Taoiseach refuses to meet murdered Donegal woman's family as she is "british"

It's beyond bizarre that somebody would freely choose to travel on a British passport, and then when something happens them their family want them to be deemed Irish. Sorry, but these choices matter. The person chose to define as British, so let that state represent their interests. After centuries of a British identify being imposed upon Irish people, holding an Irish passport is a very firm statement of Irishness.

I would never choose to travel on a British passport because I'm not British. British people travel on British passports; Irish people travel on Irish passports - it's sort of the point of those things. The idea of taking out a British passport would never even enter my head, no more than travelling on a French passport would. The wishes of that person are clearly best respected by accepting her choice of a British passport over an Irish passport. Similarly, if somebody from a Unionist background chooses an Irish passport, the government of Ireland should respect that choice and defend the interests of that person over any person from a nationalist background who chooses a British passport over an Irish passport. There's a lot to be said for consistency.

Grab All Association

Maybe the reason she traveled on a British passport vs her Irish passport was purely for visa/immigration reasons. Going to the press seems to have worked anyway and I hope she gets justice for her daughter.

EdgeCase

Amirani wrote: »

These details were already known. The British diplomats are already working on it.

Yes, but given that dual citizenship isn't unusual and is actually supported by the GFA and CTA in the case or the NI and UK-Irish relationships, it shouldn't have been a surprising situation. Not only that but you could easily have situations where an Irish citizen may hold several other citizenship(s).

Unless we have some narrow rule like those that exist in some European countries where you can only hold one citizenship at a time, then the state should expect to encounter situations like this!!

Irish citizens travel, move around and emigrate and immigrate a lot! It seems ludicrous to me that the state would have any difficulty understanding this, given Irish history!!

cursai

She was travelling as a British citizen. The taoiseach offices handles dozen of murder related requests a day. Why is this one to be handled different....because her poor mother wrote a letter asking for it?

EdgeCase

Dozens per day relating to Irish citizens murdered overseas? I would seriously doubt that.
Statistically speaking, it doesn't make sense as the total number of these cases is not remotely big enough to create dozens of letters per day.

Amirani

EdgeCase wrote: »

Yes, but given that dual citizenship isn't unusual and is actually supported by the GFA and CTA in the case or the NI and UK-Irish relationships, it shouldn't have been a surprising situation. Not only that but you could easily have situations where an Irish citizen may hold several other citizenship(s).

Unless we have some narrow rule like those that exist in some European countries where you can only hold one citizenship at a time, then the state should expect to encounter situations like this!!

Irish citizens travel, move around and emigrate and immigrate a lot! It seems ludicrous to me that the state would have any difficulty understanding this, given Irish history!!

None of this matters if India recognises her as a British Citizen and hence chooses to engages only with British diplomats. That's their sovereign right under international law and the GFA, CTA or any Irish designation is completely irrelevant. Ireland can't do anything in that scenario and nor should it try to really, it's appropriate to leave it to the British in this case.

Witchie

Glass fused light wrote: »

If she was not traveling as citizen of Ireland (on and Irish passport) and was killed outside of Ireland then unfortunately her family would have relied on the UK to provide consular assistance. As this was a response to an apparent complaint on how that assistance was provided then it is only reasonable that they were referred back to the government contact who could actually act on the correspondence.

I was living in that part of Goa at the time this happened and I helped Danielle's friends when they arrived from Australia to sort things out. I also liased a little with the Irish embassy and have to say that they were amazing. A high up rep from the embassy flew from Delhi to Goa to meet the girls and along with the British delegates they walked them through the red tape, gave them support and then got me to help organise transport and accommodation in the area.

From what I could see the both embassies stepped up to do all they could and I know her friends were very grateful.

But yes the Indian government are only obliged to deal with the British.

I think the letter was badly worded but I fail to see what meeting Leo can achieve. The guy in custody will more than likely be convicted and hung despite not being the only culprit but there doesn't seem to be a desire on the local police to charge the others involved.

It's a mess and from what I was told the accused actually kinda tried to stop it happening.

Deleted User wrote: »

It's beyond bizarre that somebody would freely choose to travel on a British passport, and then when something happens them their family want them to be deemed Irish. Sorry, but these choices matter. The person chose to define as British, so let that state represent their interests. After centuries of a British identify being imposed upon Irish people, holding an Irish passport is a very firm statement of Irishness.

I would never choose to travel on a British passport because I'm not British. British people travel on British passports; Irish people travel on Irish passports - it's sort of the point of those things. The idea of taking out a British passport would never even enter my head, no more than travelling on a French passport would. The wishes of that person are clearly best respected by accepting her choice of a British passport over an Irish passport. Similarly, if somebody from a Unionist background chooses an Irish passport, the government of Ireland should respect that choice and defend the interests of that person over any person from a nationalist background who chooses a British passport over an Irish passport. There's a lot to be said for consistency.

I was born in norn iron to a northern mother and a southern father and grew up south of the border. I currently travel on my Irish passport but when am home in a few weeks will be getting my British one. Why? Simple really. In some countries, like India, I can get a year long visa instead of a 6 month one on my Irish passport. Some countries, particularly Commonwealth ones look more favourably on the British one and also my Irish one shows were I fecked up on a visa so a clean one will be better!

My cousin who is first gen Irish American and married to a Turkish guy moved to Turkey just before the attempted coup. Both her and her hubby had their Irish passports ready to use to flee to Ireland through the Irish embassy if the pistachio hit the fan. I was glad they had that option coz traveling through a turbulent Turkey on American passports would have been too dangerous.

So I can see the value of having 2 even though a part of me dies anytime someone says am British. For me it's all about whatever makes my nomadic lifestyle easier at this point.

JupiterKid

Like witchie, I was born in the North but have never held a British passport. However my eldest sister did apply for one and got one as she was looking to emigrate in the mid 1990s to Canada, a Commonwealth country, and having a British passport made the process of residency (and eventually citizenship) much easier for her. I may add that my family would be from a "moderate" nationalist background

This thread sounds like it fell into the present from the 1970s. Also, Donegal may be in the Republic, but given the way they consistently vote on social issues they may as well be a part of the North.

Donegal is a very socially conservative county.

JustAThought

+1 to what the last 2 posters said.

But as an unpopular and only barely party elected taoiseach who barely gathred 50% of the party votes and whose flimsy government coelition took months to agree while the country had no government, this taoiseach who is using wanting to negotiate britexit as an excuse to try and stay in power and not call an election, had better take a long hard look at his 'trusted' staff and his own feeble competencies. As well as being a huge PR and compassion fail it also begs huge questions as to what he thinks he or his office could contribute that would add any substance, significance or solutions to Britexit.

And this from a man who in 2018 has gramted unlimited access and entrance to the Irish jobsmarket to Pakastani accountants. Makes you wonder.

As for Maura Duffy who wrote the letter she needs to take a good long look at herself and her values. Is basic human compassion such an abstract concept that she sees fit to write a primary school letter like this to a mother whose daughter was gang raped and murdered and dumped in wasteland. What kind of monsters are hiding behind desks and officiousness in Leinster house.

ted1

Grab All Association wrote: »

Maybe the reason she traveled on a British passport vs her Irish passport was purely for visa/immigration reasons. Going to the press seems to have worked anyway and I hope she gets justice for her daughter.

How will she get justice. You think a country with a population of over 1.2 bn care about a story in the Irish press