'Terminator' fans triggered by latest Hollywood SJW effort

B0jangles

RayCun wrote: »

it probably means they've been watching InfoWars and buying the supplements

Which, rather hilariously, contain soy.

super_furry

B0jangles wrote: »

Which, rather hilariously, contain soy.

Oh they explained that one. Basement boy Paul Joseph Watson said that their supplements and so strong and make you so manly and red, that they have to add soy to counter balance it because, as every Infowars fan knows, soy turns the frogs gay.

kunst nugget

kubjones wrote: »

Spot on.

Ellen Ripley was one of the most badass characters there has ever been in a movie, I can't think of a male character in anything I would consider more badass.

None of this "replacing male characters with Female characters" seems like female empowerment, but a middle finger to masculine stereotypes.

Like I said in an earlier post, Ripley's character was originally male. And the film Aliens was a middle finger to masculine stereotypes when a pre-teen girl, Newt's smarts could help her survive against the Aliens when the marines’ brawn and bravado failed them completely.

This was happening in movies thirty years ago and no one give a shyte but when it happens now everyone loses their minds.

kunst nugget

B0jangles wrote: »

Which, rather hilariously, contain soy.

That is fúcking brilliant.

super_furry

kunst nugget wrote: »

This was happening in movies thirty years ago and no one give a shyte but when it happens now everyone loses their minds.

We don't even know if it's happening! All that happened was they put out a teasing poster and the broflakes lost their minds.

nullzero

gmisk wrote: »

How do you know there is no "sincerity" present?


Looks its a hollywood film all they care about is making money, they would stick 3 adorable puppies as the leads if it would make them a bucket of cash.


The first 2 films are excellent in the franchise, since then it has been a disaster, no harm in trying something different.

You questioned my point and then went on to make it for me, cheers.

Lash Into The Pints

super_furry wrote: »

Oh they explained that one. Basement boy Paul Joseph Watson said that their supplements and so strong and make you so manly and red, that they have to add soy to counter balance it because, as every Infowars fan knows, soy turns the frogs gay.

You forgot to call him a 'literal Nazi'.

Keepaneye

super_furry wrote: »

We don't even know if it's happening! All that happened was they put out a teasing poster and the broflakes lost their minds.

And a lot of feminazis can't take obvious criticism. Looks like we're all stereotypically triggered.

The backlash from a single photo is ridiculous.

Wait until you see it ffs. People didn't bat an eyelid for years when the likes of these posters came out

Wibbs

jimgoose wrote: »

Mad Max Fury Road is another example of a sequel that was "modernised" a bit, and I thought it was a fine romp and a worthy successor - especially given the de-mothballing of the magnificent Hugh Keays-Byrne - with a strong female lead, in the person of the superb Charlize Theron as Furiosa, and a not-so-subtle "Silly men killed the World!!" undercurrent. :pac:

Funny, there was a flic that garnered all sorts of praise and I found it pretty shite TBH. It looked fantastic, but was essentially one long show reel of beautifully choreographed stunts with end of days acrobats thrown in. The story was lacklustre and made little sense and had near zero growth. The hubbub about the "feminist" angle on both sides puzzled me TBH. The joke being it's anything but feminist IMHO. Quite the opposite in a few ways. Beyond the "oh look buzzcut equals strong woman"(so long as she's totes gorge and lit beautifully*), a lazy trope for the hard of thinking, it was a tad old style "sexist" in a few ways. The men are bred for fighting, the women are bred as breeding stock and scantily clad catwalk model arm candy, with the fat lasses milked like cows. Old women are "Mother Earth" types. The main role and saviour is Max, not Theron's character. Cliche after cliche flicking switches that make it look like a powerful woman's film, written and directed by an all male lineup, with a man ultimately saving the day. One thing I did find refreshing was her and Max didn't shag. That made a nice change.






*again compare her to Ripley in Aliens. Weaver is not "conventionally pretty", she's tall, lanky and angular and isn't lit with a thousand filters and the only time she flashes the skin is in the sleep pod things and it's hardly done for arousal. The women, at least the pretty ones in Fury Road, are dressed and lit by Vogue with input from various lad's mags, with shots of women washing each other down.

