Do you say prayers?

Malayalam

valoren wrote: »

If ever I am out and about. Walking or driving alone. I sometimes recite the poem Invictus in my head.
It's a prayer I guess in so far as one line states "I thank whatever gods may be for my unconquerable soul..."
That it doesn't refer to a specific God makes it the perfect line. A higher power? Perhaps but it doesn't matter. I am unconquerable

That's lovely. It's a great poem. I use Vedic mantras when walking sometimes, or stuck in a queue, or by the sea, just because I learned them quite young and they have come to feel uplifting, soothing, powerful. I think chanting , including inwardly, of various kinds, poetry, prayers, meaningful sounds, goes back very deep in our species and our psyches. Like music. We are sonorous beings.

ToddyDoody

Silent prayers we're talking about I take it. The best ones by far - the before and after communion.

Sardine

Bootlegger wrote: »

Just wait for the fedora tippers to arrive..

I do pray and I believe it is a positive thing. Glad my edgy atheist phase didn't last past my teen years. Feels great to reembrace the faith of my ancestors

Lost for words at how annoying this post is. Some of us don’t believe in god, the only people who thinks we’re edgy is people like you. It may have been edgy to not believe in god in the 1600s but I don’t know anyone who believes in god right now.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Liars!

Every one prays.

"Please God, don't let those basrstds win - their fans are insufferable enough as it is."

Dear God, please let the traffic be light, I've already been late twice this week."

"My God, she can't be pregnant. Please don't let her be pregnant...."

Sardine

Using blasphemous language is hardly praying

Lorelli!

Went through a religious phase when I was around 9 or 10 despite my parents not being religious at all. It was good for me at the time. Use to get up on a Sunday morning, watch Planet of the Apes TV series, go to mass and pick up the paper for my dad on the way home.

I started saying prayers every night around that time. I stopped going to mass after a year or two but I always said my prayers every night up until I was around 15. I'm an agnostic but I still say the odd prayer just in case!

Hotblack Desiato

Sweetemotion wrote: »

Anyone who says they don't pray when the **** hits the fan is a liar.

Bullsh!t.

KevinCavan wrote: »

I hope everybody here denouncing prayer who has kids, doesn’t send them to a Catholic school, that would be hypocritical.:-)

You make it sound as if they have a choice.

The schools often try to make it as difficult as possible to opt your child out of religion, which is nothing else but pure cúntish behaviour. There is a constitutional right to opt your child out of religion. So then they make "English" stories about Jesus. "Art" draw a religious picture. Etc. Or if they do let your child opt out, they have to sit in the classroom and not do any useful work, or else be taken out of the school by a parent and who the hell is willing or able to do that.

morrf

If i thought it would get me a hill ticket for sunday i would be willing to give it a go !

arybvtcw0eolkf

Sweetemotion wrote: »

Anyone who says they don't pray when the **** hits the fan is a liar.

I've been in conflict, didn't pray.

My daughter who is only 23 had a cardiac arrest last Feb 14th, Valentines Day. It came as a result of internal blood loss.

Honestly I didn't pray, and from that day on I knew I'd never ever say a prayer or anything ridiculous like it to a God.

I'm a total disbeliever, but I don't mind that some people have a deep faith.

I see a comparison between my Judo training and someone going to mass.. If someone goes to mass on a Sunday, says a few prayers or whatever you do there and it makes them feel good for the week then BRILLIANT. Fantastic, that's what its for (IMO).

I go to Judo or BJJ training a few nights of the week.

I put on a silly pair of pyjama's and tie the coat together with a black belt.

Then I bow onto the mat and for the next 90 minutes I'll use Japanese to demonstrate every technique. Afterwards I'll bow off the mat and out of the Dojo and that makes me feel great for the rest of the week.

Different rituals, same effect ~ ie we both feel good.

But f*ck this God sh*t.

Sardine

Madalyn Hissing Ammonia wrote: »

I've been in conflict, didn't pray.

