The 2018 Rugby Championship

Dubinusa

After the rwc, I think Cheika will be released. I would think Oz would make a run at Lancaster or Schmidt. Depending on what Schmidt decides on Ireland. Just guessing.

prawnsambo

Mookie Blaylock wrote: »

Not before he pushed and shoved Tui's sister.

Tui has said (according to Cheika) that he will not play for Australia again because of it.

Mookie Blaylock

prawnsambo wrote: »

Tui has said (according to Cheika) that he will not play for Australia again because of it.

I'd say that was all heat of the moment stuff though...give him a day or 2 to calm down and he'll change his mind

Yeah_Right

His stepfather died on Wednesday as well. I imagine he isn't in a good head space and needs some time away with the family. Hopefully he comes back because he is a young guy with a lot of potential.

Steve

troyzer wrote: »

I wish he wasn't such a prick in real life.

troyzer wrote: »

I know he's a bigot. He doesn't hide it.

troyzer wrote: »

Him being a prick has nothing to do with his rugby. It's just unfortunate that such a potentially strong ambassador for the game is a prick.

troyzer wrote: »

Lads, apologies for derailing this a bit.

Simmer down or I'll get banned.

Sound.

CMod note.

These posts are not acceptable.

The mods may have overlooked them but I have not.

Please respect the ethos of Rugby and be civil and show respect to players and peers.

troyzer

Steve wrote: »

troyzer wrote: »

I wish he wasn't such a prick in real life.

troyzer wrote: »

I know he's a bigot. He doesn't hide it.

troyzer wrote: »

Him being a prick has nothing to do with his rugby. It's just unfortunate that such a potentially strong ambassador for the game is a prick.

troyzer wrote: »

Lads, apologies for derailing this a bit.

Simmer down or I'll get banned.

Sound.

CMod note.

These posts are not acceptable.

The mods may have overlooked them but I have not.

Please respect the ethos of Rugby and be civil and show respect to players and peers.

Apologies for that. I honestly didn't mean for it to get so heated.

Del.Monte

Dubinusa wrote: »

After the rwc, I think Cheika will be released. I would think Oz would make a run at Lancaster or Schmidt. Depending on what Schmidt decides on Ireland. Just guessing.

Joe will be the next All Blacks coach.

troyzer

Del.Monte wrote: »

Joe will be the next All Blacks coach.

BOD was chatting about this on Friday and was saying that there's less credit to be won coaching the All Blacks, it's less of a challenge.

Hard to say no to the job though if it is offered to him.

irishbucsfan

Yeah_Right wrote: »

Just remember, matches last for 83 minutes

This is big talk for a fan of a team who have never beaten Ireland (in Chicago)

Buer

troyzer wrote: »

BOD was chatting about this on Friday and was saying that there's less credit to be won coaching the All Blacks, it's less of a challenge.

Hard to say no to the job though if it is offered to him.

Meh. I wouldn't say it would bother anyone. Schmidt will take the job if it's offered. It gives him a strong chance of winning the RWC with his home nation which puts him on another level to anything he has enjoyed to date.

The question is will he be offered the role? NZ have never given the job to anyone based outside of NZ rugby. In all Super Rugby coaching appointments, they've only ever given one post to someone from outside of Super Rugby and that was John Kirwan, a living legend in NZ (and was a failed appointment).

sydthebeat

I'm not sure there are any standout options currently in super rugby though.
Maybe if the saders do a 3 in a row Scotty Robertson might have a good argument, but I dunno...
Boyd is off to Saints next season and plumtree is taking over, so way too soon for him I think.

I suppose Colin Cooper has the experience within the all black set up with his junior and Maori time, but he's relatively new to the super rugby scene.

I don't think tana or Aaron mauger are in t he conversation really.

Buer

sydthebeat wrote: »

I'm not sure there are any standout options currently in super rugby though.
Maybe if the saders do a 3 in a row Scotty Robertson might have a good argument, but I dunno...
Boyd is off to Saints next season and plumtree is taking over, so way too soon for him I think.

I suppose Colin Cooper has the experience within the all black set up with his junior and Maori time, but he's relatively new to the super rugby scene.

I don't think tana or Aaron mauger are in t he conversation really.