PlaneSpeeking

Wibbs wrote: »

Funny, there was a flic that garnered all sorts of praise and I found it pretty shite TBH. It looked fantastic, but was essentially one long show reel of beautifully choreographed stunts with end of days acrobats thrown in. The story was lacklustre and made little sense and had near zero growth. The hubbub about the "feminist" angle on both sides puzzled me TBH. The joke being it's anything but feminist IMHO. Quite the opposite in a few ways. Beyond the "oh look buzzcut equals strong woman"(so long as she's totes gorge and lit beautifully*), a lazy trope for the hard of thinking, it was a tad old style "sexist" in a few ways. The men are bred for fighting, the women are bred as breeding stock and scantily clad catwalk model arm candy, with the fat lasses milked like cows. Old women are "Mother Earth" types. The main role and saviour is Max, not Theron's character. Cliche after cliche flicking switches that make it look like a powerful woman's film, written and directed by an all male lineup, with a man ultimately saving the day. One thing I did find refreshing was her and Max didn't shag. That made a nice change.






*again compare her to Ripley in Aliens. Weaver is not "conventionally pretty", she's tall, lanky and angular and isn't lit with a thousand filters and the only time she flashes the skin is in the sleep pod things and it's hardly done for arousal. The women, at least the pretty ones in Fury Road, are dressed and lit by Vogue with input from various lad's mags, with shots of women washing each other down.

And her in WonderWoman is gorgeous and built like a model.

Why not hire a female bodybuilder - she has strength ?

All about the looks see!

mcmoustache

Lash Into The Pints wrote: »

You forgot to call him a 'literal Nazi'.

Put down all those red pills, Pepé. You're getting far too based.

kunst nugget

I'm going to have to watch Fury Road again I think because it didn't do much for me when I watched it. It was the post apocalyptic version of going out for pints and realising halfway there that actually the pub you're going to is crap, you've a bag of cans in the fridge, the game you were waiting on has probably finished downloading at this stage and you've probably left on the immersion anyway so you may as well head back even if the other half is going to give shít for walking out the door without telling them.

ollkiller

How anyone could get worked up by a poster with females in it is beyond me.

These are the only things to know about Terminator 6.

1. T3,4 & 5 don't exist as it's a sequel from T2. Excellent.
2. James Cameron has the rights and is a producer. Happy days.
3. Linda Hamilton and Arnie are in it. Oh yeah.

It's going to be awesome.

WoollyRedHat

Deleted User wrote: »

It's such absolute nonsense.

Look at movies like Three Billboards outside Ebbing, Missouri and you'll find an amazing performance and a genuinely strong female lead.. That's an empowering role and relateable to women instead of just ticking some boxes.

This fúckery of replacing men with women is saying "Women are stronger when they act like men." Why not have them just be strong women?

ancapailldorcha

Is anyone else surprised that nobody has posted a Jordan Peterson video yet?

Also, why is soy such a big deal?

gmisk

bluewolf wrote: »

I did hear about a female hulk... If its not based on the comics it would be silly!

You mean She Hulk? sure that character has been around since about 1980 could be a great character on screen she was always a lot more fun than the hulk.

whisky_galore

It's nonsense, and lazy nonsense...we'll just copycat a movie format in a franchise and replace the males with females. Because equality.

Can the Powerpuff Girls not be rebooted as all male now?

Wibbs

kunst nugget wrote: »

Like I said in an earlier post, Ripley's character was originally male.

It was, but in the change they didn't just drop a woman into the role. It was extensively rewritten.

And the film Aliens was a middle finger to masculine stereotypes when a pre-teen girl, Newt's smarts could help her survive against the Aliens when the marine's brawn and bravado failed them completely.

I agree 100% and it's a bloody brilliant flic because of it. But it's a very well crafted one and Ripley is a "normal" woman who becomes a hero through her flaws and brains and bravery. She triumphs not because she's a woman and that's all it takes. Like you note, Newt survives in pretty much the same way.

