NBA Regular Season & Playoffs 2018-19 Thread

ButtersSuki

Windhorst today describing the attempts by Klutch/LeBron/Paul yo get AD traded to the Lakers as “unsavory”. That’s about as bad as it gets from him to be fair.

ButtersSuki

Hitch2222 wrote: »

Yes, you are absolutely completely and utterly wrong that I am giving him a free pass on those Jewish comments. I simply highlighted that if they're in play as a rationale for determining he has received more free passes than any athlete in history, then there must be an abundance of other disgraceful transgressions that can be used to determine your "more free passes than any athlete in history comment"

Frankly I think it's absolutely disgraceful that you are alluding to me condoning the use of them because I did not remotely say that whatsoever. You were the one who brought up those comments and used them as leverage in concluding that LBJ received more free passes than anyone in history.
I simply stated that if you happy to submit them as evidence for reaching that conclusion that there are other athlete transgressions such as physical violence against women which are clearly worse than those comments which athletes have gotten away with.
It doesn't mean he shouldn't have been punished, I actually highlighted the (lack of) repercussions for what he said.

You should be extremely careful when making accusations about people even on an open forum.
I didn't remotely conclude that you believe anything you claimed about LBJ superseded any of the actions I concluded were worse.

I'm finished this conversation because that is absolutely ridiculous and so incredibly reckless on your part to say such a thing.

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

You’re wasting your time. Butter’s posting history on LeBron is twisted in hate. There’s no middle ground to be found here.

Wow the drama queens are out in force today. Way to take what I said out of context.:rolleyes:

I’ve frequently said he’s the best player on the planet. Even now, despite his age. Happy now? if I was the hater you claim I wouldn’t say that.

That however does not mean he’s perfect and his game doesn’t have flaws.....something that is routinely ignored on this thread.

Hitch2222

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Wow the drama queens are out in force today. Way to take what I said out of context.:rolleyes:

I’ve frequently said he’s the best player on the planet. Even now, despite his age. Happy now? if I was the hater you claim I wouldn’t say that.

That however does not mean he’s perfect and his game doesn’t have flaws.....something that is routinely ignored on this thread.

You're so incredibly out of order and blatantly in the wrong in this situation, the failure to acknowledge it, let alone apologise is truly unbelievable.

It's amazing that you don't realise the potential impact of accusing someone of being dismissive of a racially offensive situation and then accusing them of being a "drama queen" is incredibly ridiculous while also being rather ironic.

ButtersSuki

Hitch2222 wrote: »

You're so incredibly out of order and blatantly in the wrong in this situation, the failure to acknowledge it, let alone apologise is truly unbelievable.

It's amazing that you don't realise the potential impact of accusing someone of being dismissive of a racially offensive situation and then accusing them of being a "drama queen" is incredibly ridiculous while also being rather ironic.

I didn’t accuse you being of dismissive of a racially offensive comment. You really are seeing things there that I didn’t say there.

I mentioned the Jewish comments he made recently vis a vis how they were handled by the US Media. I also gave the analogy that gas someone like Boogie Cousins etc. made the same comment he would be vilified. There’s a double standard that exodus with LeBron and other athletes. He gets away with things others wouldn’t, and gets less criticism than others when he does mess up.....he gets a pass if you will. If you don’t think that or believe that I don’t know what to say to you, because there are lots of examples, the light treatment he received on the Jewosh comments being one.

ButtersSuki

Anyway.....the Top 3 in the East all tooled up and arguably all got better. Boston freed a roster spot by trading Bird so they’re looking for a buyout I’d assume. The Raptors also have 5 roster spots left so there will be more movement to come.

Hitch2222

ButtersSuki wrote: »

I didn’t accuse you being of dismissive of a racially offensive comment. You really are seeing things there that I didn’t say there.

In response to the above, this was your comment I was referring to when I said you accused me of being dismissive of a racially offensive comment:

ButtersSuki wrote: »

You also seem to be giving him a pass on the Jewish comments - correct me if I'm wrong?
.

