All Ireland football final 2nd September 2018 - MOD NOTE POST #1 #1187 UPDATED

OldMrBrennan83

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I think that is wrong to be honest. The luck went against them on a few kickouts.

Other aspects of the game were brilliantly executed. A whole raft of things that allowed Tyrone back to within 4 points were not.
Such is a game, ebb and flow. It flowed enough for Dublin to win it.

Not so in a boys own world of world dominating brilliance it seems. :rolleyes:

Have to agree with that definitely. They lost the head in a good few situations in the last quarter, which I hadn't expected at all from them. Running into tackles and shooting from positions they never would have in the earlier part.

elefant

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I think that is wrong to be honest. The luck went against them on a few kickouts.

Other aspects of the game were brilliantly executed. A whole raft of things that allowed Tyrone back to within 4 points were not.
Such is a game, ebb and flow. It flowed enough for Dublin to win it.

Not so in a boys own world of world dominating brilliance it seems. :rolleyes:

What's this boys own world thing about? I've never heard that phrase before.

ProudDUB

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Yeah even on the Radio on Sunday they were coming out with some guff pre-match.
Very hard to beat the same team three times in the one season.

Some arguments I heard were - "The Tyrone documentary might play a part in lifting the Tyrone players.... it could be worth three to four points" someone said

The funniest one was "Oh look the Tyrone players are linking arms during the anthem - that is different, that COULD play a part in the result"

Sorry lads. I gots the winner right here.

On Off The Ball, they said the crowd barriers were up at Gaffneys in Fairview as early as one o'clock on Sunday. The ones they put up when they expect large crowds for games, to stop the punters spilling out onto the road and getting run over by the 31A. This (according to one of the genius talking heads) was complacency that they were expecting a large crowd of post match celebratory drinkers and this complacency was sure to have an effect on the Dublin players and the game. I $hit you not !

So to the Vitners Association of Ireland, Gaffneys bar manager and the little man with the moustache, in the high viz vest, who did Gaff's Health and Safety inspection in 2014, I salute you Sirs. We owe the 4 in a row all to you.

FrancieBrady

elefant wrote: »

What's this boys own world thing about? I've never heard that phrase before.

Boys Own was a magazine that consisted largely of boyish and manly fiction and adventure tales. With very clearly defined heroes and villains.

castletownman

I think the aforementioned Cluxton kick-out is being over-exaggerated a bit. Yes it was well-executed at a time when he was off-cue from two before it, but it wasn't even the most pivotal KO of the game itself.

What is lost in the argument is that Morgan actually kicked the ground before the ball in the lead-up to O'Callaghan's turnover and subsequently Mannion's penalty. I was sitting directly in line with him and you could see dust rise from the ground before he connected with the ball. If anything it shows that luck plays a HUGE part in a kick-out being successful- had he found its intended target, it may have taken Dublin longer to find their momentum.

Just like Durcan in the 2014 decider, sometimes a mistake can have a bigger impact on proceedings than any number of premeditated kick-out routines.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I think that is wrong to be honest. The luck went against them on a few kickouts.

Other aspects of the game were brilliantly executed. A whole raft of things that allowed Tyrone back to within 4 points were not.
Such is a game, ebb and flow. It flowed enough for Dublin to win it.

Not so in a boys own world of world dominating brilliance it seems. :rolleyes:

What another load of bitter lemony rubbish. "The luck went against them on a few kickouts" - if you think Dublin's kickouts are based on luck, you understand GAA less than my 3-year old nephew.

Cluxton hit 29 out of 31 kickouts, something no other keeper can do in a major game. There was no luck in that. They are planned, drilled and executed to perfection.

mattser

elefant wrote: »

What's this boys own world thing about? I've never heard that phrase before.

It happens when you've gone from being on the ropes in a debate, to out cold on the canvas. Or when your luck runs out.

blanch152

castletownman wrote: »

I think the aforementioned Cluxton kick-out is being over-exaggerated a bit. Yes it was well-executed at a time when he was off-cue from two before it, but it wasn't even the most pivotal KO of the game itself.

What is lost in the argument is that Morgan actually kicked the ground before the ball in the lead-up to O'Callaghan's turnover and subsequently Mannion's penalty. I was sitting directly in line with him and you could see dust rise from the ground before he connected with the ball. If anything it shows that luck plays a HUGE part in a kick-out being successful- had he found its intended target, it may have taken Dublin longer to find their momentum.