Doesn't have to be a stand out option in Super Rugby. I'd be looking at the current support team as a lot more likely than the Super Rugby coaches.

I think the fact that Schmidt has beaten NZ catapulted him into a real contender position but it will still count against him that he is essentially an outsider to NZ rugby at this point. He has never had much of a coaching career there and not for over a decade now. It will be an interesting appointment. I reckon Schmidt would be in the final few but could well be overlooked or offered a role within NZ rugby as a stepping stone.

Yeah_Right

Schmidt would probably need to spend a season or 2 in Super Rugby or as an assistant for the ABs before he would get the top job. Just to get rid of some the bad habits he's picked up coaching in Ireland

Probably too early in his coaching career for Robertson. I could see him doing a stint overseas or as an assistant before going for the top job. I'd say the same about Jamie Joseph, Tony Brown, Aaron Mauger, Darryl Gibson and Leon MacDonald. All seem to be highly rated but I don't think any of them are ready for the biggest coaching job in world rugby yet.

I think Ian Foster is the most likely replacement for Hansen.

sydthebeat

Yeah_Right wrote: »

Schmidt would probably need to spend a season or 2 in Super Rugby or as an assistant for the ABs before he would get the top job. Just to get rid of some the bad habits he's picked up coaching in Ireland

Probably too early in his coaching career for Robertson. I could see him doing a stint overseas or as an assistant before going for the top job. I'd say the same about Jamie Joseph, Tony Brown, Aaron Mauger, Darryl Gibson and Leon MacDonald. All seem to be highly rated but I don't think any of them are ready for the biggest coaching job in world rugby yet.

I think Ian Foster is the most likely replacement for Hansen.

wayne smith again? no?

Buer

sydthebeat wrote: »

wayne smith again? no?

He retired from the All Blacks set up last year. I get the impression he's largely done with full time coaching now as he moves further into his sixties.

sydthebeat

Buer wrote: »

He retired from the All Blacks set up last year. I get the impression he's largely done with full time coaching now as he moves further into his sixties.

ah i didnt know that thanks...

Yeah_Right

I get the impression that Wayne Smith is a bit like Stuart Lancaster. Enjoys the coaching and working with the players but isn't too keen on all the other stuff that goes with being the man in charge. I can't see him going for the head coach role. Whoever gets the job after Hansen might look to get Smith involved as an assistant/consultant.

Part of me hopes that Schmidt gets it just to see the reaction from certain quarters. Some people in NZ would lose their **** over it.

shootermacg

Yeah_Right wrote: »

I get the impression that Wayne Smith is a bit like Stuart Lancaster. Enjoys the coaching and working with the players but isn't too keen on all the other stuff that goes with being the man in charge. I can't see him going for the head coach role. Whoever gets the job after Hansen might look to get Smith involved as an assistant/consultant.

Part of me hopes that Schmidt gets it just to see the reaction from certain quarters. Some people in NZ would lose their **** over it.

Isn't the NZ coache's job to book the hotels and flights? The players just do the rest.

errlloyd

shootermacg wrote: »

Isn't the NZ coache's job to book the hotels and flights? The players just do the rest.

You've to make sure you give the latest promising outhalf (Slade, Soponga, Cruden) a handful of caps so he can't become French qualified in a few years and screw you over.

Yeah_Right

errlloyd wrote: »

You've to make sure you give the latest promising outhalf (Slade, Soponga, Cruden) a handful of caps so he can't become French qualified in a few years and screw you over.

I believe there is also a requirement of being able to get under the skin of and wind up opposition coaches. Just for fun. And occasionally put a journalist back in their box. These are skills that I think Schmidt has (hence Ireland is number 2 in the world) and would excel at that in NZ. However he would need to learn to talk about off-loading and counter-attacking in a positive way. That might take him a season or 2.

Neil3030

Yeah_Right wrote: »

I believe there is also a requirement of being able to get under the skin of and wind up opposition coaches. Just for fun. And occasionally put a journalist back in their box. These are skills that I think Schmidt has (hence Ireland is number 2 in the world) and would excel at that in NZ. However he would need to learn to talk about off-loading and counter-attacking in a positive way. That might take him a season or 2.

2 birds with one stone there surely: now that he's not dealing with terribly coached European players, his team can off load and counter attack all they want!

