Peter Casey believes Travellers should not be recognised as an ethnic minority

FixdePitchmark

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Looking for things is not the same as getting them. There are all sorts of groups and organisations and people looking for things and laws.

SEMS is a symbolic gesture intended to foster inclusiveness and parity of esteem.

Welfare and housing entitlements are available to a wide cross section of the population. If you cherrypick one handout to castigate a community and people ignore all the other people and communities who recieve them, then yes, those people will probably vote for you. :rolleyes:

can I just ask one question

Is it intended that this group of houses are only for travelers ?

I'm being serious what is the logic of that ?

That is very poor for social inclusion to be honest and is more ghetto like

q85dw7osi4lebg

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Imagine in a country with our history having a president who in order to get elected targeted a minority.

Very very sad if it happens.

You are targeting the minority - joe public. Casey has it in the bag.

Calhoun

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Looking for things is not the same as getting them. There are all sorts of groups and organisations and people looking for things and laws.

SEMS is a symbolic gesture intended to foster inclusiveness and parity of esteem.

Welfare and housing entitlements are available to a wide cross section of the population. If you cherrypick one handout to castigate a community and people ignore all the other people and communities who recieve them, then yes, those people will probably vote for you. :rolleyes:

Its made that bit easier when at the height of a housing crisis that a community is able to just walk away from 1.7M worth of housing. We are also to believe said community which has had violent streaks in the past will not do anything to anyone who would move into those houses.

I disagree on the ethnic entitlement as they are playing the game very well in terms of making sure they get more rights than other Irish people.

Spanish Eyes

wexie wrote: »

That's what I don't get, if there are so many good sides to their culture why not promote them, show us what they are about.

I've asked before and literally the only answer I've ever gotten was 'music'.

Plenty of reality shows about Travelers, where are the ones that paint a positive picture?

Or even a YouTube channel?

Well two sites keep their bins with the handles out. Fair play to them and the sites quoted are very clean indeed.

But heck, they are not those to whom we are referring at all. Pity the remaining cohort are not condemned in the same way the "nice" Travellers are just because they are all Travellers.

All for one and one for all. The "nice" Travellers should be on Pavee's case every day and should disassociate themselves from the scumbag element that Pavee supports.

The good Travellers can keep their traditions (whatever they are, I still don't know), but can also call out their mad brothers and sisters. But no, they are terrified of the repercussions of letting down the clan I reckon. There is no win.

SEPT 23 1989

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

sure where would we be without him.

Is fun / but we can't lose national logic.

He is a useless candidate, very poor to communicate at times and very removed from real life.

The Irish electric will tend to go for the professor / artistic type

The 3 dragons in this is a joke. Casey is a real Ivory Tower type - we don't go for that.

And how is MdH not living in an Ivory Tower ?

Never created a job or worked in his life

His only saving grace is that he is a football man soccer that is

FrancieBrady

Calhoun wrote: »

Its made that bit easier when at the height of a housing crisis that a community is able to just walk away from 1.7M worth of housing. We are also to believe said community which has had violent streaks in the past will not do anything to anyone who would move into those houses.

I disagree on the ethnic entitlement as they are playing the game very well in terms of making sure they get more rights than other Irish people.

That community is not homeless for a start.
They have said they are happy for the houses to go to others. (and that was printed in the IT before Casey opened his mouth)

Someone needs to get the finger out in Tipperary which has 900+ on the housing list.

What extra rights have they? You cannot keep saying that without showing us what those extra rights are.

tayto lover

Are you on overtime again Francie?

Calhoun

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Well two sites keep their bins with the handles out. Fair play to them and the sites quoted are very clean indeed.

But heck, they are not those to whom we are referring at all. Pity the remaining cohort are not condemned in the same way the "nice" Travellers are just because they are all Travellers.

All for one and one for all. The "nice" Travellers should be on Pavee's case every day and should disassociate themselves from the scumbag element that Pavee supports.

The good Travellers can keep their traditions (whatever they are, I still don't know), but can also call out their mad brothers and sisters. But no, they are terrified of the repercussions of letting down the clan I reckon. There is no win.

Take the bray example in the above, i can tell you of 2-3 sites in the area of Bray that they showed the really bad part of their culture. All ill say is nothing quite like closing down a national road because your having a brawl across it.