My daughter who is only 23 had a cardiac arrest last Feb 14th, Valentines Day. It came as a result of internal blood loss.

Honestly I didn't pray, and from that day on I knew I'd never ever say a prayer or anything ridiculous like it to a God.

I'm a total disbeliever, but I don't mind that some people have a deep faith.

I see a comparison between my Judo training and someone going to mass.. If someone goes to mass on a Sunday, says a few prayers or whatever you do there and it makes them feel good for the week then BRILLIANT. Fantastic, that's what its for (IMO).

I go to Judo or BJJ training a few nights of the week.

I put on a silly pair of pyjama's and tie the coat together with a black belt.

Then I bow onto the mat and for the next 90 minutes I'll use Japanese to demonstrate every technique. Afterwards I'll bow off the mat and out of the Dojo and that makes me feel great for the rest of the week.

Different rituals, same effect ~ ie we both feel good.

But f*ck this God sh*t.

Ooooh you’re so edgy. Or something.

seamus

At best it's a form of meditation that allows people to gather their thoughts and box-off concerns that might otherwise be washing around in their head.

I understand that disconnecting and not thinking about things that are bothering you, is difficult for some people. So it's understandable that they will use whatever coping mechanism works for them.

As a way of actually effecting change to anything but yourself though, of course prayer does nothing.

Zubeneschamali

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

I've no problem with people who believe in anything or nothing, but when they don't follow through on their convictions, I get a tad annoyed.

My convictions say prayers are just poetry, I can recite loads of it. Have never been struck by lightning for it, seems mostly harmless.

My kids go to religious schools because they are the best local schools. I don't see how my convictions should oblige me to send them to the local tech (which also mandates Religious Education because ???).

arybvtcw0eolkf

KevinCavan wrote: »

I hope everybody here denouncing prayer who has kids, doesn’t send them to a Catholic school, that would be hypocritical.:-)

I don't know how things are now, but when I started a family I had no choice but to baptize my children in order to send them to our local schools.

My children are 23 and 26.

Loveinapril

My siblings and I range from 30- 42 years of age and I am so thankful that my parents chose not to christen us. It was definitely outside of the norm in north Dublin at that time. I don't pray because I don't have anything to aim it at- I don't believe in a god.

I also think it's pretty ridiculous for some posters to refer to atheist/ agnostic posters as 'edgy' for their choices not to pray/ believe in gods.

.......

I am the ultimate in edgy.

I not only do not say prayers.

I DO wish on stars.

Sardine

....... wrote: »

I am the ultimate in edgy.

I not only do not say prayers.

I DO wish on stars.

Edgy alert - there’s as much chance of the stars dictating our faith as imaginary Gods. I wish on shooting stars alright.

Grayson

Sardine wrote: »

Edgy alert - there’s as much chance of the stars dictating our faith as imaginary Gods. I wish on shooting stars alright.

It brought to mind the Dara O'Brian bit. Astrology, it's less accurate than racism.

Sardine

Grayson wrote: »

It brought to mind the Dara O'Brian bit. Astrology, it's less accurate than racism.

I don’t get it?

Zubeneschamali

Loveinapril wrote: »

I also think it's pretty ridiculous for some posters to refer to atheist/ agnostic posters as 'edgy' for their choices not to pray/ believe in gods.

I think this edgy atheist thing comes mostly from the states where so many people are unbelievably religious by Irish standards, with creationists, bible literalists, and fundamentalists of all sorts.

See the likes of Richard Dawkins who was just an ordinary atheist boffin type until he became popular in the more polarised American religious environment and turned into an arse.

Sardine

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

I think this edgy atheist thing comes mostly from the states where so many people are unbelievably religious by Irish standards, with creationists, bible literalists, and fundamentalists of all sorts.

See the likes of Richard Dawkins who was just an ordinary atheist boffin type until he became popular in the more polarised American religious environment and turned into an arse.

