Dairy Chitchat 3

ozil10

Haha My bad
Grammar needs to be improved
Myself to blame regarding the parlour.
With bank taking so long to get the money drawn down on the loan.
First big loan taken out so I never realised the process would take so long,
I'm learning as I go
Plan was to be in cubicle shed end of Jan but that hasn't worked out and should have gone with the parlour first.
Hindsight is great lol

Mooooo

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

+1.
Went flying herd a few years back and wouldn’t go back unless replacements go to €1500. You’d be amazed at how many man-hours are wasted on young stock.
I always buy fresh calved stock that are fully tested, parlor and cubicle trained, and straight into parlor with them.
The first bought stock are now starting to be culled at around €900/head and were bought for an average of €850...after producing over 40k litres.
Average price for a freshly calved heifer now is €1000 and 2nd lactation is €800.
I always buy with a return policy if they’ve issues like slow milkers etc.

You’ll get a name as a buyer after a while. The Coop are the best source for upcoming herd sales.

Edit. It’s also simple to adjust herd size quickly. I’d hassle getting dairy staff last year and started to destock rapidly, now we’re back to a full team I’m buying hard again...it gives great flexibility to duck and dive.

Tb could be a major issue depending on area and can't offload stock or if buying in they can be put down with no comp

jaymla627

ozil10 wrote: »

When buying in stock
What are you looking from a health point of view
Would all animals have to be vaccinated for ibr. Salmonella etc
We operate a closed herd here
Only vaccinate for lepto
As never had ibr or salmonella show up in the milk disease screening

You could potentially have a bomb go off at breeding if you mix your cows which are pretty much naive to ibr/salmonella/bvd don’t forget about mortelaro aswell if your herd is free of it at the minute you’ll almost guarantee it will be brought in by bought in stock and that’s a lifetime issue you’ll have to deal with

Morris Moss

ozil10 wrote: »

Haha My bad
Grammar needs to be improved
Myself to blame regarding the parlour.
With bank taking so long to get the money drawn down on the loan.
First big loan taken out so I never realised the process would take so long,
I'm learning as I go
Plan was to be in cubicle shed end of Jan but that hasn't worked out and should have gone with the parlour first.
Hindsight is great lol

If you had of gone to finance Ireland you would have had a loan in 3-4 weeks, we had the same problems with the bank, 3 months of waiting to be told ya need to jump through another hoop, put in a 20 unit parlour here, just got it going in the last week, was meant to be done for start of January but lots of delays, just remember trying to put cows into a new parlour straight from the old 1 is not easy and ya might have to run them through a couple of times before ya milk.

Anyways if I was you I'd stay at the 100 cows till the new parlour is up and running, no point killing yourself before ya get started.

ozil10

Morris Moss wrote: »

ozil10 wrote: »

Haha My bad
Grammar needs to be improved
Myself to blame regarding the parlour.
With bank taking so long to get the money drawn down on the loan.
First big loan taken out so I never realised the process would take so long,
I'm learning as I go
Plan was to be in cubicle shed end of Jan but that hasn't worked out and should have gone with the parlour first.
Hindsight is great lol

If you had of gone to finance Ireland you would have had a loan in 3-4 weeks, we had the same problems with the bank, 3 months of waiting to be told ya need to jump through another hoop, put in a 20 unit parlour here, just got it going in the last week, was meant to be done for start of January but lots of delays, just remember trying to put cows into a new parlour straight from the old 1 is not easy and ya might have to run them through a couple of times before ya milk.

Anyways if I was you I'd stay at the 100 cows till the new parlour is up and running, no point killing yourself before ya get started.

Well I did have two banks competing for the business
Competition def helps knock down the interest rate

Morris Moss

ozil10 wrote: »

Well I did have two banks competing for the business
Competition def helps knock down the interest rate

3•5 % with finance Ireland, 7 % with AIB only 1 winner there.

dar31

ozil10 wrote: »

I have allowed for the buying in of stock in my plan

Buy the stock and get on with it, you will find away to manage in the short term, get some one to help milk no matter the cost.
If you have building loans and stocking loans to be paid, sending milk out the gate is the only way you get them paid.
Stressing over repayments will ware you out a lot quicker than the physical work

straight

Ya, I enjoy breeding off my own stock and trying to improve them. You just have to love farming because if you put the same hours and investment into anything else you would be better off financially.

whelan2

Morris Moss wrote: »

3•5 % with finance Ireland, 7 % with AIB only 1 winner there.