If we saw what was actually the good part of their culture and they condemned crime no matter who it was like the rest of us it be all good.

Spanish Eyes

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

can I just ask one question

Is it intended that this group of houses are only for travelers ?

I'm being serious what is the logic of that ?

That is very poor for social inclusion to be honest and is more ghetto like

Well in fairness would you live beside them? Horsesh!it if you say yes and the reference to the horses is relevant.

From what I see on Google maps there is a huge green area there anyway so the horses would be fine. But there might not be room to move in twenty caravans either. What a dilemma.

Calhoun

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Well in fairness would you live beside them? Horsesh!it if you say yes and the reference to the horses is relevant.

From what I see on Google maps there is a huge green area there anyway so the horses would be fine. But there might not be room to move in twenty caravans either. What a dilemma.

They were also built for them to stop them illegally squatting on the land across the road. So yes they were built just for them, just like where i live now there is a housing estate of 10 houses that is just traveller only.

Spanish Eyes

tayto lover wrote: »

Are you on overtime again Francie?

I cannot believe that poster is so prolific. But hey, it's his sad life. Who am I to judge, just find it amazing that someone has so much time to post. But hey, maybe others use his log in and do it for him also on shift. :pac:

Spanish Eyes

Calhoun wrote: »

They were also built for them to stop them illegally squatting on the land across the road. So yes they were built just for them, just like where i live now there is a housing estate of 10 houses that is just traveller only.

The irony is, that if they refuse to move in, other homeless people might be very nervous about taking those lovely houses, knowing the history of this, and the potential recipients being across the road.

I think the Travellers have won this one. But it is such an indictment on life today in Ireland, that this could happen.

lesliescott586

Those houses would be burnt out before they were even moved in to if the council reassigned them.

Calhoun

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

The irony is, that if they refuse to move in, other homeless people might be very nervous about taking those lovely houses, knowing the history of this, and the potential recipients being across the road.

I think the Travellers have won this one. But it is such an indictment on life today in Ireland, that this could happen.

Indeed it is that we are basically at ransom of seeing 1.6M being essentially pissed into the ground or to give more land and stables. You know that even if people don't move in they will be destroyed.

FixdePitchmark

Calhoun wrote: »

They were also built for them to stop them illegally squatting on the land across the road. So yes they were built just for them, just like where i live now there is a housing estate of 10 houses that is just traveller only.

But if they want to become housed - is that not becoming "settled" .

If you are becoming "settled" - why would you want a special case, it is generally accepted that putting people from the same background when social deprivation is part of their history , is not a good thing.

You seem to be causing a problem from the off.

Spanish Eyes

Calhoun wrote: »

Indeed it is that we are basically at ransom of seeing 1.6M being essentially pissed into the ground or to give more land and stables. You know that even if people don't move in they will be destroyed.

Well to be fair I am not sure the houses would be destroyed, but for sure other potential recipients would be very wary of taking those lovely houses because of the backstory.

McMurphy

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Imagine in a country with our history having a president who in order to get elected targeted a minority.

Very very sad if it happens.

Francie, we normally see eye to eye on most subject's, and I have admired a lot of your posts on this site, but I'm afraid I have to call you out on this one, and we are going to have to disagree on the whole traveller ethnic minority thing.

Casey didn't target a minority, this is very disingenuous to even insinuate.

I will remind you once again.

Rather than "target" a minority, he was being interviewed for a podcast and was asked for his opinion on travellers being granted special status as an ethnic minority.

He said he personally thought it was nonsense.

He gave an honest answer to a question posed, spoke his mind, and the media and govt overlords thought they'd try and misrepresent his views that everyone as an Irish citizen should be treated equally, was in some way racist/bigoted/divisive, Leo even went to the length of just stopping short of pleading with us not to vote for him.

First they wanted MDH to return to the Aras unabated, unchallenged, and with no election, when that didn't happen, they tried to divide and conquer methods of implying one of the candidates was a racist bigot, and again tried to tell us that MDH was the man we should all be voting for, don't vote for Casey, he's dangerous blah blah blah.

I have little to no interest in traveller bashing, never have, never will, but I'm with Casey on this one that they're just Irish people, like me or you, and giving them special status is in itself divisive and liable to create an us and them stand off, rather than one of inclusiveness.