I could never understand how RD get so popular from just stating the blindly obvious

Grayson

Sardine wrote: »

I don’t get it?

The wishing upon a star reminded me of astrology.

.......

Sardine wrote: »

I could never understand how RD get so popular from just stating the blindly obvious

Its because he is Religiously Atheist, i.e., he tries to spread the word of Atheism and convert the unbelievers.

Most normal atheists arent at that carry on.

Verity.

AMKC wrote: »

The reason I am asking this is the parents had a prayer that is supposed to help cure illness. I was waiting for bus home and they were passing and picked me up. Said there is a prayer you should say. I looked at it but did not say it. I said I would not say it as I do not believe in it so there was no point in me saying it. I do not say prayers. Have never believed in any of that. I just see it as a way for the church to brainwash people.

When you're done making sure everyone knows how non-religious you are, perhaps you might see your parents side of the coin. You are so busy being offended by this prayer card all the while ignoring the simple kindness behind it.

They must be practicing Catholics? While it would mean nothing to you to receive a small gift like that, it would probably mean a great deal for them to receive something like that in their hour of need. It wasn't given to you to shove religion down your neck, to them they were trying to give you hope. If you don't pray, then be honest with them. Just don't be unkind or disrespectful about it. You can believe whatever you wish without going off into a rant about it, and making a mockery of their faith.

I am not old but I am not young either am in the middle age wise. I love my parents and they did try to get us to go to church when were young me and my other siblings that is but I would avoid it when I could.

Parents of other faiths raise their children in their own faith, your parents were no different.

Whats about other board'ies?
What is your say on it?

I'd be delighted with a gift like that. Regardless of whether you pray or not, it is a heartfelt gift from someone who cares deeply about you.

Hotblack Desiato

Foisting religion on other people is not kindness.

seamus

Sardine wrote: »

I could never understand how RD get so popular from just stating the blindly obvious

Because in Christianity and Islam, you're not permitted to question the faith. The very basis of it is "believe or be punished". So the adherents...uh...adhere to that and punish people who would dare question the belief. Even Theology as an academic pursuit, doesn't go down the rabbit hole - it starts from the assumption that God exists and then explores the nature of that.

So, for much of the Christian world, Dawkins presented something of a taboo viewpoint. Something which many people probably identified with, but wouldn't dare explore it, for fear of being shamed - either by your own sense of personal guilt, or by your community. A book though, allows you to explore it from someone else's point of view. And you can do it privately, you don't have to openly talk about it, even with yourself.

His writing is compelling, tbh. But his success more a "right place, right time" one. 30 years sooner and he'd never have been published. 30 years later and he'd be old hat.

And now he is old hat. He's reduced to being the conservative media's equivalent of Katie Hopkins - the resident troll they wheel out when ratings are flagging.

RiderOnTheStorm

Does God believe in atheists?

Pherekydes

RiderOnTheStorm wrote: »

Does God believe in atheists?

Ask her.

We'll wait...

RiderOnTheStorm

RiderOnTheStorm wrote:

Does God believe in atheists?

....He doesnt.

riffmongous

Even Conan prayed to Crom, before the Battle of the Mounds

I used to say prayers when I was a child but it was because I was told that it was the right thing to do. Growing up there was a lot of 'say your prayers Persepoly and everything will be ok'. But I never believed that.

I see the strength and comfort prayer gives to so many people. In the nursing home where my mam is religion plays a big part in many of the residents lives. They look forward to mass on a Sunday, to visits from the priest, to sitting with their rosary beads, and of course the Pope visit was on the tv in every ward.

It's not just among the elderly I see it but people who are going through tough times and the meaning that having a God to talk to gives them.
The older I get the more I find myself thinking that if only I had that faith then maybe death wouldn't terrify me and in the dark times there would be a kind of spiritual grounding for me. There isn't though and I can't force it.