This was happening in movies thirty years ago and no one give a shyte but when it happens now everyone loses their minds.

Beyond the Yanks on both sides of their ever increasing divided cultural worldview, I would say one of the actual issues is that more and more plot and decent storytelling takes a back seat to hamfisted preaching and spectacle. Hollywood is lacking in a lot of ways currently. The big ticket stuff is franchises and reboots, all flash and bang and cliche. TV is more where it's at if you want more nuanced stuff about people.

Though maybe audience expectations for mainstream cinema have changed and not just in the whole gender identity nonsense? The old style hero's journey seems to be lacking. Instead of heroes and heroines that come to that position through a struggle we get comic book magic superheroes whose only struggle is usually about worrying about how awesome they already are. Again look at Star Wars. Luke Skywalker took three flics screwing up time after time before he became the hero and even then his father ultimately saved him. in the new run his current counterpart Rey is awesome outa the box, needs no training to beat people who've trained for years. She just is(playing the lego movie's "Everything I awesome" song every time she's on screen fits too well). And outside of the Disney Princess that she is*, I strongly suspect that if she had been cast as a he, not much would change on this score. Modern audiences, or at least the writers and directors involved, seem to want instant gratification. Born, not made superheroes.




*I don't see her as a "Mary Sue" which so many seem to. I do see her as an old style Disney Princess. A long standing, even ancient cliche of female characters. The Disney Princess is born awesome, usually hidden in plain sight and her only struggle is for her to see this and the wider world to discover this in due course. QV Cinderella, Rapunzel. Funny enough the actual Disney princesses in Frozen are far more interesting and complex characters(though are still born "awesome").

Mickeroo

Regardless of whether I agreed with it I kind of understand where the whining was coming from with Ghostbusters and to a lesser extent Oceans 8 logically but who's been replaced in this instance exactly?

Here all we've got to go on is a picture that shows one of the main heroes of the only two good films in the entire franchise and two new characters that happen to be played by women? We already know Arnie is coming back and one of the main leads in the film is another bloke. What is the issue here?

Wibbs

PlaneSpeeking wrote: »

And her in WonderWoman is gorgeous and built like a model.

Why not hire a female bodybuilder - she has strength ?

All about the looks see!

TBH with a pure comic book fantasy like Wonderwoman I have zero issue with that. Just like Superman they're going to be depicted as whatever the current culture sees as the beauty ideal. Comic book heroes of this sort are the demigods of our time. A fat bald guy in the super suit or a tubby lass in WonderWoman's getup would be a bit silly.

DickSwiveller Returns

Is there any group in society patronised more than women? It's embarrassing at this stage.

Star Bingo

But didn’t ahnold effectively become a socal justice warrior himself as the franchise developed?

valoren

kunst nugget wrote: »

Like I said in an earlier post, Ripley's character was originally male. And the film Aliens was a middle finger to masculine stereotypes when a pre-teen girl, Newt's smarts could help her survive against the Aliens when the marines’ brawn and bravado failed them completely.

This was happening in movies thirty years ago and no one give a shyte but when it happens now everyone loses their minds.

Hey Vasequez...have you ever been mistake for a man?

No....have you?

:cool:

RayCun

Wibbs wrote: »

Luke Skywalker took three flics screwing up time after time before he became the hero and even then his father ultimately saved him. in the new run his current counterpart Rey is awesome outa the box, needs no training to beat people who've trained for years.

couldn't resist :rolleyes:

in the original trilogy, Luke gets ten minutes training, and is an amazing spaceship pilot who uses the force to blow up a space station
he gets a few days training in the second movie, and starts the third movie as a Jedi

in the new run, Rey is shown to be a good fighter in the early part of the movie, and beats Ren a few minutes after he kills his father and gets shot in the stomach. Maybe he wasn't quite at his best right then?

kunst nugget

Wibbs wrote: »

It was, but in the change they didn't just drop a woman into the role. It was extensively rewritten.