Just like Durcan in the 2014 decider, sometimes a mistake can have a bigger impact on proceedings than any number of premeditated kick-out routines.

It is not luck to kick the ground before the ball - it is poor execution of a skill. It is not luck when you cave under the pressure being put on by the Dublin forwards and miscue a kick-out, it is poor mental preparation.

Cluxton must be the luckiest person in Ireland according to you guys.

bruschi

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I think that is wrong to be honest. The luck went against them on a few kickouts.

Other aspects of the game were brilliantly executed. A whole raft of things that allowed Tyrone back to within 4 points were not.
Such is a game, ebb and flow. It flowed enough for Dublin to win it.

Not so in a boys own world of world dominating brilliance it seems. :rolleyes:

I completely get where you are coming from, but you wont get any change out of supporters of a team who just won 4 in a row. Leave them be.

In analysis of your point though, I think luck is the wrong word to be used. It implies a fluke or accidental type result from a scenario. Cluxton intended to hit the ball where he did and it reached the desired target. That is not luck in my view. It was a perfect execution of a kick that he does and practices often. He failed in a similar attempt earlier. Again, I wouldnt call them unlucky/lucky, moreso that it was good play/bad play.

I get your point however, if Tyrone had to have been one foot closer to the tackle, if McCaffrey had to have been one foot off the pace, a different outcome would arise. It's probably semantics over the definition of a word, I understand your meaning of the play, but would say luck, in its true form, had little to do with it.

Aside from this kick, and something spoken about previously, but Cluxton gets all the credit on kick outs when in my opinion a vast majority of the credit should go to the tactics and positional play of the players. They create the separation and space for cluxton to hit into. For the majority of his kicks, he has a huge window of space to land the ball into. ON other occasions, he doesnt as in the McCaffrey one, and executes them perfectly. But again, it was the run of McCaffrey that made that moreso than anything.

elefant

bruschi wrote: »

I completely get where you are coming from, but you wont get any change out of supporters of a team who just won 4 in a row. Leave them be.
.

I'm neither from Dublin, nor a Dublin supporter. I think they're a brilliant team, and hope some other team can beat them soon!

I just think it's ridiculous to suggest that Dublin hit 29/31 kick-outs in an All-Ireland final, and one that's executed perfectly can be reduced to 'lucky'. The 'few' (read: two) that went against them were also because of luck.

castletownman

blanch152 wrote: »

It is not luck to kick the ground before the ball - it is poor execution of a skill. It is not luck when you cave under the pressure being put on by the Dublin forwards and miscue a kick-out, it is poor mental preparation.

Cluxton must be the luckiest person in Ireland according to you guys.

I didn't directly attribute luck with Cluxton's kickout. Other posters mentioned how close the Tyrone marker was to nabbing the ball, and brought other variables like if Jack was a fraction slower off the mark, into play.

If anything, I was saying that luck was against Morgan in that moment. You can't legislate kicking the sod before connecting with the ball now can you? It may be poor execution of a skill in your opinion, but it's rare occurrence, particularly at that level, that had a huge a bearing on the result.

I'll put it to you this way. Say if Rock (or any other Dublin player) had an injury-time free that he needed to score to win the game, and slipped on the wet turf just as he was going to connect to it (ALA John Terry in the 08 CL final), and the ball veered wide as a result, would you be cursing the player for his failure to execute a skill, or maybe bemoan lady luck for contriving to conjure up a freak series of events?

You'd probably still praise Cluxton's kickout percentages actually

elefant

castletownman wrote: »

I didn't directly attribute luck with Cluxton's kickout. Other posters mentioned how close the Tyrone marker was to nabbing the ball, and brought other variables like if Jack was a fraction slower off the mark, into play.

If anything, I was saying that luck was against Morgan in that moment. You can't legislate kicking the sod before connecting with the ball now can you? It may be poor execution of a skill in your opinion, but it's rare occurrence, particularly at that level, that had a huge a bearing on the result.

I'll put it to you this way. Say if Rock (or any other Dublin player) had an injury-time free that he needed to score to win the game, and slipped on the wet turf just as he was going to connect to it (ALA John Terry in the 08 CL final), and the ball veered wide as a result, would you be cursing the player for his failure to execute a skill, or maybe bemoan lady luck for contriving to conjure up a freak series of events?

