Smart Thermostat yoke.

Soarer

Morning all.

Our house has 3no. heating zones (downstairs front, downstairs back, upstairs) and a hot water "zone". The hot water uses both solar panels and the gas boiler.
The current thermostats/controllers are a pain in the hole, with the biggest annoyance being the lack of a boost button.

Because of that, I'm thinking of changing to smart technology, and that's where the problems start 'cause I haven't a bull's!

I checked the Electric Ireland site, and they offer the Nest and the Climote. The Nest doesn't do 3 zones, so I guess that's out. Which leaves the Climote. Don't know if that's any good, but it would be convenient getting it sourced and fitted (don't know if fitting these things is a hassle).

So anyways, is there any sort of beginner's guide to these yokes?
Is the boost facility customisable? I'm assuming the boost is an hour, but I'd prefer half an hour (house gets hot fast!).
Does everything work through the one thermostat, or do you have a main unit and a couple of on/off units dotted around?
Are the annual subs a requirement, or are they only for when you're out and about? If you don't have a sub, can you still use the app on the same wifi network as the thermostat?
Are all thermostat "smart home" compatible, so that if/when I finally start getting with the times, everything will sync up?

All help greatly appreciated.

keane2097

Might be best to start here:

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057758281

Soarer

Jaysus, 52 pages!

I'd better get comfy!

bk

I wouldn't go with Climote, quiet old fashioned and has a yearly sub!

I'd check out Tado, I believe it supports multiple zones and hot water.

Soarer

Cheers bk.

Are these yokes handy to set up yourself?

bk

Soarer wrote: »

Cheers bk.

Are these yokes handy to set up yourself?

Depends on your setup, how it is wired and your level of comfort with wiring/DIY.

Sometimes easy to DIY, other times you might want to get someone in. Check out the manual for them and also the Home heating automation thread if you have any questions.

Note, I don't have Tado myself, I've Netatmo, but it doesn't work with hot water systems, so not suitable for you.

garion

Tado is a great option but I'll throw evohome in there too. It sounds like you have a decent sized house (3 zones) so having the flexibility to control each room would be a fantastic option. Tado and Evohome offer very similar solutions with smart TRVs etc. I went for evohome when I upgraded by heating controller about 2 years ago and I've never looked back.

The only reason I didn't consider tado at the time was because they didn't offer smart TRVs then.

One thing that as an evohome user you might want to see if tado can do better is the ability to keep hot water at a set temperature between certain periods of the day.
With evohome I can see the temperature in my tank and I can easily schedule when I want to heat it etc. but it would be fantastic if I could say "Between the hours of 6am and 10am keep the water temp at 50 degrees." to allow for showers etc. in the morning. Then "From 10am to 7pm" keep it at 40 degrees" for daily tasks. Then "From 7pm to 9pm keep it at 50 degrees" to allow for kids bath time etc.. Then finally "From 9pm to 6am keep it at 30 degrees" while everyone is asleep. The same as it does for zones via smart trvs. Seems a strange gap in functionality that maybe tado does better.

Overall I'm very happy with evohome though.

8kvscdpglqnyr4

Our house has 3 zones and also a hot water zone.
Went with Hive and it's fantastic - very happy with it

wexfordman2

Soarer wrote: »

Morning all.

Our house has 3no. heating zones (downstairs front, downstairs back, upstairs) and a hot water "zone". The hot water uses both solar panels and the gas boiler.
The current thermostats/controllers are a pain in the hole, with the biggest annoyance being the lack of a boost button.

Because of that, I'm thinking of changing to smart technology, and that's where the problems start 'cause I haven't a bull's!

I checked the Electric Ireland site, and they offer the Nest and the Climote. The Nest doesn't do 3 zones, so I guess that's out. Which leaves the Climote. Don't know if that's any good, but it would be convenient getting it sourced and fitted (don't know if fitting these things is a hassle).

So anyways, is there any sort of beginner's guide to these yokes?
Is the boost facility customisable? I'm assuming the boost is an hour, but I'd prefer half an hour (house gets hot fast!).
Does everything work through the one thermostat, or do you have a main unit and a couple of on/off units dotted around?
Are the annual subs a requirement, or are they only for when you're out and about? If you don't have a sub, can you still use the app on the same wifi network as the thermostat?
Are all thermostat "smart home" compatible, so that if/when I finally start getting with the times, everything will sync up?

All help greatly appreciated.

nest does do zones, simply 1 nest per zone. I have 2 zones plus hot water all run by nest.

Soarer

wexfordman2 wrote: »

nest does do zones, simply 1 nest per zone. I have 2 zones plus hot water all run by nest.