Not according to David Giler, the producer of Alien:

Writing-wise, the transition from male to female lead was not all that difficult for Giler and Hill; in fact, they relegated the task to their typist: “We really just had the secretary change ‘he’ to ‘she,'” admitted Giler.

So any extensive rewrites to the character happened when it was still male.

https://alienseries.wordpress.com/2012/11/28/roby-to-ripley/

take everything

Wibbs wrote: »

It was, but in the change they didn't just drop a woman into the role. It was extensively rewritten. I agree 100% and it's a bloody brilliant flic because of it. But it's a very well crafted one and Ripley is a "normal" woman who becomes a hero through her flaws and brains and bravery. She triumphs not because she's a woman and that's all it takes. Like you note, Newt survives in pretty much the same way.

Beyond the Yanks on both sides of their ever increasing divided cultural worldview, I would say one of the actual issues is that more and more plot and decent storytelling takes a back seat to hamfisted preaching and spectacle. Hollywood is lacking in a lot of ways currently. The big ticket stuff is franchises and reboots, all flash and bang and cliche. TV is more where it's at if you want more nuanced stuff about people.

Though maybe audience expectations for mainstream cinema have changed and not just in the whole gender identity nonsense? The old style hero's journey seems to be lacking. Instead of heroes and heroines that come to that position through a struggle we get comic book magic superheroes whose only struggle is usually about worrying about how awesome they already are. Again look at Star Wars. Luke Skywalker took three flics screwing up time after time before he became the hero and even then his father ultimately saved him. in the new run his current counterpart Rey is awesome outa the box, needs no training to beat people who've trained for years. She just is(playing the lego movie's "Everything I awesome" song every time she's on screen fits too well). And outside of the Disney Princess that she is*, I strongly suspect that if she had been cast as a he, not much would change on this score. Modern audiences, or at least the writers and directors involved, seem to want instant gratification. Born, not made superheroes.




*I don't see her as a "Mary Sue" which so many seem to. I do see her as an old style Disney Princess. A long standing, even ancient cliche of female characters. The Disney Princess is born awesome, usually hidden in plain sight and her only struggle is for her to see this and the wider world to discover this in due course. QV Cinderella, Rapunzel. Funny enough the actual Disney princesses in Frozen are far more interesting and complex characters(though are still born "awesome").

Wow.
(Another) great post, Wibbs.
I've always thought that about the superhero franchises. How do people relate without the hero's journey part. Ironman, Batman and Spiderman are relatable but there's a lot of stuff thats difficult to relate to.

Star Bingo

An Alien revival that’d be good. Rumour has it one is in the works, she’s been spotted buffing up in the gym

Wibbs

RayCun wrote: »

couldn't resist :rolleyes:

in the original trilogy, Luke gets ten minutes training, and is an amazing spaceship pilot who uses the force to blow up a space station
he gets a few days training in the second movie, and starts the third movie as a Jedi

Rolleyes all you like, but nope. In the original trilogy it's established that Luke is already a good pilot, good enough to be accepted by the academy. They even reference this later on when he compares shooting the target on the Death Star to shooting some sort of creature they hunted from the air when they were younger. Secondly he only blows up the space station with outside help from both Han and Chewie who save him at the last minute and his space guru Ben guiding him. He can't save his aunt and uncle, Ben saves him a lot. Han saves him. The princess saves him. The droids save him.

The second flic opens up with him using some force skills with great difficulty. He goes to Yoda(who he doesn't have the sense to recognise at first), gets some basic training, which he largely fails at BTW, then buggers off half cocked against Yoda's wishes. To the degree that Yoda reckons we better go to the backup plan Ted. He faces his da, who promptly fucks him up as would be realistically expected if a newbie no matter how talented faced a trained and experienced fighter. And lops off his hand to make his point. As you do. He falls to his doom, only to be rescued. Again. The guy is a rescue magnet.