You'd probably still praise Cluxton's kickout percentages actually

Slipping on wet grass is almost certainly unfortunate, not bad execution.
Kicking the ground is the exact opposite.

Unless there was a stray molehill that popped up in front of the O'Neills after Morgan placed it it was entirely his own fault.

jmayo

eagle eye wrote: »

Reason I quote you is the word skill.

There is very little skill in that Dublin football team. It's just being bigger, fitter and stronger than the rest.
The game has changed, it's about who has the best athletes these days.

I'm from Dublin and I've no love for this team.

I think anybody with a clear mind knew in September 2017 that Dublin were going to win this All-Ireland just as it's clear right now that they'll win it again next September. The reason it's so clear is that nobody is close to the level of strength and conditioning that this Dublin team possesses.

Ah jaysus.
I have to admit they have some very skillful players.

Yes they are very fit and well well conditioned, that's where the huge backroom team and finance comes in.

But you can't turn a pigs ear into a silk purse.
Kilkenny, Connolly, Brogan, Mannion, Flynn, O’Callaghan, Rock, Fenton, Cluxton, McCaffrey all have skill in abundance.
And there are more.
They don't carry passengers.

ProudDUB wrote: »

Ok. We get it. Kerry are the greatest team of all time. In this sports and in all other sport. Including tiddleywinks, tae kwon do & tap dancing. Pat Spillane had the greatest farmers tan of all time. Michael Fassbender is the best actor of all time. Fungi is the handsomest dolphin of all time. Peig is the greatest work of literature of all time...oh and both Poles should be named after Tom Crean.

There.

Happy now?

Jesus !

I don't care if I am banned or not, but would ever you feck off ya boll***s. :P

After 30 odd years I have tried my best to forget about that horror of a book that generations of Irish students were forced to study and fecking learn.
And then you drag it up.
:mad::mad::mad:

And students today should be forced to study it like we were. :mad:

Oh and never take the name of Tom Crean in vain.

The rest I couldn't give shyte about,

As for the rolling debate about Dublin being lucky yesterday?
I don't think anyone said it directly bar the claim about kickout.

The only thing lucky about them was they didn't fall asleep.
They had the game in the bag after 20 minutes.

And Cluxton's kickouts aren't "lucky".

You always find the most skillful and practiced are always the "luckiest".

Now if you do want to talk about Dublin and luck in finals then we'll discuss the drawn final in 2016. :mad:

Bonniedog

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I just hope Jim Gavin waits seven years and does not go for the Uachtarán na hÉireann job.... yet.

At least he has achieved something!

List of possible candidates announced so far sounds like they are all running for an Institute of Technology officer board position!

I am trying to persuade our local ice cream man to throw his hat in the ring alongside all the other "entrepreneurs."

ArielAtom

castletownman wrote: »

I didn't directly attribute luck with Cluxton's kickout. Other posters mentioned how close the Tyrone marker was to nabbing the ball, and brought other variables like if Jack was a fraction slower off the mark, into play.

If anything, I was saying that luck was against Morgan in that moment. You can't legislate kicking the sod before connecting with the ball now can you? It may be poor execution of a skill in your opinion, but it's rare occurrence, particularly at that level, that had a huge a bearing on the result.

I'll put it to you this way. Say if Rock (or any other Dublin player) had an injury-time free that he needed to score to win the game, and slipped on the wet turf just as he was going to connect to it (ALA John Terry in the 08 CL final), and the ball veered wide as a result, would you be cursing the player for his failure to execute a skill, or maybe bemoan lady luck for contriving to conjure up a freak series of events?

You'd probably still praise Cluxton's kickout percentages actually

It was simply poor execution, he was using a tee FFS. If you cant kick a ball off a tee at this level, forget about luck, because being lucky is all about practice.

blanch152

ArielAtom wrote: »

It was simply poor execution, he was using a tee FFS. If you cant kick a ball off a tee at this level, forget about luck, because being lucky is all about practice.

If you are under pressure, not sure where to kick it, with the Dublin press, a mistake like kicking the ground is much more likely, nothing to do with luck.

Loafing Oaf

blanch152 wrote: »

If you are under pressure, not sure where to kick it, with the Dublin press, a mistake like kicking the ground is much more likely, nothing to do with luck.

