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Air BnB to be effectively banned for non PPR

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    #392
    Jamsiek
    Registered Users Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭Jamsiek


    Pkiernan wrote: »
    Shocking that you think its okay for governement to dictate what i can do with my property just because they won't do the right thing and build homes.

    I'm lucky that my unit is mortgage free. It'll remain empty now.

    I've never gouged a tenant and just had one leave that cost me 17000 euro in unpaid rent and damage. That was 4 years post tax rental income.

    No way I'll rent it again. I'll leave it empty and watch it appreciate and not have to worry about overholding tenants.

    Many cities have started an Empty Homes tax to encourage landowners to let there properties to renters. I can see this happening in Ireland and I would support it.

    You can't just do what you want with your property anyway. What do you think planning laws are for? AirBNB need to be at least regulated more as the current situation is not working.


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    #393
    GingerLily
    Registered Users Posts: 4,767 ✭✭✭GingerLily


    Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »
    No becuase there is a housing crisis on and private property is regualted for the common good. While I don't agree with forcing a lodger on someone, the sentiment is correct - time for a empty bed room tax. After all we all want to do our bit right?

    And while were about it we need to ensure that people in larger than they need units of social housing get moved on too.

    I agree, let's live with either one extreme or the other, no in between!


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    #394
    stateofflux
    Registered Users Posts: 1,563 ✭✭✭stateofflux


    I am all for the enforcement of this legislation. especially during a housing crisis

    but i do agree with some posters that it is a quick PR distraction temporary fix by a govt that is/has been completely ineffective with dealing with housing crisis. to save their skin for re-election


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    #395
    Jamsiek
    Registered Users Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭Jamsiek


    Twenty Grand wrote: »
    Banning AirBnB is not the solution. It may be PART of a solution, but only if the government gives more security and earning potential to landlords, which it won't do.
    It has worked in many places around the world. Ireland is not the first country to do it and it won't be the last.


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    #396
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 24,714 ✭ [Deleted User]


    TheChizler wrote: »
    Is it? If the new owner occupier exits the rental market then there is a drop in both demand and supply. Why will rents only rise as a consequence?

    Well for a start a lot of people buying are living at home in order to save to buy or are moving from house shares which means there is only a bed space freed up for a full house taken.


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    #397
    TheChizler
    Registered Users Posts: 9,455 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    Jordy Muscular Pennon wrote: »
    Well for a start a lot of people buying are living at home in order to save to buy or are moving from house shares which means there is only a bed space freed up for a full house taken.
    Well if that's the case, and I don't see any reason to believe that's anything like the norm, then there's no net effect on rentals. The AirBnB wasn't in the rental market to begin with. How will it not being added to the rental market raise rents?


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    #398
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,506 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    Queenstown in NZ allows you to put properties on Air B&B for X days per year (i think around 100 or so), once you go over this you have to pay commercial rates but can have them up for 365 days if you want.
    This would be a more sensible option, give people the opportunity to pay commercial rates rather than just ban it outright.


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    #399
    STB.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    stateofflux wrote: »
    I am all for the enforcement of this legislation. especially during a housing crisis

    but i do agree with some posters that it is a quick PR distraction temporary fix by a govt that is/has been completely ineffective with dealing with housing crisis. to save their skin for re-election
    Jamsiek wrote: »
    It has worked in many places around the world. Ireland is not the first country to do it and it won't be the last.

    But its not a solution to solving the housing crisis all of which is of this governments own doing because they were asleep at the wheel for the last 10 years implementing feel good legislation whilst avoiding anything constructive.

    All of it can be traced back to the reneging on the electoral promises not to pay unsecured bond holders. That was the starting point. Quickly followed by the madness of parcel selling all the land and property portfolios through NAMA to foreign vulture funds at rock bottom prices, and ringfencing nothing for social and affordable means. Then wondering where they were going to get the land to do so. It is nothing to do with the small numbers using their private properties for commercial use.

    This legislation is a sideshow and will be as effective as banning pissing on O Connell Street to save us from a flood.

    It's to save TDs own skins at the general election that is looming large. There is clearly no plan B.

    I'm surprised that a landlord hasn't taken a competition case with the EU, given the ridiculous social and restrictive rental obligations that have been foisted upon private property owners who are also paying property taxes.


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    #400
    Jamsiek
    Registered Users Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭Jamsiek


    Lantus wrote: »
    Airbnb is a great example of innovation in an otherwise stagnant status quo sector.

