Formula 1 2018 - Round 16 – Russia

Maybe time for Verstappen to stop now, gain 2 seconds a lap til the end, win, easy. :P

thisonetaken

H3llR4iser wrote: »

It's because of the farce - Mercedes and Wolff specifically keep pretending they let their guys "race", often implying others are at fault for not doing so. People scream about Ferrari "not allowing Kimi...", but Mercedes are a lot worse. Also, switching positions isn't the worst, the fact they regularly use Bottas as a mobile chicane (have done it multiple times this year), while "legal" in the strict sense, is extremely unsporting - not even the Todt-Brawn led Ferrari of the Schumacher era used that kind of trick so often (one could argue it was because Irvine was slow enough on his own, but that's a different story )

Irvine was on course to be world champion before schumacher in a Ferrari up until the team sabotaged him

H3llR4iser

Faugheen wrote: »

They did let their drivers race when there was drivers championships to be won for either of them. Look at when Rosberg was Hamilton's team-mate.

Bottas is out of the Championship, so he takes a back seat.

I know people are looking for any reason to call shenanigans but it really, really isn't difficult to understand.

They claim they let their drivers race NOW, not two seasons ago. Pointless argument. Wolff let it even slide with Bottas being a great "wingman". Drop the facade, end of it. Valterri is #2 by contract. And don't complain when others do the same.

thisonetaken

Faugheen wrote: »

This is absolutely not true. That Ferrari was more than a match for the Merc.

No that’s not true, look at the practice sessions results, qualifying results and race results, the 2 Mercs are always ahead of the 2 Ferrari’s. When a no 2 driver is outpacing the lead driver in the other car you know it’s the car not the driver.

Ghost Train

thisonetaken wrote: »

Irvine was on course to be world champion before schumacher in a Ferrari up until the team sabotaged him

Irvine crashing the car in Qualifying at Suzuka I thought hurt his chances. They did help him in Spa and Malaysia too. It was only one or two points in the end that he missed out on it

Why are they leaving Verstappen out in traffic?

skipper_G

Why are they cutting away from the race to show Putin arriving at the circuit 10 laps from the end

skipper_G

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Why are they leaving Verstappen out in traffic?

Are they trying to extend the stint on the softs so he can have Hypersoft good to the end

RoryMac

Faugheen wrote: »

This is absolutely not true. That Ferrari was more than a match for the Merc.

The Ferrari was a match for Mercedes at the start of the season but Mercedes have caught and passed them over the course of the season.

And another lap! FFS! Ricciardo doing lap records now. They've thrown away a position. Kimi was 15 seconds behind and it went under 10. Stupidity.

H3llR4iser

Ghost Train wrote: »

Irvine crashing the car in Qualifying at Suzuka I thought hurt his chances. They did help him in Spa and Malaysia too. It was only one or two points in the end that he missed out on it

The mystery of that season was the fact that with Schumacher out, suddenly Irvine's performances surged...he was nowhere near that level before. One has to wonder if it was just a matter of resources, motivation, or simply that the team didn't actually care about car #2 at the time.

H3llR4iser

skipper_G wrote: »

Why are they cutting away from the race to show Putin arriving at the circuit 10 laps from the end

Because the director doesn't want to be sent to a work camp

Ps. great team radio by the Hulk as usual :P

skipper_G

So Max might catch Kimi by the end but probably not able to pass

skipper_G

skipper_G wrote: »

Are they trying to extend the stint on the softs so he can have Hypersoft good to the end

They let the gaps get far smaller though.

Verstappen having a ****e out lap.

Faugheen

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Faugheen wrote: »

They did let their drivers race when there was drivers championships to be won for either of them. Look at when Rosberg was Hamilton's team-mate.

Bottas is out of the Championship, so he takes a back seat.

I know people are looking for any reason to call shenanigans but it really, really isn't difficult to understand.

They claim they let their drivers race NOW, not two seasons ago. Pointless argument. Wolff let it even slide with Bottas being a great "wingman". Drop the facade, end of it. Valterri is #2 by contract. And don't complain when others do the same.

When did they claim that this weekend?

People don't complain when Kimi plays wingman for Vettel because 'that's his role' but do when Bottas does the same for his title-challenging team-mate.