I like this guys content, it's entertaining even though I don't always agree with his observations.

Thought this review of the South Africa win at the weekend was quality.

errlloyd

Deleted User wrote: »

I like this guys content, it's entertaining even though I don't always agree with his observations.

Thought this review of the South Africa win at the weekend was quality.

I agree that I love his content, but I hope he mostly sticks with relatively timeless content instead of topical content. I like when he analyses long term trends, or performance over a season. A video you can watch any time like, I am less keen on a podcast that just deals with what happened this weekend, it'll be irrelevant by next weekend.

Sabre0001

Covers everything well, but will they learn? They didn't put any more emphasis on the ability to take a drop goal (or at least go for one) after the French defeat. Will they just focus on the "score loads more tries" plan more?

swiwi_

Philippe Sella - Fra vs Aus, 1987



Bautista Delguy - Arg vs Aus, 2018

swiwi_

swiwi_

An Irishman, an Englishman and a Scotsman and a Kiwi talk rugby.

joseywhales

They we're right to go for the try, it was the percentage play

Elvisjuice

joseywhales wrote: »

They we're right to go for the try, it was the percentage play

percentage play in what way ?

sydthebeat

joseywhales wrote: »

They we're right to go for the try, it was the percentage play

no they werent.... it was completely the wrong play

score or miss they were receiving the ball again

they hadnt scored a try for 20 minutes prior... why did they think they could magic one up in the last 90 secs?

sydthebeat

sydthebeat wrote: »

no they werent.... it was completely the wrong play

score or miss they were receiving the ball again

they hadnt scored a try for 20 minutes prior... why did they think they could magic one up in the last 90 secs?

I believe there was about 20 minutes between Franks and Crotty scoring in 2013.

Personally, I have no problem with what they did. I've had so many people mention to me that they should have taken the drop goal, but I reckon if they continued going through the phases, they would probably score or SA would have conceded a penalty.

sydthebeat

They needed a try in 2013.... They only needed 3 points last Saturday...???

Yeah_Right

Sabre0001 wrote: »

Covers everything well, but will they learn? They didn't put any more emphasis on the ability to take a drop goal (or at least go for one) after the French defeat. Will they just focus on the "score loads more tries" plan more?

If you want to win matches by kicking goals then you should be playing soccer. Rugby is about the ball in hand and scoring tries. Billy W Ellis picked the ball up, he didn't f***ing kick it!! The All Blacks are trying to protect the sport's traditions by going for tries.

prawnsambo

Yeah_Right wrote: »

If you want to win matches by kicking goals then you should be playing soccer. Rugby is about the ball in hand and scoring tries. Billy W Ellis picked the ball up, he didn't f***ing kick it!! The All Blacks are trying to protect the sport's traditions by going for tries.

And quite right too. You guys just keep leaving out thiose pesky conversions and penalties, the rest of us will follow suit... presently. :pac:

sydthebeat

sydthebeat wrote: »

They needed a try in 2013.... They only needed 3 points last Saturday...???

I know, but they still back themselves to score tries in those situations. It's still what set the AB's apart from most other teams.

stephen_n

Yeah_Right wrote: »

If you want to win matches by kicking goals then you should be playing soccer. Rugby is about the ball in hand and scoring tries. Billy W Ellis picked the ball up, he didn't f***ing kick it!! The All Blacks are trying to protect the sport's traditions by going for tries.

Is that why you let BB take the kicks?

Former Former

In one sense, you can't blame the AB's for going for it because a) they've dug themselves out of so many holes just like that in the past and b) Barrett clearly didn't fancy it.

But the percentage play was the drop. When you have a five-metre scrum in front of the posts and you get stable ball at the base of it, that's as easy a win as you can ask for. If Dan Carter was still around, that's what would have happened.

thomond2006

sydthebeat wrote: »

They needed a try in 2013.... They only needed 3 points last Saturday...???

I don't recall a game in 2013 when NZ needed a last minute try. No, I certainly do not.

errlloyd

Yeah_Right wrote: »

If you want to win matches by kicking goals then you should be playing soccer. Rugby is about the ball in hand and scoring tries. Billy W Ellis picked the ball up, he didn't f***ing kick it!! The All Blacks are trying to protect the sport's traditions by going for tries.

