Peter Casey believes Travellers should not be recognised as an ethnic minority

gmisk

Bannasidhe wrote: »

LGBT groups get loads of grants.

Awaits rants.

They get some, good (I am gay btw, I havent got any grants!.....disappointed!) I can now get married though, which is nice.
Transgender people imo in particular need support.
So do travellers groups, good people in this underprivileged group need support.
Hopefully they help people in those communities.

Conservative

Bannasidhe wrote: »

gmisk wrote: »

Grants...are not "power or privilege"...lots of disadvantaged groups get grants and support (immigrants etc), they are not "rights".

LGBT groups get loads of grants.

Awaits rants.

You forgot the Q and the + you nazi!!!

maccored

cruizer101 wrote: »

The thing is though most people didn't have the option for voting for someone with those views. Candidates always want to play it safe and not say anything too controversial. In the last GE I voted based on who I disliked the least rather than liked the most.


So saying stop voting in the same candidates doesn't work, there weren't viable other candidates to vote in.


Peter Casey getting in or coming second won't change anything now, but it might come the next GE make more viable alternative candidates put themselves forward, that is my hope anyway, so it isn't a wasted vote to vote for him even though I am pretty confident he won't get in. It is a way for the electorate to have a voice on a particular issue than most candidates didn't go near beforehand.


Also he is now down to 10/1 and 10/15 without MDH on PP

thats a cop out. if people vote for people they dont like, who then get into government and make changes that the same people dont like, then theres no point complaining afterwards.

jmayo

Deleted User wrote: »

Even with those stats I’m not gonna mimic Casey though and state that Travellers ‘basically live in houses’. It would be wrong of me to do so as it is equally wrong for Casey to say what he said.

What is wrong with questioning why a group of travellers have refused to move into houses provided for them because they are not getting special treatment, ala provision of stables and land for grazing ?

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

He won`t get anywhere near 20%. 13 -14% at most and that is not taking account of the strong possibility that Michael D supporters who may originally not have bothered voting now do turn out at the polls.

Actually this got me thinking.

If you look at Mickie D's support it is from 4 political parties, but the party leadership telling it's supporters to vote for someone of another party is not the same as real support for one of their own.
There are going to be a fair few FF and FG members/supporters who would have been lukewarm voters for Higgins and now they have an alternative, an alternative that resonates with lots of rural voters especially.

Also there were some in those parties who felt that they should have stood a candidate themselves.
They could do an old protest vote of sorts to stick it to the leadership.

So it could get very interesting.

Technocentral wrote: »

Look at the attempts to get far right parties off the ground in Ireland, no appetite for them at all, will always be a tiny minority for those views.

What was once termed conservative is now labelled by some, especially in media and around here, as being far right and nazis.
There is a middle ground in Ireland that some are refusing to acknowledge and because they are being ignored, hell now as we see lambasted, they are going to start looking for someone, anyone, to voice their concerns.

FrancieBrady

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

How do exit polls work ?

RTE has commissioned RED C to do an exit poll. They ask people exiting the poll who they voted for.

They will publish the first results on the Late Late Show tomorrow night.

Cue: 'It's a sinister plot by RTE to get people to watch de Turbidy' from the conspiracy nutjobs.

Gravelly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

But... But... Casey never mentioned any of that, he said SEMS made travellers more equal than the rest of us and that travelers are basically people who camp on other people's land.

Are you suggesting Casey really intended to say that??? :eek::eek::eek:

Do you imagine I speak for Casey?

I'm responding to you and your buddy's posts, where you dismiss any criticism of travellers in this thread a racism.

Like I said, you lads have issues with logic.

SafeSurfer

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Sigh...those aren't 'rights'. Do try and keep within the concepts being talked about.

Entitelments are not the same as rights.

There are many many people in this society who are entitled to more than me for various reasons. They are still 'equal' to me though.

No wonder Casey was so able to incite the hate he has incited. :rolleyes:

Throughout this entire thread you have been differentiating between rights and entitlements. What is a right if not a legal entitlement?
Entitlements come from rights.

gmisk

Conservative wrote: »

You forgot the Q and the + you nazi!!!

I dont think most gay people I know would take offense....and I am gay, I dont even know the full acronym.

So am I a nazi or not?!

tretorn

Bannasidhe wrote: »

LGBT groups get loads of grants.

Awaits rants.

Absolutely disgraceful to even put LGBT people in the same sentence as travellers.

What are you trying to say, LGBT couples dont send their children to school and take them shoplifting with them. There is no proof of this so why compare LGBT people to travellers, pathetic.

Young gay travellers have a terrible time living in their "ethnic status" culture. If anyone comes out as gay they will be ostracised or may be in line for physical abuse.

Gravelly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Cue: 'It's a sinister plot by RTE to get people to watch de Turbidy' from the conspiracy nutjobs.

You think that anyone who believes a programme might feature a popular item in an attempt to increase it's audience is a conspiracy nutjub :D:D

Jaysus.

Bannasidhe

Conservative wrote: »

You forgot the Q and the + you nazi!!!

