Mary Robinson wants us all to become vegan

Rubberchikken

I read this as i enjoy my 2 pork chops.

I love animals. Wouldnt hurt a hair on the head if one of them. Ever. But i love meat. It doesnt make me a bad person. Just weak i guess but i couldnt be vegetarian never mind vegan. But i do admire those who are.
Now Mary Robinson. Thats another post.

Woke Hogan

Patww79 wrote: »

I've never eaten a rancid steak and I doubt many others have. Where did you get that idea? I also don't have grandkids.

You should try a steak though, would go down much better than that dictionary you swallowed.

You can be as glib as you like. We'll see how funny you'll find it when the world around us crumbles as the sea levels rise. Our grandchildren will be land-refugees, fleeing like rats from the over-ripe fruits of the hubris of man and machine.

OldMrBrennan83

Woke Hogan wrote: »

You can be as glib as you like. We'll see how funny you'll find it when the world around us crumbles as the sea levels rise. Our grandchildren will be land-refugees, fleeing like rats from the over-ripe fruits of the hubris of man and machine.

Like I said, I don't have grandchildren. Nor do I care about anyone elses.



_

gozunda

Woke Hogan wrote: »

No there aren't. This dying planet and the impending extinction of our species are the most important concerns facing us at the moment.

The permanently outraged meat eaters in this thread should reflect on their robbing of their grandchildren's future as they choke down each rancid bite of their steaks. The price they're paying for a burger and chips is the eventual annihilation of their lineal descendency, doomed to eventual societal collapse and premature deaths and the blackened promise of the human race.

Lol. Private car? Public transport? Fossil fuels or carbon based energy to heat your home? Cheap imported foods? All these contribute to the number one major contributors to environmental pollution. But I guess that doesn't fit with the hyperbole does it

Seems like you swallowed that big ol propaganda pill there tbh WH and looks like it's given you the verbal scutters :pac:

gozunda

Patww79 wrote: »

Like I said, I don't have grandchildren. Not do I care about anyone elses.

^^^ Folks we have the winner. The most important thing you can do for this planet. Don't replicate. Kudos.

Now if only we could educate the veganistas ..

trashcan

suicide_circus wrote: »

when vegan food tastes as good as non vegan food, I will become vegan

Chips.

Woke Hogan

gozunda wrote: »

Lol. Private car? Public transport? Fossil fuels or carbon based energy to heat your home? Cheap imported foods? All these contribute to the number one major contributors to environmental pollution. But I guess that doesn't fit with the hyperbole does it

Seems like you swallowed that big ol propaganda pill there tbh WH and looks like it's given you the verbal scutters :pac:

"Propaganda."

Do you deny, then, that humans' dependence on those same fossil fuels has lead to our species' hanging on the precipice of extinction? You accuse me of propaganda and yet you stand here opposed to the scientific consensus. The rape of our planet and continued denial of same is our greatest shame, a thousand Holocausts, and you're laughing in the chamber.

goat2

We are eating too much meat anyway,
Less on the plate
I have gone a bit vegetarian, Milk, Eggs, Cheese and so on is much of my animal products these days,
Would not touch a sausage, god knows what is in it

Eathrin

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

Not in Ireland. You know what cattle eat here? Grass. Even in winter. There is some animal feed but proportionality less than the US.

If you are importing soy it’s a cost to the environment.

:pac: I'm aware

gozunda wrote: »

The point there is - that's not my quote. And yes you were preaching. Much the same as previous tbh.

Okay good stuff

Your own definition of 'justice'? Ah come on - less of the SJW stuff already ...

I'm sorry that you see justice as a bad thing. Says a lot about one's character.

No vegan diet is locally sustainable here - that's the point. Vegan 'diets are cheaper because they rely on cheap imported produce from third world countries or on foodstuffs produced in areas with few if any environmental or ethical standards unlike locallly produced food.