I share the same views on monarchy, aristocratic and what's known as "the upper class", we're all the same at the end of the day, no one's shyte smells like roses compared to another's, and ultimately we're all going to the same place when we pass on from this life.

I'm voting for Casey not solely on his special status views, I'm going to vote for him because of the aforementioned demonisation the man has been subjected to, both on the media, by our politicians and on here.

But I'm especially giving him my no1 because the Taoiseach of the country thought he has the right to subtly ask me not to.

Higgins just got use to the luxurious surroundings the last 7 years, and the cosy relationship between them all needs to end.

The debates this week will be quality entertainment, something in my water tells me Higgins won't stick the pace, someone's gonna drop a clanger on him, and I don't want to miss it.

All in all, this elections shaping up to be quare auld craic, might even end an 8 week abstention and partake in a frothy cold one.

wexie

Calhoun wrote: »

Indeed it is that we are basically at ransom of seeing 1.6M being essentially pissed into the ground or to give more land and stables. You know that even if people don't move in they will be destroyed.

Surely we could find a different use for them? Could be a good spot for a new Garda station!

Try_harder

That fooking dog video - seriously lads- he is a dope

Calhoun

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

But if they want to become housed - is that not becoming "settled" .

If you are becoming "settled" - why would you want a special case, it is generally accepted that putting people from the same background when social deprivation is part of their history , is not a good thing.

You seem to be causing a problem from the off.

I am not saying they should have been i was just giving the reasoning for why the houses were built. I have also seen evidence elsewhere of houses just built for them in estates.

Sheep breeder

AnneFrank wrote: »

He will get the uneducated vote only, never a chance to win or even compete,but he's got publicity whiach is all he wanted, bang for his buck in terms of campaign spend.

How dare you say anyone who votes for Casey is uneducated, the people on here and out in the general public are well educated and have one major thing freedom of choice and speech. This is a insult to educated hard working tax payer.

FixdePitchmark

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Imagine in a country with our history having a president who in order to get elected targeted a minority.

Very very sad if it happens.

Is that not a bit harsh.

I do think he was wrong.

But the ethnicity issue was a hard fight and fairly heavy hitting debate was had on both sides.

It is still an issue of considerable ambiguity and to suggest it was totally accepted is not fair.

For example if you had a referendum on it, would it pass ?

Yet we consider answers in recent referendum as all knowing.

FixdePitchmark

Try_harder wrote: »

That fooking dog video - seriously lads- he is a dope

he is a dope - is it worse having a dope as a president.

omega man

Whilst I completely disagree with Francie’s views on this subject at least he’s not losing his sh1t and having a go at those he disagrees with (unless I missed that bit!). The world would be a boring place if we all agreed with each other all of the time.

SEPT 23 1989

"Uneducated"

There it is folks

The Mask slips everytime

FrancieBrady

Johnny Dogs wrote: »

Francie, we normally see eye to eye on most subject's, and I have admired a lot of your posts on this site, but I'm afraid I have to call you out on this one, and we are going to have to disagree on the whole traveller ethnic minority thing.

Casey didn't target a minority, this is very disingenuous to even insinuate.

I will remind you once again.

Rather than "target" a minority, he was being interviewed for a podcast and was asked for his opinion on travellers being granted special status as an ethnic minority.

He said he personally thought it was nonsense.

He gave an honest answer to a question posed, spoke his mind, and the media and govt overlords thought they'd try and misrepresent his views that everyone as an Irish citizen should be treated equally, was in some way racist/bigoted/divisive, Leo even went to the length of just stopping short of pleading with us not to vote for him.

First they wanted MDH to return to the Aras unabated, unchallenged, and with no election, when that didn't happen, they tried to divide and conquer methods of implying one of the candidates was a racist bigot, and again tried to tell us that MDH was the man we should all be voting for, don't vote for Casey, he's dangerous blah blah blah.

I have little to no interest in traveller bashing, never have, never will, but I'm with Casey on this one that they're just Irish people, like me or you, and giving them special status is in itself divisive and liable to create an us and them stand off, rather than one of inclusiveness.

I share the same views on monarchy, aristocratic and what's known as "the upper class", we're all the same at the end of the day, no one's shyte smells like roses compared to another's, and ultimately we're all going to the same place when we pass on from this life.

I'm voting for Casey not solely on his special status views, I'm going to vote for him because of the aforementioned demonisation the man has been subjected to, both on the media, by our politicians and on here.