And just to clarify, this was my full comment you were claiming was not what you said:

Hitch2222 wrote: »

It's amazing that you don't realise the potential impact of accusing someone of being dismissive of a racially offensive situation and then accusing them of being a "drama queen" is incredibly ridiculous while also being rather ironic.

Now, can you please highlight where the tangible distinction lies between my conclusion that you were suggesting I was dismissive of a racially offensive comment and what you are actually quoted above as saying??

That's my primary issue now so perhaps we can clear up how I'm a drama queen in all of this because I do find what you said offensive because I did not remotely insinuate that I was giving him a pass on the Jewish comment.

ButtersSuki

Yes, I asked you to clarify if you were giving him a pass onnthat or not, as your first reply wasn't clear. The question mark at the end of the sentence indicates that it was a question, not an accusation. Hope that clarifies the matter for you?

Delighted to see (unlike some elements of the media) that you aren’t giving him a pass for it btw.

Hitch2222

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Yes, I asked you to clarify if you were giving him a pass onnthat or not, as your first reply wasn't clear. The question mark at the end of the sentence indicates that it was a question, not an accusation. Hope that clarifies the matter for you?

Delighted to see (unlike some elements of the media) that you aren’t giving him a pass for it btw.

You led with the assumption I was giving him a free pass. How someone doesn't understand the difference between posing their assumption like

ButtersSuki wrote: »

You also seem to be giving him a pass on the Jewish comments - correct me if I'm wrong?
.

Opposed to something like this:

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Do you believe he should be given a free pass for his Jewish comment?
.

Especially in light of the person being accused not having remotely alluded to giving him any sort of pass makes it that little bit more accusatory.

It's a malignant point discussed within the sphere of a relatively anodyne topic. My annoyance stems from the fact that there is clear asymmetry involved when someone makes a comment the way you did and concludes that it is a truly objective question when it is in fact not.

I believe you should be more careful when making claims about what people were trying to say because if it wasn't so blatantly clear to everyone that I did not remotely even insinuate what you think I did, recovering and clarifying my comments becomes an uphill battle which is where the clear asymmetry exists.

ButtersSuki

Hitch2222 wrote: »

You led with the assumption I was giving him a free pass. How someone doesn't understand the difference between posing their assumption like



Opposed to something like this:




Especially in light of the person being accused not having remotely alluded to giving him any sort of pass makes it that little bit more accusatory.

It's a malignant point discussed within the sphere of a relatively anodyne topic. My annoyance stems from the fact that there is clear asymmetry involved when someone makes a comment the way you did and concludes that it is a truly objective question when it is in fact not.

I believe you should be more careful when making claims about what people were trying to say because if it wasn't so blatantly clear to everyone that I did not remotely even insinuate what you think I did, recovering and clarifying my comments becomes an uphill battle which is where the clear asymmetry exists.

I clarified that I didn’t accuse you. If you can’t accept that, that’s on you.

Hitch2222

ButtersSuki wrote: »

I clarified that I didn’t accuse you. If you can’t accept that, that’s on you.

It's quite clear for anyone to read that you did and the framing of the "question" was incendiary.

However you're completely entitled to persist with your state of intransigence, others have also pointed how obdurate you are on other topics so at least you're consistent.

ButtersSuki

Hitch2222 wrote: »

It's quite clear for anyone to read that you did and the framing of the "question" was incendiary.

However you're completely entitled to persist with your state of intransigence, others have also pointed how obdurate you are on other topics so at least you're consistent.

As this is clearly affecting you enormously, please accept my most sincere contrafribularities by way of apology.

Now can we get back to basketball?

Hitch2222

ButtersSuki wrote: »

As this is clearly affecting you enormously, please accept my most sincere contrafribularities by way of apology.

Now can we get back to basketball?

Please do, we're all waiting for your latest LBJ related post.

Hitch2222

Harris seemed to slot in quite seamlessly to the Sixers last night.

It looks to be an immediate fit with him and JJ combining for 8/10 from 3pt range.
It'll be interesting to see what happens moving forward but it's a lot of scorers to feed.