By the third he's more confident, but still screws up on the regular where he needs digging out yet again. In the final battle he only gets the upper hand by losing his cool and going "dark side", again a failure. Only coming back from that at the last minute, when he finally says he's a Jedi like his father before him. That's the point where he becomes one. Then the Big Bad steps in and decides to microwave him to death. For the craic like. And he can't fight this. His Da then... *drumroll* ...saves him from that fate.

in the new run, Rey is shown to be a good fighter in the early part of the movie, and beats Ren a few minutes after he kills his father and gets shot in the stomach. Maybe he wasn't quite at his best right then?

In the new run, she's the bestest fighter ever, can fly the Falcon better than Han outa the box on her very first go. Can fix the Falcon better than him too. Oh yes. Uses the oul force like a master without prompting, or any instruction at all. Beats a trained dude with relative ease just cos, then after oul Han bites the bullet(Ford breathing a sigh of relief), Leia goes and comforts her, who she just met, over Chewie or anyone else. Oh and gets handed the captains seat in the Falcon in the end to go and head a search for Luke and all this a matter of days after she shows up. Cos she's awesome. By the second one she's way ahead of Luke after a day or two of training. Yoda, for some reason in constant funny mode, says she already knows more than what's in the the Haynes books of Jedi written over thousands of years. By the end she's literally moving actual mountains, where Luke could barely lift a couple of rocks and failed at getting his ride out of Yoda's swamp.

TL;DR? there is quite simply zero comparison between them.

RayCun

Wibbs wrote: »

The old style hero's journey seems to be lacking.

Rey's Hero's Journey in The Force Awakens

1. Ordinary World
This is where the Hero's exists before his present story begins, oblivious of the adventures to come.

Rey salvaging from crashed ships

2. Call To Adventure
The Hero's adventure begins when he receives a call to action,

Rey finds rolling robot

3. Refusal Of The Call
Although the Hero may be eager to accept the quest, at this stage he will have fears that need overcoming.

"I can't leave the planet"

4. Meeting The Mentor
At this crucial turning point where the Hero desperately needs guidance he meets a mentor figure who gives him something he needs.

Han Solo

5. Crossing The Threshold
The Hero is now ready to act upon his call to adventure and truly begin his quest, whether it be physical, spiritual or emotional.

out into space

6. Tests, Allies, Enemies
Now finally out of his comfort zone the Hero is confronted with an ever more difficult series of challenges that test him in a variety of ways.

Maz's cantina

7. Approach To The Inmost Cave
The inmost cave may represent many things in the Hero's story such as an actual location in which lies a terrible danger or an inner conflict which up until now the Hero has not had to face.

finding the light saber

8. Ordeal
The Supreme Ordeal may be a dangerous physical test or a deep inner crisis that the Hero must face in order to survive

capture and torture

9. Reward (Seizing The Sword)
After defeating the enemy, surviving death and finally overcoming his greatest personal challenge, the Hero is ultimately transformed into a new state, emerging from battle as a stronger person and often with a prize.

realising she can use the force

10. The Road Back
This stage in the Hero's journey represents a reverse echo of the Call to Adventure in which the Hero had to cross the first threshold.

escape and meeting the gang again

11. Resurrection
This is the climax in which the Hero must have his final and most dangerous encounter with death.

fighting Kylo

12. Return With The Elixir
This is the final stage of the Hero's journey in which he returns home to his Ordinary World a changed man.

back to base, with a new quest

Rey has much less narrative focus in TFW than Luke in Star Wars, there are more characters to spend time with, things are compressed. But I was surprised how easy it was to map the movie's plot directly on to the template. (More so than many other movies)

Wibbs

RayCun wrote: »

Rey's Hero's Journey in The Force Awakens...
... But I was surprised how easy it was to map the movie's plot directly on to the template. (More so than many other movies)

Taytoland

SJW mentality ruined and I do mean utterly annihilated the last Star Wars movie the Last Jedi. A movie which is practically blasphemy and unforgivable. Why they keep making Terminator movies is beyond me. Judgement day is the only great movie in the franchise. 