I already have carpal tunnel from adding the Q and + during the Mar Ref.
I'm invoking the disability clause. :cool:

FrancieBrady

Gravelly wrote: »

Do you imagine I speak for Casey?

I'm responding to you and your buddy's posts, where you dismiss any criticism of travellers in this thread a racism.

Like I said, you lads have issues with logic.

Oh so wrong again.

I haven't 'dismissed' anything. I have proved by using facts (I know people here are not fond of such things) that Casey was talking nonsense on his 'starter for ten hate' comments.

jimgoose

gmisk wrote: »

I dont think most gay people I know would take offense....and I am gay, I dont even know the full acronym.

So am I a nazi or not?!

That depends - do you have a rather fetching rubber SS Sturmbannführer uniform?

Huntergonzo

Technocentral wrote: »

Your side has lost, we are never going back to the reactionary right days. The future is progressive. Look at last 2 referendums.

Personally I supported those 2 referendums and I do believe in progessive social policy, however I think we have to be very careful when defining what's progressive and what's oppressive.

I don't think we're too bad in Ireland (yet), but look at all the nonsense in America with 'trigger warnings', 'safe spaces', multiudes of different genders etc, I would hate to see that sort of bollóxolly taking a stranglehold over here.

Economically speaking, I've always been more right leaning, socialism doesn't work, simple as that.

gmisk

Bannasidhe wrote: »

I already have carpal tunnel from adding the Q and + during the Mar Ref.
I'm invoking the disability clause. :cool:

I would worry for your wrists if they are so weak to type a couple of extra letters, you should really see a doctor.

Gravelly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Oh so wrong again.

I haven't 'dismissed' anything. I have proved by using facts (I know people here are not fond of such things) that Casey was talking nonsense on his 'starter for ten hate' comments.

No you haven't.

southstar

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

I doubt Casey will win, but that doesn't matter, if he achieves a substantial vote, well the media cannot hide that fact anymore.

No **** Sherlock...I have to say this particular form of media is full of crackpots and pub bores ...a veritable echo chamber of whiney opinionated clowns....or snowflakes who feel put upon ..(.isn't that they term they love to use.)...who no doubt think Casey will hit gold tomorrow..a Trump like messiah...Good luck with that

Bannasidhe

gmisk wrote: »

They get some, good (I am gay btw, I havent got any grants!.....disappointed!) I can now get married though, which is nice.
Transgender people imo in particular need support.
So do travellers groups, good people in this underprivileged group need support.
Hopefully they help people in those communities.

Oh, I wasn't expecting you to rant.

I was just giving an example of another minority group who gets quite large amounts of money from the State in extra supports.

Are those extra rights? No.
Some people (not you!) can't seem to get their heads around that.

Huntergonzo

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The Left that aren't in power, or the secret Left pulling all the real power strings in da country? :rolleyes:

Oh dear Francie, please teach this simple soul of mine, for I'd be lost without your wisdom ;-)

PlaneSpeeking

gmisk wrote: »

I dont think most gay people I know would take offense....and I am gay, I dont even know the full acronym.

So am I a nazi or not?!

I've plenty of mates who have been called down the rainbow path and their responses to the acronym range from "we just need the G darling!" to others who go the whole LGBTQIA+ route.

I'm reliably informed that currently LGBT is the preferred but that the "T" group want to be separate as hardcore trans activists are at a bit of a war with the LGB group - given as one pal has been told he's a "f***ing bigot" for not wanting to have sex with a biological woman who "identifies" as a man.

He calls himself a triple platinum gay (I think I got that right!) - never slept with a woman, never will sleep with a woman and was a C-section, so never even gone there!!!

Anyway OT but knowledge is always good!

jmayo

Technocentral wrote: »

Your side has lost, we are never going back to the reactionary right days. The future is progressive. Look at last 2 referendums.

Yeah, but that is socially right and the fact people have moved away from the reactionary church has meant those stringent social conservatism is not holding sway anymore.

But the traveller issue, the asylum seeker issue is a different kettle of fish and as been evident with Brexit in UK, the working classes that were once the backers of the socialist movements that pushed all the progressive equality issues are moving away from that party's ethos.

Technocentral wrote: »

Didnt say you couldnt, but tarring every traveller with the same brush isnt on. If travellers want two stables and extra land they should pay for it.

Are travellers now painting the tar on?

It would explain why it doesn't last long. :rolleyes:

FrancieBrady

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Throughout this entire thread you have been differentiating between rights and entitlements. What is a right if not a legal entitlement?
Entitlements come from rights.

Your entitlements do not make you more or less equal than me or anyone else.

Gosh, this is basic 'civics' (as it was called when I was going to school.)

And on the subject, this seems the right moment to re-post this eloquent put down of those who jump up and down about entitlements or people seemingly getting more than them.
James O'Brien of LBC radio responding to anger that Nigel Farage will be getting a bonus payment for leaving the EU of 150,000.
Maybe sit down and think about it, reasonably, in relation to your own anger folks?