ButtersSuki

Hitch2222 wrote: »

Harris seemed to slot in quite seamlessly to the Sixers last night.

It looks to be an immediate fit with him and JJ combining for 8/10 from 3pt range.
It'll be interesting to see what happens moving forward but it's a lot of scorers to feed.

Yes, they now have 5 players averaging 17 or more ppg. That’s very rare, and shows how strong they are 1-5. But they have very little depth beyond that.

Hitch2222

Although I think the front office and head coach have done a fantastic job in recent years, it feels like the Celtics are coming apart at the seams.

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/25961731/clippers-come-back-28-points-kyrie-irving-exits-game-knee-sprain
Kyries knee "buckled" and Morris talking about players attitudes.

If that's true and it all implodes it will be interesting to see how the narrative perhaps switches around on all the fantastic moves that Ainge has orchestrated.

The signing of Horford may be viewed as poorly aligned timeline.

Signing of Hayward on a max deal in a position they're loaded at.

Tatum & Brown's failure to take the leap after such promising starts especially given Markelle Fultz renaissance at the Magic.

Perhaps the failure to keep Kyrie after this season too.

Obviously just joking on some points but some of those are not farfetched and given fans are so fickle, the praise the front office has garnered may subside quite quickly.

I think the remainder of this season and the summer is their most vital summer in years.

ButtersSuki

Well you don't see stuff like this every day.......

https://twitter.com/BarstoolHubbs/status/1094397898769469440

For Forks Sake

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Well you don't see stuff like this every day.......

Was literally about to post that up. He's an absolute freak. You'd have to be concerned about the toll a pro career would take on him, but he's going to be a lot of fun to watch

ButtersSuki

Hitch2222 wrote: »

Although I think the front office and head coach have done a fantastic job in recent years, it feels like the Celtics are coming apart at the seams.

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/25961731/clippers-come-back-28-points-kyrie-irving-exits-game-knee-sprain
Kyries knee "buckled" and Morris talking about players attitudes.

If that's true and it all implodes it will be interesting to see how the narrative perhaps switches around on all the fantastic moves that Ainge has orchestrated.

The signing of Horford may be viewed as poorly aligned timeline.

Signing of Hayward on a max deal in a position they're loaded at.

Tatum & Brown's failure to take the leap after such promising starts especially given Markelle Fultz renaissance at the Magic.

Perhaps the failure to keep Kyrie after this season too.

Obviously just joking on some points but some of those are not farfetched and given fans are so fickle, the praise the front office has garnered may subside quite quickly.

I think the remainder of this season and the summer is their most vital summer in years.

I'd agree there's a lot on the line and it could go horribly wrong, but I disagree on the likelihood of same and I'm not sure where the fans are so fickle line is coming from? That's not a Boston thing to be fair.

Horford was a consolation prize in the KD sweepstakes. He was the best available FA that summer after KD.

No-one could have predicted the Hayward injury and the failure to recover from same. That said, I did think they overpaid salary-wise (I know they had no choice, but it's another way of saying I wouldn't have done the deal) and I did think he was over-rated in Utah (best player on an ok team stats line filling type scenario). Part of it felt like doing Brad a solid as he and Hayward go back to when Hayward was a kid - so an emotional decision if you will. I do think it's been their biggest mis-step - and this is not revisionist hindsight.

I will absolutely agree if Kyrie walks it will F*ck Sh*t Up big time, from the move itself to the knock on effects.

But I honestly think things are going to work out just fine. And Im happy to give up Tatum in any AD deal. I wouldn't even think twice about it.

Hitch2222

ButtersSuki wrote: »

I'd agree there's a lot on the line and it could go horribly wrong, but I disagree on the likelihood of same and I'm not sure where the fans are so fickle line is coming from? That's not a Boston thing to be fair.

Horford was a consolation prize in the KD sweepstakes. He was the best available FA that summer after KD.