Can't believe its 7% with aib. Ulster are nearly half that, they mustn't be backing brave anymore

ozil10

They were competitive with my loan to be fair
They went to 3.1%
Still didn't go with them tho

Morris Moss

Maybe my loan was small fry to them, either way I won't be getting a loan with them if I can help it, finance Ireland was very straight forward, told ya what was needed and that was it, no being passed from pillar to post with them unlike AIB.

GrasstoMilk

Morris Moss wrote: »

Maybe my loan was small fry to them, either way I won't be getting a loan with them if I can help it, finance Ireland was very straight forward, told ya what was needed and that was it, no being passed from pillar to post with them unlike AIB.

Never had that issue with AIB anything I ever looked for was approved very promptly!
Ulster bank on the other had?!! We spent 6 months being messed around by them, went to AIB one day then and they approved us in a week. We moved all the business to them that very day. Ulster to me are the biggest waste of time

whelan2

GrasstoMilk wrote: »

Never bad that issue with AIB anything I ever looked for was approved very promptly!

I'm not sure about aib but alot of stuff can be down to your account manager. I have changed branches a few times to get away from useless ones

Mooooo

90% down to the people you deal with

Buford T. Justice XIX

whelan2 wrote: »

Can't believe its 7% with aib. Ulster are nearly half that, they mustn't be backing brave anymore

First 3 quotes from AIB that I got were 6.25%, 6.5% and 7%, same loan and sums involved. Looked for a quote from BOI through the Co-op, unsecured for up to 65k and repayments taken straight from the milk cheque at 4%. The more information I gave them, the more information they wanted but it was all available in the accounts they got for the loan. After yet another call to the accountant for more info, I was told it was just stringing me along till I got sick of providing more information.



Rang AIB directly instead of going through the managers and quoted 5.5% and went with them, all sorted in 3 days.


BOI rang back the day the money hit my account wondering if I had the information for them so I said I'd send it on in the morning. Never said what morning though.


I wouldn't mind except BOI are actively looking to increase their farm lending, according to the man I was dealing with. Funny that AIB could approve a loan with way less information in a quicker time than them. And funny that I got 4 different rates from 4 different people for the same loan from AIB:rolleyes:


God, I hate banks.

Mortelaro

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

First 3 quotes from AIB that I got were 6.25%, 6.5% and 7%, same loan and sums involved. Looked for a quote from BOI through the Co-op, unsecured for up to 65k and repayments taken straight from the milk cheque at 4%. The more information I gave them, the more information they wanted but it was all available in the accounts they got for the loan. After yet another call to the accountant for more info, I was told it was just stringing me along till I got sick of providing more information.



Rang AIB directly instead of going through the managers and quoted 5.5% and went with them, all sorted in 3 days.


BOI rang back the day the money hit my account wondering if I had the information for them so I said I'd send it on in the morning. Never said what morning though.


I wouldn't mind except BOI are actively looking to increase their farm lending, according to the man I was dealing with. Funny that AIB could approve a loan with way less information in a quicker time than them. And funny that I got 4 different rates from 4 different people for the same loan from AIB:rolleyes:


God, I hate banks.

AIB managers have discretion still up to about 60k unsecured
BoI small business lending (less than 500k) doesn't
It goes to the computer and if something is awry its spat out
Theres a set criteria on it and if the first bank official doesn't enter all it needs,its rejected
Then it goes to credit (real people)who depending on who you get will just keep asking for more info
That sounds like where yours went
A pain in the proverbial

whelan2

Mooooo wrote: »

90% down to the people you deal with

Am geting finance on my feeder, first time ever getting finance. This lad rang me the other day from 1 company, I said I was getting a loan for sheds and feeder would be a shorter term finance deal than my loan, his first comment was well we will be way cheaper than their 8% :eek: he shot himself in the foot straight away . I said they are under 4% actually :rolleyes: you'd wonder were they get some of these lads from at all

jaymla627

GrasstoMilk wrote: »

