Dairy Chitchat 3

straight

alps wrote: »

And can any of the above geniuses pick holes in the above piece?

No geniuses farming lad. They're all in soft jobs. A major bugbear of mine is anyone that talks about dairy farming as being highly profitable. I mean for 80 hours a week average and capital invested, risk, etc. Highly profitable to me 4k+ net profit per cow which I'm not making here anyway. I see all these guys that don't want to feed cows and their figures were in moorepark the other day all their milk solids were in the 400's. All the talk of 500 but they don't seem to reach it. I feed about 1 ton here and aim for 600 kg per cow. I cull anything in third + lactation under 500kg solids. I got 83% conception rate to sex straws this year when these guys can't seem to get the results with it. My cows are well fed and have more than a cubicle space each and that's the way it will always be here. If I was in it for the money god help me. Also he is contradictory when he talks about higher stocking rates with bigger cows smaller cows.

mahoney_j

straight wrote: »

No geniuses farming lad. They're all in soft jobs. A major bugbear of mine is anyone that talks about dairy farming as being highly profitable. I mean for 80 hours a week average and capital invested, risk, etc. Highly profitable to me 4k+ net profit per cow which I'm not making here anyway. I see all these guys that don't want to feed cows and their figures were in moorepark the other day all their milk solids were in the 400's. All the talk of 500 but they don't seem to reach it. I feed about 1 ton here and aim for 600 kg per cow. I cull anything in third + lactation under 500kg solids. I got 83% conception rate to sex straws this year when these guys can't seem to get the results with it. My cows are well fed and have more than a cubicle space each and that's the way it will always be here. If I was in it for the money god help me. Also he is contradictory when he talks about higher stocking rates with bigger cows smaller cows.

On the money I go to a lot of these open days ,farm walks etc and tbh there is nothing new or outside the box thinking fixated with more cows more expansion no consideration for smaller units with fragmented land blocks and of your feeding over 6/700 kg meal your a bad grassland manager wasting grass etc if u ask me a lot of advisors don’t have the will nor the skill set to a different approach to managing cows if there not jex or managing higher Sr and feeding stronger

Castlekeeper

alps wrote: »

I'm pretty sure that retailers and service providers are allowed to add interest to overdue bills. It is part of the T&C's on the coop dockets

Of course it is.

Grueller

Lads as have said here I am thinking of entering dairying. 99% certain to be honest. Reading the tillage expansion thread has gotten me thinking on milk price given dawggones pessimism re milk price.
Milk is on world price this few years. We can produce from grass predominantly giving us an edge on cost of production on most of the world. I understand eastern Europe may open up to dairy and have lower labour costs etc but will be heavily reliant on cereals too.
Given the link to energy prices that most other systems have will we continue to have a margin over world price in Ireland or am I missing something.

mahoney_j

Grueller wrote: »

Lads as have said here I am thinking of entering dairying. 99% certain to be honest. Reading the tillage expansion thread has gotten me thinking on milk price given dawggones pessimism re milk price.
Milk is on world price this few years. We can produce from grass predominantly giving us an edge on cost of production on most of the world. I understand eastern Europe may open up to dairy and have lower labour costs etc but will be heavily reliant on cereals too.
Given the link to energy prices that most other systems have will we continue to have a margin over world price in Ireland or am I missing something.

Don’t be fooled there is no benefit in price on our grass fed milk it’s a myth look at what our European counterparts are paid for there milk from minimal grazed grass ,holland pays a bonus to farmers to let there cows graze for 120 days most farmers don’t bother because of the hit to production they still make profit have high levels of debt etc grass is a benefit here but it’s true value is overplayed we produce a high quality product but sell into bargain basement commodities mostly where’s the added value ????

jaymla627

Grueller wrote: »

Lads as have said here I am thinking of entering dairying. 99% certain to be honest. Reading the tillage expansion thread has gotten me thinking on milk price given dawggones pessimism re milk price.
Milk is on world price this few years. We can produce from grass predominantly giving us an edge on cost of production on most of the world. I understand eastern Europe may open up to dairy and have lower labour costs etc but will be heavily reliant on cereals too.
Given the link to energy prices that most other systems have will we continue to have a margin over world price in Ireland or am I missing something.

