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Landlords agent let themselves in

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    #182
    Marcusm
    Registered Users Posts: 10,322 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    Sleeper12 wrote: »
    You seem to argue for the sake of arguing. The periodic inspection is usually reserved for older buildings. It's where an electrician goes in and inspects everything including fusebox, wiring, sockets and lighting. This is a safety inspection. Insurance companies require this on old rental property from time to time. Without the periodic inspection it could not be proved if the building was safe. This in itself can be classified as an emergency. Added to the safety concerns was the fact that the bui would have no insurance without the certificate. If there was a fire & Tennant got badly injured or died there would be no insurance in place.

    You might not believe it to be an emergency & you are entitled to that opinion however your opinion was irrelevant in this case. A landlord does not have to justify himself to every Tom, dick and Harry. So long as he is able to convince the governing body that is all that matters.

    On the same point the landlord didn't care if he got into trouble. It was more important to him to ensure that his building wasn't a fire hazard and safe for the tenant. It was vital to him to have full insurance cover to protect himself and his tenant. Sometimes you have to act immediately and pay the consequences, if there are any.

    Driving instructor on the radio a few weeks ago. Told a story where learner driver almost hit a opening car door rather than break a solid white line with no oncoming traffic. Obviously this is nuts. Break the white line to avoid an accident. If it's found that you broke the law then you pay the fine but no lives will be in danger.

    There are two potential wrongs; impermissible entry in violation of thebtenant’s rights and a breach of the tenant’s duty to permit the landlord entry for routine maintenance/inspections.

    Whether you agree with it or not, the balance of the law in ireland is placed on respecting the tenant’s right to occupation of the property to the exclusion of the landlord and/or it’s agents. If a heating system had failed or a tap was dripping, the landlord does not have the legal authority to enter the property even if he felt it would reduce further costs. The lndlord’s remedy in those circumstances is to seek to terminate the tenancy and evict the tenant. In 99% of cases, the landlord and tenant would come to a mutually acceptable outcome. Irrespective, the landlord cannot simply enter the property to reduce his future costs.
    Conversely, if a fire, an unsafe electrical installation or similar was discoveee by the landlord then he would not only be entitled but would be required to enter the property to alleviate the danger.

    What occurred in the OP’s case was the result of a misunderstanding.

    However, if the plumber entered and raised fear in the occupants, perhaps by entering unannounced and refusing to leave, a charge of criminal trespass might be in point.


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    #183
    Squatter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,841 ✭✭✭Squatter


    Graces7 wrote: »
    The law is very clear cut. Seems from this thread though that some landlords are intent on ignoring or twisting it?

    And I do not believe the penultimate sentence either.

    ONLY in emergency and this was not that. Like others if that ever happened here the Gardia would be called and charges pressed. As the one who tried it here learned fast.

    Your propertry is our home, Privacy is law.




    The law is for compliant citizens.



    A tenant acting the arsehole isn't a compliant citizen and may indeed be mentally ill. The landlord was 100% correct to take whatever actions were required in order to ensure the safety of his imbecilic tenant.


    And remember Grace - just because you're a well-behaved tenant doesn't mean that everyone else is.


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    #184
    Marcusm
    Registered Users Posts: 10,322 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    Squatter wrote: »
    The law is for compliant citizens.



    A tenant acting the arsehole isn't a compliant citizen and may indeed be mentally ill. The landlord was 100% correct to take whatever actions were required in order to ensure the safety of his imbecilic tenant.


    And remember Grace - just because you're a well-behaved tenant doesn't mean that everyone else is.

    Ah ha, the universally true “two wrongs make it right” approach. Hmmm.


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    #185
    stinkbomb
    Registered Users Posts: 263 ✭✭stinkbomb


    Marcusm wrote: »
    There are two potential wrongs; impermissible entry in violation of thebtenant’s rights and a breach of the tenant’s duty to permit the landlord entry for routine maintenance/inspections.

    The landlord had no right to enter or send an agent to enter. The tenant does have the right to deny entry for routine maintenance or inspections.
    There is only one potential wrong, legally speaking.

    And the law is for everyone, well behaved, "compliant", or not.


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    #186
    runawaybishop
    Registered Users Posts: 9,504 ✭✭✭runawaybishop


    stinkbomb wrote: »
    The landlord had no right to enter or send an agent to enter. The tenant does have the right to deny entry for routine maintenance or inspections.
    There is only one potential wrong, legally speaking.

    And the law is for everyone, well behaved, "compliant", or not.

    A tenant cannot refuse a reasonable inspection notice. The RTB actually have found fault with landlords not carrying out regular inspections.


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    #187
    stinkbomb
    Registered Users Posts: 263 ✭✭stinkbomb


    runawaybishop wrote: »
    A tenant cannot refuse a reasonable inspection notice. The RTB actually have found fault with landlords not carrying out regular inspections.


    Actually they can. Landlord can evict them for it, but they cannot access the property if tenant says no, until they remove the tenant.
    The law is clear. And very simple: nobody can enter a tenanted property without the express permission of the tenant, except in very limited emergencies or with a legal warrant or court order. This includes the landlord, their agents, the guards, anyone at all.


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    #188
    runawaybishop
    Registered Users Posts: 9,504 ✭✭✭runawaybishop


    stinkbomb wrote: »
    Actually they can. Landlord can evict them for it, but they cannot access the property if tenant says no, until they remove the tenant.
    The law is clear. And very simple: nobody can enter a tenanted property without the express permission of the tenant, except in very limited emergencies or with a legal warrant or court order. This includes the landlord, their agents, the guards, anyone at all.

    That effectively means the same thing, refusal of reasonable notice is not allowed and can result in eviction.


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    #189
    stinkbomb
    Registered Users Posts: 263 ✭✭stinkbomb


    I don't think it is the same thing in practice, not allowed implies that the LL can do the inspection anyway, when they cannot without evicting.


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    #190
    Marcusm
    Registered Users Posts: 10,322 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    stinkbomb wrote: »
    The landlord had no right to enter or send an agent to enter. The tenant does have the right to deny entry for routine maintenance or inspections.
    There is only one potential wrong, legally speaking.

    And the law is for everyone, well behaved, "compliant", or not.

    I think you need to reread my post and you will see that I stated that no entry can lawfully occur without the tenant’s permission (absent an emergency such as a fire). Selective quoting demeans your post rather than mine.


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