Never had that issue with AIB anything I ever looked for was approved very promptly!
Ulster bank on the other had?!! We spent 6 months being messed around by them, went to AIB one day then and they approved us in a week. We moved all the business to them that very day. Ulster to me are the biggest waste of time

Ulster bank managed to put through a cheque here for 30,500 euro that was wrote for 3,500, was lucky the funds weren’t their to meet it, still haven’t called back with an explanation after calling them on Friday to see what in the name of god happened, their a disaster to deal with on all accounts, having to ring the company up that the cheque was wrote to explain it wasn’t bounced because of a funds issue was a ball-ache too

whelan2

jaymla627 wrote: »

Ulster bank managed to put through a cheque here for 30,500 euro that was wrote for 3,500, was lucky the funds weren’t their to meet it, still haven’t called back with an explanation after calling them on Friday to see what in the name of god happened, their a disaster to deal with on all accounts, having to ring the company up that the cheque was wrote to explain it wasn’t bounced because of a funds issue was a ball-ache too

Has happened me before, it has to all be fixed up by close of business that day .

Keep Sluicing

whelan2 wrote: »

Can't believe its 7% with aib. Ulster are nearly half that, they mustn't be backing brave anymore

AIB were offeeing me a 3.72% interest rate. BOI gave me 3.49%. Got it sorted in under 2 weeks

jaymla627

whelan2 wrote: »

Has happened me before, it has to all be fixed up by close of business that day .

Did they correct your account and remove the unpaid cheque of it, will be demanding it’s done here, the chap on the phone said it would but it still looks bad on your account when something like that shows up as unpaid

whelan2

jaymla627 wrote: »

Did they correct your account and remove the unpaid cheque of it, will be demanding it’s done here, the chap on the phone said it would but it still looks bad on your account when something like that shows up as unpaid

Mine was a cheque for 300 euro taken out as 3005 , it was to my brother. It stayed on my account even though it was corrected, it didnt cause my account to go over my limit though

Mortelaro

Keep Sluicing wrote: »

AIB were offeeing me a 3.72% interest rate. BOI gave me 3.49%. Got it sorted in under 2 weeks

Secured I presume?
Great if they've already got security but a pain if you have to pay double legal fees (theirs and your own) to set up security for the first time for them

alps

whelan2 wrote: »

I don't know part of the love of dairy farming is seeing progeny coming through year after year from your good cows

I used to think that when bulls had proofs. It's lucky bag breeding now, and with the new codes, bulls identity is so anonymous that the "art" that was in breeding has disappeared and that pleasure you correctly aspire to is dwindling...

Gawddawggonnit

ozil10 wrote: »

When buying in stock
What are you looking from a health point of view
Would all animals have to be vaccinated for ibr. Salmonella etc
We operate a closed herd here
Only vaccinate for lepto
As never had ibr or salmonella show up in the milk disease screening

Before anything enters the herd they must be tested for;
Lepto.
IBR.
Brucellosis.
TB.
Q fever.
Neosporosis.
Salmonella.
Bvd.

A fortnight later they’re blooded for IBR again. We don’t vaccinate the herd for anything only Rota/Corona, and that’s really for crypto and rota scour in calves.

Gawddawggonnit

Mooooo wrote: »

Tb could be a major issue depending on area and can't offload stock or if buying in they can be put down with no comp

Matter a feck to me here as there’s no compo...the cost of herd health insurance is prohibitive so we self insure.

Amazing how Irish farmers think that French farmers are subsidized to the max, when in reality there’s only the sfp.

Mooooo

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

Matter a feck to me here as there’s no compo...the cost of herd health insurance is prohibitive so we self insure.

Amazing how Irish farmers think that French farmers are subsidized to the max, when in reality there’s only the sfp.

Only talking from my own experience 're tb, complicates everything really. Contract rearing again would have similar issues. It's something I'd consider as finding land to rent is difficult in cork but tb and it's restrictions make it difficult. 40 acres went to 18.5k at public auction recently about 5 miles away, 2 lads went at it. No development potential at all just farmland. Rel little ground coming on the market to rent as well

mahoney_j

alps wrote: »

I used to think that when bulls had proofs. It's lucky bag breeding now, and with the new codes, bulls identity is so anonymous that the "art" that was in breeding has disappeared and that pleasure you correctly aspire to is dwindling...