The green agenda and what allowable stocking rates/fert rates and the cost of complying with all of this is will be the kicker going forward, all with add a extra layer of cost to dairy farms going forward but how much exactly is hard to know

Mooooo

Grueller wrote: »

Lads as have said here I am thinking of entering dairying. 99% certain to be honest. Reading the tillage expansion thread has gotten me thinking on milk price given dawggones pessimism re milk price.
Milk is on world price this few years. We can produce from grass predominantly giving us an edge on cost of production on most of the world. I understand eastern Europe may open up to dairy and have lower labour costs etc but will be heavily reliant on cereals too.
Given the link to energy prices that most other systems have will we continue to have a margin over world price in Ireland or am I missing something.

As we export majority of our produce both beef and dairy we have been on world markets for a while. Yes quota protected us a bit but arguably not as much as the rest of Europe as they had much larger domestic markets.
Mother nature effects the price as much as anything else depending on what she inflicts around the world. You can make the change relatively cost effectively so you should be in an ok position starting out. Do your figures for different prices and perhaps throw in a 5 year average of 30 cent received which would be maybe 28cent base price. You'll see what will be required to get thru a price of 22 cent in a year then. As you have outfarms your overall sr shouldn't be an issue 're changes to nitrates unless they decide to do it on a block by block basis but I don't think that has been mentioned.

older by the day

I found a cow dead with grass tetny the 4 of June. She was going in heat that day. If I could travel back in time I would have given her an extra kg of nuts. When you find a cow dead in the morning it makes meal feeding feel cheap.

jaymla627

older by the day wrote: »

I found a cow dead with grass tetny the 4 of June. She was going in heat that day. If I could travel back in time I would have given her an extra kg of nuts. When you find a cow dead in the morning it makes meal feeding feel cheap.

Knackery man was getting a cow here in April that died of sepsis due to a torn calf bed and was after taking 7 cows from a lad that morning with tetany, was his first and hopefully last visit this year but I had to laugh when he mentioned you think your going bad and recalled the lad he’d been with that morning....

RightTurnClyde

straight wrote: »

No geniuses farming lad. They're all in soft jobs. A major bugbear of mine is anyone that talks about dairy farming as being highly profitable. I mean for 80 hours a week average and capital invested, risk, etc. Highly profitable to me 4k+ net profit per cow which I'm not making here anyway. I see all these guys that don't want to feed cows and their figures were in moorepark the other day all their milk solids were in the 400's. All the talk of 500 but they don't seem to reach it. I feed about 1 ton here and aim for 600 kg per cow. I cull anything in third + lactation under 500kg solids. I got 83% conception rate to sex straws this year when these guys can't seem to get the results with it. My cows are well fed and have more than a cubicle space each and that's the way it will always be here. If I was in it for the money god help me. Also he is contradictory when he talks about higher stocking rates with bigger cows smaller cows.

The day ONE of these advisors gives up their job to go milking this highly profitable system, is the day I'll start listening to them.
( well actually I wont because they're an even idiot than the rest to believe their own ****e )
:):)

wrangler

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

The day ONE of these advisors gives up their job to go milking this highly profitable system, is the day I'll start listening to them.
( well actually I wont because they're an even idiot than the rest to believe their own ****e )
:):)

And he's the one with quality of life and no cows ****ting down on top of him twice a day...... beats all don't it

kevthegaff

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

The day ONE of these advisors gives up their job to go milking this highly profitable system, is the day I'll start listening to them.
( well actually I wont because they're an even idiot than the rest to believe their own ****e )
:):)

in fairness I have a cousin who's related to another boardsies wife here! Who is advising and has invested in a few farms with no land, all rented. He sometimes writes on the journal, he's on top of the game too
. I use to say the very same thing till he started milking

alps

straight wrote: »

Graise consultancy's latest... How to be HIGHLY profitable.