So this is not surprising. It's ruining movies now. People being cast into movies simply to fill a quota and it's not how movies should be made.

super_furry

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Is anyone else surprised that nobody has posted a Jordan Peterson video yet?

Also, why is soy such a big deal?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8dfiDeJeDU

Huexotzingo

How many more Terminator adaptions/sequels/prequels do we need :rolleyes:

Howard the Duck

Ghostbusters got unfair criticism but it was a bad movie which is way it didn't do well. All the characters were very similar and the jokes were poor.

I'm a big Terminator fan so I'll give this a chance, I don't care if most of the cast are females , Sarah Connor was the best character in T2.
But I don't have high hopes ,most of the stuff after T2 has been average. The biggest mistake they could make with this is to not make it a chase movie which is what all Terminator movies should be.
Fingers crossed it'll be a good movie and if it is it will do well no matter what some idiots on the internet think.

pickarooney

bluewolf wrote: »

It's funny that a poster of 3 members of one half of the population is normal, but a poster of a different 3 members is sjw or pandering and literally the worst thing ever

I raise you Thelma and Louise with Edward Norton and Ryan Philippe.

RayCun

Wibbs wrote: »

Rolleyes all you like, but nope. In the original trilogy it's established that Luke is already a good pilot, good enough to be accepted by the academy.

he passed a piloting test, did he?
Got a reference for that?

Wibbs wrote: »

They even reference this later on when he compares shooting the target on the Death Star to shooting some sort of creature they hunted from the air when they were younger.

Womp rats. Nothing about shooting them from the air, just that he used to shoot them.

Wibbs wrote: »

Secondly he only blows up the space station with outside help from both Han and Chewie who save him at the last minute and his space guru Ben guiding him.

and the fact that with a couple of hours training (which he shows no aptitude for) he can guide missiles better than the targetting computer with his amazing force powers

Wibbs wrote: »

The second flic opens up with him using some force skills with great difficulty.

and completely untrained

Wibbs wrote: »

By the third he's more confident,

and is using mind control powers, telekinesis, etc, etc, despite having hardly been trained

Wibbs wrote: »

In the new run, she's the bestest fighter ever,

Ren is obviously the better fighter in TLJ

Wibbs wrote: »

can fly the Falcon better than Han outa the box on her very first go. Can fix the Falcon better than him too.

amazing that a woman who has spent her whole life salvaging spaceships is shown to have mechanical aptitude

Wibbs wrote: »

Uses the oul force like a master without prompting

realises she has some force capability when someone establishes a force connection straight into her mind

Wibbs wrote: »

Beats a trained dude with relative ease just cos,

just cos the dude has been shot in the stomach :rolleyes:


If it was a guy doing these things there would be no complaints, because fiction is full of farmboys who become heroes overnight

jimgoose

Wibbs wrote: »

Funny, there was a flic that garnered all sorts of praise and I found it pretty shite TBH...

I can't credibly contradict any of that, Wibbles - but I wanted to enjoy it, because as far as this Marine is concerned the original Mad Max is the greatest road flick EVER, and because Hugh Keays-Byrne as Head-Buck-Kid baddie!

jimgoose

pickarooney wrote: »

I raise you Thelma and Louise with Edward Norton and Ryan Philippe.

No no NO!! John Travolta and Samuel L. Motherfuckin' Jedi Jackson in character as Vincent and Jules. :cool:

Infini

Think the problem here is that while there is absolutely no problem with female leads expecially good ones, the sheer obviousness of having a pure female cast reeks of having them just for the sake of being female and the scrips for all of these are terrible.

Ripley from Aliens is the best example of a female lead off the top of my head because she's ends up leading not leading because she's female but because she's been through ****, is sick of the bull**** and able to take control of the situation quickly through ability.

Taytoland

fxotoole wrote: »

somefeen wrote: »

Nothing wrong with decent and strong female leads but if they don't concentrate  on making good and interesting characters and stories first it just ends up being a crap film.

