team needs or a manager wants. Before and most likely during Jose’s tenure this has happened. This summer was the 2nd in a row that Jose didn’t get some or more players he wanted.

How can the club say its matching Jose’s ambitions when they won’t get the players he says he needs? The club is saying they got Jose for success yet didn’t support him after the clubs best league finish in half a decade. They say one thing and do another...

Loafing Oaf

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Never trust a big lump like Jones with a penalty, but I guess were scraping the barrel at the stage...

TheDoc wrote: »

Hahaha “When we get to Jones and Bailey we know we are in trouble” haha that was good tbh.

'Special' minds think alike, clearly.:P Although I'd put even Bailly in before Jones, slightly less lumbering...

Whatsisname

Can’t say my first game was a boring one anyway.

But thought we were incredibly poor for the most part, constantly second to every ball and really struggled against their pressing.

Thought Martial played well, looked our most dangerous player all game. Lukakus form is a worry, he was off the pace all night, his missed chances are costing us big time. I’d gladly keep Dalot in the team for now. An actual attacking threat from the right for a change.

Hopefully we’ll see the back of Phil Jones soon, how he’s still at the club is beyond me, the whole stadium knew he was gonna miss when he walked up.

On a positive, less on the field, note. Fred seems like a genuinely nice dude. I was sat in the front row of the south stand by the tunnel and a guy next to me called him as he was walking in at half time to sign a jersey for his son, he gestured he’d do it coming back out and went straight over to the kid when the teams returned. Nice touch.

emo72

maybe get someone with a great european track record like, say, roy hodgson?

Loafing Oaf

emo72 wrote: »

maybe get someone with a great european track record like, say, roy hodgson?

Or schteve mclaren...

GSPfan

I’d suggest you all take a year out from being a Manchester United customer. This idea that you support the club through thick and thin is a marketing ploy designed to make you feed them with money without them having to deliver anything of worth.
I love Burger King but if they changed the taste of their food to something unrecognisable from what I love, I’d stop eating their food.
I love IPhones but if the product became something I believe was not worth the price tag (which happened a year ago), I would not buy their product.

Liam McPoyle

emo72 wrote: »

maybe get someone with a great european track record like, say, roy hodgson?

He wasn't up to the task with you boys so what makes you think he could handle the step up to a big team?

fergiesfolly

GSPfan wrote: »

I’d suggest you all take a year out from being a Manchester United customer. This idea that you support the club through thick and thin is a marketing ploy designed to make you feed them with money without them having to deliver anything of worth.
I love Burger King but if they changed the taste of their food to something unrecognisable from what I love, I’d stop eating their food.
I love IPhones but if the product became something I believe was not worth the price tag (which happened a year ago), I would not buy their product.

City thread ➡️➡️➡️➡️➡️

Mitch Connor

The problems and worries identified last season, continuing and getting worse this season.

The management of United at every footballing level is a disgrace.

Woodward is failing. Mourinho is failing. The players are failing. And it was all so easily predicted.

Pete Moss

I struggle to think of any other example of a major organisation with such an apparent lack of cohesive strategy. Since SAF left the team has become this Frankenstein made-up of players brought in to back three different managers, who all have a different style to management and tactical approach.

The board have now retained Mourinho longer than Moyes and LvG, so you'd imagine the approach should be to back him completely. Mourinho has always opted for well-established physical players who are rarely found in the bargain basement. In his first two seasons, the board invested and bought into his approach. Woodward seemed to be capable and was willing to back his man. The result was trophies in his first season, a second place finish to a record breaking team and FA Cup Final.

Given that Mourinho was doing what he was brought in to do, make United competitive once again in some way, shape or form, it makes no sense not to invest in him this season. The idea of giving him the boot now is nearly as bad an idea as not backing him financially. United would then be looking at another manager, with another style and tactical approach who requires investment. Fair enough, a new manager might not have to sell off world beaters like Schneiderlin, an aged and ineffective Rooney & Schweinsteiger, etc. But, the squad, as is, would still require rejuvenation and investment. This is something the current flavour of the month, Zidane is not capable of doing. He would not be inheriting peak Ronaldo, Ramos, Modric, Kroos and I don't believe Zidane would offer anymore than, at best, a short-term solution.

Backstreet Moyes

GSPfan wrote: »

I’d suggest you all take a year out from being a Manchester United customer. This idea that you support the club through thick and thin is a marketing ploy designed to make you feed them with money without them having to deliver anything of worth.
I love Burger King but if they changed the taste of their food to something unrecognisable from what I love, I’d stop eating their food.
I love IPhones but if the product became something I believe was not worth the price tag (which happened a year ago), I would not buy their product.

Bycot the club for the year how many games a year do you go to?

Comparing United to food and phones, for me from an early age I grew up watching united and look forward to every game through good and bad.

If you clasify yourself as a customer and they are equavilent of phones and burgers it may be best you go support city.

In the bad times you really see who are true fans and those who are glory hunters.

garra

GSPfan wrote: »

I’d suggest you all take a year out from being a Manchester United customer. This idea that you support the club through thick and thin is a marketing ploy designed to make you feed them with money without them having to deliver anything of worth.
I love Burger King but if they changed the taste of their food to something unrecognisable from what I love, I’d stop eating their food.
I love IPhones but if the product became something I believe was not worth the price tag (which happened a year ago), I would not buy their product.