    It has nothing to do with the disfunction of the housing market and instead was trying to find better ways to move forwards and provide solutions.

    Banning Airbnb is a shocking curtailment of personal freedom and liberty. It won't make any difference to housing availability because the core underlying conditions remain unchanged.

    It's communist economics under the banner of helping people. Governments are banning uber, my taxi and Airbnb in a few places. They don't like cost effective solutions that provide a really good service eroding state backed industries that need protection to survive.

    I'm guessing you haven't been following this thread or you would know that everything you just posted has already been mentioned and refuted


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    #401
    Bluefoam
    Registered Users Posts: 7,740 ✭✭✭Bluefoam


    I just think that if a property is used principally as an Airbnb, competing with the hotel trade, that it should be bound by the same standards as a hotel regarding services and facilities provided... Why should hotels be regulated but not Airbnb which are competing directly with hotels... As I've said before, providing Airbnb in your primary residence is a totally different thing, which I welcome wholeheartedly.


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    #402
    Bluefoam
    Registered Users Posts: 7,740 ✭✭✭Bluefoam


    Jamsiek wrote: »
    Idbatterim wrote: »
    I hope this can be legally challenged. I think its going too far, when the government dictate what you can and cant do with your property, down to their failure
    So you don't think planning laws should exist then?
    Idbatterim wrote: »
    this housing crisis in entirely their fault! not mine, not yours and certainly not f*cking airbnb's!
    It has been proven that AirBNB type rentals are part of the problem
    I tend to agree with you. However, if you are going to make blanket statements, please provide some proof, or a link... If it's proven, it shouldn't be difficult to provide the proof.


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    #403
    Jamsiek
    Registered Users Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭Jamsiek


    Jordy Muscular Pennon wrote: »
    Airbnb guests are gone in a day or two and while you might get an odd bad one most will be good and respectful guests.

    I can guarantee most people would rather not live next to an AirBNB, me included. They have been banned from the building I live in for a good reason.


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    #404
    Bluefoam
    Registered Users Posts: 7,740 ✭✭✭Bluefoam


    Jamsiek wrote: »
    Jordy Muscular Pennon wrote: »
    Airbnb guests are gone in a day or two and while you might get an odd bad one most will be good and respectful guests.

    I can guarantee most people would rather not live next to an AirBNB, me included. They have been banned from the building I live in for a good reason.
    Who has the authority to ban a landlord from Airbnb'ing their property? Not sure a management company has the authority, nor the other tenants


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    #405
    Jamsiek
    Registered Users Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭Jamsiek


    Visconti wrote: »
    Should we start an empty cars tax ? People who get the train to work monday to friday and only use a car occasionally should be forced to "rent" the car to some fella who never worked or paid tax in his life (paid for by the taxpayer of course).
    No car shortages exist, nonsense argument
    Visconti wrote: »
    What about an empty field tax ? Any farmer who does not plant a crop or grase cattle on his land should have to let Margaret Cash and her followers stick mobile homes on it (paid by the tax payer)
    No field shortages either
    Visconti wrote: »
    If a person BUYS a house they should be able to leave it empty if they like, its their property ffs.
    Yes, they can leave it empty. However it's up to the government to give incentives for them to rent it. If that includes a tax, so be it.
    Visconti wrote: »
    What about if we stop all the people coming out of shops with bags of shopping and go through their bags making sure they will eat what they buy ? Maybe take a few beers or packets of crisps off people (you dont need 4 Heineken and a 6 pack of tayto here split it with this lad next to me who spends all his money on gambling and drugs.
    Thats the future by the looks of things.
    Ridiculous comparison in fairness


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    #406
    Jamsiek
    Registered Users Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭Jamsiek


    Bluefoam wrote: »
    Who has the authority to ban a landlord from Airbnb'ing their property? Not sure a management company has the authority, nor the other tenants

    Where I live, the management company has the power.
    The landlords pay strata fees to use the building and are bound by the rules.


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    #407
    Visconti
    Registered Users Posts: 301 ✭✭Visconti


    Jamsiek wrote: »
    No car shortages exist, nonsense argument


    No field shortages either


    Yes, they can leave it empty. However it's up to the government to give incentives for them to rent it. If that includes a tax, so be it.


    Ridiculous comparison in fairness

    So taxing people is considered an incentive ? Do you work for the government ?