Very easy to get cross about this. But, as with things like human rights legislation & even unemployment benefits, a functioning system that helps the deserving has to accommodate the tiny percentage of vile miscreants who abuse it. It’s an uncomfortable requirement of democracy.

pumpkin4life

yeah, there a lot of NGOs and "causes" that are just there to get a big lump of taxpayer cash for a small subsection of people. Look at Colm O Gorman for example. 110k Salary for Amnesty International.

What's that old bible story about teaching a lad to fish?

Throwing 1.7 million euro developments at Travellers and going down the whole "ah poor Travellers" route is not going to alleviate the problems in their community.

Technocentral

Gravelly wrote: »

FrancieBrady wrote: »

But... But... Casey never mentioned any of that, he said SEMS made travellers more equal than the rest of us and that travelers are basically people who camp on other people's land.

Are you suggesting Casey really intended to say that??? :eek::eek::eek:

Do you imagine I speak for Casey?

I'm responding to you and your buddy's posts, where you dismiss any criticism of travellers in this thread a racism.

Like I said, you lads have issues with logic.

??? Those travellers who want extra land and stables are assholes, I object to ALL travellers being tarred with the same brush, thats my problem not legitimate criticism!

jimgoose

southstar wrote: »

No **** Sherlock...I have to say this particular form of media is full of crackpots and pub bores ...a veritable echo chamber of whiney opinionated clowns....or snowflakes who feel put upon ..(.isn't that they term they love to use.)...who no doubt think Casey will hit gold tomorrow..a Trump like messiah...Good luck with that

I can tell you that a lot of fairly astute people are planning on giving Casey #1 and Higgins #2, the idea being that when Casey loses the vote will transfer. The problem being that if enough people think that way the wiry-haired clooter could actually win the wretched thing... :pac::pac::pac:

Gravelly

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Oh, I wasn't expecting you to rant.

I was just giving an example of another minority group who gets quite large amounts of money from the State in extra supports.

Are those extra rights? No.
Some people (not you!) can't seem to get their heads around that.

Of course getting housing that is larger and better than anyone else's confirms a right. Local authorities are obliged to provide traveller-specific housing. Therefore, the Irish state has given travellers the right to specific housing, over and above what non-travellers get.

It's not difficult lads.

gmisk

PlaneSpeeking wrote: »

I've plenty of mates who have been called down the rainbow path and their responses to the acronym range from "we just need the G darling!" to others who go the whole LGBTQIA+ route.

I'm reliably informed that currently LGBT is the preferred but that the "T" group want to be separate as hardcore trans activists are at a bit of a war with the LGB group - given as one pal has been told he's a "f***ing bigot" for not wanting to have sex with a biological woman who "identifies" as a man.

He calls himself a triple platinum gay (I think I got that right!) - never slept with a woman, never will sleep with a woman and was a C-section, so never even gone there!!!

Anyway OT but knowledge is always good!

Your mates sound like they have met some grade A plonkers who happened to be gay, lots of them about gay straight and anything else.

My mates wouldnt go on like that or they wouldnt be my mates.


I think I will use the phrase being called down the rainbow path though thanks!

"I was going to go home...but I was called down the rainbow path!"
"I am sorry I was late for work...I was called down the rainbow path"
etc etc

Bannasidhe

tretorn wrote: »

Absolutely disgraceful to even put LGBT people in the same sentence as travellers.

What are you trying to say, LGBT couples dont send their children to school and take them shoplifting with them. There is no proof of this so why compare LGBT people to travellers, pathetic.

Young gay travellers have a terrible time living in their "ethnic status" culture. If anyone comes out as gay they will be ostracised or may be in line for physical abuse.

Thanks for straightsplaining that to a lesbian.

I said LGBTQ+ (:P) groups get significant funding from the State due to being a minority group. That's it. Feck off with your faux-outrage.

Does this funding confirm extra rights? NO. It bloody well doesn't.

Also - as I have worked with Traveller groups around the issues faced by LGBTQ+ Travellers I reckon I know more about it than you so jog on.

Bannasidhe

gmisk wrote: »

I would worry for your wrists if they are so weak to type a couple of extra letters, you should really see a doctor.

Can't. Apparently Travellers broke the HSE. :mad:

tretorn

The travellers turn up offering to pave the garden, one arrived here and wanted to mark out the garden with a bag of flour. I told him to go but sadly some elderly neighbours didnt. One let him do her garden and he wrecked it and then his buddy turned up. They asked for four grand for the work and told the old lady they would go to the bank with her so she could withdraw the cash, she was too scared to say NO and didnt ring her children.

Another one told an elderly man he needed new roof tiles at the back, he told the elderly man he has already replaced the tiles before knocking on the door and again he wanted hundreds of euros so another trip to the bank.

These really elderly people are terrified and they probably think if they dont hand over the money they will get a visit in the middle of the night.

Anyone word from Pavee Point about members of their "ethnic minority" bringing shame on the whole community,is Pavee points remit to speak on behalf of travellers or is it just to whine about how hard travellers have it.

None of the elderly people who travellers have been convicted of attacking had much wealth at all, the travellers would actually be living on a lot more money than the pensioners they attack. There should be a minimum thirty year sentence with no parole for anyone caught attacking pensioners in their own home.