Deontay Wilder v Tyson Fury - December 1st

qwabercd

Wilder Points

showpony1 wrote: »

Hopefully PP still pay out in fury on points as a publicity stunt

They only do that when it suits them and they have very little exposure. They had fury to win on points as an enhanced bet yesterday so would have taken a nice bit on it, no hope of a payout imo.

squinn2912

Draw

Anyone watch the post fight presser? Fury finished by being thankful both men return to their families and then sang. His charisma lights up a robotic and boring division. In a year he’s lost 8 stone and come close to winning the world title after two nothing fightsðŸ˜႒

froog

it's amazing how three professional boxing judges can give 3 completely different scores. the sooner we have artificial intelligence scoring fights the better!

walshb

Wilder Points

froog wrote: »

it's amazing how three professional boxing judges can give 3 completely different scores. the sooner we have artificial intelligence scoring fights the better!

It’s not amazing...it’s a subjective system...

walshb

Wilder Points

Btw, it was ultimately Fury’s own countryman that “screwed” him...

froog

walshb wrote:

It’s not amazing...it’s a subjective system...

My point is it shouldn't be subjective. it's not a poetry competition. it's a technical contest with technical rules for scoring.

walshb

Wilder Points

froog wrote: »

My point is it shouldn't be subjective. it's not a poetry competition. it's a technical contest with technical rules for scoring.

Well, it is subjective....from day 1....

Not sure how you can make it not...

And it is not ALL technical...plus it happens and is scored in real time...

Henno30

Fairly sickened by that. 115-111 for Wilder was outrageous.

Subcomandante Marcos

Draw

walshb wrote: »

Btw, it was ultimately Fury’s own countryman that “screwed” him...

I have no idea how you can say that when it was a Mexican ref who gave one of the most bizzare scores in a world title fight in recent years.

113-113 isn't a mile off what would be a fair result, but 115-111 is idiocy.

walshb

Wilder Points

Read between the lines...screwed in inverted commas..

You are that close to a win, and two foreign judges are split...

The last judge is your countryman....

“Yes, surely my countryman will get me over the line here. I won this fight. He has to give it to me.....”

You get a draw from him...

Really, who are you going to be pissed off with?

Try see the human side here...

Angliru

Draw

As many predicted here, Wilder got the rub of the green on the cards yet again. Absolute nonsense.

As for Fury, legend doesn't do him justice. Robbed of one of the great comeback stories in all of sport. What he did last night was heroic. After all he has been through mentally and physically over the last few years, to come back after two meaningless fights and take the second best HW to school was staggering. And that recovery after the knockdown is the freakiest **** I have ever seen. To top it all off he's singing his heart out in the press conference after.

He might not be some people's cup of tea inside and outside the ring but to me Tyson Fury is one of the great characters we have. It is so good to have him back near the top of the sport.

Subcomandante Marcos

Draw

walshb wrote: »

Read between the lines...

You are that close to a win, and two foreign judges are split...

The last judge is your countryman....

“Yes, surely my countryman will get me over the lime her. I won this fight. He has to give it to me.....”

You get a draw from him...

Really, who are you going to be pissed off with?

The one judge with the anomalous score cards, like any sane person.

Henno30

Hope Fury holds it together. A guy that went off the rails once can do it again. 12th round was a testament to both of them. Wilder for somehow finding that one big shot, and Fury for somehow recovering as quickly as he did.

walshb

Wilder Points

Subcomandante Marcos wrote: »

The one judge with the anomalous score cards, like any sane person.

Yeh yeh...

Like I said, see the human side...

I know I’d be pissed off with my countryman, “more.”

VeryTerry

walshb wrote: »

In case anyone else gets their knickers in a twist, I was just making a point about what I see as blatantly biased commentary that can happen..

I watched the first 4 rounds on Showtime and then the rest on BT. The BT lads were unbearable in comparison.

Esse85

Angliru wrote: »

As many predicted here, Wilder got the rub of the green on the cards yet again. Absolute nonsense.

As for Fury, legend doesn't do him justice. Robbed of one of the great comeback stories in all of sport. What he did last night was heroic. After all he has been through mentally and physically over the last few years, to come back after two meaningless fights and take the second best HW to school was staggering. And that recovery after the knockdown is the freakiest **** I have ever seen. To top it all off he's singing his heart out in the press conference after.

He might not be some people's cup of tea inside and outside the ring but to me Tyson Fury is one of the great characters we have. It is so good to have him back near the top of the sport.

Good post and I'd agree with almost all of it.

It does make you wonder about the standard of HW boxing when a guy can take 2.5 years out, absolutely abuse his body with drink, drugs and alcohol, balloon up to 28 stone, announce a comeback and fight two nobody's and then go toe to toe with America's best HW and be robbed of the result.

Tyson was done extremely well and credit to him, he can only fight what's in front of him, but for anyone to be able to do the above, they are either an absolute freak of nature one in a million type or they are in an era where the standard of HW boxing is just not very competitive.

Henno30

There's no technical solution to judging. Boxing is boxing. You can't reduce it to numbers.

qwabercd

Wilder Points

walshb wrote: »

Yeh yeh...