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    #408
    Bluefoam
    Registered Users Posts: 7,740 ✭✭✭Bluefoam


    Jamsiek wrote: »
    Bluefoam wrote: »
    Who has the authority to ban a landlord from Airbnb'ing their property? Not sure a management company has the authority, nor the other tenants

    Where I live, the management company has the power.
    The landlords pay strata fees to use the building and are bound by the rules.
    But strata fees are for the upkeep of the property. The management company are not the law. They cannot govern the property owners, as much as they'd like too...


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    #409
    Bluefoam
    Registered Users Posts: 7,740 ✭✭✭Bluefoam


    The landlord doesn't pay to use the building, they pay for its maintenance and block insurance


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    #410
    Jamsiek
    Registered Users Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭Jamsiek


    Visconti wrote: »
    So taxing people is considered an incentive?
    It can be
    Visconti wrote: »
    Do you work for the government ?
    No


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    #411
    Jamsiek
    Registered Users Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭Jamsiek


    Bluefoam wrote: »
    But strata fees are for the upkeep of the property. The management company are not the law. They cannot govern the property owners, as much as they'd like too...

    The landlords have signed contracts that give them the authority.
    Maybe they should have read the small print.


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    #412
    GingerLily
    Registered Users Posts: 4,767 ✭✭✭GingerLily


    Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »
    Crisis means no half measures, or is it only a crisis until it affects you?

    Where did I use the word Crisis? I think you're confusing me with someone else


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    #413
    Wheres Me Jumper?
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,288 ✭✭✭Wheres Me Jumper?


    i welcome this if it comes into effect, but i cant help but feel that like in so many other areas of legislation in this country, it will never be properly enforced.

    this little couutry is choc full of laws, but all too often there is little or no enforcement.
    i suspect this will be another such example.


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    #414
    GingerLily
    Registered Users Posts: 4,767 ✭✭✭GingerLily


    Wheres Me Jumper? wrote: »
    i welcome this if it comes into effect, but i cant help but feel that like in so many other areas of legislation in this country, it will never be properly enforced.

    this little couutry is choc full of laws, but all too often there is little or no enforcement.
    i suspect this will be another such example.

    At least posters here will stop brag about getting rid of their long term tenants to Airbnb!!


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    #415
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Mod Note

    Off topic posts deleted.


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    #416
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Bluefoam wrote: »
    Who has the authority to ban a landlord from Airbnb'ing their property? Not sure a management company has the authority, nor the other tenants

    Restrictions on short-term letting are typically part of the head lease when you buy an apartment.


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    #417
    Wheres Me Jumper?
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,288 ✭✭✭Wheres Me Jumper?


    Graham wrote: »
    Restrictions on short-term letting are typically part of the head lease when you buy an apartment.

    exactly my point.
    and it hasn't made a jot of difference


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    #418
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Wheres Me Jumper? wrote: »
    exactly my point.
    and it hasn't made a jot of difference

    Agreed.

    I suspect the new proposals will be aimed for implementation by the booking platforms and mandatory licensing/registration requirements. Booking platforms are much more likely to enforce compliance enough to be effective.


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    #419
    listermint
    Registered Users Posts: 33,932 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    Graham wrote: »
    Agreed.

    I suspect the new proposals will be aimed for implementation by the booking platforms and mandatory licensing/registration requirements. Booking platforms are much more likely to enforce compliance enough to be effective.

    And neighbours im sure can complain but now have some recourse


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    #420
    AlmightyCushion
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 35,078 Mod ✭✭✭✭AlmightyCushion


    Graham wrote: »
    Agreed.

    I suspect the new proposals will be aimed for implementation by the booking platforms and mandatory licensing/registration requirements. Booking platforms are much more likely to enforce compliance enough to be effective.

    From what we've heard so far this will be the case. It's a great idea. People are less likely to break the law if you make it difficult for them to do it.


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    #421
    SusanC10
    Registered Users Posts: 2,432 ✭✭✭SusanC10


    Bluefoam wrote: »
    I just think that if a property is used principally as an Airbnb, competing with the hotel trade, that it should be bound by the same standards as a hotel regarding services and facilities provided... Why should hotels be regulated but not Airbnb which are competing directly with hotels... As I've said before, providing Airbnb in your primary residence is a totally different thing, which I welcome wholeheartedly.

    I actually disagree with this. We pay less than a Hotel to rent someone's Apartment/House when we travel. We do not hold it to the same standards as a Hotel and we don't pay the same amount as a Hotel - usually considerably less which makes it affordable for us. However, we do want a self-catering place to ourselves.


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