JohnnyFlash

I read a great article a few years back about this physiological theory that was/is emerging among leaders in the field of that science. It was to do with the 'God Hole'. A society that has pretty much dismissed religion and a belief in a higher power, yet still yearns for something deeper. People are filling their lives with consumerism, idealised portrayals of themselves on social media, the pursuit of the perfect body, and the idea of living forever. Eat this diet, follow this influencer, think this way, be happy.

But people aren't getting happier. Suicide, anti-depressant use, drug addiction, self-harm, body dysphoria are all on the rise. Spirituality is seen as a really archaic concept in this world. And like it doesn't have to mean believing in Jesus, or storming the gates of Jerusalem, or sitting down to pray every evening. Meditation, lying down on a blanket and staring at the stars, sitting in a church and thinking - all very healthy pursuits that take us away from this concept of the immediate, and the world revolving around ourselves.

branie2

At Mass, or when someone dies

RabbleRouser2k

Verity. wrote: »

When you're done making sure everyone knows how non-religious you are, perhaps you might see your parents side of the coin. You are so busy being offended by this prayer card all the while ignoring the simple kindness behind it.

I'd be delighted with a gift like that. Regardless of whether you pray or not, it is a heartfelt gift from someone who cares deeply about you.

I remember strict Atheist Penn Jillette (raised atheist, no religion ever in his life) spoke about losing his mother, and one of the things a fan of his presented him with was a mass card/ prayer book for his mother. He very much took it with pride and kindness, as it wasn't a 'convert him in time of loss' but rather 'sorry for your loss, thinking of you at this difficult time'.
There was respect between both of them.

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

I read a great article a few years back about this physiological theory that was/is emerging among leaders in the field of that science. It was to do with the 'God Hole'. A society that has pretty much dismissed religion and a belief in a higher power, yet still yearns for something deeper. People are filling their lives with consumerism, idealised portrayals of themselves on social media, the pursuit of the perfect body, and the idea of living forever. Eat this diet, follow this influencer, think this way, be happy.

But people aren't getting happier. Suicide, anti-depressant use, drug addiction, self-harm, body dysphoria are all on the rise. Spirituality is seen as a really archaic concept in this world. And like it doesn't have to mean believing in Jesus, or storming the gates of Jerusalem, or sitting down to pray every evening. Meditation, lying down on a blanket and staring at the stars, sitting in a church and thinking - all very healthy pursuits that take us away from this concept of the immediate, and the world revolving around ourselves.

This is an interesting post, for sure. I know Sam Harris has spoken about non-belief and spirituality. That being 'spiritual' doesn't mean belief, it means being fulfilled. Not having the 'God Hole' where you're trying to fill it in with something.
I imagine there's been a greater definition of 'success' in the last 50 years. Some time around the 70s and 80s, even prior to that, it was 'work hard, get a job, get married'-simple tasks, simple fulfillment.

Now it's 'you can have it all'...yet you really can't. You have to sacrifice something, same as our forefathers and foremothers.
PEople see the success, they don't see the sacrifices. Hence we have reality tv shows, music competitions and so on-easy fame, skipping the hardships in order to get a brief 'making lots of money' moment.

Plus there is, sadly, the over comparison to Social media, as you said.

thebull85

Id be willing to bet most people here, myself included will be praying to god when they're in agony on their deathbed.

FishOnABike

KevinCavan wrote: »

I hope everybody here denouncing prayer who has kids, doesn’t send them to a Catholic school, that would be hypocritical.:-)

Only if the children are sent to a Catholic school specifically to get a Catholic education. If it's the only school in the area it's just a pragmatic compromise. They can be sent to a Catholic (or other faith based) school but opt out of religious instruction.

Zubeneschamali

thebull85 wrote: »

Id be willing to bet most people here, myself included will be praying to god when they're in agony on their deathbed.

Funny how you assume we know which god you are talking about.

Malayalam

Deleted User wrote: »

The older I get the more I find myself thinking that if only I had that faith then maybe death wouldn't terrify me and in the dark times there would be a kind of spiritual grounding for me. There isn't though and I can't force it.

