Constructive dismissal

Poor_old_gill

Hi All- I just want to run something by people and see am I wide of the mark or not.

In my current employment one of the senior managers has taken a real dislike to me and for reasons unbeknownst to myself. The person has continuously criticised my ability to do my job and my attitude- although my own senior manager recently gave me a promotion.

However the criticism was never done to my face or said to my own manager- it was a series of throw away comments made to people or just general b*tching about the way I conduct myself.

I'm not saying that I am not prone to days where I might be frustrated or wound up, like any worker, but the fact that all of this was done without any clear examples given (they have been requested) or without saying it directly to me- has led to me feeling really uncomfortable in my role.

I know of another manager whom I have no dealings with who has questioned my ability to do my job- not based on any first hand evidence but based on comments made by said senior manager.

This has been going on now for another of months and I have requested specific examples of changes that I could make but none have been pointed out.

I now really feel that i cant continue in my role and that I should leave asap as people whom I dont even work with have a negative opinion of my ability. I'm phenomenally anxious going into work most days and really feel like ringing in sick all the time.

My own senior manager has backed me 100% and I have a proven track record of delivering projects withing the company to back up my abilities, along with the necessary academics. However the general feedback that I have gotten when I have raised this issue is that- thats just the way it is and I'll have to try get on with it.

Wanderer2010

You absolutely wont get anywhere with constructive dismissal until you have exhausted every single avenue for official complaint, and have a record of all your correspondence from the moment you invoke the grievance procedure right up to and including steps taken by you to cooperate and work with your employer. Do you have a union rep? If so meet with them and tell them about your anxiety and you feel put down by this manager and lodge a complaint. I know its tough but its the only way you have to resolve this. Complaining and hoping it will work out just wont work out.
If you are not in a union, study your handbook and start the grievance procedure straight away. State your case calmly and explain how you feel with regards this one manager and that you have a proven track record with delivering quality work. That way if it does get really bad you have a paper trail to prove you tried to resolve the situation.
There is a very very heavy onus on the employee taking constructive dismissal to state they acted 100% reasonably and had no other option than to quit, as in, no other reasonable person could be expected to tolerate such working conditions.

davo10

Constructive Dismissal:

the changing of an employee's job or working conditions with the aim of forcing their resignation.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/unemployment_and_redundancy/dismissal/constructive_dismissal.html

Unlike unfair dismissal where the employer must prove that you were fairly dismissed, in constructive dismissal it is you that must prove that you were forced out. By what you described above, it looks like you are a long way short of meeting that threshold.

Poor_old_gill

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

You absolutely wont get anywhere with constructive dismissal until you have exhausted every single avenue for official complaint, and have a record of all your correspondence from the moment you invoke the grievance procedure right up to and including steps taken by you to cooperate and work with your employer. Do you have a union rep? If so meet with them and tell them about your anxiety and you feel put down by this manager and lodge a complaint. I know its tough but its the only way you have to resolve this. Complaining and hoping it will work out just wont work out.
If you are not in a union, study your handbook and start the grievance procedure straight away. State your case calmly and explain how you feel with regards this one manager and that you have a proven track record with delivering quality work. That way if it does get really bad you have a paper trail to prove you tried to resolve the situation.
There is a very very heavy onus on the employee taking constructive dismissal to state they acted 100% reasonably and had no other option than to quit, as in, no other reasonable person could be expected to tolerate such working conditions.

Thanks for this.

I've raised it with my manager already but will do so with my union rep also- cheers!

_Brian

I think your currently a million miles from constructive dismissal.. I mean youve been given a good appraisal and a promotion..


Now, to me its not far from bullying behaviour..


If it were me I'd approach it straight on..
Ask for a meeting with your manager and this other manager, make it professional and detail examples of the rubbish hes been talking.. I'd be askng what information he's basing his opinions on..
Have it out and try to put it behind ye, your getting on well with your direct manager which is really what counts...