Not for me anyway but I get where your comming from ,picking bulls studying figures going back thru records and ultimately seeing your replacements comming thru is something that gives me great satisfaction

Timmaay

mahoney_j wrote: »

Not for me anyway but I get where your comming from ,picking bulls studying figures going back thru records and ultimately seeing your replacements comming thru is something that gives me great satisfaction

Equally so I get good satisfaction from "shopping" around for Incalf heifers, finding and visiting good herds who I know will do as good if not better a job at rearing replacements than me, unfortunately we have been exposed to quite afew diseases here in the past, including mortellaro and salmonella so that's less of an issue, tb we thankfully have no issues with, so I definitely try to avoid any tb hotspots. And finally with 140ac to milk off here, and zero outside grazing land, it simply doesn't make economic sense to have replacements taking the spot of milker's. I'll still split the difference and rear half my replacements but will buy in also. (and that's about the only comfort in the absolutely God awful run of bulls to heifers here, 2/3s to 1/3 so far ugggh)

Gawddawggonnit

Mooooo wrote: »

Only talking from my own experience 're tb, complicates everything really. Contract rearing again would have similar issues. It's something I'd consider as finding land to rent is difficult in cork but tb and it's restrictions make it difficult. 40 acres went to 18.5k at public auction recently about 5 miles away, 2 lads went at it. No development potential at all just farmland. Rel little ground coming on the market to rent as well

€18.5k per acre??
Crazy. Nuts. Mad. Imho!

Still, more luck to the buyer...he could be the one sitting smugly in time to come.

Gawddawggonnit

mahoney_j wrote: »

Not for me anyway but I get where your comming from ,picking bulls studying figures going back thru records and ultimately seeing your replacements comming thru is something that gives me great satisfaction

Gave up looking too hard at records. Mobility, depth of frame and feet is all I look at now. With the right grub any hol is capable of 10+k litres.
I bought a few freshly calved heifers in Normandy before Xmas. One is a half sister to a bull in Ai here and nothing extra...

Mooooo

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

€18.5k per acre??
Crazy. Nuts. Mad. Imho!

Still, more luck to the buyer...he could be the one sitting smugly in time to come.

Totally, an excellent operator by all accounts as well.

GrasstoMilk

Does anyone know if its possible to get 20ft diagonal barriers? Would they be a special order?

atlantic mist

condons do them up to 25ft

GrasstoMilk

atlantic mist wrote: »

condons do them up to 25ft

Ideal. Trying to figure out a way of roofing a proposed new tank at the side of a cubicle shed

gozunda

Mooooo wrote: »

Only talking from my own experience 're tb, complicates everything really. Contract rearing again would have similar issues. It's something I'd consider as finding land to rent is difficult in cork but tb and it's restrictions make it difficult. 40 acres went to 18.5k at public auction recently about 5 miles away, 2 lads went at it. No development potential at all just farmland. Rel little ground coming on the market to rent as well

Sorry read that as 40 acres for 18.5k! Lol. Wrong century!

Mooooo

gozunda wrote: »

Sorry read that as 40 acres for 18.5k! Less than 2000 per acre?) Lol. Wrong century!

I had it badly worded

Timmaay

Mooooo wrote: »

I had it badly worded

I read it as 18500 rent for the yr, or 462e/ac lol

older by the day

Land price ain't dear if your single farm payment is big. I know know of lads buying farms with 3 years SFP. If you had to borrow and earn it, then it is expensive. So it's not a level playing field. God forbid the Ifa would ever look after the small guy

wrangler

older by the day wrote: »

Land price ain't dear if your single farm payment is big. I know know of lads buying farms with 3 years SFP. If you had to borrow and earn it, then it is expensive. So it's not a level playing field. God forbid the Ifa would ever look after the small guy

There's more groups trying to take it off us than there is to leave it with us this time but it was the same the last time.
Better to leave it with us than young lads blowing it in ''COPPERS'' :rolleyes:

Waffletraktor

wrangler wrote: »

There's more groups trying to take it off us than there is to leave it with us this time but it was the same the last time.
Better to leave it with us than young lads blowing it in ''COPPERS'' :rolleyes:

How long until there’s an ‘I blame grandad for not buying me a big enough farm’ group?

wrangler

Waffletraktor wrote: »

How long until there’s an ‘I blame grandad for not buying me a big enough farm’ group?