If this game had been played in 1877 SA would have comfortably won 4-2.

The solution is clearly to increase tries to 10 points, keep conversions and penalties the same, and make dropgoals worth 1 point as a gamebreaker if the scores are level.

sydthebeat

Basil3 wrote: »

I know, but they still back themselves to score tries in those situations. It's still what set the AB's apart from most other teams.

not at all what was being discussed though Baz.....

not going for the drop goal at the end being the wrong call was the discussion.

Yeah_Right

errlloyd wrote: »

If this game had been played in 1877 SA would have comfortably won 4-2.

And Jaco would have been there cheering from the sidelines.

Yeah_Right

thomond2006 wrote: »

I don't recall a game in 2013 when NZ needed a last minute try. No, I certainly do not.

Correct. It wasn't the last minute. It was the 83rd minute. And it was a converted try. :cool:

joseywhales

sydthebeat wrote: »

joseywhales wrote: »

They we're right to go for the try, it was the percentage play

no they werent.... it was completely the wrong play

score or miss they were receiving the ball again

they hadnt scored a try for 20 minutes prior... why did they think they could magic one up in the last 90 secs?

It's was an easy try, they had numbers, they were keeping possession well. The execution let them down but I think the try was less risky than a drop goal from that advantageous position. A couple of passes to hand is less risky than a drop goal attempt. They just f*cked up.

22 drop out could have seen them building from their own half

sydthebeat

joseywhales wrote: »

It's was an easy try, they had numbers, they were keeping possession well. The execution let them down but I think the try was less risky than a drop goal from that advantageous position. A couple of passes to hand is less risky than a drop goal attempt. They just f*cked up.

22 drop out could have seen them building from their own half

well, if youre in a game, 2 points down, with 90 seconds to go and your deep in the opponents 22 battering the line under the posts.... the 'less risky' call is to go for an easy drop goal. yes, continuing to batter could lead to a try.. but is it worth more to win by 1 or 5 ??

the very fact they f*cked up shows it was the wrong call.
Youre at risk of a penalty turn over, or a handling error ...... as happened.

edit: and i full agree to disagree (before we go round in circles)

troyzer

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/opinion/107376916/how-rugby-forgot-about-yellow-cards

Weird, thoughts?

stephen_n

troyzer wrote: »

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/opinion/107376916/how-rugby-forgot-about-yellow-cards

Weird, thoughts?

It’s not a good thing for the game or the safety of players, if and it’s a big if. Referees are being cowed into submission by coaches and former players.

swiwi_

stephen_n wrote: »

It’s not a good thing for the game or the safety of players, if and it’s a big if. Referees are being cowed into submission by coaches and former players.

You guys don’t really watch super rugby but there was wasaaay too TMO and too many unjustified cards. Unless it’s flagrant I prefer to let the citing commissioner earn his money. I like my rugby to flow not endless « check check » from the TMO. I suppose more set piece orientated stop start is more common in NH than SH so maybe less of an issue. In any case don’t think the RC has suddenly become more « unsafe » as a result of less TMO.

errlloyd

swiwi_ wrote: »

You guys don’t really watch super rugby but there was wasaaay too TMO and too many unjustified cards. Unless it’s flagrant I prefer to let the citing commissioner earn his money. I like my rugby to flow not endless « check check » from the TMO. I suppose more set piece orientated stop start is more common in NH than SH so maybe less of an issue. In any case don’t think the RC has suddenly become more « unsafe » as a result of less TMO.

I think we all agree the middle line is somewhere without "check check". We see it on tries a lot. Refs hardly ever check, but they trust the TMO will chime in if something comes up. I want more TMOs passively TMOing

stephen_n

swiwi_ wrote: »

You guys don’t really watch super rugby but there was wasaaay too TMO and too many unjustified cards. Unless it’s flagrant I prefer to let the citing commissioner earn his money. I like my rugby to flow not endless « check check » from the TMO. I suppose more set piece orientated stop start is more common in NH than SH so maybe less of an issue. In any case don’t think the RC has suddenly become more « unsafe » as a result of less TMO.

Was Read cited? That’s all fine in theory but if the citings don’t happen, it’s a free for all.