The pressure on the goalie in those situations must be unbelievable. You can see how the Kerry keeper ended up kicking over his endline last year...

rm75

elefant wrote: »

I thought that point absolutely encapsulated this Dublin team. No luck about it. Great skill, speed and tactical awareness, and making it all seem so easy.

- Pinpoint kick out.
- Jack McCaffrey covering huge amounts of ground and completely burning his marker off.
- Then the lay it off, followed by running straight into a defender under the pretence of looking for the return, and making the space for KK to kick a great point.

And all that when struggling for their first score of the game up to that stage. Pure class and efficiency.

Absolutely, astonishing that with all their success they are still able to keep going. Cluxton is an astonishing player made even better by his unwillingness to play the media game. We could do with more "celebrities" like him. The man exudes class.

castletownman

ArielAtom wrote: »

It was simply poor execution, he was using a tee FFS. If you cant kick a ball off a tee at this level, forget about luck, because being lucky is all about practice.

He actually wasn't using a kicking tee at all. I don't think he does in general. Something I remarked about to my companion at the match. So maybe the mistake can be explained a way a bit clearer

ArielAtom

castletownman wrote: »

He actually wasn't using a kicking tee at all. I don't think he does in general. Something I remarked about to my companion at the match. So maybe the mistake can be explained a way a bit clearer

OK, its still a mistake for me, nothing to do with luck. Maybe a little more practice might eliminate those costly errors.

Billy86

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Look at how close the Tyrone player got (one more step and he had the ball and the kick would have been the same as the other ones that didn't work -i.e. a bad one) then look at the lay off and Cavanagh's non tackle and the 'accidental' taking out of the advancing Tyrone player by McCaffery.

That's such a nonsensical argument I don't even know where to start. If all Michael Jordan's shots were just a little to the side, he wouldn't have been regarded as half the player he was. If all of Ronaldo or Messi's goals were struck just a little softer for the keeper to save, or a little higher or wider so as to not be on target then neither would they. If Tiger Woods back in the 2000s had been missing shots like Tiger Woods of the 2010s, he would not have been held in such high esteem. If Roger Federer was not intelligent enough to make so many of the shots he has down the years, he would be just another tennis player and not the greatest ever. On and on this can go about literally anybody to play any sport in the history of our entire species.

"You wanted to ball to go somewhere, and you hit it in such a way that it went exactly there as planned. But if it had not gone exactly there it would have been a poor attempt, so I don't really rate it to be honest and think it was lucky because there was no guarantee it was 100% going to come off if you didn't hit it as well as you actually did hit it." - I mean how does that even begin to make sense?

But besides all that painfully obvious fact that being able to make the best out of limited space is what separates many greats from the rest (in soccer and the NFL it often is the defining characteristic), just exactly how big are your steps? :pac:

FrancieBrady

Billy86 wrote: »

That's such a nonsensical argument I don't even know where to start. If all Michael Jordan's shots were just a little to the side, he wouldn't have been regarded as half the player he was. If all of Ronaldo or Messi's goals were struck just a little softer for the keeper to save, or a little higher or wider so as to not be on target then neither would they. If Tiger Woods back in the 2000s had been missing shots like Tiger Woods of the 2010s, he would not have been held in such high esteem. If Roger Federer was not intelligent enough to make so many of the shots he has down the years, he would be just another tennis player and not the greatest ever. On and on this can go about literally anybody to play any sport in the history of our entire species.

"You wanted to ball to go somewhere, and you hit it in such a way that it went exactly there as planned. But if it had not gone exactly there it would have been a poor attempt, so I don't really rate it to be honest and think it was lucky because there was no guarantee it was 100% going to come off if you didn't hit it as well as you actually did hit it." - I mean how does that even begin to make sense?

But besides all that painfully obvious fact that being able to make the best out of limited space is what separates many greats from the rest (in soccer and the NFL it often is the defining characteristic), just exactly how big are your steps? :pac:

It is simpler than you think. Try starting from this point - kicking a ball into a space is not such a tremendous feat. The 'feat' is the coming together of the teamwork.

Cluxton's, Beggan's, Morgan's kicks come together because of the teamwork, dragging men on dummy runs, and a player running into a space in the hope that the ball arrives in that space before an opposing player. There are numerous things, other than the kick that have to go right.

And in the case of that kick, a Tyrone team that was coping well were off the pace for long enough to allow it to work. And Cavanagh unusually failed to make a tackle (it was a pathetic effort if you look at it actually) and an advancing Tyrone player got knocked off his challenge by McCaffery after he off loaded.