Sure we're blessed, there must be eight or ten organisations already

older by the day

wrangler wrote: »

Waffletraktor wrote: »

How long until there’s an ‘I blame grandad for not buying me a big enough farm’ group?

Sure we're blessed, there must be eight or ten organisations already

Well surely some one of those organizations would see that a payment of 60000 euro is not bad. Compared to your organisation that were very quiet until the BPM started. Look after the big fellow anyway wrangler

Buford T. Justice XIX

Greenfields update
https://twitter.com/dfogarty6/status/1099730560166047745?s=19

wrangler

older by the day wrote: »

Well surely some one of those organizations would see that a payment of 60000 euro is not bad. Compared to your organisation that were very quiet until the BPM started. Look after the big fellow anyway wrangler

Anyone can put out press releases, BPM is news at the moment, IFA'll be there when all the others are gone, When we were reforming ICSA, the Indo was all about us, need I say more

K.G.

ozil10 wrote: »

Morris Moss wrote: »

ozil10 wrote: »

Haha My bad
Grammar needs to be improved
Myself to blame regarding the parlour.
With bank taking so long to get the money drawn down on the loan.
First big loan taken out so I never realised the process would take so long,
I'm learning as I go
Plan was to be in cubicle shed end of Jan but that hasn't worked out and should have gone with the parlour first.
Hindsight is great lol

If you had of gone to finance Ireland you would have had a loan in 3-4 weeks, we had the same problems with the bank, 3 months of waiting to be told ya need to jump through another hoop, put in a 20 unit parlour here, just got it going in the last week, was meant to be done for start of January but lots of delays, just remember trying to put cows into a new parlour straight from the old 1 is not easy and ya might have to run them through a couple of times before ya milk.

Anyways if I was you I'd stay at the 100 cows till the new parlour is up and running, no point killing yourself before ya get started.

Well I did have two banks competing for the business
Competition def helps knock down the interest rate

good stuff but the real game is security.banks have a tendencey of throwing paper at you when you go to draw down the loan so make.sure you know exactly what security tbey are looking for.wodnt be unusual for them to throw in a personal garuntee at the laast second.sounds your going for 200 k plus by the time your finizshed.

older by the day

wrangler wrote: »

older by the day wrote: »

Well surely some one of those organizations would see that a payment of 60000 euro is not bad. Compared to your organisation that were very quiet until the BPM started. Look after the big fellow anyway wrangler

Anyone can put out press releases, BPM is news at the moment, IFA'll be there when all the others are gone, When we were reforming ICSA, the Indo was all about us, need I say more

And ye were on the paper's when ye gave Smith his million pension. Ifa might be there in future, but a lot of family farms won't be

Panch18

older by the day wrote: »

Land price ain't dear if your single farm payment is big. I know know of lads buying farms with 3 years SFP. If you had to borrow and earn it, then it is expensive. So it's not a level playing field. God forbid the Ifa would ever look after the small guy

You do know the payment is taxable right? And at 52% if it’s an anyway decent payment at all

There wouldn’t be much good land bought around here anyway for 3 years payments, no matter how big the payment is. So I’d be interested to know what your idea of “farm” is

Also just to say that the larger payments have been cut a savage amount in the last few years. Thousands upon thousands have been taken off ours, enough to pay a sizeable loan

wrangler

older by the day wrote: »

And ye were on the paper's when ye gave Smith his million pension. Ifa might be there in future, but a lot of family farms won't be

Two million wasn't it, If the present CEO is getting 150k, smith was worth 500k.
I see Bert Stewart, one of the finance committee at the time choosing whether to go on the board of monaghan mushrooms or some creamery. so he didn't suffer much
Anyway it's in the past, won't worry me, no worse than what the public service is doing to us

straight

http://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/is-feeding-those-extra-dairy-cows-really-making-you-anymore-money/