Online Purchase OLED

sightband

Hi,

Bought an online purchase from a nationwide supposed reputable dealer for a 55” OLED TV, long story short, collected tv from warehouse and the tv is ex demo store display. It’s not just used, the screen is destroyed, all over. This was never advertised as ex display as I wouldn’t have gone near it. I was sent packing today by the store today saying as it was online bought it is a customer services issue.

Any ideas of where to progress from here?

Thanks.

L1011

Online purchases have an automatic right of return under distance selling regulations.

Tippex

<SNIP> no need to quote full OP

I would imagine online stock is from a different stock than the store you bought it in. So they are likely correct in saying ut is a customer services issue. How did they handle it when you brought it to the store?

sightband

Tippex wrote: »

I would imagine online stock is from a different stock than the store you bought it in. So they are likely correct in saying ut is a customer services issue. How did they handle it when you brought it to the store?

Sent me packing, said it was a customer services issue. Wouldn’t take the unit back. Been on to customer services and requested to send an email. Happy to post the dealer if permitted. also happy to post photos of screen, box etc.

theteal

Was the box new and sealed when you collected it?
Was is discounted much?
How bad is the screen?

Item not as described is a clear contravention of your consumer rights. Have you proof that it’s not as described e.g. screen cap, purchase email?

As previously mentioned, distance selling rules also come into play.

sightband

theteal wrote: »

Was the box new and sealed when you collected it?
Was is discounted much?
How bad is the screen?

Item not as described is a clear contravention of your consumer rights. Have you proof that it’s not as described e.g. screen cap, purchase email?

As previously mentioned, distance selling rules also come into play.

Box appeared to be new but instead of having those strong plastic cable wrapping to secure it, it was crudely wrapped with sellotape.

Was discounted from €2199 to €1699...so quite a bit

The screen is absolutely destroyed, top to bottom left to right, I can’t even see how they could use it for store display.

I have an invoice, email and my online account with the dealer shows the order. No screen grab and the offer is gone now.

davo10

sightband wrote: »

Box appeared to be new but instead of having those strong plastic cable wrapping to secure it, it was crudely wrapped with sellotape.

Was discounted from €2199 to €1699...so quite a bit

The screen is absolutely destroyed, top to bottom left to right, I can’t even see how they could use it for store display.

I have an invoice, email and my online account with the dealer shows the order. No screen grab and the offer is gone now.

Distance selling laws allow you to return it within the timeframe, look on their site for instructions for online returns. Bricks and mortar shops often won't accept online purchase returns, you have to go through website and arrange for collection.

Del2005

davo10 wrote: »

Distance selling laws allow you to return it within the timeframe, look on their site for instructions for online returns. Bricks and mortar shops often won't accept online purchase returns, you have to go through website and arrange for collection.

Would the fact the OP collected the item from the company have an impact on this being a distance sale? Since the point of no quibble returns online is you had no opportunity to inspect the item pre purchase.

sightband

davo10 wrote: »

Distance selling laws allow you to return it within the timeframe, look on their site for instructions for online returns. Bricks and mortar shops often won't accept online purchase returns, you have to go through website and arrange for collection.

Thanks....one of their branches which I was due to collect it from told me as I bought online it could not be returned to them and was a customer services issue. Have to contact them today.

Out of interest, Are they under any obligation to replace the item? As in can you demand a replacement rather than a refund? It’s been a serious amount of hassle to go through just to get money back.

CeilingFly

sightband wrote: »

Sent me packing, said it was a customer services issue. Wouldn’t take the unit back. Been on to customer services and requested to send an email. Happy to post the dealer if permitted. also happy to post photos of screen, box etc.

Its nothing to do with an individual store unless you purchased from the individual store.

You have your online receipt and you'll have ticked a box that you reed the term and conditions of sale and unless those terms and conditions say you can simply walk into one of their stores and demand a replacement, then you do not have that right.

Its as simple as going onto the website, reading the returns procedure and following the returns procedure.

L1011

Under distance selling it's a refund, under normal consumer legislation it's the retailers choice of repair, refund or replacement. Repair isn't going to be a practical option here

CeilingFly

Del2005 wrote: »

Would the fact the OP collected the item from the company have an impact on this being a distance sale? Since the point of no quibble returns online is you had no opportunity to inspect the item pre purchase.

