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Would you report a landord after viewing

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  • 20-08-2018 3:43pm
    #1
    kenmm
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,698 ✭✭✭


    Hi,

    A friend just went for a viewing of a property (2 bed, 2200). During the viewing the landlord admitted they were going to sell the house and then decided not to, but the tenants had moved out.

    I am curious - assuming a landlord did want to sell (and issued the correct notice with stat declaration etc) and then did change there minds, arent they still obliged to keep within the rent pressure zone rules? If that is the case, it seems very coincidental that the rent is such a high and round number.

    No one is planning on doing anything about it, but it got me thinking - should this sort of behaviour be reported (even if suspected breeches).


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    #2
    Samuel T. Cogley
    Registered Users Posts: 10,684 ✭✭✭✭Samuel T. Cogley


    Yes it should be reported and investigated.


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    #3
    April 73
    Registered Users Posts: 846 ✭✭✭April 73


    If they decided not to sell then they should have offered the property back to the original tenants too.
    €2200 is a very nice, rounded number alright. These people don’t even have the wit to make it look like they are playing by the rules.


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    #4
    kenmm
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,698 ✭✭✭kenmm


    although, checking the register the previous tenancy wasnt registered.

    They first (last week) had this one advertised at 1850 as well - ffs


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    #5
    kenmm
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,698 ✭✭✭kenmm


    I understand why people are tempted by this - the rules are somewhat penalising pre-rent pressure zone landlords as new landlords to the market can get way more rent. However its really adding to the problem as you are sending more tenants into the marketplace again and increasing the prices.


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    #6
    DubCount
    Registered Users Posts: 1,089 ✭✭✭DubCount


    There are lots of facts that are unclear. Was the property renovated since the last letting? Was the LL living at the property and licensing space in the previous letting? Maybe the house was re-offered to previous tenants and you just dont know.

    Mostly though, I just wonder what the benefit of reporting to the RTB is? Outside of being an aid to the public good, you could be going through a lot of heartache for no gain.


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    #7
    kenmm
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,698 ✭✭✭kenmm


    ye - I realise this - but the apartment wasnt refurbished (not in the last 10 years). The tenants may have been reoffered and the landlord definitely wanst there as she stated she hadnt lived in it for years.

    I dont know if I can be arsed reporting it - but its pissing me off att eh same time.


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    #8
    December2012
    Registered Users Posts: 4,695 ✭✭✭December2012


    No obligation BUT you're about to be a tenant of a property (even if not this one). Wouldn't you like to limit this practice? Might be good to speak to the RTB.


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    #9
    antoinolachtnai
    Registered Users Posts: 9,792 ✭✭✭antoinolachtnai


    Who would you report this to?

    The RTB is not the apartment police.


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    #10
    Sleeper12
    Registered Users Posts: 17,069 ✭✭✭✭Sleeper12


    April 73 wrote:
    If they decided not to sell then they should have offered the property back to the original tenants too. €2200 is a very nice, rounded number alright. These people don’t even have the wit to make it look like they are playing by the rules.


    I mentioned this on another thread recently. A great many landlords in Dublin flout the law regarding the 4 percent increase. Most tenants are happy to go along with it as they have a roof over their head. This won't change till we have more accommodation. When we have more accommodation we won't have rent pressure zones. The rent pressure zones is an I'll thought out system.


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    #11
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    I thought you had to be the tenant/LL to bring a complaint to the RTB.

    Op, do you know for certain that the apartment wasn't offered back to the previous tenants?


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    #12
    Baby01032012
    Registered Users Posts: 1,622 ✭✭✭Baby01032012


    davo10 wrote: »
    I thought you had to be the tenant/LL to bring a complaint to the RTB.

    Op, do you know for certain that the apartment wasn't offered back to the previous tenants?

    Could open a third party case. Could have been offered back and rejected. Even if the sale was genuine and then changed mind it’s the fact that the increase since last tenancy has gone over 4% assuming the last tenancy was less than 2 years previous.

    Daft report Q2 said Dublin average rents up 14% in 12 months in a county where there’s a 4% rent cap. I know there’s some new developments however to have an average 14% you have to have a lot of landlords flouting the law or claiming substantial refurbishment.

    RPZ is not workable. Tenants don’t care as someone else will take it if they don’t. RTB don’t have resources to investigate individual cases.