Cheers wexfordman.

to clarify, I said it didn't do 3 zones. You've 2, so it works.

Blanchy90

Soarer wrote: »

Cheers wexfordman.

to clarify, I said it didn't do 3 zones. You've 2, so it works.

You can have 2 zones per nest so Just get 2 nests and you can control it all from the app

Soarer

Blanchy90 wrote: »

You can have 2 zones per nest so Just get 2 nests and you can control it all from the app

Ah ok.

I'm an idiot!:o

Blanchy90

I went with the electric Ireland home comfort kit (with the nest) and then ordered a second nest off them.

wexfordman2

Soarer wrote: »

Cheers wexfordman.

to clarify, I said it didn't do 3 zones. You've 2, so it works.

No, it will work with three zones, in fsvt it will work with ten zones if you want.

Soarer

Right lads.

I've been tooing and froing between the Hive and the Nest, but I've some to the conclusion that they're only part of the solution. It's all well and good to be able to heat the upstairs, but when there are 2 rooms and 2 bathrooms that don't need any heat, and 2 rooms that that need 75%-100% heat, then it's only bit part.

Unless, of course, there are TRVs that work with Nest? Anyone know? Each TRV would be it's own zone?

So that leads me back to the evohome.

It seem like one of the more advanced systems? They say it's completely wireless. Is that true? As in there's nothing needs to be connected to the boiler? Just a case of attaching the thermos to the rads?

Also, I know everything can be run from the central unit, but is it possible to by basic one zone thermos, so that I can control the bedroom from the bedroom if I leave my phone and main control downstairs?

Also, bk mentioned the Tado. TBH, I don't think I like the minimalist appearance of the Tado unit. But if they're a genuine competitor, they must be worth a look? They have the TRVs now, so maybe more equal to the evo?

Finally, Honeywell are doing this TR6 thing as well. I'm assuming that's their version of the Nest/Hive, and would still need the rad thermos for full control?

Again lads, sorry for all the novice questions.

keane2097

The Tado smart thermostat is excellent anyway FWIW.

Soarer

keane2097 wrote: »

The Tado smart thermostat is excellent anyway FWIW.

Cheers dude.

I'd have no doubt that it is. But I'm not sure I could look at that display everyday. Then again, maybe I could.

bk

Soarer wrote: »

Cheers dude.

I'd have no doubt that it is. But I'm not sure I could look at that display everyday. Then again, maybe I could.

The question is, why would you even look at the display?

My Netatmo thermostat is even more minimalist, what you quickly realise with smart thermostats once you get one, is how seldom you touch it!

Mostly it should be automatic, based on presence, temperature and schedule. The odd time if you are feeling cold, you might say "Hey Google, turn up the heat", if you need to do something more complex, use your phone/tablet app.

It seems that way these thermostats are starting to go, is to disappear. The first smart thermostats were big, bold and obvious, Evohome, Hive, Nest. But the newer ones are all taking on a much more minimalist look, because they are being bypassed, more and more. Take a look at Tado, Netatmo or the new Nest E as examples.

Soarer

Blanchy90 wrote: »

I went with the electric Ireland home comfort kit (with the nest) and then ordered a second nest off them.

I was looking at that.
Did they charge you the full price for the second nest, or did they do it for the €130 special offer?

Soarer

bk wrote: »

The question is, why would you even look at the display?

My Netatmo thermostat is even more minimalist, what you quickly realise with smart thermostats once you get one, is how seldom you touch it!

Mostly it should be automatic, based on presence, temperature and schedule. The odd time if you are feeling cold, you might say "Hey Google, turn up the heat", if you need to do something more complex, use your phone/tablet app.

It seems that way these thermostats are starting to go, is to disappear. The first smart thermostats were big, bold and obvious, Evohome, Hive, Nest. But the newer ones are all taking on a much more minimalist look, because they are being bypassed, more and more. Take a look at Tado, Netatmo or the new Nest E as examples.

I never thought of it that way. And never thought of the extra automation of a Google Home or something.
So I guess, seeing as Nest is Google, that it would be the best starting point for all in syncing? Or is everything fairly compatible with everything else these days?

bk

Soarer wrote: »

I never thought of it that way. And never thought of the extra automation of a Google Home or something.
So I guess, seeing as Nest is Google, that it would be the best starting point for all in syncing? Or is everything fairly compatible with everything else these days?

Google seems to be pretty open about supporting other companies stuff. As far as I can see Netatmo (and I guess Tado, etc.) use the exact same API's on Google Home as Nest does, so no real difference.

Though it will be interesting to see if Google Home Screens get heating control integrated into them and will it be open to all or Nest only.