No, The transaction was online, doesn't matter whether it was delivered or collected, but the returns / fault process must follow the online procedure which is usually quite simple.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Online sale. Follow the online returns procedure and get a refund. Don't delay, to ensure you're within the cooling off period. It's simple enough.

theteal

Yeah I did ponder if collecting it negates distance selling but then I concluded that loads of places do click and collect. Distance selling still applies with these. It’s still a distance purchase and the consumer doesn’t really have a chance to see it in the flesh - its not reasonable to remove packaging and unbox in the middle of a shop.

sightband

Has the store/dealer not breached any laws, rules or regulations by selling me a used product that was not advertised as such?

I’ve no issue with returning a product that was faulty, it happens, that’s life but I spent a lot of money on a heap of broken used junk that was supposedly new.

theteal

sightband wrote: »

Has the store/dealer not breached any laws, rules or regulations by selling me a used product that was not advertised as such?

I’ve no issue with returning a product that was faulty, it happens, that’s life but I spent a lot of money on a heap of broken used junk that was supposedly new.

Yes, the item is not as described, slam dunk contravention to your consumer rights.

Xterminator

Hi Op

you are entitled to one of the 3R's - repair replace refund.

You don't have the right to choose which one, though you don't have to accept their offer either. however a full refund would be a very reasonable offer. i reckon you would like the replacement option, so push for that, but i wouldnt turn down a refund if that was offered.

mdebets

One thing to be careful of if you return it under distance selling rules is that you are responsible for the shipping costs of returning it, so if you can't bring it back in person, it might be better to return it as faulty (It looks like it in your description) as that means the shop has to pay the shipping costs for it.

.......

mdebets wrote: »

One thing to be careful of if you return it under distance selling rules is that you are responsible for the shipping costs of returning it, so if you can't bring it back in person, it might be better to return it as faulty (It looks like it in your description) as that means the shop has to pay the shipping costs for it.

Not if the item is not as described.

CeilingFly

sightband wrote: »

Has the store/dealer not breached any laws, rules or regulations by selling me a used product that was not advertised as such?

I’ve no issue with returning a product that was faulty, it happens, that’s life but I spent a lot of money on a heap of broken used junk that was supposedly new.

It probably just a simple error with incorrect information passed to someone at some stage.

People and companies make errors and in almost all cases its rectified quickly one they know about it.

mdebets

....... wrote: »

Not if the item is not as described.

What I'm saying, only if you invoke your customer rights, rather than return it under distance selling legislation

micks_address

Hi Op - when you say screen is destroyed - what do you mean? Its all cracked? Or there's burn in or something?

.......

mdebets wrote: »

What I'm saying, only if you invoke your customer rights, rather than return it under distance selling legislation

It makes no odds - the OP is not required to pay for the return of the product if its not as described or if its faulty.

The only way the OP would be liable to pay the returns would be a on change of mind - which is not the case here.

Can see why returns postage will apply at all anyway as the OP physically collected the item - it wasnt posted out - so probably not be posted back.

sightband

micks_address wrote: »

Hi Op - when you say screen is destroyed - what do you mean? Its all cracked? Or there's burn in or something?

no cracks, or burn...only way i can describe it is that it looks like paint is running down the screen in about ten or so different areas all over. there is also a series of different sized ovals side by side down the bottom left. have no idea how this type of damage could have taken place, potentially people coming into the store and messing with it. I wouldn't be the fussiest of watchers but its totally unwatchable. even if the shop takes it back, its worthless. you wouldn't give €100 for it.

mdebets

....... wrote: »

It makes no odds - the OP is not required to pay for the return of the product if its not as described or if its faulty.

The only way the OP would be liable to pay the returns would be a on change of mind - which is not the case here.

Can see why returns postage will apply at all anyway as the OP physically collected the item - it wasnt posted out - so probably not be posted back.