When is 22 more than 27? Matching your system to milk payment


When I run regular groups in Ireland I gather information before group day for the hand-out on the day. This usually includes production and feed rates to which I apply the milk pricing from the milk buyer most common to the group. See the example from a recent group using the local milk price of €6.1767/Kg protein, €3.0488/Kg fat and a deduction of €0.0335/litre for the A + B – C calculation; I have isolated 2 of the group’s production figures to show the difference, one farmer doing 22 litres with xbred cows, good fat and protein %s and feeding no concentrate vs another farmer doing 27 litres/cow with lower fat and protein %s (still very good, I see much lower!) feeding 4Kg/cow concentrate.

The blue cell is the calculation of the protein X protein payment + fat X fat payment minus litres X volume charge and then minus the cost of the concentrate @ €280/T.

In this case the income/cow net of concentrate cost is near 50c/cow/day higher for the farmer producing 5 litres/cow less!! ��

Anyone want to give assumptions about the 2 mentioned farmers?

straight

alps wrote: »

Anyone want to give assumptions about the 2 mentioned farmers?

Don't make assumptions. Makes an Ass out of u and me.

Keepgrowing

jaymla627 wrote: »

Knackery man was getting a cow here in April that died of sepsis due to a torn calf bed and was after taking 7 cows from a lad that morning with tetany, was his first and hopefully last visit this year but I had to laugh when he mentioned you think your going bad and recalled the lad he’d been with that morning....

7 cows?? I’m calling bullshyte on that story. Knacker men renound for tall tales

Keepgrowing

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

The day ONE of these advisors gives up their job to go milking this highly profitable system, is the day I'll start listening to them.
( well actually I wont because they're an even idiot than the rest to believe their own ****e )
:):)

I can name 4 of them

Buford T. Justice XIX

Some were asking a while back about paddock sizes and infrastructure, there's a link below in the tweet to a Teagasc booklet on infrastructure.
https://twitter.com/teagasc/status/1147445300598104064?s=19

Grueller

Buford T. Justice VI wrote: »

Some were asking a while back about paddock sizes and infrastructure, there's a link below in the tweet to a Teagasc booklet on infrastructure.
https://twitter.com/teagasc/status/1147445300598104064?s=19

That was me thanks Buford

kevthegaff

Sick of giving money to meal merchants, seriously considering reducing it

yewtree

Keepgrowing wrote: »

I can name 4 of them

I can name a few more than 4 who are dairy farming. The best advisors are always stuck into it themselves.

Mooooo

The meal situation depends on the cow you have and the grass you have. Would fall into the category of farmer 2 above feeding the 4kgs. Esp with my low bf the financial return directly from meal in the last 2 months may not be there bit I guess it depends on what else it is doing for you, maintaining condition, higher plane of nutrition during breeding etc. While there are a lot of lads in the low meal bracket not hitting 500kgs, there are a lot of lads in the high meal bracket not hitting the 550/ 600 either.,my self included. There are lads feeding a half to a tonne less than me and selling the same amount of milk per cow with some a lot more per ha so it's an area I have to improve in. Not for teagasc or anyone else but my pocket. The growth this year kinda came in a burst in June which left quality hard to get right, have gone up and down a kg while managing it

RightTurnClyde

Keepgrowing wrote: »

I can name 4 of them

Good for you. If you can name 4 that gave up state jobs, Mon to Fri, with pensions that can't be bought to go dairy farming fulltime you need to look at the people you surround yourself with :):):)

wrangler

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

Good for you. If you can name 4 that gave up state jobs, Mon to Fri, with pensions that can't be bought to go dairy farming fulltime you need to look at the people you surround yourself with :):):)

You don't need to give up a job that takes absolute max 40 hrs wk for only 46 wks of the year as there seems to be enough money slushing around dairy farms to pay labour, especially if you can get them milked for €50.

Grueller

wrangler wrote: »

You don't need to give up a job that takes absolute max 40 hrs wk for only 46 wks of the year as there seems to be enough money slushing around dairy farms to pay labour, especially if you can get them milked for €50.

Not true of many 9 to 5s though wrangler. If a lad needs to be in an office for 9 he needs to be out of the yard by 7:45 for shower, change, and the commute to start at 9. He will leave the office at 5 and getting home, changed, quick bite and its six by the time he is in the yard. That is over 50 hours and a short commute.
I have been this soldier and got out of it to go self employed.

alps

Keepgrowing wrote: »

7 cows?? I’m calling bullshyte on that story. Knacker men renound for tall tales

If only he fed another kilo..