The corporate machine that is the United hierarchy will only respond tangibly to a fall in sales and not a fall in footballing standards. It will take another few years of poor on pitch performance to feed through to the bottom line but at least you are making a stand sir.

bangkok

What exactly was our game plan last night? Score an early goal and then just sit back and try to hit Derby on the break instead of keep going and get a 2nd, 3rd goal etc

Said it here last year and nothing has changed in a year, lukakus movement when we have the ball is really poor. Not good enough for a club the size of united. Next season we hopefully have a world class striker at the club and lukaku can play a supporting role

Pete Moss

Pete Moss wrote: »

I struggle to think of any other example of a major organisation with such an apparent lack of cohesive strategy. Since SAF left the team has become this Frankenstein made-up of players brought in to back three different managers, who all have a different style to management and tactical approach.

The board have now retained Mourinho longer than Moyes and LvG, so you'd imagine the approach should be to back him completely. Mourinho has always opted for well-established physical players who are rarely found in the bargain basement. In his first two seasons, the board invested and bought into his approach. Woodward seemed to be capable and was willing to back his man. The result was trophies in his first season, a second place finish to a record breaking team and FA Cup Final.

Given that Mourinho was doing what he was brought in to do, make United competitive once again in some way, shape or form, it makes no sense not to invest in him this season. The idea of giving him the boot now is nearly as bad an idea as not backing him financially. United would then be looking at another manager, with another style and tactical approach who requires investment. Fair enough, a new manager might not have to sell off world beaters like Schneiderlin, an aged and ineffective Rooney & Schweinsteiger, etc. But, the squad, as is, would still require rejuvenation and investment. This is something the current flavour of the month, Zidane is not capable of doing. He would not be inheriting peak Ronaldo, Ramos, Modric, Kroos and I don't believe Zidane would offer anymore than, at best, a short-term solution.

Excellent post

DeanAustin

GSPfan wrote: »

I’d suggest you all take a year out from being a Manchester United customer. This idea that you support the club through thick and thin is a marketing ploy designed to make you feed them with money without them having to deliver anything of worth.
I love Burger King but if they changed the taste of their food to something unrecognisable from what I love, I’d stop eating their food.
I love IPhones but if the product became something I believe was not worth the price tag (which happened a year ago), I would not buy their product.

I’m a Spurs fan and I have to say that this post really saddens me. If you’re likening your football club to burgers or iPhones then you don’t get it.

The post stinks of entitlement. Supporting your club through thick and thin was there long before anyone associated marketing with football.

Hococop

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Funny how it was the players fault at Chelsea when Jose got sacked.

Then the next season Chelsea won the league with the same players.

Some serious denial going on here.

Then had another falling out with the manager and didn't get top 4

TitianGerm

DeanAustin wrote: »

I’m a Spurs fan and I have to say that this post really saddens me. If you’re likening your football club to burgers or iPhones then you don’t get it.

The post stinks of entitlement. Supporting your club through thick and thin was there long before anyone associated marketing with football.

I assume he's taking the piss?

pjohnson

TitianGerm wrote: »

I assume he's taking the piss?

Highly unlikely tbh. Fairly sure hes said similar before.

TitianGerm

pjohnson wrote: »

Highly unlikely tbh. Fairly sure hes said similar before.

Really? Jesus Christ

beno619

I'm still of the belief that Mourinho survives an at worst 5/6th place finish.

That obviously assumes he still has the backing of the fans and pressure is directed towards Woodward to back José in doing whatever he wants to the squad in the summer, bar De Gea nobody had performed to a level where you would say they are unsellable.

As another example, does anyone not wonder why the likes of Mata, Smalling (and I have been forgiving of him personally), Herrera, Martial did not get selected or play in the first 11 for their relevant international teams in the world cup gone by?
If Martial is so good why wasn't he part of a World Cup winning side?

These are the types who some are depending on to challenge for the PL title in comparison to the caliber of player City have.
City are the benchmark. They are the champions. That's is what we are up against.

The_Kew_Tour

Great day out yesterday. Meeting few United lads after some are fit enough to do better job then that lot last night. Utter pathetic performance yet again.

Pogba can **** off too. give it to somebody who at least gives a ****. Really wish he never came back and sooner he leaves the better. Don't even care if he goes on a free. A cancer on the club

Backstreet Moyes

Mitch Connor wrote: »

The problems and worries identified last season, continuing and getting worse this season.

The management of United at every footballing level is a disgrace.

Woodward is failing. Mourinho is failing. The players are failing. And it was all so easily predicted.

Woodward is a finance person dealing with football matters

Mourinho is a world class coach who has had success everywhere he goes if backed to build teams to suit his style, no way Pogba was his signing not his type of player

Players have been failing for years and are still starting

The likely scenario is Woodward and the players will be here next year and we will have replaced Mourinho with a less successful manager.

Then next year as we fall further behind we can berate the new mananger for not getting the best out of the players and keep going in circles for years

Iused2likebusts

Nuts102 wrote: »

Woodward is a finance person dealing with football matters

Mourinho is a world class coach who has had success everywhere he goes if backed to build teams to suit his style, no way Pogba was his signing not his type of player

Players have been failing for years and are still starting

The likely scenario is Woodward and the players will be here next year and we will have replaced Mourinho with a less successful manager.

Then next year as we fall further behind we can berate the new mananger for not getting the best out of the players and keep going in circles for years

There is no chance that pogba wasnt a mourinho signing. Not a hope on just taking the job that a mamager that had been as successful as jose would let the board be making decisions that ultimately fall in him if it goes wrong. There are arguments for what happened this summer with the board interfering in transfers. However for the first two years of his reign those signings are all on jose. Unfortunately for him the two cbs he signed, pogba, mkhitaryan and sanchez havent turned out the way he hoped. That is ultimately on him.

beno619

Thought Fellaini was excellent last night as always.

Fellaini ball is a viable tactic when executed properly, getting the ball wide and putting decent balls into the box not centre halfs pumping aimless 60 yards balls up the field.