You could easily say the same about **** movies with weak male characters. It goes both ways. The problem isn’t Hollywood trying to push an SJW agenda or being pro-feminist. The problem is ****ty writers not being able to write interesting characters.

Actually that is exactly what they are doing. They did it with the Ghostbusters reboot, ruined it, did it with the Last Jedi, destroyed it. They are consistently doing it, going with ideology over great storytelling.

super_furry

jimgoose wrote: »

I can't credibly contradict any of that, Wibbles - but I wanted to enjoy it, because as far as this Marine is concerned the original Mad Max is the greatest road flick EVER, and because Hugh Keays-Byrne as Head-Buck-Kid baddie!

Vanishing Point says hello.

I'll give it a go purely because Hamilton is back. T1 and T2 and hands down the best. The sequels that followed T2 are muck!

kunst nugget

super_furry wrote: »

Vanishing Point says hello.

Alvin Straight ain't got time to watch your Vanishing Point, he's got to get to his brother… in only the best road movie eval!!!

jimgoose

super_furry wrote: »

Vanishing Point says hello.

Three words: Jim Goose Kwaka.

ionapaul

Does anyone have any details of this gender or diversity quota that the studios are being forced to meet in their new movies? Just curious as I've seen it mentioned a few times; if having to meet the new requirements is costing them lots of cash due to narrowing their potential customer base and therefore shrinking their profits, they must be bulling about it being imposed on them! I'm guessing it's something forced on them by the US Government or the corporations that own the studios?

jimgoose

ionapaul wrote: »

Does anyone have any details of this gender or diversity quota that the studios are being forced to meet in their new movies?...

30% gammon, 30% soy, 35% Dat Sweet Lil' Hoochie and the rest mostly dark matter with just a twist of lemming.

Wibbs

RayCun wrote: »

he passed a piloting test, did he?
Got a reference for that?

It clearly states he was accepted into the academy. He whinges that he can't leave because he's needed for one more season. One presumes this required a test. He seems to reckon himself he's a good pilot, but when he mentions this to Han and the hairy fella and Ben, they smirk and ignore him. They certainly didn't go OK and hand over the keys like they did with yer wan.

and the fact that with a couple of hours training (which he shows no aptitude for) he can guide missiles better than the targetting computer with his amazing force powers

That's the single only thing he does right. The only one. With help.

and completely untrained

and unlike Princess Rey he's crap, because yep he's untrained. Big shock.

and is using mind control powers, telekinesis, etc, etc, despite having hardly been trained

Not well. His mind control has its limits, he doesn't even spot the dirty great trapdoor which comes standard with every evil dude's lair. He's concentrating like a bugger to lift anything and he got some training in that. The biggest thing he lifts is the C3PO lad. He's certainly not changing the maps by terraforming.

amazing that a woman who has spent her whole life salvaging spaceships is shown to have mechanical aptitude

you forgot the bestest pilot ever. With no reason at all given.

If it was a guy doing these things there would be no complaints

I'd certainly complain about it. And certainly if they had gone with a bloke in the new Star Wars. For exactly the same reasons. Indeed I suspect more would have complained among the mainstream critics if it had been a bloke, because the Luke comparisons would be even more stark. And as I said I strongly suspect if she had been a he not much would have been changed as audiences and writers seem to prefer instant superheroes rather than a slow burn into hero. Even regardless of her the Force Awakens was a horribly obvious and marketing cynical paint by numbers of the original Star Wars. It really showed the original for all its faults as the far superior storytelling exercise. Then again; JJ Abrams. The (very) poor man's Spielberg, with none of the heart or vision, the remake king. The Last Jedi was beyond risible, on damned near every level, only saved by very nice production values. And little enough to do with Princess Rey or Hermit Luke necking tit milk from funny looking seals. The pacing was all over the place and there were so many plot holes in the script it would have passed decent muster as a teabag.

super_furry

Ah lads, are we really arguing about the comparative powers of space wizards and space witches now?

kunst nugget

super_furry wrote: »

Ah lads, are we really arguing about the comparative powers of space wizards and space witches now?