Maybe it might be because the concept of ''God'' we inherited from our childhoods is so small and almost childlike, as we see it nowadays in various religions. God seems like an all-too-human politicised figure, trapped within human institutions.
Maybe reading something like The Upanishads or The Tao Teh Ching might open up an idea of an infinite unknowable, which is supposed to be at the heart of prayer. At the very least there is beauty and poetry there.
It can be harder to find the metaphysical closer to home, in Catholicism for example, though I do believe it is there from conversations I have with a friend who is both a devout Catholic and a learned philosopher. But in the western area the Nag Hammadi texts are interesting - much broader in aspect than the familiar Gospels, which I feel were significantly manipulated/edited by people, like Irenaeus for example. The Nag Hammadi came suddenly out of the ground in modern times and took a while to translate and are much different in tone than the Gospels and could not be edited before public consumption. The Thunder, Perfect Mind or the Thought of Norea - there's two (for example) that expand the idea of ''God'' that we have inherited from childhood. Especially the first mentioned. But there are many.

I also think star gazing expands everything! maybe better than anything.

Various Hermetic texts are good also, think of Alexandria in Egypt 2000 years ago when great thinkers in all sciences including metaphysics from all over the world converged and debated and shared ideas - well, I find that somehow inspiring, haha. Pity we have no modern Alexandria. We are kind of narrow minded in so many ways though we imagine it is the opposite.
Also, closer to home, I have listened to lectures about an Irishman called Johannes Scotus Erigenua - he was a 9th century mystic, philosopher, theologian and neo-Platonist - ''All that is, is light,'' he said.
These lesser known takes on ''religion'' can be so wholly different from the often moralistic, narrow rulebooks that we were taught. Child like faith is good in its way but if one is intellectual or questing it may not be sufficient.
There is also metaphysics and deep prayer in the complete absence of belief, of faith, of structures, of hope - in the great Void.

Guy:Incognito

Giving someone you know isn't religious and has absolutely no interest in it a mass card for your particular religion strikes me as a self serving thing to do at the core of it.

Like some sort of hope of "converting" them. Or that you don't have much interest in actually helping but want to be seen to do something (again, for who's benefit?). If you actually cared, would you not put the effort in and get them something that you think might actually comfort or help them?

Personally, Id rather people stuck a fiver in an envelope for me or something, like a birthday. I'd get use out of that at least.


People pray because they were conditioned too. If you'd never heard of religion and fell off a cliff, do you think you're default line would be "please help me god"?

As for praying being a good think to take time out of your day to reflect? Yeah, fine if you really believe in religion, but at the end of the day is no more effective or better or worse than taking the same time out to do anything else. In fact, if instead of praying, you spent the reflecting time thinking about the things in your life you want to change to make it better, you'd probably be better off anyway.

It all comes back to religion not actually being in any way necessary for me. Anything organised religion does, can be done by individuals or groups anyway, without the need for a layer of "god" or any associated costs or the restrictions imposed on going about life, for no reason.

chakotha

I am agnostic/atheist but I will sometimes mumble a Nicheren Buddhism chant nam-myoho-renge-kyo several times to my self when hoping for a good outcome to something imminent.

Giraffe Box

Malayalam wrote: »

Maybe it might be because the concept of ''God'' we inherited from our childhoods is so small and almost childlike, as we see it nowadays in various religions. God seems like an all-too-human politicised figure, trapped within human institutions.
Maybe reading something like The Upanishads or The Tao Teh Ching might open up an idea of an infinite unknowable, which is supposed to be at the heart of prayer. At the very least there is beauty and poetry there.
It can be harder to find the metaphysical closer to home, in Catholicism for example, though I do believe it is there from conversations I have with a friend who is both a devout Catholic and a learned philosopher. But in the western area the Nag Hammadi texts are interesting - much broader in aspect than the familiar Gospels, which I feel were significantly manipulated/edited by people, like Irenaeus for example. The Nag Hammadi came suddenly out of the ground in modern times and took a while to translate and are much different in tone than the Gospels and could not be edited before public consumption. The Thunder, Perfect Mind or the Thought of Norea - there's two (for example) that expand the idea of ''God'' that we have inherited from childhood. Especially the first mentioned. But there are many.