Keepgrowing

IGA summer tour is a must for this year. Both gave up careers outside farming to dairy farm full time. Both very different in scale and land owned. Lifestyle was a key driver, believe it or not.

Shameless plug

mengele

Are many spreading fert in this weather. I know some have got showers or rain but I hadn't got anything in the south or nothings looks forecast. Is it a waste putting it out on dry ground?

Panch18

Keepgrowing wrote: »

IGA summer tour is a must for this year. Both gave up careers outside farming to dairy farm full time. Both very different in scale and land owned. Lifestyle was a key driver, believe it or not.

Shameless plug

When’s it on keepgrowing?

And is it open to none members?

mahoney_j

mengele wrote: »

Are many spreading fert in this weather. I know some have got showers or rain but I hadn't got anything in the south or nothings looks forecast. Is it a waste putting it out on dry ground?

Topped up silage ground and right up to behind cows Friday evening and yesterday .we had a smashing day yesterday full nice steady rain yesterday am and misty rain all afternoon and evening sun hardly made an appearance due to clouds so little evaporation no rain today but dull ,if we had a week like yesterday I’d be happy as starting to get tight on grass due to lack mousture
If no rain I’d leave it in bag even tho you’d be tempted to go with it

Keepgrowing

Panch18 wrote: »

When’s it on keepgrowing?

And is it open to none members?

Open to non members.

Timmaay

Any rain on Yr here keeps drifting out, grass burning up on any hilly ground (which couldn't hold the heavy showers that hit in early June). Decent afc of 280 here at the minute so not going to react yet.

Keep Sluicing

Keepgrowing wrote: »

IGA summer tour is a must for this year. Both gave up careers outside farming to dairy farm full time. Both very different in scale and land owned. Lifestyle was a key driver, believe it or not.

Shameless plug

Both different scale but both well above the average cow numbers. No point planning milking 80 cows anymore it seems. But i think i head along to it anyway.

Keepgrowing

Keep Sluicing wrote: »

Both different scale but both well above the average cow numbers. No point planning milking 80 cows anymore it seems. But i think i head along to it anyway.

Mr Hamm was happy milking 30-40 cows, he was not expecting additional lands to become available. His initial starting land block was 39 ac with 12 leased away from farm.

What’s interesting is his thought process that lead him to dairying having been in other careers before hand.

farisfat

Keepgrowing wrote: »

Open to non members.

You'll probably get a bashing now.....indoor is the way forward.

Keepgrowing

farisfat wrote: »

You'll probably get a bashing now.....indoor is the way forward.

I’m well able for it

The way forward for the IGA is to pass on the latest research and information pertinent to pastoral farming thus allowing members decide for themselves. We’d be very strong on a no one size fits all approach

straight

Keepgrowing wrote: »

IGA summer tour is a must for this year. Both gave up careers outside farming to dairy farm full time. Both very different in scale and land owned. Lifestyle was a key driver, believe it or not.

Shameless plug

They must have had fairly sh1t jobs if they switch to dairy farming for a better lifestyle.

Timmaay

straight wrote: »

They must have had fairly sh1t jobs if they switch to dairy farming for a better lifestyle.

I've a research masters in engineering and could easily of gone back to that whole area over the last few yrs and scaled back the farming, but the grass is certainly not always greener on the other side, back in the rat race, stuck in traffic at 6.30am, stuck in an office all day, and nowhere near the flexible that I have nowadays, feb and March are busy but rest of the yr whenever I need a milking off I usually have someone to cover for me.

straight

Timmaay wrote: »

I've a research masters in engineering and could easily of gone back to that whole area over the last few yrs and scaled back the farming, but the grass is certainly not always greener on the other side, back in the rat race, stuck in traffic at 6.30am, stuck in an office all day, and nowhere near the flexible that I have nowadays, feb and March are busy but rest of the yr whenever I need a milking off I usually have someone to cover for me.

I worked in the hi tech sector for 20 years. A good job but just wasn't for me. Have other qualifications and opportunities too so I'm farming cos I want to. Think I just need more relief Milkers here is my biggest thing.