Like I said, see the human side...

I know I’d be pissed off with my countryman, “more.”

So you'd expect a professional judge to side with you just because he's from the same country? And would be more pissed off with him than a fellow judge who gave a four point victory to your opponent? Weird.

flatty

walshb wrote: »

Really need to start muting Sky and BoxNation. Their commentary is so biased...

Fury did well, and was winning rds and nicking scores, but Jesus the lads commentary was way OTT. Times where he was landing nothing and they were wetting their pants with praise...

In fairness, if it was an Irish lad fighting on rte it'd be just as bad or worse.
'Hon Tyson Fury.
What a man.

Angliru

Draw

One way I could think of sorting the corrupt judging problem is that you have a lot of assigned judges score a fight, maybe 5 for smaller fights, up to 10 for higher up fights and as many as 20 for a fight like last night. Then after the fight a computer randomly picks 3 cards and they're the cards for the fight. Much harder to have a bought judge give a card then and even if so there would only be a chance they'd be picked. You could obviously push on then and have five official cards for bigger fights.

Logistically it is obviously a bit of a nightmare but sooner or later we're going to have a situation where judges will be in rooms watching fights on monitors and computers and not even at the venue so it isn't a million miles away. With the recent resurgence of the sport over the last few years it is about time some money is invested to rid the sport of the problem.

walshb

Wilder Points

qwabercd wrote: »

So you'd expect a professional judge to side with you just because he's from the same country? And would be more pissed off with him than a fellow judge who gave a four point victory to your opponent? Weird.

Not weird at all...

If you really thought you won, then it stands to reason that you might just believe that your fellow countryman could see it too, and give you the nod..

We’re not robots. We’re humans, with emotions, connections, ties etc...bias exists in human nature...we expect in close situations that we can get a “favor” off those that are “closer” to us. Not saying to blatantly rob, but in this fight Fury must feel hard done by by his fellow Englishman..

Btw, isn’t that exactly why judges really should be neutral...?

You’re proving my point...

walshb

Wilder Points

Maybe drawn cards should have to be awarded to a winner...

So you tot up your card and it’s level.

You then decide based off the whole fight who won “more” of the fight and was that bit better over 36 minutes...a level card doesn’t necessarily mean each fighter won exactly the same amount of the fight...last night Fury would or should get the nod in this scenario. He probably won 22/25 minutes of that fight.

You then announce your winner..

Not all 10/9 rds are the same...

Maybe make each rd weighted. Clear 10/9, confident 10-9, very close 10/9....judges have to describe each rd...

walshb

Wilder Points

And who is Fury giving out about this morning?

Yes, Phil Edwards.....-asking the BBBoC to have a word..

Not weird at all to think that Tyson would be pissed off...

What disappoints him is the British judge...

His awarding a draw cost him the fight. Yes, the Mexican as well...

But ultimately, “in his eyes” he was “screwed” by his countryman, and his disappointment proves this..

Henno30

The other two judges agreed on 11 rounds, and the Mexican judge was only with them on 4 of those rounds. It's very obvious that he was the one watching a different fight.

walshb

Wilder Points

Henno30 wrote: »

The other two judges agreed on 11 rounds, and the Mexican judge was only with them on 4 of those rounds. It's very obvious that he was the one watching a different fight.

Yet Fury asks that same question of Edwards...

I’m not saying the Mexican is off the hook..

I’m discussing it from the human and personal side...as is Tyson if you read between the lines..

qwabercd

Wilder Points

walshb wrote: »

And who is Fury giving out about this morning?

Yes, Phil Edwards.....-asking the BBBoC to have a word..

Not weird at all to think that Tyson would be pissed off...

What disappoints him is the British judge...

His awarding a draw cost him the fight. Yes, the Mexican as well...

But ultimately he was “screwed” by his countryman, and his disappointment proves this..

The two of ye are headers!

walshb

Wilder Points

qwabercd wrote: »

The two of ye are headers!

I’m with him...

Seriously, would you not feel like him if in his position?

I think it’s very natural...

The Mexican he probably cursed, but his fellow countryman has him really disappointed...that’s the personal/human side I am looking at here..

walshb

Wilder Points

Adonis in a bad way after last night.....

qwabercd

Wilder Points

walshb wrote: »

I’m with him...

Seriously, would you not feel like him if in his position?

I think it’s very natural...

The Mexican he probably cursed, but his fellow countryman has him really disappointed...that’s the personal/human side I am looking st here..

Tbh I'd actually nearly expect the countryman to go more the other way, it's his job and if he was to blatantly vote for fury it would be clear as day, intrinsically as a judge you could be inclined to overcompensate.

Anyway gone off topic..i do see your point though.

walshb

Wilder Points

qwabercd wrote: »

Tbh I'd actually nearly expect the countryman to go more the other way, it's his job and if he was to blatantly vote for fury it would be clear as day, intrinsically as a judge you could be inclined to overcompensate.

Anyway gone off topic..i do see your point though.

You’re not off topic at all...

Fair points.