Breaky Bitcoin Blues

Samsong

Irish Kings wrote: »

Exactly, that was the point I was making, read what I posted.

Can you run it by me again please. Iv totally nissed your point.


Just fyi the vechain crypto currency is not a currency. It is a token system in where users of the block chain buy tokens to use it. Vethor. You wont be able to buy a coffee with vechain for example.

So you are going to totally ignore partnerships with some of the worlds biggest companies in their sectors who have at this stage have already began using vechains blockchain and in the case of Dnvgl actually bought 10% of the company?

Renault, Louis vutton , BYD ( Chinas highest volume selling ev vehicle manufacturer for 4 years in a row and the worlds highest for 3 years in a row) are just another few who have announced working partnerships with vechain.

There are also national level partnerships with the Chinese governments in process.

How you can disregard this even though it is fact and easily verifiable shows you are just here to make uninformed arguments.

JohnnyFlash

Donovan Shapely Adventurer wrote: »

Why are you so obsessed with dissing cryptocurrency and why do you want it to fall so badly? Its beyond idiotic.

The greater fool theory is fascinating.

Irish Kings

Samsong wrote: »

Can you run it by me again please. Iv totally nissed your point.


Just fyi the vechain crypto currency is not a currency. It is a token system in where users of the block chain buy tokens to use it. Vethor. You wont be able to buy a coffee with vechain for example.

So you are going to totally ignore partnerships with some of the worlds biggest companies in their sectors who have at this stage have already began using vechains blockchain and in the case of Dnvgl actually bought 10% of the company?

Renault, Louis vutton , BYD ( Chinas highest volume selling ev vehicle manufacturer for 4 years in a row and the worlds highest for 3 years in a row) are just another few who have announced working partnerships with vechain.

There are also national level partnerships with the Chinese governments in process.

How you can disregard this even though it is fact and easily verifiable shows you are just here to make uninformed arguments.

Yet again you didn't read what I posted.

Bitcoin IS NOT REQUIRED FOR ANY OF THIS.

Austria!

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Proof of Stake, Byzantine fault tolerance, least trust models have all been proposed. This stuff isn't new. Merkle Trees have been around since the 70's. The maths behind all this is very simple. It does not scale though.

Right now no one knows if it will scale. You're being unreasonably dismissive here unless you know things the developers don't.

Samsong

Irish Kings wrote: »

Yet again you didn't read what I posted.

Bitcoin IS NOT REQUIRED FOR ANY OF THIS.

No bitcoin is not required for this in future but at the minute it is the only thing that matters in crypto. We will hopefully soon see fiat pairings to other coins and the 99% of **** coins die off as we move away from the ridiculously volatile speculation stage.

By the end of 2019 vechains technology will be installed on at least half a million of byds EVs.

As part of Chinas "made in china 2025 plan the government have stated that 75% of the national fleet will be domestically produced electric vehicles. There are 300 million vehicles in china.

I copied and pasted this info on another Chinese partner:

D.I.G is a government-owned wine importer, responsible for over 30% of China’s wine imports. D.I.G. is owned by the Shanghai Waigaoqiao Free Trade Zone Development subsidiary and hopes to eventually become one of China’s biggest distribution channels for imported physical items.

An estimated 30,000 counterfeit wine bottles are sold every hour in China. VeChain will be tasked to authenticate and trace winery data from the producers, through the supply chain and eventually to the consumer using smart NFC chips in the wine bottles, to stop this counterfeiting market.

Irish Kings

Samsong wrote: »

No bitcoin is not required for this

you're starting to get it.

Samsong

Irish Kings wrote: »

you're starting to get it.

Yes i get it. I may have read it too quickly and started hammering the keyboard!
My bad. ill admit when im wrong. And i was

JohnnyFlash

Samsong wrote: »

No bitcoin is not required for this in future but at the minute it is the only thing that matters in crypto. We will hopefully soon see fiat pairings to other coins and the 99% of **** coins die off as we move away from the ridiculously volatile speculation stage.

By the end of 2019 vechains technology will be installed on at least half a million of byds EVs.

As part of Chinas "made in china 2025 plan the government have stated that 75% of the national fleet will be domestically produced electric vehicles. There are 300 million vehicles in china.

I copied and pasted this info on another Chinese partner:

D.I.G is a government-owned wine importer, responsible for over 30% of China’s wine imports. D.I.G. is owned by the Shanghai Waigaoqiao Free Trade Zone Development subsidiary and hopes to eventually become one of China’s biggest distribution channels for imported physical items.