No-one could have predicted the Hayward injury and the failure to recover from same. That said, I did think they overpaid salary-wise (I know they had no choice, but it's another way of saying I wouldn't have done the deal) and I did think he was over-rated in Utah (best player on an ok team stats line filling type scenario). Part of it felt like doing Brad a solid as he and Hayward go back to when Hayward was a kid - so an emotional decision if you will. I do think it's been their biggest mis-step - and this is not revisionist hindsight.

I will absolutely agree if Kyrie walks it will F*ck Sh*t Up big time, from the move itself to the knock on effects.

But I honestly think things are going to work out just fine. And Im happy to give up Tatum in any AD deal. I wouldn't even think twice about it.

Likelihood of the same?

I'm not referring to Boston fans, sports fans are fickle and Boston is no different.
It's obviously a fantastic sporting city but they're no less likely to adhere to some availability bias than any other fans.

My point was not whether Horford was the best available or how unlucky Hayward was, both are entirely true but that is not necessarily what fans will remember if everything implodes, these issues become far more salient and may be viewed as worse misteps than they deserve to be.

Working out fine is relative, 18 months ago, one might have argued that Boston had the best LT trajectory of any team in the league but now I suspect that doesn't seem to be the case.

Paully D

Early days obviously, but Tobias Harris looks a great fit in Philly.

Really good win for them tonight.

Embiid with a monsterous game (37/14).

jonok28

ButtersSuki wrote: »

I'd agree there's a lot on the line and it could go horribly wrong, but I disagree on the likelihood of same and I'm not sure where the fans are so fickle line is coming from? That's not a Boston thing to be fair.

Horford was a consolation prize in the KD sweepstakes. He was the best available FA that summer after KD.

No-one could have predicted the Hayward injury and the failure to recover from same. That said, I did think they overpaid salary-wise (I know they had no choice, but it's another way of saying I wouldn't have done the deal) and I did think he was over-rated in Utah (best player on an ok team stats line filling type scenario). Part of it felt like doing Brad a solid as he and Hayward go back to when Hayward was a kid - so an emotional decision if you will. I do think it's been their biggest mis-step - and this is not revisionist hindsight.

I will absolutely agree if Kyrie walks it will F*ck Sh*t Up big time, from the move itself to the knock on effects.

But I honestly think things are going to work out just fine. And Im happy to give up Tatum in any AD deal. I wouldn't even think twice about it.

Boston are going to be just fine, Even if they lose Irving, don't get Davis and don't make a good play off run they still have a solid young core, good picks and a top 10 Coach and GM. Plus half the Reports and Media members are from Boston so I'm sure they will also paint them in a favourable light .

Dave147

Two bad games for the Celtics back to back but not overly worried, been impressed with Roziers cover and Tatum is making some very steady progress, that alley oop the other night was ridiculous. Hayward hasn't done much and a lot is being left to Irving and some amazing 3 point shooting by Smart, really enjoyable team to watch despite the occasional implosion. Thought Daniel Theis has improved markedly lately too, getting some nice blocks.

Hitch2222

Dave147 wrote: »

Two bad games for the Celtics back to back but not overly worried, been impressed with Roziers cover and Tatum is making some very steady progress, that alley oop the other night was ridiculous. Hayward hasn't done much and a lot is being left to Irving and some amazing 3 point shooting by Smart, really enjoyable team to watch despite the occasional implosion. Thought Daniel Theis has improved markedly lately too, getting some nice blocks.

Well Rozier, Smart & Tatum shoot 36-37% from deep and all of them are around the league average or slightly worse in terms of offensive contribution so I wouldn't be pinning much hope on them making up the offensive load left by Irving through his short term injury or if he leaves.
Theis looks good but he's 26 so ceiling is pretty close.

I think they're the 4th best team in the East and their previous edge of youth and assets doesn't look quite as valuable as before.

irishguitarlad

That was a great win for the Mavs last night. Luka is a class act, that last lay-up with the and 1 was crazy. Good win by Philly as well, they are playing extremely well.

