Farming: A dangerous occupation.

blackbox

I'm delighted to see this important topic in the main farming forum rather than sidelined into "safety and off-season".

Danzy

blackbox wrote: »

I worked for a large manufacturing multinational for many years where safety was considered to be a high priority.

The fact that you had multiple serious incidents would have indicated that your setup was far from very good and safe (no offence intended).

Every setup would have been reviewed before being put to use to anticipate any possible issues and eliminate them. If issues arose afterwards (and an issue that caused someone to miss a day from work was considered very serious) the setup and method of use would be reviewed again to see how and why it happened. Either the equipment or work method would be changed to prevent a recurrence. Not quite air crash investigation, but you get the picture.

This might sound very time-consuming and inefficient and costly. It definitely took some time, but in the medium to long term it boosted efficiency and saved money.

In addition to this it boosted morale and improved industrial relations.

The motto was that everyone was entitled to go home safe to their families after a day's work.

Unfortunately it is very difficult to see where the leadership will come from to make a similar transformation in farming, where there are so many individually run farms.

Things can be improved, safety wise, but you are talking chalk and cheese.

Nekarsulm

Its the lityle things that make s big difference.
The broken PTO cover you've been meaning to fix.
Changing an agitation gang slat for a safer version.
A better crush headgate or walkway etc.

Its a pity the grant scheme a few years ago only kicked in if you spent several thousand euro, because a thousand spent on 3 or 4 tbings could make a big difference.

blackdog1

4 weeks ago ended up in accident and emergency from getting straight avalkasan in my eye luckily there was water close by otherwise I'd have been in serious trouble.. Still spent 3 hours with a drip in my eye and 2 weeks on drops. Guy there said the place was full of farmers losing eyes. Needless to say I went out and bought 10 packets of safety goggles and I have 2 everywhere there is lime or chemicals.

Bullocks

blackdog1 wrote: »

4 weeks ago ended up in accident and emergency from getting straight avalkasan in my eye luckily there was water close by otherwise I'd have been in serious trouble.. Still spent 3 hours with a drip in my eye and 2 weeks on drops. Guy there said the place was full of farmers losing eyes. Needless to say I went out and bought 10 packets of safety goggles and I have 2 everywhere there is lime or chemicals.

I got 12 hours of that horrible drip in the eye after getting skim in it. It's a rotten feeling especially when they let the fluid run out of half an hour before changing the next pouch!

Cattlepen

blackbox wrote: »

I worked for a large manufacturing multinational for many years where safety was considered to be a high priority.

The fact that you had multiple serious incidents would have indicated that your setup was far from very good and safe (no offence intended).

Every setup would have been reviewed before being put to use to anticipate any possible issues and eliminate them. If issues arose afterwards (and an issue that caused someone to miss a day from work was considered very serious) the setup and method of use would be reviewed again to see how and why it happened. Either the equipment or work method would be changed to prevent a recurrence. Not quite air crash investigation, but you get the picture.

This might sound very time-consuming and inefficient and costly. It definitely took some time, but in the medium to long term it boosted efficiency and saved money.

In addition to this it boosted morale and improved industrial relations.

The motto was that everyone was entitled to go home safe to their families after a day's work.

Unfortunately it is very difficult to see where the leadership will come from to make a similar transformation in farming, where there are so many individually run farms.

I can see how this works well and it is the way it should be. Everyone is entitled to go home safely
BUT, how do you tell that to a cow who’s chin you can scratch out in the field all year turns in to a ferocious near tone weight of a beast that wants to kill you when she calves? You can say she should be removed from the herd but I have seen third calvers that had no aggressive history turning into maniacs.
My cattle handling setup was imported from new zealand and is state of the art with immobilizer crush, curved panels etc. I have 5 calving pens each with its own calving gate. Cattle sheds are setup so that cattle can be easily herded without walking through them.
Even with all this,especially with large numbers of cows, there is that chance danger factor that can’t be accounted for. Animals have their own mind and attitude that can change in the blink of an eye. Systems or analytics won’t change that.
But one thing that will make it safer for me is Bye Bye sucklers!!!!

riemann

Cattlepen wrote: »

I would like to think I have a very good, safe setup for handling and calving livestock.


....

In spite of this i’ve Been knocked unconscious a few times, got a broken heal bone, broken wrist and had the spring clip on the chain to secure a calving gate go straight through my finger.

Those two statements contradict each other.

Farming is safer than it's ever been.

There seems to be an almost sneering attitude to health and safety amongst some farmers. As if taking safety precautions is some sort of cowardly act, not for real men.

Cattlepen

riemann wrote: »

Those two statements contradict each other.

Farming is safer than it's ever been.