Poor_old_gill

_Brian wrote: »

I think your currently a million miles from constructive dismissal.. I mean youve been given a good appraisal and a promotion..


Now, to me its not far from bullying behaviour..


If it were me I'd approach it straight on..
Ask for a meeting with your manager and this other manager, make it professional and detail examples of the rubbish hes been talking.. I'd be askng what information he's basing his opinions on..
Have it out and try to put it behind ye, your getting on well with your direct manager which is really what counts...

Thanks- its always good to get completely independent opinions when dealing with such an issue!

dreamers75

The OP is a form of bullying which would lead to constructive dismissal.

Not sure why someone would think any form of bullying isnt constructive dismissal?

At the moment you have options:

Official Complaint.
Meeting with those involved (take notes or bring a note taker) then official complaint.


The complaint is bullying and harassment causing anxiety and creating personal stress, your current relationship with direct boss needs to be looked only in official documents (ie Performance reviews, promotions etc) If this gets nasty he will be instructed how to behave, be aware of that.

If none of those are completed to a satisfactory result (in your opinion) ie it still continues.

Leave and you will be reimbursed for time spent unemployed and possible bonus payment for the company allowing bullying and harassment in the workplace.

davo10

dreamers75 wrote: »

The OP is a form of bullying which would lead to constructive dismissal.

Not sure why someone would think any form of bullying isnt constructive dismissal?

At the moment you have options:

Official Complaint.
Meeting with those involved (take notes or bring a note taker) then official complaint.


The complaint is bullying and harassment causing anxiety and creating personal stress, your current relationship with direct boss needs to be looked only in official documents (ie Performance reviews, promotions etc) If this gets nasty he will be instructed how to behave, be aware of that.

If none of those are completed to a satisfactory result (in your opinion) ie it still continues.

Leave and you will be reimbursed for time spent unemployed and possible bonus payment for the company allowing bullying and harassment in the workplace.

Bullying and constructive dismissal are two completely seperate issues and definitions. Bullying can be a method used to force someone to leave, but they are not the same thing.

How you are getting bullying and harassment from the op is beyond me, the op said the manager has said nothing to her, nor her manager so this would appear to be third hand information.

Leave and the op has to prove she was constructively dismissed, no easy thing to do seen as the manager has never actually said anything to her face to face.

Lastly, the bar on this type of situation was raised considerably in a court judgement last year, so the op is by no means garanteed a payout as you suggested.

https://www.matheson.com/news-and-insights/article/supreme-court-decision-in-ruffley

Op, how has your job or working conditions changed and are you being forced to leave?

OMM 0000

This also doesn't sound like constructive dismissal at all to me.

It just sounds like real life.

There will always be people in the office who don't like you. There will also be people who say mean things behind your back.

My advice to you is to toughen up. I mean that in a kind way.

_Brian

OMM 0000 wrote: »

This also doesn't sound like constructive dismissal at all to me.

It just sounds like real life.

There will always be people in the office who don't like you. There will also be people who say mean things behind your back.

My advice to you is to toughen up. I mean that in a kind way.

If it were a co worker I’d say the same, but this is another manager who obviously holds some influence in the company - my inclination would be confront it on a “let me help you see the truth” way rather than “ I think this is going to become a construct dismissal case” sort of way.

OMM 0000

_Brian wrote: »

If it were a co worker I’d say the same, but this is another manager who obviously holds some influence in the company - my inclination would be confront it on a “let me help you see the truth” way rather than “ I think this is going to become a construct dismissal case” sort of way.

The thing is, it's all second hand information.

For all we know it's some asshole on her team exaggerating it for drama purposes.

She's being promoted and her manager is fully supporting her... so it sounds like she's doing fine.

Edit to say: I think the solution to this problem is developing a thicker skin. The reality is the OP might experience this again in her next job. There are always going to be people we don't get along with, or people who dislike us for some reason, or simply someone unpleasant who is unhappy and decides to take it out on us or those around us.