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    #13
    utmbuilder
    Registered Users Posts: 471 ✭✭utmbuilder


    I don't see why one couldn't live there pay 2200 for 2 years then claim back the unlawful over charging through the rtb and have it enforced against the landlords home

    2 years at 600 over charing would be 14,400


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    #14
    Edgware
    Registered Users Posts: 5,874 ✭✭✭Edgware


    April 73 wrote: »
    If they decided not to sell then they should have offered the property back to the original tenants too.
    €2200 is a very nice, rounded number alright. These people don’t even have the wit to make it look like they are playing by the rules.
    Of course they arent but despute all the bluff from Murphy and Varadkar there is no official willingness to take on rogue landlords. Too much revenue to be got from high rents. Tenant pay 2000 a month. Tax man gets about 700 of that.


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    #15
    An_Toirpin
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 424 ✭✭An_Toirpin


    Edgware wrote: »
    April 73 wrote: »
    If they decided not to sell then they should have offered the property back to the original tenants too.
    €2200 is a very nice, rounded number alright. These people don’t even have the wit to make it look like they are playing by the rules.
    Of course they arent but despute all the bluff from Murphy and Varadkar there is no official willingness to take on rogue landlords. Too much revenue to be got from high rents. Tenant pay 2000 a month. Tax man gets about 700 of that.
    It is very tempting to accuse the Gov of not enforcing rules on the landlords but there is an invitably about landlods breaking the rules when landlords are being forced to charge below the market rate.


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    #16
    lcwill
    Registered Users Posts: 259 ✭✭lcwill


    An_Toirpin wrote: »
    It is very tempting to accuse the Gov of not enforcing the landlords but there is an invitably about it when landlords are being forced to charge below the market rate.

    I'm a landlord following the law and charging below market rates on properties in the Dublin RPZ. Or am I just an moralizing eejit giving up thousands of euros of potential income every year when it seems I would never be caught? Has anyone actually been prosecuted yet?


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    #17
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    Baby01032012 wrote: »
    Could open a third party case. Could have been offered back and rejected.

    Looking at the RTB site, third party disputes seem to be limited to neighbours living next door to tenants and relates to antisocial behaviour.


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    #18
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    utmbuilder wrote: »
    I don't see why one couldn't live there pay 2200 for 2 years then claim back the unlawful over charging through the rtb and have it enforced against the landlords home

    2 years at 600 over charing would be 14,400

    And if you are wrong/lose, that windfall you were counting on is gone, no reference and you are listed on the RTB site, what is now becoming th best database of tenants to avoid.


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    #19
    OneOfTheOnes
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭OneOfTheOnes


    davo10 wrote: »
    And if you are wrong/lose, that windfall you were counting on is gone, no reference and you are listed on the RTB site, what is now becoming th best database of tenants to avoid.

    What database is that? How can I view this? And how can I get myself removed if I’m on it?

    I checked there and couldn’t find anything obvious on their site about this.


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    #20
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 36,348 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    davo10 wrote: »
    And if you are wrong/lose, that windfall you were counting on is gone, no reference and you are listed on the RTB site, what is now becoming th best database of tenants to avoid.

    Be afraid! Don't pursue your rights!! Don't hold landlords to their obligations!!!


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    #21
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    OneOfTheOnes wrote: »
    What database is that? How can I view this? And how can I get myself removed if I’m on it?

    I checked there and couldn’t find anything obvious on their site about this.

    Check disputes for tenants name.


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    #22
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    LuckyLloyd wrote: »
    Be afraid! Don't pursue your rights!! Don't hold landlords to their obligations!!!

    True there is s civic duty to report wrongdoing, but you have to also consider that if 50 other people are trying to rent the same property as you, why would a landlord take the risk of renting to someone without a reference and a history of making complaints to the RTB? This is less about protecting/punishing the LL, and more about giving yourself the best chance of renting in future.

    In this case, the op isn't the tenant and doesn't know for certain what the situation is, it really would be risk with absolutely no reward for the op.


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    #23
    An_Toirpin
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 424 ✭✭An_Toirpin


    lcwill wrote: »
    An_Toirpin wrote: »
    It is very tempting to accuse the Gov of not enforcing the landlords but there is an invitably about it when landlords are being forced to charge below the market rate.

    I'm a landlord following the law and charging below market rates on properties in the Dublin RPZ. Or am I just an moralizing eejit giving up thousands of euros of potential income every year when it seems I would never be caught? Has anyone actually been prosecuted yet?
    Well you high light well the moral hazard created when unenforceable laws are created.


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