City Councillors embarrassed by tent city.

pwurple

Builders and tradespeople went bust from not being paid. Developers are vilified. Landlords are the devil himself apparently. They Can't even claim the interest on a loan as a business expense. The only sector in our country singled out for that bizaar penalty.

All are providers of the stock we need to reduce a shortage.

Is it a hangover from colonialism that we haven't gotten over yet? Anyone who provides housing is a scourge, and we actively discourage building or providing units for rent.

Shock, horror and outrage ensues when the housing dries up.

I'd be perfectly happy to provide a small amount of social housing, for the unhousables.... but god almighty, when the cap on income level to qualify is set at 50k... Why would anyone buy their own?

EdgeCase

The biggest issue here is lack of supply.
Government policy should be about managing a sustainable housing sector that can provide affordable homes.

When housing is too expensive you get a fall in disposable income as most of it going on providing a roof over your head and those on low and moderate income end up in unstable accommodation situations and basically housing poverty and homelessness.

Not only that but it's adding risks to the economy by putting households into unsustainable borrowing.

We need a major rethink as what we have at the moment isn't capable of delivering the housing stock we need and the private landlords sector shouldn't be getting used as a way of providing social housing via subsidies. It's extremely has value for money.

The Irish banks are also still dysfunctional and have gone from own extreme to the other. Throwing money at people a few years ago to being very tightfisted now as they try to undo their financial bust of the pre 2008 era.

Ireland's got ebbs and flows of population due to emigration and immigration and seems to have a boom bust economic cycle.

We need to have a steady sustainable level of development and we also need to move to this single European banking system model to remove the risk and strangle hold of the "big 3 or big 4" or is it just the big 2 banks these days.

I don't think the government is really doing enough to resolve this. It's the same with the perpetual crisis that's been in healthcare here, through booms and busts. I don't remember any time, including during our loads of money era, when Irish healthcare wasn't an absolute mess. Housing now looks like it's becoming a similar unsolvable problem.

JupiterKid

Completely agree wjth EdgeCase's points.

Ireland has an utterly dysfunctional housing system where we've moved from an essentially policy driven approach from the 1920s to the 1990s with a robust social housing sector to a laissez faire; free market approach where low income households are shunted into a distorted and dysfunctional private rented sector, proper strategic planning is non existent and there is no political will by Govt to remedy the situation.

Housing and wider economic policies by successive govts over the past 20 years are pro-cyclical in nature and are damaging our economic competitiveness greatly.

Housing is a very complex, nuanced issue. It's depressing the utterly simplistic, mean spirited "I'm all right Jack" attitude spouted online. When your children can't afford to rent anywhere or move out will you still feel the same way?

the beer revolu

the_syco wrote: »

The homeless charities help the homeless who want to be helped. Help those who abide by the rules.

Why would you give a house to someone who can't not drink so that they'd get a bed in a homeless hostel? The house would be thrashed in a matter of days!

You quoted me and then said the above.
My comment was in response to someone who was suggesting that as there are lots of vacant houses in Ireland that the only reason people are homeless is because they have refused accommodation in their location of choice.

I was stating that this is not the case.

Would you care to point out where I said that every homeless person should be given the keys to a vacant house?

EdgeCase

JupiterKid: It's being driven by what has become an Irish dream of paper wealth. There's a cohort of people who bought property during those more sane housing market days, when it was either affordable or when mortgages were being whittled away by enormous levels of inflation.

One half of society seems to be pulling the ladder up on the other half. You've a lot of people who feel quite happy with the notional value of their now seriously expensive homes that were once modestly priced and many of those people are quite ok with the idea of housing being used as a speculative asset class as they're benefiting from it enormously.

The problem is that the policies that inflate the value of an unexciting, normal, utilitarian home in the suburbs to the guts of €1 million, create miserable conditions for younger generations and those who can't ever hope to achieve the living standards that their parents had.

Couple that with poor planning and you've got a whole generation who are being forced into either substandard accommodation or insanely long commutes on clogged motorways and there's no political vision to even put in proper transit networks.

There's a major problem here with failing to see that and I think if they don't resolve it fairly soon, you are looking at political chaos ahead as people start to turn towards different political outlets.

FG and FF need to figure out that the demographic they appeal to is getting older and a younger demographic will end up voting elsewhere if it's not addressed.

Ireland's potentially bottling up a major political problem for a decade or so's time if they don't start resolving these issues. There's a strong argument to show how it's precisely these kinds of policies and lack of concern for the middle class / working class that have destabilised other countries and seen a rise of populism as they lash out against what is perceived as an establishment that's against them.

I'm not saying that they've voted for very sensible or reasonable alternatives in many cases, but if you fail to connect with the voters, that's the kind of thing that can happen and I am very worried that this is where FG/FF or general status quo politics in Ireland is headed.