An estimated 30,000 counterfeit wine bottles are sold every hour in China. VeChain will be tasked to authenticate and trace winery data from the producers, through the supply chain and eventually to the consumer using smart NFC chips in the wine bottles, to stop this counterfeiting market.

What’s a smart NFC chip? And do they propose putting one on every bottle? Lads, vechain is a scam.

Samsong

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

What’s a smart NFC chip? And do they propose putting one on every bottle? Lads, vechain is a scam.

https://vechaininsider-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/vechaininsider.com/partnerships/a-complete-list-of-vechain-partnerships/amp/?amp_js_v=a2&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQCCAE=#referrer=https://www.google.com&amp_tf=From %1$s&ampshare=https://vechaininsider.com/partnerships/a-complete-list-of-vechain-partnerships/


Put that up your jacksy

You know nothing about it yet you call all a scam. This is why you were banned from the other thread

Pintman Paddy Losty

Donovan Shapely Adventurer wrote: »

Why are you so obsessed with dissing cryptocurrency and why do you want it to fall so badly? Its beyond idiotic.

No lad. Buying magic crypto beans at the height of a bubble was idiotic. Insisting on holding them, despite deep down knowing they are worthless is idiotic. Silly decisions.

Woke Hogan

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

That does sound like classic behaviour of people who have bought into pyramid schemes. To get money back on their investment, they need others to buy into it. And don’t care whether those below them in the pyramid lose out. These schemes bring out the worst in human nature, truly.

That's exactly it and why I refuse to hold any sympathy for anyone who got burnt in this scam. It was a particularly toxic Ponzi scheme that was destroying the planet, and all of the pro-coin acolytes want to drag more victims into the cesspit with them.

Donovan Shapely Adventurer

Donovan Shapely Adventurer wrote: »

Holding now makes absolute sense imo. What’s the point in selling now when you have lost 2/3 of what you invested for example? If you sell now you definitely aren’t going to recoup anything whereas at least if you hold you have some chance if things do recover. I’d rather risk losing the bit that’s left rather than realise a big loss by selling.

If someone who's down decides that if they cashed out today, they'd buy the same amount of bitcoin tomorrow, then yeah, hold. Realistically though, many wouldn't go and buy it if they had the cash back in their hards.

There is simply to reason to imagine that bitcoin will go up in value, so all it is is a sunk cost fallacy.

Samsong

[Deleted User] wrote: »

If someone who's down decides that if they cashed out today, they'd buy the same amount of bitcoin tomorrow, then yeah, hold. Realistically though, many wouldn't go and buy it if they had the cash back in their hards.

There is simply to reason to imagine that bitcoin will go up in value, so all it is is a sunk cost fallacy.

If you think crypto is only about Bitcoin then you are not informed enough to be on here making bold statements.

JohnnyFlash

Samsong wrote: »

https://vechaininsider-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/vechaininsider.com/partnerships/a-complete-list-of-vechain-partnerships/amp/?amp_js_v=a2&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQCCAE=#referrer=https://www.google.com&amp_tf=From %1$s&ampshare=https://vechaininsider.com/partnerships/a-complete-list-of-vechain-partnerships/


Put that up your jacksy

You know nothing about it yet you call all a scam. This is why you were banned from the other thread

That link doesn’t work. Again, what is a smart NFC tag, and how does it work in verifying that a bottle of wine isn’t counterfeit? Mapping physical objects into a digital world is difficult. This is yet another example of applying the word blockchain to an end-point solution that doesn’t need it, raising hundreds of millions based on hot air, hype, and hysteria, then leaving a load of bag holders at the end.

Samsong

Samsong wrote: »

If you think crypto is only about Bitcoin then you are not informed enough to be on here making bold statements.

What bold statement did I make? And what makes you think I don't know more than bitcoin?

You sound like an absolute tit to be honest.

Samsong

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

That link doesn’t work. Again, what is a smart NFC tag, and how does it work in verifying that a bottle of wine isn’t counterfeit? Mapping physical objects into a digital world is difficult. This is yet another example of applying the word blockchain to an end-point solution that doesn’t need it, raising hundreds of millions based on hot air, hype, and hysteria, then leaving a load of bag holders at the end.

You need to highlight it and paste. All of your questions about vechain and it's IOT technology will be answered.

Samsong

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What bold statement did I make? And what makes you think I don't know more than bitcoin?

You sound like an absolute tit to be honest.