Blanchy90

Soarer wrote: »

I was looking at that.
Did they charge you the full price for the second nest, or did they do it for the €130 special offer?

Sorry I'm just seeing this now, I got the second one for the 130 offer price.

Thats a great price including installation

paulbok

garion wrote: »

Tado is a great option but I'll throw evohome in there too. It sounds like you have a decent sized house (3 zones) so having the flexibility to control each room would be a fantastic option. Tado and Evohome offer very similar solutions with smart TRVs etc. I went for evohome when I upgraded by heating controller about 2 years ago and I've never looked back.

The only reason I didn't consider tado at the time was because they didn't offer smart TRVs then.

One thing that as an evohome user you might want to see if tado can do better is the ability to keep hot water at a set temperature between certain periods of the day.
With evohome I can see the temperature in my tank and I can easily schedule when I want to heat it etc. but it would be fantastic if I could say "Between the hours of 6am and 10am keep the water temp at 50 degrees." to allow for showers etc. in the morning. Then "From 10am to 7pm" keep it at 40 degrees" for daily tasks. Then "From 7pm to 9pm keep it at 50 degrees" to allow for kids bath time etc.. Then finally "From 9pm to 6am keep it at 30 degrees" while everyone is asleep. The same as it does for zones via smart trvs. Seems a strange gap in functionality that maybe tado does better.

Overall I'm very happy with evohome though.

Yeah, evohome could do with an upgrade to the controller. What you mentioned,
Group trvs into zones (can sort of be done by making them all as one room)
Quick boost for one or all trvs is also lacking.
Otherwise I agree, a great system.

kaisersose77

Blanchy90 wrote: »

Sorry I'm just seeing this now, I got the second one for the 130 offer price.

Thats a great price including installation

Did you ring up and place an order for two at the same time or did you place separate orders to get the €130 price?

Cheers

Soarer

This rabbit hole goes deeper and deeper!

Still undecided as to what system to get (although if that Electric Ireland Nest offer comes through, I'll probably go with that), and part of my thinking has now turned to lighting/automation.
Sooo.....
Is home automation kinda like home audio, in that you're better off with seperates as opposed to an all-in-one?
Nest is obviously Google, and I see Google have launched that new home hub yoke. Would that be capable of controlling the Nest zones, as well as a rake of smart plugs dotted around the house? We've 6no. lamps in the living/dining/kitchen area alone, which SWMBO insists on turning on every evening. I'm last to bed, and have to turn them all off afterwards! So a little "Hey Google, turn off the lamps" would be awesome!

bk

We will need to wait for reviews for the Google Hub, but yes from the videos it has shown so far it definitely works with Nest.

Those videos also show it working with Philips Hue smart lights, which isn't surprising. I'd recommend them to you if your thinking of going into smart lights.

Smart plugs for lighting are ok, but of much more limited utility, only giving you on/off control. While Hue lights give you on/off, brightness level, white ambiance and colour control (last two depending on the one you buy). Vastly more useful and nicer IMO.

If you do want to get some smart plugs, then I'd recommend ones that work with Google Assistant, those are most likely to work with Google Home Hub.

In fairness to Google, they have been very open to third party devices working with Google Assistant, even where Google/Nest have competing products. For instance my Netatmo Thermostat works exactly the same as a Nest thermostat does on Google Home, no difference at all.

I'd assume that will continue with the Home Hub.

Blanchy90

kaisersose77 wrote: »

Did you ring up and place an order for two at the same time or did you place separate orders to get the €130 price?

Cheers

Yeh I ordered at the same time there was no issue getting that price

kaisersose77

I rang earlier today and was told second nest would be 270 euros. WIll try again another day as I'm not paying that when the gas and boiler service offer would/should make the cost of a second nest 209euros max.

Blanchy90

kaisersose77 wrote: »

I rang earlier today and was told second nest would be 270 euros. WIll try again another day as I'm not paying that when the gas and boiler service offer would/should make the cost of a second nest 209euros max.

Are you ordering 2 nests or getting the home comfort kit and an additional nest?

Soarer

Blanchy90 wrote: »

Are you ordering 2 nests or getting the home comfort kit and an additional nest?

I asked them about the comfort pack and the extra Nest, and they said no joy.

So it looks like you got lucky.

Soarer

Another day, another quandary!

I'm wondering if I'm not starting at the start, but somewhere in the middle? The end game is a fairly automated house, including heating, lighting, plugs, etc.

So I guess, should I be looking at Google Home, Alexa, etc. to see which one of them is best/user friendly, has the best app, etc.? And then, once that's settled, get whatever peripherals suit?