True, but the OP has two choices:
give it back as change of mind under distance selling legislation
- quicker repayment of the money, but might have to pay shipping if he can't bring it back himself.
give it back as it being defective
- has not to pay shipping, but he might get messed around in regards of time it takes to check the fault, and potential for a try of repair first, so it might take some time until he get his money back or a replacement TV

micks_address

sightband wrote: »

micks_address wrote: »

Hi Op - when you say screen is destroyed - what do you mean? Its all cracked? Or there's burn in or something?

no cracks, or burn...only way i can describe it is that it looks like paint is running down the screen in about ten or so different areas all over. there is also a series of different sized ovals side by side down the bottom left. have no idea how this type of damage could have taken place, potentially people coming into the store and messing with it. I wouldn't be the fussiest of watchers but its totally unwatchable. even if the shop takes it back, its worthless. you wouldn't give €100 for it.

It's hardly a screen protector over it? Does it look bad when powered off or just when on? What make and model is it? Some have routines which run in standby to clear up and screen image retention etc.. Have LG oled myself

banie01

CeilingFly wrote: »

No, The transaction was online, doesn't matter whether it was delivered or collected, but the returns / fault process must follow the online procedure which is usually quite simple.

The distance selling regs don't apply, the regs are designed to allow a customer a leeway for purchases where there is no right of inspection.
A distance sale entails the entire transaction taking place off premises and the purchase being delivered to them.
It allows the customer to refuse the transaction and to refuse delivery.
In this instance the customer placed the order online, but collected the item and had opportunity to inspect and refuse the item.

Where the order is placed online, but the customer collects in store there is no recourse to distance selling regs.
The item would still need to meet to the requisite standards for SOGA re: merchantable quality and so on, but distance selling doesn't apply in this instance.

Comes up quite often in issues with click and collect sales.
Most companies do just follow distance selling regs, but not obliged to in these instances.

CeilingFly

banie01 wrote: »

The distance selling regs don't apply, the regs are designed to allow a customer a leeway for purchases where there is no right of inspection.
A distance sale entails the entire transaction taking place off premises and the purchase being delivered to them.
It allows the customer to refuse the transaction and to refuse delivery.
In this instance the customer placed the order online, but collected the item and had opportunity to inspect and refuse the item.

Where the order is placed online, but the customer collects in store there is no recourse to distance selling regs.
The item would still need to meet to the requisite standards for SOGA re: merchantable quality and so on, but distance selling doesn't apply in this instance.

Comes up quite often in issues with click and collect sales.
Most companies do just follow distance selling regs, but not obliged to in these instances.

You are mixing up "reserve and collect" - similar to argos reserve and collect. This is simply a promise to hold an item and has no contractual rights to either side.

Distance Selling Regulations do apply to ‘click and collect’ as long as you have agreed a contract at a distance. In other words, if you commit to make a purchase when you confirm your order online, you are covered under the regulations.

I'm selling online for 10 years and member of REI ecommerce forum and this subject comes up regularly and the answer from legal experts is always the same.

banie01

CeilingFly wrote: »

I'm selling online for 10 years and member of REI ecommerce forum and this subject comes up regularly and the answer from legal experts is always the same.

Working for a multinational that offers a click and collect service and each and every time this was queried with our legal and regulatory team the info I gave above was what they reverted with.

That said on a purely cost and experience basis we dealt with issues as per the regs.

CeilingFly

banie01 wrote: »

Working for a multinational that offers a click and collect service and each and every time this was queried with our legal and regulatory team the info I gave above was what they reverted with.

That said on a purely cost and experience basis we dealt with issues as per the regs.

The law applies to when and where the contract was formed. In retail, payment is the point of contract formation.

You also need to tick a box agreeing to terms and conditions of sale and in online sales the distance selling regulations must be part of those terms and conditions.

Also, Retail Excellence Ireland's ecommerce group is part of a pan european ecommerce group and I'll accept their advice which also makes sense when you think of contract law.

.......

banie01 wrote: »

Working for a multinational that offers a click and collect service and each and every time this was queried with our legal and regulatory team the info I gave above was what they reverted with.

That said on a purely cost and experience basis we dealt with issues as per the regs.

With Click and Collect you pay when you go to collect. Not distance selling.

With online sales you pay online when you order - regardless of how you receive them (collect or through the post). Distance selling.