Pidae.m

Timmaay wrote: »

I've a research masters in engineering and could easily of gone back to that whole area over the last few yrs and scaled back the farming, but the grass is certainly not always greener on the other side, back in the rat race, stuck in traffic at 6.30am, stuck in an office all day, and nowhere near the flexible that I have nowadays, feb and March are busy but rest of the yr whenever I need a milking off I usually have someone to cover for me.

My brother has a similar qualification (has a young family and has to travel a good bit) and wants to come home farming. He has lived in oz the last ten yrs. As my old lad says you'll never be rich from farming but it's a great place to rear a family.

Sacrolyte

I really need rain. And I’ve hay down. I’m so torn................

boggerman1

Update on the blood test for Tb after 2 more going down a couple of weeks ago.6 showed up in the blood so they're for the chop now.5 of the 6 of coarse are in calf as I did scanning last week on about 113 between cows and heifers.had myself geared up for more to go.hopefully this has found whatever lodger is there.all the same age group of 2nd to 4th calvers and as anyone else knows not bad auld milkers to boot.it's never a bad one!.

Timmaay

2nd skin test here today, reading on Thursday, fingers crossed.

Timmaay

[url] https://www.glanbiaconnect.com/news/glanbia-ireland-announce-farmgen-solar-pv-solution[/url]

Mother of God talk about pure spin. And not one single mention of the actual economics of it. Any of the previous teagasc work done on dairy energy efficiency and renewables concluded that solar didn't have the sufficient payback over its lifetime, and in particular when there was no feed in tariff, what prices are these now offering?

Mortelaro

Timmaay wrote: »

[url] https://www.glanbiaconnect.com/news/glanbia-ireland-announce-farmgen-solar-pv-solution[/url]

Mother of God talk about pure spin. And not one single mention of the actual economics of it. Any of the previous teagasc work done on dairy energy efficiency and renewables concluded that solar didn't have the sufficient payback over its lifetime, and in particular when there was no feed in tariff, what prices are these now offering?

There’s a company,a well established company down in Brandon, I think it is that does this called Waterpower(they’re also an electricity provider ie you can swap your provider to them)
The ballpark price I got off them for something capable of running most things a year ago was around 9k ex VAT
That was for a system delivering 10kva iirc
Still thinking about it
If you were going to splash 3.5 K on a Genny,then this would probably be a better step if you have the cash
You get the Vat back of course and the cap ex write down
The lack of a feed in tariff is an issue, but that will come,the pressure is on climate change lobby wise

Water John

Really needing the Tams grant to make it pay. Glanbia obviously want their cut.
FIT probably from 2021.

Mortelaro

Water John wrote: »

Really needing the Tams grant to make it pay. Glanbia obviously want their cut.
FIT probably from 2021.

I dunno,I'd say,the 'green credentials ' are more what they want

As regards fundequip,the rate is low on that and no bank palava
If you were paying say 300 a month on those payments your ESB bill was down 400 a month
Then any grant is a bonus,its a no brainer then
I'd want to see if Eirtricity cover the maintenance on the panels

It's not all as cracked as it looks at first glance

Buford T. Justice XIX

Mortelaro wrote: »

I dunno,I'd say,the 'green credentials ' are more what they want

As regards fundequip,the rate is low on that and no bank palava
If you were paying say 300 a month on those payments your ESB bill was down 400 a month
Then any grant is a bonus,its a no brainer then
I'd want to see if Eirtricity cover the maintenance on the panels

It's not all as cracked as it looks at first glance

And the end of life recycling of the panels looks like it will be an issue as well. They're not so well able to do that atm so that could be a long term sting in the tail as well.

whelan2

Will there be many autumn calving cows for sale this year? With lads getting out would they have served them anyway?

Mooooo

whelan2 wrote: »

Will there be many autumn calving cows for sale this year? With lads getting out would they have served them anyway?

When I got out I rolled them and served for the spring, know a couple that did that so dunno would they be sold if good cow's unless the person is reducing numbers as well

jaymla627

Mini-drought just about to start here, gr on higher drier block back to low 30’s likewise with anything grazed the past 5 days, higher covers on wetter ground still motoring but once eaten will crash gr wise unless a good dumping of rain occurs