But I'm especially giving him my no1 because the Taoiseach of the country thought he has the right to subtly ask me not to.

Higgins just got use to the luxurious surroundings the last 7 years, and the cosy relationship between them all needs to end.

The debates this week will be quality entertainment, something in my water tells me Higgins won't stick the pace, someone's gonna drop a clanger on him, and I don't want to miss it.

All in all, this elections shaping up to be quare auld craic, might even end an 8 week abstention and partake in a frothy cold one.

A number of things that convinces me you are codding yourself Johnny. And as you say, we'll have to agree to disagree.

He went over and above criticising SEMS and equality in his remarks.

He did target them went he went on a jaunt to Tipp which was basically a PR stunt and nothing else.

I agree Leo shouldn't have gotten involved but Leo suffers from the same love of populist PR .

And lastly, coming from where I do, I believe that people have to be careful of what they incite.

The GFA was all about inclusiveness and parity of esteem, Casey should know all about this and it's value and that is exactly what was intended in SEMS. It does not threaten anyone else's equality and it hurts no-one only those, (like the DUP who still object to the GFA) too entrenched to see it's value or possible value to travellers themselves and those trying to work with them.

I normally enjoy the presidential elections but the prospect of this stunt winning him the Aras fills me with genuine sadness and anger. How ****ing stupid would we be.

looksee

Johnny Dogs wrote: »

Francie, we normally see eye to eye on most subject's, and I have admired a lot of your posts on this site, but I'm afraid I have to call you out on this one, and we are going to have to disagree on the whole traveller ethnic minority thing.

Casey didn't target a minority, this is very disingenuous to even insinuate.

I will remind you once again.

Rather than "target" a minority, he was being interviewed for a podcast and was asked for his opinion on travellers being granted special status as an ethnic minority.

He said he personally thought it was nonsense.

He gave an honest answer to a question posed, spoke his mind, and the media and govt overlords thought they'd try and misrepresent his views that everyone as an Irish citizen should be treated equally, was in some way racist/bigoted/divisive, Leo even went to the length of just stopping short of pleading with us not to vote for him.

First they wanted MDH to return to the Aras unabated, unchallenged, and with no election, when that didn't happen, they tried to divide and conquer methods of implying one of the candidates was a racist bigot, and again tried to tell us that MDH was the man we should all be voting for, don't vote for Casey, he's dangerous blah blah blah.

I have little to no interest in traveller bashing, never have, never will, but I'm with Casey on this one that they're just Irish people, like me or you, and giving them special status is in itself divisive and liable to create an us and them stand off, rather than one of inclusiveness.

I share the same views on monarchy, aristocratic and what's known as "the upper class", we're all the same at the end of the day, no one's shyte smells like roses compared to another's, and ultimately we're all going to the same place when we pass on from this life.

I'm voting for Casey not solely on his special status views, I'm going to vote for him because of the aforementioned demonisation the man has been subjected to, both on the media, by our politicians and on here.

But I'm especially giving him my no1 because the Taoiseach of the country thought he has the right to subtly ask me not to.

Higgins just got use to the luxurious surroundings the last 7 years, and the cosy relationship between them all needs to end.

The debates this week will be quality entertainment, something in my water tells me Higgins won't stick the pace, someone's gonna drop a clanger on him, and I don't want to miss it.

All in all, this elections shaping up to be quare auld craic, might even end an 8 week abstention and partake in a frothy cold one.

And no matter how you argue it, none of that is a good reason for voting for a particular person to be president of the country.

c.p.w.g.w

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

he is a dope - is it worse having a dope as a president.

What video are ye talking about

_Kaiser_

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

"Uneducated"

There it is folks

The Mask slips everytime

This is what happens when the usual "right on" echo chamber brigade encounter dissenting viewpoints.

Because they can't counter them coherently - mostly because they're unable to deal with the concept in the first place - the "debate" descends into pretty name calling and insulting the intelligence of those not "on message"

It's akin to a toddler throwing a tantrum because they don't get told "no" enough.

Calhoun

omega man wrote: »

Whilst I completely disagree with Francie’s views on this subject at least he’s not losing his sh1t and having a go at those he disagrees with (unless I missed that bit!). The world would be a boring place if we all agreed with each other all of the time.

He has called people that don't have the same opinion as him uneducated and bigoted/racist.