When Bottas is good enough to challenge for a title, then see what the team orders are. Until then, stop being a baby and looking for something to cry about.

Seriously weird with the Red Bulls. Ricciardo is staying a consistent gap behind Verstappen while Max is losing time to the Ferraris.

Charlie-Bravo

Hamilton's blister didn't look too bad. Hopefully he can 'gift' Bottas the win as a thank you.

ctrl-alt-delete

Verstappen must regret coming in at this stage.

Ghost Train

astrofluff wrote: »

Hamilton's blister didn't look too bad. Hopefully he can 'gift' Bottas the win as a thank you.

Regift... Ruturn the gift

RoryMac

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Seriously weird with the Red Bulls. Ricciardo is staying a consistent gap behind Verstappen while Max is losing time to the Ferraris.

Not the first time that's happened this season with drivers going onto the 'quicker' tyre and not seeing the benefits.

Faugheen

astrofluff wrote: »

Hamilton's blister didn't look too bad. Hopefully he can 'gift' Bottas the win as a thank you.

H3llR4iser

Faugheen wrote: »

When did they claim that this weekend?

People don't complain when Kimi plays wingman for Vettel because 'that's his role' but do when Bottas does the same for his title-challenging team-mate.

When Bottas is good enough to challenge for a title, then see what the team orders are. Until then, stop being a baby and looking for something to cry about.

Perfect argument, calling people names. You're not worth discussing with.

ctrl-alt-delete

Not giving it back,

We will talk about it after the race,

Pull it over and park it up Bottas

Ghost Train

Bottas a bit in the dark about what just happened

skipper_G

Good performance from Leclerc, best of the rest

Charlie-Bravo

Faugheen wrote: »

Woah, what's this about. Play the post, not the poster.

I understand team orders, but it doesn't mean I have to like it. Even Toto being on the radio to Bottas knows how it looks from the fans' perspective hence the sheepish comment. It doesn't bode well for them on a PR side.

ctrl-alt-delete

Faugheen wrote: »

When did they claim that this weekend?

People don't complain when Kimi plays wingman for Vettel because 'that's his role' but do when Bottas does the same for his title-challenging team-mate.

When Bottas is good enough to challenge for a title, then see what the team orders are. Until then, stop being a baby and looking for something to cry about.

Winning races would be a start,

Oh hold on. . .

:pac:

Faugheen

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Faugheen wrote: »

When did they claim that this weekend?

People don't complain when Kimi plays wingman for Vettel because 'that's his role' but do when Bottas does the same for his title-challenging team-mate.

When Bottas is good enough to challenge for a title, then see what the team orders are. Until then, stop being a baby and looking for something to cry about.

Perfect argument, calling people names. You're not worth discussing with.

So I just want to be clear that you're not going to answer the question I have raised because I said you were crying like a baby.

RoryMac

RoryMac wrote: »

Not the first time that's happened this season with drivers going onto the 'quicker' tyre and not seeing the benefits.

I was half-expecting them to do the fastest lap on the last lap to show they'd just been going handy but apparently not.

BikeRacer

Absolutely no celebration from Lewis to be fair

antodeco

The cameraman went flying. Haha

Faugheen

astrofluff wrote: »

Faugheen wrote: »

Woah, what's this about. Play the post, not the poster.

I understand team orders, but it doesn't mean I have to like it. Even Toto being on the radio to Bottas knows how it looks from the fans' perspective hence the sheepish comment. It doesn't bode well for them on a PR side.

Bottas knows the story. If he had kicked off about having to let Hamilton through then we would have heard about it.

I don't know why anyone wants to believe otherwise. Bottas is annoyed but at the end of the day he knows what the story is and he won't do or say anything.

Rossi IRL

Bottas not a happy lad and understandably so.... Team orders do happen in all teams, I still don't have to like them though.

Mercedes should just put Russell in that car next year instead of Bottas. He isn't going to be a championship winning driver so either get out or know what your role is going to be.

TheChrisD

ctrl-alt-delete wrote: »

Not giving it back,

We will talk about it after the race,

Pull it over and park it up Bottas

More like, turn the engine up to max and ram LewLew off :P

Rossi IRL

Did Vettel blank Putin? Looks awkward in there.