And you sound like a whiny prick

Samsong

Samsong wrote: »

And you sound like a whiny prick

You're clearly upset because I said there is no reason to imagine bitcoin go up in value.. Just think about that for a second. You think I'm a whiny prick because I insulted your coins.

Keep posting and embarrass yourself, please.

JohnnyFlash

Calm down gents. This is a trying time for investors in digital coins magicked out of thin air, but decorum costs nothing.

:rolleyes:

Samsong

[Deleted User] wrote: »

You're clearly upset because I said there is no reason to imagine bitcoin go up in value.. Just think about that for a second. You think I'm a whiny prick because I insulted your coins.

Keep posting and embarrass yourself, please.

The sooner bitcoin disappears the better

Samsong

Samsong wrote: »

The sooner bitcoin disappears the better

But then how would anyone buy alt-coins.

Samsong

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Calm down gents. This is a trying time for investors in digital coins magicked out of thin air, but decorum costs nothing.

:rolleyes:

I'll leave ye too it. Death to Bitcoins

Samsong

[Deleted User] wrote: »

But then how would anyone buy alt-coins.

Vechain will become a regular stock. This is speculation stage and it's a ****ty rigged market. It needs to die.
The partnerships I have listed multiple times are with real companies.
Paste the link and see the full list.

asteroids over berlin

what - Cryptos have made it to after hours!!! The bear market is over and the next bull run is imminent so.
Most of you are talking crap and do not understand the technology behind it, Bitcoin will not disappear and in fact adoption is growing, just because people jumped on board and took a position at the top of the market in December/January and are now down. As said, adoption is growing, particularly in Asia. Rome was not built in a day, digital currencies are the future. The value of Bitcoin and some other alt coins will reach new all time highs in the near future. Of course, if you invested in **** coins, then you get what you deserve. Anyway, no point preaching to the weak, you guys would get burned in any investment.

Slideways

The Independant has a bleak article out there for all the shrewd investors :rolleyes:

https://m.independent.ie/business/world/crypto-worse-than-dotcom-bust-37310547.html

Samsong

Slideways wrote: »

The Independant has a bleak article out there for all the shrewd investors :rolleyes:

https://m.independent.ie/business/world/crypto-worse-than-dotcom-bust-37310547.html

Great article. Very in depth.

JohnnyFlash

asteroids over berlin wrote: »

what - Cryptos have made it to after hours!!! The bear market is over and the next bull run is imminent so.
Most of you are talking crap and do not understand the technology behind it, Bitcoin will not disappear and in fact adoption is growing, just because people jumped on board and took a position at the top of the market in December/January and are now down. As said, adoption is growing, particularly in Asia. Rome was not built in a day, digital currencies are the future. The value of Bitcoin and some other alt coins will reach new all time highs in the near future. Of course, if you invested in **** coins, then you get what you deserve. Anyway, no point preaching to the weak, you guys would get burned in any investment.

What sort of bitcoin adoption is growing in Asia? Buying it, holding it, spending it etc? Any opinion on the energy it uses?

Samsong

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

What sort of bitcoin adoption is growing in Asia? Buying it, holding it, spending it etc? Any opinion on the energy it uses?

Im still waiting for you to get back to me. Did you read the link?

Keyzer

Like most of these things, if you get in early and it takes off you make a fortune. Late comers are more likely to get burned.

I know a chap who got into crypto in the very early days and people thought he was mad, which he was but it paid off for him. He cashed out when he was (more than) satisifed with his return and bought a beautiful 600K house outright. Still has a nice pot of cash to keep him going for a couple of years.

JohnnyFlash

Samsong wrote: »

Im still waiting for you to get back to me. Did you read the link?

I did. The partnerships are all PoC type stuff. They sign up for incubator progs then hype the hell out of them. The one they claim with Microsoft is especially cheeky and borderline fraudulent. They signed up for a Microsoft Azure account and claimed it was a partnership!!! Lol.

Samsong

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

I did. The partnerships are all PoC type stuff. They sign up for incubator progs then hype the hell out of them. The one they claim with Microsoft is especially cheeky and borderline fraudulent. They signed up for a Microsoft Azure account and claimed it was a partnership!!! Lol.

And the Chinese state ones?
Dnvgl?

rapul

Samsong don't mind Johnny he was banned from the crypto forum for just spewing the same ****e over and over,just ignore him and I see his bumchum Paddy has followed him here haha pathetic,they both think they know all about crypto which is clearly evident they don't know anything

JohnnyFlash

Samsong wrote: »

And the Chinese state ones?
Dnvgl?