It is all there in the clip. A number of lucky elements to an important score which turned out to be a turning point.

Ronaldo, Federer etc all had luck in their careers too. And they would admit it too.

Billy86

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Ronaldo, Federer etc all had luck in their careers too. And they would admit it too.

So are you saying that they're not among the very greatest of all time in their sports, or that this Dublin team is among the very greatest football teams of all time?

At least you seem to have dropped the 'he was only one step away from it' line though.

tritium

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It is simpler than you think. Try starting from this point - kicking a ball into a space is not such a tremendous feat. The 'feat' is the coming together of the teamwork.

Cluxton's, Beggan's, Morgan's kicks come together because of the teamwork, dragging men on dummy runs, and a player running into a space in the hope that the ball arrives in that space before an opposing player. There are numerous things, other than the kick that have to go right.

And in the case of that kick, a Tyrone team that was coping well were off the pace for long enough to allow it to work. And Cavanagh unusually failed to make a tackle (it was a pathetic effort if you look at it actually) and an advancing Tyrone player got knocked off his challenge by McCaffery after he off loaded.

It is all there in the clip. A number of lucky elements to an important score which turned out to be a turning point.

Ronaldo, Federer etc all had luck in their careers too. And they would admit it too.

Who was it that said “the more I practice the luckier I seem to get”....

dog_pig

I can't tell if Francie is being serious or not

blanch152

dog_pig wrote: »

I can't tell if Francie is being serious or not

To be fair, it may be a load of rubbish, but Francie sincerely believes everything that he posts.

Fann Linn

tritium wrote: »

Who was it that said “the more I practice the luckier I seem to get”....

Gary Player.

Stoner

dog_pig wrote:

I can't tell if Francie is being serious or not

He's a well informed poster with a mix of Ulster devilment.

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

To be fair, it may be a load of rubbish, but Francie sincerely believes everything that he posts.

I believe every goalkeeper kicks into a space and his team need to be on the same wavelength as him or he looks very silly, as Cluxton Beggan, Morgan and every single other one looks silly at times.

Your unwillingness to accept your hero is fallible and depends on a bit of luck is as usual a bit cringy and no different to your belief in this team's saintliness.

The attack dogs fairly come out when somebody tries to discuss the game that actually happened.

tayto lover

tritium wrote: »

Who was it that said “the more I practice the luckier I seem to get”....

Gary Player the golfer.

munster87

‘The more funding you get, the luckier you get’ - Ewan Mackenna

Slattsy

Can the 42 people that voted for Tyrone be named and shamed?

Grandeeod

munster87 wrote: »

‘The more funding you get, the luckier you get’ - Ewan Mackenna

Utterly predictable article from him.

shockframe

munster87 wrote: »

‘The more funding you get, the luckier you get’ - Ewan Mackenna

Dublin might have got a bit of financial backing but for it to be such a big deal is ludicrous.

They have spent money but have invested it wisely.

Look at how other counties squandered investment.

KIldare got into difficulty earlier in the decade, Laois had a huge bill for Portlaoise, Waterford spent a fortune for a decade on management. Limerick have a well known backer but spent 30 years stuck in a rut.

Cork have spent upwards of 80 million on a stadium when its county senior teams standing have never stood so low. All the while remaining hostile to anyone who dares question them. Meath have been a shambles this decade. Antrim have been a laughing stock given the size of the county.

Its not just in GAA either. How many soccer clubs overreached themselves. Cork City, Shelbourne, Limerick FC. The FAI has done very little to improve the state of the game in Ireland.

I'm not a Dublin man but you know what they have done things the right way.They have got it spot on with participation levels, coaching, social media, open minded county board officials, always looking or marginal gains, not much debt, people devoted to the good of the county teams.

For anyone to be moaning about money given how badly other counties have been run and even how much money was splashed about needlessly in the celtic tiger era is well wide of the mark.

They approached things in a very calculated way.More power to them. Others could learn from it.

munster87

Grandeeod wrote: »

Utterly predictable article from him.

How does he get paid to regurgitate the same stories all the time

maccored

Slattsy wrote: »

Can the 42 people that voted for Tyrone be named and shamed?

i voted for tyrone - no shame about it

jmayo

shockframe wrote: »

Dublin might have got a bit of financial backing but for it to be such a big deal is ludicrous.