Give me the low down on a fully balanced diet, that is all produced in Ireland so? Literally give me your meal plan and show me how it accounts for all of your nutritional needs. This has nothing to do with veganism in any case. Can you show me a person who doesn't eat any imported food?

How much beef does Ireland export again?

I eat fruits, vegetables, grains, legumes, seeds etc. I don't need any processed food.

you will also find out if you do any bit of research that globally 85% of soya is grown to extract soya oil mainly used in processed foodstuffs. The left overs or waste product - 'soya meal' is mainly fed to animals. So yes soya grown primarily goes to feed humans - the left overs get fed to animals. Go figure.

First of all, I'm pretty sure you just made that up and can't back your claim with a source. 80% of Soy bean, that the Amazon rainforest is being chopped down to grow, is for animal agriculture. https://globalforestatlas.yale.edu/amazon/land-use/soy

And it's 67% worldwide
https://globalforestatlas.yale.edu/land-use/industrial-agriculture/soy-agriculture

So get out of here with your fake sh*t

You appeared to have adopted all the propaganda with little of the understanding. I wouldn't stress about it too much tbh ...

Ironic that you have no self awareness

Franz Von Peppercorn

Woke Hogan wrote: »

"Propaganda."

Do you deny, then, that humans' dependence on those same fossil fuels has lead to our species' hanging on the precipice of extinction? You accuse me of propaganda and yet you stand here opposed to the scientific consensus. The rape of our planet and continued denial of same is our greatest shame, a thousand Holocausts, and you're laughing in the chamber.

Are you living on air, or is it like Mary one law for the goose, another for the gander.

I don’t even think you’re a vegan. You would have said.

Franz Von Peppercorn

Eathrin wrote: »

:pac: I'm aware


Okay good stuff


I'm sorry that you see justice as a bad thing. Says a lot about one's character.



Give me the low down on a fully balanced diet, that is all produced in Ireland so? Literally give me your meal plan and show me how it accounts for all of your nutritional needs. This has nothing to do with veganism in any case. Can you show me a person who doesn't eat any imported food?

How much beef does Ireland export again?

I eat fruits, vegetables, grains, legumes, seeds etc. I don't need any processed food.



First of all, I'm pretty sure you just made that up and can't back your claim with a source. 80% of Soy bean, that the Amazon rainforest is being chopped down to grow, is for animal agriculture. https://globalforestatlas.yale.edu/amazon/land-use/soy

And it's 67% worldwide
https://globalforestatlas.yale.edu/land-use/industrial-agriculture/soy-agriculture

So get out of here with your fake sh*t


Ironic that you have no self awareness

In all of that you haven’t factored in (again) transport costs. Eating local food clearly reduces that carbon foot print. Therefore in a country with an indigenous and local dairy and meat production the carbon cost is often lower than fruits. Which have to be imported

Eathrin

Rubberchikken wrote: »

I read this as i enjoy my 2 pork chops.

I love animals. Wouldnt hurt a hair on the head if one of them. Ever. But i love meat. It doesnt make me a bad person. Just weak i guess but i couldnt be vegetarian never mind vegan. But i do admire those who are.
Now Mary Robinson. Thats another post.

Sorry to break it to you but you can't murder something you love. This is not the same as putting down a sick dog, we're talking about raising animals for the sole purpose of slaughter and doing so when they are effectively children.

gozunda wrote: »

^^^ Folks we have the winner. The most important thing you can do for this planet. Don't replicate. Kudos.

Now if only we could educate the veganistas ..

Cool nickname. A lot of vegans are anti natalist already. No one trick ponies.

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

Poor Mary is a wee bit behind the times, again.
https://twitter.com/SBakerMD/status/1049696517177503745
The third graph there is the interesting one, agricultural emissions dropping but the rest of the emissions on a huge upward surge. People may have to look a bit closer to home than is comfortable to reduce emissions.