A housing crisis and a healthcare crisis is already beyond just a crisis. It's now normalised and has become something the political establishment is just treating as something that's acceptable.

If the major parties here don't respond, they will only have themselves to blame when the demographics go against them in a decade or so.

j8wk2feszrnpao

City Council maybe too busy enjoying Sn Francisco to be embarrassed.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/cork-city-councils-50k-san-francisco-trip-bill-867644.html
I understand the twinned concept and the visiting delegation stuff. Taking you partner along on the free trip, subsistence of €133 for each day; just taking the p!ss.

whisky_galore

munstermagic11 wrote: »

City Council maybe too busy enjoying Sn Francisco to be embarrassed.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/cork-city-councils-50k-san-francisco-trip-bill-867644.html
I understand the twinned concept and the visiting delegation stuff. Taking you partner along on the free trip, subsistence of €133 for each day; just taking the p!ss.

Plenty money to pay for junkets for golden circles and pointless bridges. The boom is back baby.

who_me

whisky_galore wrote: »

Plenty money to pay for junkets for golden circles and pointless bridges. The boom is back baby.

Funnily enough, the bridge is right next to the 'tent city'. They'll probably be moved once it opens, to avoid spoiling the photos!

Two of the tent folk in The Examiner on Saturday ......... "I just want a house/flat of my own" very much the gist of the story.

One of them lost their last home/house after going into services for addiction......... bit of a story there I imagine. Her fiance shares the tent with her.

The other is 24, homeless since 17 and just wants a house so his infant child can come and stay with him at the weekends. I imagine an effectively single male at 24 is low enough down the housing list priority wise. There was no mention of a partner but presumably the child is with the mother.

Simon claim the tent folk aren't accepting their assistance, the tent folk deny this and say "there's no beds over there for me/us" .

I suspect a reluctance to accept a Simon bed......... generally when one toes the line in that sort of accommodation there are further options available once you engage with the relevant depts ..........it's no doubt worth a try to jump the queue and plead for a house publicly especially if you reckon it will be challenging to toe the line in the Simon shelter etc due to whatever issues you have and the other folk in there.

the beer revolu

Augeo wrote: »

Simon claim the tent folk aren't accepting their assistance, the tent folk deny this and say "there's no beds over there for me/us" .

I suspect a reluctance to accept a Simon bed......... generally when one toes the line in that sort of accommodation there are further options available once you engage with the relevant depts ..........it's no doubt worth a try to jump the queue and plead for a house publicly especially if you reckon it will be challenging to toe the line in the Simon shelter etc due to whatever issues you have and the other folk in there.

I believe that a lot of homeless people are genuinely afraid of homeless shelters and the carry on that goes on in them and feel safer sleeping on the streets.
I can kind of understand that.

That is of course valid.
However, if you effectively refuse to engage with Simon but you "I just want a house" and you have no cash, job or family support then you are not helping yourself.

Nerdlingr

GavRedKing wrote: »

I seen it the other day and I genuinely had to take a second look to make sure I wasn't seeing things.

They should have been moved on as soon as they started to put up the tents.

Towards the end the Monaghan road, just before where the old showgrounds were, theres a narrow, yet long stretch of grass land thats overgrown and full of rubbish, you can see between the trees there is a few tents where people have setup.

I suspect these are the same group that were down the Marina a few months ago and were moved on.

Pass by this every day too. Seems the tent is gone this morning...but all the sh*t is left behind.

Aglomerado

I drove past here this morning and it looked like someone set their duvets and blankets on fire, the items on the railing were badly scorched.

Bad form to do this to them whatever their circumstances.

who_me

the beer revolu wrote: »

I believe that a lot of homeless people are genuinely afraid of homeless shelters and the carry on that goes on in them and feel safer sleeping on the streets.
I can kind of understand that.

Heard that as well, lots of bullying and assaults.

There's one right across the river from 'Tentsville', and you see ambulances and/or Gardaí pulling up there very often at night.

the beer revolu

Augeo wrote: »

That is of course valid.
However, if you effectively refuse to engage with Simon but you "I just want a house" and you have no cash, job or family support then you are not helping yourself.

I've no argument with that.

GavRedKing

GavRedKing wrote: »

I seen it the other day and I genuinely had to take a second look to make sure I wasn't seeing things.

They should have been moved on as soon as they started to put up the tents.

Towards the end the Monaghan road, just before where the old showgrounds were, theres a narrow, yet long stretch of grass land thats overgrown and full of rubbish, you can see between the trees there is a few tents where people have setup.

I suspect these are the same group that were down the Marina a few months ago and were moved on.

Nerdlingr wrote: »

Pass by this every day too. Seems the tent is gone this morning...but all the sh*t is left behind.

Gardai were down here at lunch time with the sniffer dog and the council clearing this place up.

No idea why the dog was there, maybe looking for drugs or some such but it seems to be clean now.