Hitch2222

They took it down but still funny:

https://twitter.com/Paul_HQ/status/1094487031432921088?s=20

ButtersSuki

Hitch2222 wrote: »

Well Rozier, Smart & Tatum shoot 36-37% from deep and all of them are around the league average or slightly worse in terms of offensive contribution so I wouldn't be pinning much hope on them making up the offensive load left by Irving through his short term injury or if he leaves.
Theis looks good but he's 26 so ceiling is pretty close.

I think they're the 4th best team in the East and their previous edge of youth and assets doesn't look quite as valuable as before.

I’m a Boston fan and to be fair they’d likely finish 5th in the east this year but for Oladipo’s injury. They’ll likely finish 4th and I wouldn’t rule anything out in the Play Offs but I’m not optimistic tbh. As someone said last week on some pod or other they have the smallest margin of error of anyone of the top 4 in the east in the play offs.

ButtersSuki

Hitch2222 wrote: »

They took it down but still funny:

https://twitter.com/Paul_HQ/status/1094487031432921088?s=20

Twitter comments were hilarious. I esp. liked the “looks like Billy McFarland is behind this” line.

Paully D

Completely agree with Stein on this:

https://twitter.com/thesteinline/status/1094995410995892232?s=21

It’d never happen of course, but one day I’d love to see a franchise say “**** it”, tell the player “no, you’re not going anywhere” and out of bitterness sit him for the duration of his contract, allowing him to walk upon expiry.

jonok28

Paully D wrote: »

Completely agree with Stein on this:

https://twitter.com/thesteinline/status/1094995410995892232?s=21

I don't, the Spurs got fined when they sat Manu, Tony and Duncan so they could rest for the playoffs. The League is openly threatening to fine the Pelicans because they would be openly tanking when they have a fully fit Superstar on their roster. Why would fans show up to a game if they knew they are going to try and lose every game, where they would be spending hard earned money and the main attraction is being told to stay home. If the Lakers did it they would be cursed out by every single team in the league.

Teams need to know there is repercussions for openly tanking.

Here's what Bucks co-owner Marc Lasry told Sporting News' Mitch Lawrence on Thursday about a report suggesting Milwaukee was one of four clubs Davis would sign a long-term contract with:

"I saw that report, and I think it's great. It's a little bit of what we want. We want players to come and play in Milwaukee. And part of it is, when you're winning and you're setting a standard for excellence, people see that. People want to win.

Lasry is speaking in somewhat general terms here. But he had more to add:

It doesn't make a difference if you're in Milwaukee, New York or LA. The whole goal is winning. So we hope it would be players like Anthony Davis and others who want to come to Milwaukee.

The Lakers get crucified if they mention someones name and the Bucks do it an nobody cares. Absolutely ridiculous.

ButtersSuki

jonok28 wrote: »

I don't, the Spurs got fined when they sat Manu, Tony and Duncan so they could rest for the playoffs. The League is openly threatening to fine the Pelicans because they would be openly tanking when they have a fully fit Superstar on their roster. Why would fans show up to a game if they knew they are going to try and lose every game, where they would be spending hard earned money and the main attraction is being told to stay home. If the Lakers did it they would be cursed out by every single team in the league.

Teams need to know there is repercussions for openly tanking.

Here's what Bucks co-owner Marc Lasry told Sporting News' Mitch Lawrence on Thursday about a report suggesting Milwaukee was one of four clubs Davis would sign a long-term contract with:

"I saw that report, and I think it's great. It's a little bit of what we want. We want players to come and play in Milwaukee. And part of it is, when you're winning and you're setting a standard for excellence, people see that. People want to win.

Lasry is speaking in somewhat general terms here. But he had more to add:

It doesn't make a difference if you're in Milwaukee, New York or LA. The whole goal is winning. So we hope it would be players like Anthony Davis and others who want to come to Milwaukee.

The Lakers get crucified if they mention someones name and the Bucks do it an nobody cares. Absolutely ridiculous.

You’re right that it’s absolutely ridiculous. It’s absolutely ridiculous you think what LA/Klutch/LeBron/Paul did is even in the same league as those comments.