There seems to be an almost sneering attitude to health and safety amongst some farmers. As if taking safety precautions is some sort of cowardly act, not for real men.

Personally I dont think they contradict each other. Read my last post. My set up is clearly described. State of the art . I’m not sure if your used to farming on a large scale or what type of farming your at but dry stock can’t carry the cost of Labour and if you get into it in a big way accidents are inevitable.
I’m not being macho. It is just the realty of it as I see it

Cattlepen

And I certainly don’t sneer at health and safety. I have an up to date safety statement. Pto shafts covered etc. I have been inspected by teagasc to have students and passed with flying colors. Farming is just a dangerous occupation especially with cattle although it was a ram that broke my wrist

Cattlepen

riemann wrote: »

Those two statements contradict each other.

Farming is safer than it's ever been.”



And if you want to talk about contradiction your statement is a good one. 24 deaths in 2017. Real safe

TheBoyConor

It's reading things like this makes me so glad that I didn't get involved in taking on the family farm. A mugs game as far as I'm concerned. It's leased now which, for me at least, is a lot safer and less hassle.

riemann

Cattlepen wrote: »

Personally I dont think they contradict each other. Read my last post. My set up is clearly described. State of the art . I’m not sure if your used to farming on a large scale or what type of farming your at but dry stock can’t carry the cost of Labour and if you get into it in a big way accidents are inevitable.
I’m not being macho. It is just the realty of it as I see it

Mate you just stated that you've been knocked unconscious a few times. Once would be worrying but a few times?

That is just unfathomable. If you have all the necessary equipment like you say, then by process of elimination it's easy to figure out where the problem lies.

Good luck out there.

Cattlepen

riemann wrote: »

Mate you just stated that you've been knocked unconscious a few times. Once would be worrying but a few times?

That is just unfathomable. If you have all the necessary equipment like you say, then by process of elimination it's easy to figure out where the problem lies.

Good luck out there.

Thanks for that. I ain’t yer mate

Durrus Boy

riemann wrote: »

Mate you just stated that you've been knocked unconscious a few times. Once would be worrying but a few times?

That is just unfathomable. If you have all the necessary equipment like you say, then by process of elimination it's easy to figure out where the problem lies.

Good luck out there.

Unfortunately animals (especially cattle!) neither read or abide by the farm safety statement!!!

Joe Daly

An uncle of mine had cattle sheep he was the coolest man I ever saw around animals he had a great dog that sorted lambs with him for market never saw him using a stick forcely a little tip . He had big cattle never saw him getting hurt with any of the animals .

charolais0153

Joe Daly wrote: »

An uncle of mine had cattle sheep he was the coolest man I ever saw around animals he had a great dog that sorted lambs with him for market never saw him using a stick forcely a little tip . He had big cattle never saw him getting hurt with any of the animals .

Ya. This is a video of cattle mans setup. He makes great use of the whip.
https://youtu.be/m92xY2wIKJk
No wonder he gets hurt all the time

Mooooo

You control as much as you can, where the cattle walk and are handled, etc escape routes, guards on machinery, etc but when dealing with animals and weather conditions can change fast so accidents can and do happen. Having the phone with you or a lone work alarm for older relatives or neighbours would help

whelan2

Neighbour who is a woman nearly 50 and her dad were gathering sticks with their 35 and transport box yesterday. He has a load of stents in and wouldnt be very agile, the tractor started to run away from them and he went to run after it :eek: She pulled him back reckoned he would have been run over otherwise, it's the split minute decisions that lead to injuries and death

TheBoyConor

Why was the tractor not secured with a parking brake?
Was the machine properly maintained?
Was the parking brake working?
Were there even any brakes at all?
If not, then why was the tractor even in use?
And if the aul lad was no longer competent to operate the machine safely then why was he even anywhere near it?

The agri industry has an attitude towards safety that is outrageously cavalier and more or less unheard of in any other industry. And for the most part, it's those with the power to implement safe working practices and their families that suffer. No excuses.
Despite death after needless death, the message never seems to get through.

This used to be the case in construction and things only improved when three HSA started to come down heavy on those who disregarded basic safety, either through hefty fines or by shutting sites down with prohibition notice until the contractor pulled up their socks.

The carrot approach in use with farming currently isn't working and it's only a matter of time before the stick method is brought to bear.

whelan2

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Why was the tractor not secured with a parking brake?
Was the machine properly maintained?
Was the parking brake working?
Were there even any brakes at all?
If not, then why was the tractor even in use?
And if the aul lad was no longer competent to operate the machine safely then why was he even anywhere near it?

The agri industry has an attitude towards safety that is outrageously cavalier and more or less unheard of in any other industry. And for the most part, it's those with the power to implement safe working practices and their families that suffer. No excuses.
Despite death after needless death, the message never seems to get through.