Inviere

From a team perspective, the team order made perfect sense. Sure, nobody likes them, it sours the win, sours the achievement, but make sense when in a points battle. Bottas had the win taken away from him, not unnecessarily mind, but it was taken away. As above, he has to be expecting that at this stage, he's not in the title fight. It's a bitter order, but hey, if you don't like your position in the team, you need to make sure you ARE in the title fight, or else find a different team.

Verstappen was sublime. Granted the cars ahead were slower, but he carved through them beautifully.

Ferrari did better today strategy wise, Merc made an error and left Lewis out a lap too long. Vettel did all he could do really.

Great drive by Le Clerc too.

antodeco

I agree on Ferraris strategy. They got it right today. However, the Merc was a better outright car.

Looking forward to Japan next week. Hopefully a Godzilla attack spices things up

Inviere

antodeco wrote: »

However, the Merc was a better outright car.

100%

Whatever the deficit was to Ferrari early/mid season, Mercedes seems to have gotten on top of it.

50 point lead. 5 races to go. 125 points up for grabs. Lewis can comfortably afford all 2nd places now

pjohnson

Rossi IRL wrote: »

Bottas not a happy lad and understandably so.... Team orders do happen in all teams, I still don't have to like them though.

Mercedes should just put Russell in that car next year instead of Bottas. He isn't going to be a championship winning driver so either get out or know what your role is going to be.

Ta fcuk with Russell. Give it to Ocon.

pjohnson

Actually forgot to say but delighted Renault got nothing after their "tactical" Q2 stunt.

Spudman_20000

Have to say, enjoyed Paul Di Resta in the Sky comms booth for the race. He got the good kind of excited at certain points during the race, kinda in contrast to Brundle who just keeps very nonchalant about what's happening on track.

Inviere

Spudman_20000 wrote: »

Have to say, enjoyed Paul Di Resta in the Sky comms booth for the race. He got the good kind of excited at certain points during the race, kinda in contrast to Brundle who just keeps very nonchalant about what's happening on track.

Sky surprised me when Lewis complained about Vettel defending by moving twice...they said it was hard racing, that rules should be relaxed, and it didn't deserve a penalty. I agreed it wasn't penalty worthy, but there was a definite double move when defending, I thought he'd get a slap on the wrist for it? Very high speed section, just before a DRS pass, not a place you want to have an accident

BikeRacer

Inviere wrote: »

Sky surprised me when Lewis complained about Vettel defending by moving twice...they said it was hard racing, that rules should be relaxed, and it didn't deserve a penalty. I agreed it wasn't penalty worthy, but there was a definite double move when defending, I thought he'd get a slap on the wrist for it? Very high speed section, just before a DRS pass, not a place you want to have an accident

That was Johnny Herbert, he went on to say that Ham fully deserved to win the race.

What he giveth he taketh away.

Inviere

BikeRacer wrote: »

That was Johnny Herbert, he went on to say that Ham fully deserved to win the race.

What he giveth he taketh away.

Di Resta and Croft said it too iirc? Herbert is a pure waste, adds absolutely nothing.

Inviere

Inviere wrote: »

but there was a definite double move when defending

Hmm, this changed my mind somewhat - https://streamable.com/6u9o9

skipper_G

I didn't see anything wrong with what Vettel did at the time, and it's clear from the replays. It's not a double movement as once he starts to move he keeps moving in the same direction

Inviere

skipper_G wrote: »

I didn't see anything wrong with what Vettel did at the time, and it's clear from the replays. It's not a double movement as once he starts to move he keeps moving in the same direction

Watching live, from Lewis' on board, in the moment, it definitely looked like two moves to me. It clearly wasn't though

Charlie-Bravo

Inviere wrote: »

Watching live, from Lewis' on board, in the moment, it definitely looked like two moves to me. It clearly wasn't though

Yes, my opinion too, it looked like a double move (we got Hamilton's view first and a few replays of it) but not really any other angle. Vettel just continued to close the door.

skipper_G

Inviere wrote: »

Watching live, from Lewis' on board, in the moment, it definitely looked like two moves to me. It clearly wasn't though

I agree, I thought the same from Hamilton's onboard at first. But they did show a wider angle replay like the one you linked and then i changed my mind.

Is there any clips of KMag move on Ocon. I thought his was worse