Intimidation by a minor: is the parent legally responsible?

corks finest

the purple tin wrote: »

Dial Hard wrote: »

And Chav Daddy has absolutely no responsibility for the situation, no? :rolleyes:

The Chav Daddy is quite often absent.

Locally most are

NUTLEY BOY

corkdave wrote: »

Situation briefly is that children way under 10 years are making life miserable for a woman living alone in a city housing estate. Throwing stones at her windows. Shouting at her. Taking stuff from her garden. Scratching her car. She lives alone since her husband died. The City Council has offered to move her, but she loves her house and the memories of her life with her husband are tied up there. Also she has done nothing wrong and cannot see why she should be the one to move when all she wants is to live in peace. Gardai say they cannot intervene because the children are minors.
Yesterday a five year old threw stones at the windows and used a stick to break her letter box. She shouted at him to stop.
Hours later the child’s mum arrived at her door and screamed obscenities at her for shouting at her child. The scene lasted for a number of minutes.
The experience has shattered her. She is in her fifties and not in good health. Aside from leaving her home, does she have options in law?
Any comments appreciated.

To answer the original question.

Generally, a parent is not legally responsible for the malevolent conduct of their children. The only civil exception to that would be where a child is acting as an agent of the parent in which case the parent might be vicariously liable for the acts of the child.

In the real world this would probably just not fly in terms of trying to enforce a remedy.

On the face of it this looks like the criminal offence of harassment as per S.10 Non-fatal Offences Against the Person At 1997. link http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1997/act/26/section/10/enacted/en/html#sec10

The problem here, as already pointed out, is that the actual perpetrators of the conduct are below the age of criminal responsibility. You could not get at the problem parent unless you could show that she was actually organising it deliberately and that is a long shot.

Discodog

NUTLEY BOY wrote: »

To answer the original question.

Generally, a parent is not legally responsible for the malevolent conduct of their children. The only civil exception to that would be where a child is acting as an agent of the parent in which case the parent might be vicariously liable for the acts of the child.

In the real world this would probably just not fly in terms of trying to enforce a remedy.

On the face of it this looks like the criminal offence of harassment as per S.10 Non-fatal Offences Against the Person At 1997. link http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1997/act/26/section/10/enacted/en/html#sec10

The problem here, as already pointed out, is that the actual perpetrators of the conduct are below the age of criminal responsibility. You could not get at the problem parent unless you could show that she was actually organising it deliberately and that is a long shot.

Does this allow someone to recruit children to commit crime knowing that the Guards won't act ? How do the Guards deal with serious crime committed by children ?

Peregrinus

Discodog wrote: »

Does this allow someone to recruit children to commit crime knowing that the Guards won't act ? How do the Guards deal with serious crime committed by children ?

Serious crime committed by children is rare, unless you adopt a very expansive definition of "serious crime".

Where it does happen, parents are mostly appalled, and are anxious to co-operate to address the problem. Ordinary criminal justice processes aren't relevant here.

Where children are engaged in serious crime, and parents are unconcerned or indifferent or even encouraging, that's a child welfare issue, since the children themselves are endangered by this state of affairs. Tusla's problem, not the guards.

Discodog

Peregrinus wrote: »

Serious crime committed by children is rare, unless you adopt a very expansive definition of "serious crime".

Where it does happen, parents are mostly appalled, and are anxious to co-operate to address the problem. Ordinary criminal justice processes aren't relevant here.

Where children are engaged in serious crime, and parents are unconcerned or indifferent or even encouraging, that's a child welfare issue, since the children themselves are endangered by this state of affairs. Tusla's problem, not the guards.

So when, as happened in Galway, a group of children stoned a foal to death the Guards wouldn't act. Do Tusla have a mobile force with powers of arrest ? Who is supposed to act when groups of children are throwing rocks at passing cars ?

lawred2

corkdave wrote: »

Situation briefly is that children way under 10 years are making life miserable for a woman living alone in a city housing estate. Throwing stones at her windows. Shouting at her. Taking stuff from her garden. Scratching her car. She lives alone since her husband died. The City Council has offered to move her, but she loves her house and the memories of her life with her husband are tied up there. Also she has done nothing wrong and cannot see why she should be the one to move when all she wants is to live in peace. Gardai say they cannot intervene because the children are minors.
Yesterday a five year old threw stones at the windows and used a stick to break her letter box. She shouted at him to stop.
Hours later the child’s mum arrived at her door and screamed obscenities at her for shouting at her child. The scene lasted for a number of minutes.
The experience has shattered her. She is in her fifties and not in good health. Aside from leaving her home, does she have options in law?
Any comments appreciated.

not absolving the fear animals of their responsibilities here but she should just move

lawred2

Tell me how wrote: »

CCTV is a completely different consideration now due to GDPR.

Even so, you'd have to have cameras covering all areas so that someone interfering with one camera would be seen on another. And even if you can set this up, expect one or more with their faces covered so they can't be identified to target the cameras.

My heart goes out to the lady mentioned in the OP. Wish she stood a better chance of getting support.

CCTV for the purposes of recording criminality is entirely justified under GDPR.

Just have to put up a sign and be prepared to provide copies to the scumbags if they request it.

Peregrinus

Discodog wrote: »

So when, as happened in Galway, a group of children stoned a foal to death the Guards wouldn't act. Do Tusla have a mobile force with powers of arrest ? Who is supposed to act when groups of children are throwing rocks at passing cars ?

Tusla is concerned about the children, not the cars.