I also think star gazing expands everything! maybe better than anything.

Various Hermetic texts are good also, think of Alexandria in Egypt 2000 years ago when great thinkers in all sciences including metaphysics from all over the world converged and debated and shared ideas - well, I find that somehow inspiring, haha. Pity we have no modern Alexandria. We are kind of narrow minded in so many ways though we imagine it is the opposite.
Also, closer to home, I have listened to lectures about an Irishman called Johannes Scotus Erigenua - he was a 9th century mystic, philosopher, theologian and neo-Platonist - ''All that is, is light,'' he said.
These lesser known takes on ''religion'' can be so wholly different from the often moralistic, narrow rulebooks that we were taught. Child like faith is good in its way but if one is intellectual or questing it may not be sufficient.
There is also metaphysics and deep prayer in the complete absence of belief, of faith, of structures, of hope - in the great Void.

You posted the above at 8.38 this morning?
That's fierce strong coffee you're drinking!!!

Malayalam

Giraffe Box wrote: »

You posted the above at 8.38 this morning?
That's fierce strong coffee you're drinking!!!

Haha. unfortunately I am caffeine intolerant though good coffee is one of my favourite smells. I get up very early.

Hotblack Desiato

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

I remember strict Atheist Penn Jillette (raised atheist, no religion ever in his life) spoke about losing his mother, and one of the things a fan of his presented him with was a mass card/ prayer book for his mother. He very much took it with pride and kindness, as it wasn't a 'convert him in time of loss' but rather 'sorry for your loss, thinking of you at this difficult time'.
There was respect between both of them.

It's a lot easier to regard religion as benign when your upbringing completely insulated you from all of its harmful effects.

gormdubhgorm

morrf wrote: »

If i thought it would get me a hill ticket for sunday i would be willing to give it a go !

If there is someone above he is not a Mayoman that's for sure!

I often wonder what part of Dublin God is from :rolleyes:

But then I think sure isn't that silly talk God walks among us.
He is from Clondalkin.
Played for Round Towers




There is no need to pray when you can trust in 'the process'.
After Sunday O'Connell street should be renamed Gavin Street.

RabbleRouser2k

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

If there is someone above he is not a Mayoman that's for sure!

I often wonder what part of Dublin God is from :rolleyes:

There is no need to pray when you can trust in 'the process'.
After Sunday O'Connell street should be renamed Gavin Street.

Any chance you can discuss the subject matter without trolling?

Grayson

Malayalam wrote: »

Haha. unfortunately I am caffeine intolerant though good coffee is one of my favourite smells. I get up very early.

jesus. That makes me want to pray for you.

Malayalam

Grayson wrote: »

jesus. That makes me want to pray for you.

''Yea, God, that they may one day take the Tae...even though, Oh Lord, the demons shake and rend their very souls, make they take the tae in peace, Amen.''

FishOnABike

thebull85 wrote: »

Id be willing to bet most people here, myself included will be praying to god when they're in agony on their deathbed.

I'd be asking my medical team for more (and more) painkillers until I slipped oblivious into the oblivion.

thebull85

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Funny how you assume we know which god you are talking about.

What's funny about it? When i see people on here talking about god i assume its the god the majority of us here learned about in school.

Explain please..

gormdubhgorm

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

Any chance you can discuss the subject matter without trolling?

I am not trolling and I resent the implication, or maybe you are just living up to your username?
Someone should pray for you!

Hotblack Desiato

Malayalam wrote: »

''Yea, God, that they may one day take the Tae...even though, Oh Lord, the demons shake and rend their very souls, make they take the tae in peace, Amen.''

Lidl Fallons decaf tea is good. Just sayin'