Jaysus understatement much.

The GAA are finally beginning to twig that the development funding is highly skewed in favour of Dublin even when you drag in playing numbers, clubs and population.

shockframe wrote: »

They have spent money but have invested it wisely.

Look at how other counties squandered investment.

Yes that is true, but does that mean that you give them up to ten times more than almost every other county bar one or two outliers.
Look at how Kerry has managed underage development despite fact in 2014/2015 they were getting less than €20 per registered players as opposed to Dublins €240 odd.

How about the idea of funding centrally controlled development in the weaker and reckless counties, based on Dublin model ?

And yes I know the reason this would not pass is counties want to control that themselves, even if they do make a complete fooking hames of it. :mad:

shockframe wrote: »

KIldare got into difficulty earlier in the decade, Laois had a huge bill for Portlaoise, Waterford spent a fortune for a decade on management.
Limerick have a well known backer but spent 30 years stuck in a rut.

Limerick have had success at underage levels, it just never translated to senior.
Laois screwed up with timing as bubble burst AFAIK.
Waterford is not the only county to spend a fortune on management.
That massive Dublin backroom team don't come free you know.

Hell if rumours I hear are half way true some ex Dublin players have made a fortune from even club management.

shockframe wrote: »

Cork have spent upwards of 80 million on a stadium when its county senior teams standing have never stood so low. All the while remaining hostile to anyone who dares question them. Meath have been a shambles this decade. Antrim have been a laughing stock given the size of the county.

Jaysus have you ever been in Antrim?
Antrim is one of the only counties in NI that still has protestant majority with a large chunk of die hard loyalists so good luck finding a GAA club & facilities in Larne or Carrickfergus. :rolleyes:

yobr

munster87 wrote: »

How does he get paid to regurgitate the same stories all the time

The most interesting bit for me is that he lives in Brazil and would never attend a GAA match.

jmayo

yobr wrote: »

The most interesting bit for me is that he lives in Brazil and would never attend a GAA match.

Is he on the run ?

The Talking Bread

jmayo wrote: »

yobr wrote: »

The most interesting bit for me is that he lives in Brazil and would never attend a GAA match.

Is he on the run ?

His wife is Brazilian

legendary.xix

I was impressed by Dublin’s tactical intelligence in the final.

Fann Linn

legendary.xix wrote: »

I was impressed by Dublin’s tactical intelligence in the final.

We paid dearly for the knowledge. But then again, we could afford it.

Bonniedog

jmayo wrote: »

Is he on the run ?

His mother threw him out of the house for accusing her of having stolen her neighbour's bingos cards.

yobr

legendary.xix wrote: »

I was impressed by Dublin’s tactical intelligence in the final.

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/darragh-%C3%B3-s%C3%A9-hats-off-to-dublin-they-re-a-country-mile-better-than-the-rest-1.3618476

So was Daragh O'Se but you wont see his articles quotes as much as the Boy from Brazil.

yobr

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/ciar%C3%A1n-murphy-football-is-in-trouble-just-don-t-blame-the-dubs-1.3619515

Ciarán Murphy: Football is in trouble – just don’t blame the Dubs : Another article from the IT.

FrancieBrady

yobr wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/darragh-%C3%B3-s%C3%A9-hats-off-to-dublin-they-re-a-country-mile-better-than-the-rest-1.3618476

So was Daragh O'Se but you wont see his articles quotes as much as the Boy from Brazil.

yobr wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/ciar%C3%A1n-murphy-football-is-in-trouble-just-don-t-blame-the-dubs-1.3619515

Ciarán Murphy: Football is in trouble – just don’t blame the Dubs : Another article from the IT.

You also don't see legions of salivating fans demeaning them or having a huff/strop for having an opinion either, in fairness.

LoughNeagh2017

Tyrone flags still up in Southderry, they are like the loyalists, keeping their flags up even when celebration is over.

BonnieSituation

LoughNeagh2017 wrote: »

Tyrone flags still up in Southderry, they are like the loyalists, keeping their flags up even when celebration is over.

Loyalists celebrate?

robbiezero

LoughNeagh2017 wrote: »

Tyrone flags still up in Southderry, they are like the loyalists, keeping their flags up even when celebration is over.

Fair play to them. Good to see.

ArielAtom

The Talking Bread wrote: »

His wife is Brazilian

Irish women gave up on him, he had to look further afield😂