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Keys for Balcony

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  • 17-10-2018 12:29pm
    #1
    jimwallace197
    Registered Users Posts: 1,134 ✭✭✭


    Hello,

    Just a quick question, is it necessary to provide keys to the balcony of an apartment in rental accomodation if they have been lost by a previous tenant? Thanks


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    #2
    dennyk
    Registered Users Posts: 1,701 ✭✭✭dennyk


    Are you renting a room or the entire property? If the latter, then yes, you'd need to give your tenant access to the balcony, and as it is an exterior door, you would need to give the tenant the ability to lock it for security reasons (assuming it is a double deadbolt, requiring a key on both sides to lock or unlock). It may also be necessary per fire codes for them to be able to access the balcony as a fire escape option, depending on the height of the building and the layout, even if they are just renting a room rather than the entire property.

    It should be very simple to remove the lock from the door and bring it to a locksmith to be rekeyed; it just takes a few minutes and shouldn't cost more than €10-€20, especially if you bring it to them instead of calling one out to your place. No reason at all not to have it done.


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    #3
    The Student
    Registered Users Posts: 1,262 ✭✭✭The Student


    jimwallace197 wrote: »
    Hello,

    Just a quick question, is it necessary to provide keys to the balcony of an apartment in rental accomodation if they have been lost by a previous tenant? Thanks

    As a landlord I would say yes. The balcony forms part of the property and the tenants should be able to access same and secure the door when they are not there.


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    #4
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,335 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    jimwallace197 wrote: »
    Hello,

    Just a quick question, is it necessary to provide keys to the balcony of an apartment in rental accomodation if they have been lost by a previous tenant? Thanks

    Previous tenant lost them, nothing got to do with the new / current tenant.
    He has to have a key to access the balcony and supply of this is at your cost.

    You should obviously keep a copy of the key and if the current tenant loses the key, you can charge him for a replacement.


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    #5
    PhoenixParker
    Registered Users Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭PhoenixParker


    Seems like a fire hazard not to have ready access to the balcony.


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    #6
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,335 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    PhoenixParker wrote: »
    Seems like a fire hazard not to have ready access to the balcony.

    Not really from a technical point of view. Balconies are not designed for escape or rescue under our Fire Safety Regulations. The buildings are built to allow a protected escape vertically and horizontally through the building.

    In the case of a fire, a balcony is the last place I would want to be, but I do understand that if the fire has fully developed and you have nowhere to go, you have no choice.


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    #7
    PhoenixParker
    Registered Users Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭PhoenixParker


    kceire wrote: »
    Not really from a technical point of view. Balconies are not designed for escape or rescue under our Fire Safety Regulations. The buildings are built to allow a protected escape vertically and horizontally through the building.

    In the case of a fire, a balcony is the last place I would want to be, but I do understand that if the fire has fully developed and you have nowhere to go, you have no choice.

    A fire could also start there.


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    #8
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,524 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    jimwallace197 wrote: »
    Hello,

    Just a quick question, is it necessary to provide keys to the balcony of an apartment in rental accomodation if they have been lost by a previous tenant? Thanks

    They should have been replaced with the previous tenants deposit.


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    #9
    Askthe EA
    Registered Users Posts: 724 ✭✭✭Askthe EA


    Just to muddy the waters on this, the leases I use grant a license to tenants to use the balcony and state that this license can be removed at any time for any reason. The point of the clause is that if they are acting the maggot use of the balcony can be withheld. The only way to withhold the use is by locking the balcony door. Its not a fire escape. So, theoretically, you do not have to give tenants access to the balcony.


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    #10
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,335 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Askthe EA wrote: »
    Just to muddy the waters on this, the leases I use grant a license to tenants to use the balcony and state that this license can be removed at any time for any reason. The point of the clause is that if they are acting the maggot use of the balcony can be withheld. The only way to withhold the use is by locking the balcony door. Its not a fire escape. So, theoretically, you do not have to give tenants access to the balcony.

    I'll add more mud to your water.
    The original granting of Planning Permission for the apartments would have included the area of the balconies as private open space to that particular unit and it should be made available to the occupants of that unit.

    If tenants are acting the maggot on the balcony then it's grounds for eviction rather than balcony access is removed.


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    #11
    Askthe EA
    Registered Users Posts: 724 ✭✭✭Askthe EA


    kceire wrote: »
    I'll add more mud to your water.
    The original granting of Planning Permission for the apartments would have included the area of the balconies as private open space to that particular unit and it should be made available to the occupants of that unit.
    .

    Im not a solicitor (nor planner), but I dont see how one can extrapolate the requirement to have balconies to achieve planning permission to a legal requirement to provide access to that balcony for an occupant. Its my understanding that the apartment owner never owns the balcony and that the ownership of same stays with the OMC in any case??


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    #12
    spaceHopper
    Registered Users Posts: 3,991 ✭✭✭spaceHopper


    Leaves blow on to the balcony, the drain blocks it floods to above the level of the damp proof core and water comes into the apartment ! Happend to us the snow in 2010 the gutters on the roof came down our balcony flooded.. get a lock smith and get it sorted at some point you will have to anyway


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    #13
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,335 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Askthe EA wrote: »
    Im not a solicitor (nor planner), but I dont see how one can extrapolate the requirement to have balconies to achieve planning permission to a legal requirement to provide access to that balcony for an occupant. Its my understanding that the apartment owner never owns the balcony and that the ownership of same stays with the OMC in any case??

    In the same way, can you give a tenant a house and lock the back door so they have no access to the back garden?


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    #14
    Askthe EA
    Registered Users Posts: 724 ✭✭✭Askthe EA


    kceire wrote: »
    In the same way, can you give a tenant a house and lock the back door so they have no access to the back garden?

    I dont know. If the garden has a shed, must you give the tenants a key??


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    #15
    Claw Hammer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,236 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    You can demise whatever portion of the property you like. There is no need to include sheds balconies etc in the demise. If doing something like that the lease should have a sketch attached showing exactly what is being leased to the tenant. There may be planning/fire safety issues however.


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    #16
    listermint
    Registered Users Posts: 33,932 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    this is an awful long summation , for the cost of a door lock.


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    #17
    Doop
    Registered Users Posts: 1,470 ✭✭✭Doop


    Askthe EA wrote: »
    I dont know. If the garden has a shed, must you give the tenants a key??

    The point is the unit complies with the planning permission on the basis that the balcony is available for use by the tenant/occupier of said individual unit.

    The shed example is not the same, as it has no relevance to planning.


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    #18
    Askthe EA
    Registered Users Posts: 724 ✭✭✭Askthe EA


    listermint wrote: »
    this is an awful long summation , for the cost of a door lock.

    Guess we have time on our hands today!! ;-)


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    #19
    listermint
    Registered Users Posts: 33,932 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    One would assume the landlord withheld deposit for missing key. If so then deposit pays for new lock.


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    #20
    Claw Hammer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,236 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    Doop wrote: »
    The point is the unit complies with the planning permission on the basis that the balcony is available for use by the tenant/occupier of said individual unit.

    The shed example is not the same, as it has no relevance to planning.

    The shed may be an exempted development on the basis that it is ancillary to the main dwelling. There may be issues if the landlord retains the shed independently of the main dwelling.


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