All early stage proof of concepts. No vechain being used in anger in an existing industry. I’d suggest a healthy skepticism when dealing with any of the claims and promises of Chinese crypto coin companies.

Samsong

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

All early stage proof of concepts. No vechain being used in anger in an existing industry. I’d suggest a healthy skepticism when dealing with any of the claims and promises of Chinese crypto coin companies.

Dnvgl are Norwegian I believe.
Look we have two different opinions and it's fairly obvious we won't agree so I have no more interest in arguing on this anymore.
Best of luck

Samsong

rapul wrote: »

Samsong don't mind Johnny he was banned from the crypto forum for just spewing the same ****e over and over,just ignore him and I see his bumchum Paddy has followed him here haha pathetic,they both think they know all about crypto which is clearly evident they don't know anything

In done.

JohnnyFlash

rapul wrote: »

Samsong don't mind Johnny he was banned from the crypto forum for just spewing the same ****e over and over,just ignore him and I see his bumchum Paddy has followed him here haha pathetic,they both think they know all about crypto which is clearly evident they don't know anything

Bumchum? I see we are dealing with a real intellectual here. Look it’s not cool that you lost money buying digital coins with no inherent value. Not gloating about that at all.

But it’s not cool to be trying to persuade others to get involved just so you can sell on your coins. All scams have a bag holder at the end. It’s you and your sort this time. Learn from it and move on.

rapul

Johnny if you actually read anything that we replied to you on the other forum you would know that I'm actually doing quite well crypto wise and your just pissed you missed the boat ,you have fun in this thread on your high horse

seamus

Donovan Shapely Adventurer wrote: »

There is no grounded ship there. The probability of the top coins rallying again is higher than them completely tanking to 0.

I bough this coins with holding them for a fairly long time to see how high they would go, because they have dropped a lot doesn’t change that plan.

Your total obsession with being anti-cryptos is farcical at this stage.

I'm afraid nox, with all due respect, this belief that a rally is more likely than a collapse reveals your ignorance about just what bitcoin is.

Physical assets have a residual value. When you buy a property and lose your hole on it, you still have a physical asset. It probably has some utility, and at the very least you'll have something that you can sell, that someone will buy at some price. At some point, that asset's utility will be realised, and its value increased.

This is not the case with crypto. The bitcoins you hold, have no utility. They cannot be used for anything but selling to someone else. They will never become a proper currency. That ship has sailed.

What's worse is that the cost of selling your bitcoins increases over time. The longer you hold, the more it will cost to sell. This is generally not a feature of any other asset. The cost of selling a house remains largely fixed (in fact, it often drops with the price). The cost of selling gold, or oil, is largely fixed.

For bitcoin, the cost of selling increases every time a transaction is made, regardless of the value of the coin.

Thus it is inevitable that the value of bitcoin will continue to drop, and drop sharply, as the cost of selling outweighs any potential return for users or processors.

And unlike other assets where something exists which you have to deal with, bitcoin can simply be deleted, gone. And what's worse - you don't know when someone else has deleted their coins. There are millions of bitcoins which have been mined, and never used. For all you know, these have been deleted.
In a traditional market, this increases the value of your asset. With Bitcoin, it makes it uncertain. You could be holding the only bitcoin left in existence, but you'd never be able to know. That makes it worthless.

Sell now, get out while you have something. In a decade, bitcoin will be a piece of history and nothing more.

JohnnyFlash

rapul wrote: »

Johnny if you actually read anything that we replied to you on the other forum you would know that I'm actually doing quite well crypto wise and your just pissed you missed the boat ,you have fun in this thread on your high horse

Sorry, I don’t actually remember you from the other forum. I’m sure the good folks of AH don’t want to read about that anyway. I just found your use of the word bumchum offensive. I’ve a son I suspect is a homosexual and find the language unsavoury. He’s also a bit thick so might be the sort to buying overpriced crypto coins based on dubious white papers, paid for articles, outright lies, and a fear of missing out.

rapul

Haha you crack me up Johnny I'm out ,you keep pretending to be the crypto guru that you seem to think you are

conorhal

Aongus Von Bismarck wrote: »

A complete scam of course, and it just goes to shows what happens when large amounts of people who don't understand economics, the creation of wealth, and the systems behind it, attempt to 'get rich quick'.