This used to be the case in construction and things only improved when three HSA started to come down heavy on those who disregarded basic safety, either through hefty fines or by shutting sites down with prohibition notice until the contractor pulled up their socks.

The carrot approach in use with farming currently isn't working and it's only a matter of time before the stick method is brought to bear.

They are not farmers, I was giving an example , he has been lorry driving and tractor driving all his life

Muckit

I'd say the last time you seen a 35 was on a bus! But feel free to lecture us!

Cattlepen

charolais0153 wrote: »

Ya. This is a video of cattle mans setup. He makes great use of the whip.
https://youtu.be/m92xY2wIKJk
No wonder he gets hurt all the time

Who’s setup is that

TheBoyConor

Muckit wrote:

I'd say the last time you seen a 35 was on a bus! But feel free to lecture us!

That's the attitude I'm taking about - completely deflecting from the actual issue and having a pop.

And it don't make a difference whether it's a little old 35 or a big T7.235, the same principles for accident prevention ought to apply.

SuperTortoise

TheBoyConor wrote: »

This used to be the case in construction and things only improved when three HSA started to come down heavy on those who disregarded basic safety, either through hefty fines or by shutting sites down with prohibition notice until the contractor pulled up their socks.

And we're now in a situation where it's the complete opposite on building sites, clipboard warriors fresh out of college dictating work procedures when they would'nt know which end of a shovel to sink in the ground.


The HSA done a lot of good on the buildings around the late 90's and early 00's, the problem now is there's so many of them they need to invent work to make it look like they're busy in order to justify their wage. Farming will go the same way as the building sites, almost impossible to do a day's work.

emaherx

TheBoyConor wrote: »

That's the attitude I'm taking about - completely deflecting from the actual issue and having a pop.

And it don't make a difference whether it's a little old 35 or a big T7.235, the same principles for accident prevention ought to apply.

You also jumped to a lot of conclusions about the condition of the tractor. I've seen that exact same situation happen with both a car and a truck and in neither case was the vehicle faulty. Nobody is incapable of making a mistake.

You are right though on many farms safety has far too low a priority. But even in the best run farms accidents can and will happen, there are too many unpredictable factors (farmers have a responsibility to minimize these as much as possible), for one farmers live on their farms unlike construction workers. If a farmer falls over at their back door it's a work place accident, if a construction worker falls over at his back door it's just some guy who fell outside his house.

Dakota Dan

whelan2 wrote: »

Neighbour who is a woman nearly 50 and her dad were gathering sticks with their 35 and transport box yesterday. He has a load of stents in and wouldnt be very agile, the tractor started to run away from them and he went to run after it :eek: She pulled him back reckoned he would have been run over otherwise, it's the split minute decisions that lead to injuries and death

My neighbour was getting fertilizer at the local co op years ago with a tractor and trailer. The fork lift driver was putting two pallets into the trailer from the back as the sides were on. When he pushed the first pallet forward with the second pallet the force started the tractor. The fork lift driver was panicking but my neighbour said let it off it will stop somewhere. The tractor ended up in a stream beside the co op and no one was hurt. Worst thing to do is try to jump on the tractor when it starts moving. Another neighbour in the same area a few years earlier was not so lucky though his tractor took off on a hilly field with a massive drop into a deep ravine, he missed his step trying to mount the moving tractor and was killed and the tractor ended up at the bottom of the ravine.

riemann

Cattlepen wrote: »

Thanks for that. I ain’t yer mate

Someone who gets knocked unconscious frequently needs all the mates they can get.

Seriously though, you can probably get lessons in how to handle cattle properly without causing serious injury to yourself. Maybe some of the students could be worth talking to in that regard, they could point you in the right direction.

Cattlepen

riemann wrote: »

Someone who gets knocked unconscious frequently needs all the mates they can get.

Seriously though, you can probably get lessons in how to handle cattle properly without causing serious injury to yourself. Maybe some of the students could be worth talking to in that regard, they could point you in the right direction.

Good man. I’ve been full time farming since 1989. These unfortunate incidents have happened over the course of my working life which is nearly 30 years. No one said I got knocked unconscious frequently. I said a “few” times. You are trying to make this personal and I really don’t want to be rising to your bait. I think the other posters on this forum know my post was genuine on the subject matter. I’m not going to get into the amounts of stock i’ve Handled or what you’ve handled etc. that would be childish and petty. I wish you success with whatever type of farming your doing and hope you continue to stay safe

patsy_mccabe

I was nearly killed twice and guess what, both times nothing to do with farming.

Cattlepen

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

I was nearly killed twice and guess what, both times nothing to do with farming.

Will ya tell us what happened