That said, not everyone lost money. Over 90% of people did. I made some money off Bitcoin completely by chance. A number of us here at the bank in Frankfurt bought some of them a number of years back. We had intended to give them to one of C-Suite in the bank as a joke present - the 'future of money'. We didn't however, as he died of a massive heart attack before we had the opportunity to do so.


Anyway, we forgot about them, until last December, where we saw that each coin was valued at over 10k dollars a pop. We cashed them all in at 14700k a pop, which wasn't the height of the bubble, but no point getting greedy with this sort of thing, and ending up being a bag-holder/owner of worthless digital 'beany babies'.


I paid the required tax on the profits, and was able to purchase a small holiday home in West Cork with the proceeds. I also had enough left over to purchase a golf course membership down there, as well as a Paul Henry painting for the kitchen. So all-in-all, a pleasant experience.


Don't even bother reading about it these days. There's this idea that those of us who work in traditional banking are terrified of bitcoin. We aren't. It's silly libertarians playing silly games with silly virtual money.

Generally I agree with your sentements if not that staggering hubris of that last statement. It always amazes me how fast bankers have forgotten that the crash also involved traditional bankers playing with virtual money, a lot of which dissapeared in a poof when the market collapsed. Since moving off the gold standard and into casino banking, there's no real moral high ground for the banks to take against the cryptos, just claims of competence, and A LOT MORE PEOPLE paid the price for the failures of the banking sector and it's various pyramid schemes then those who were putting punts on the wild west of cryptos.

Ray Bloody Purchase

Why do all these 'canny' investors get so butthurt when a bad word is said about bitcoin?

rapul

Ray Bloody Purchase wrote: »

Why do all these 'canny' investors get so butthurt when a bad word is said about bitcoin?

It tends to be because anyone who doesn't agree with bitcoin let's say is just ignorant to it and doesn't actually want their opinion swayed ,it gets tiring explaining the same stuff over and over year on year

Also great name Toast is some show haha!

Pretty clear that the cynics sound more informed that the supporters.

rapul

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Pretty clear that the cynics sound more informed that the supporters.

Would not agree at all ,go over to the actual crypto forum and you might learn something

seamus

Ray Bloody Purchase wrote: »

Why do all these 'canny' investors get so butthurt when a bad word is said about bitcoin?

Psychology

conorhal

Ray Bloody Purchase wrote: »

Why do all these 'canny' investors get so butthurt when a bad word is said about bitcoin?

Because you're dealing with true believers. I find many of the crypto enthusiasts to have the same near religious zeal as Apple devotess that verges on the cultish. Well the Kool Aid has been well and truly passed around.

rapul

rapul wrote: »

Would not agree at all ,go over to the actual crypto forum and you might learn something

I guarantee there is nothing you could possibly teach me about crypto.

Grayson

Deleted User wrote: »

Pretty clear that the cynics sound more informed that the supporters.

Not really. The thing to remember is that neither of them know for certain. There's no way to tell how crypto's will go in the long run. For some we can make certain limited predictions. Bit coin will never replace currency. There's a goods example of a bar in San Francisco that accepts bitcoin as payment. However it takes hours to process a transaction so it's useless as an actual currency to buy stuff. There are newer crypto's that don't have that problem but you need a stable one if it's going to replace physical currency.

However as an investment it's all a bit up in the air. I know a guy who retired because of his bitcoin investment. He was lucky. Others like the ones in the OP will lose money. Really when you get down to it, people who invest are betting money. And they're betting on something that's incredibly new, that doesn't always follow the rules of a traditional market. My personal advice would be to have a flutter. It's fun having a few quid in the game and watching your money go up and down. But don't bet the house on it because you could lose it all and no-one can tell you 100% whether you will win or lose.

JohnnyFlash

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Sorry, I don’t actually remember you from the other forum. I’m sure the good folks of AH don’t want to read about that anyway. I just found your use of the word bumchum offensive. I’ve a son I suspect is a homosexual and find the language unsavoury. He’s also a bit thick so might be the sort to buying overpriced crypto coins based on dubious white papers, paid for articles, outright lies, and a fear of missing out.

Hi Johnny, I’d just like to say that I remember you from reading the Crypto forum. You were actually the poster I was referring to in my previous post.

Your quality posts, impeccable research, and your patience in the face of such continued abuse was admirable, to say the least.

The fact you were banned for not responding to a post, which I actually believe you covered in a later post, was way OTT.

I would also like to condemn the homophobic slurs that were aimed at you, incredibly juvenile and wholly unacceptable.