But, yeah, beef is the cause:rolleyes:

I hope you're aware of the amount of methane produced by animal agriculture? Do you know how much more lethal methane is to the environment than even Co2?

gozunda

Woke Hogan wrote: »

"Propaganda."
Do you deny, then, that humans' dependence on those same fossil fuels has lead to our species' hanging on the precipice of extinction? You accuse me of propaganda and yet you stand here opposed to the scientific consensus. The rape of our planet and continued denial of same is our greatest shame, a thousand Holocausts, and you're laughing in the chamber.

But you're thd one going on about 'rancid' beef :pac:

I pointed out that fossil fuels and transport are in fact the planet's number one issue atm. So do yis do any of that - driving and such? or are you just ranting or something? Either way ye still have a bad dose of the verbal scutters there I'm afraid. Couldn't make head nor tail of most of it tbh ...

gozunda

Eathrin wrote: »

Cool nickname. A lot of vegans are anti natalist already. No one trick ponies.

Delighted to hear that ....

Eathrin

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

In all of that you haven’t factored in (again) transport costs. Eating local food clearly reduces that carbon foot print. Therefore in a country with an indigenous and local dairy and meat production the carbon cost is often lower than fruits. Which have to be imported

Pretty sure everyone eats (Or should eat) fruit. We can grow peas and beans in Ireland.

Irish Guitarist

There's a thread about vegans or vegetarian being 'preachy' here at least once a month. These threads are full of preachiness about how a meat based diet is better.

Why the fuck it matters to anyone that someone chooses not to eat meat is beyond me.

There's about as many foreign ingredients in processed meat as there is in soya or Quorn by the way. Some of them even use soya as a filling ingredient. If you don't want to give up meat because you enjoy it that's understandable but this shit about caring for the planet more than vegetarians is ridiculous.

Grayson

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

We need to get more food globally? Surely that’s a carbon producer. Did you mean locally?

Ireland is different from other countries that may have to import lots of food, in theory we don’t except what is not grown here.

There have already been food shortages. that's what started the war in Syria and the Arab spring in Egypt. Globally climate change is changing the way we produce food and it's availability. In many ways it's going to be one of the biggest impacts on humanity from climate change

gozunda

Eathrin wrote: »

I'm aware
Okay good stuff I'm sorry that you see justice as a bad thing. Says a lot about one's character.Give me the low down on a fully balanced diet, that is all produced in Ireland so? Literally give me your meal plan and show me how it accounts for all of your nutritional needs. This has nothing to do with veganism in any case. Can you show me a person who doesn't eat any imported food?How much beef does Ireland export again? I eat fruits, vegetables, grains, legumes, seeds etc. I don't need any processed food. First of all, I'm pretty sure you just made that up and can't back your claim with a source. 80% of Soy bean, that the Amazon rainforest is being chopped down to grow, is for animal agriculture. So get out of here with your fake sh*t Ironic that you have no self awareness

Yup not 'justice' btw but SJW for sure. It remains no vegan diet is locally sustainable and so mainly relies on cheap imported foods produced in areas with few if any environmental or ethical standards. (Which you are promoting!) But I see you don't care about any of that or the fuel miles and fossil fuel usage for some reason - odd indeed.

The trouble you see Eartrin is that veganistas rely on misinformation whilst really knowing feck all at all or failing to understand the actual facts. Unfortunately it doesn't stop them spreading the same bull crap (or as you call it 'fake ****') all the same lol.

You want the real facts about soya ?

Industry data* show that approx "85% of the world’s soya beans are processed, or "crushed," to produce soya bean oil and the crushed soya meal as a waste product of that process. See:

* Diagram
http://www.kvsgs.com/en/images/stories/page/table29.jpg

* Data
http://www.oilseedandgrain.com/soy-facts

* Method
https://www.soya.be/soybean-oil-production.php

Soya meal is actually a waste product of the process of extracting this soya oil from the soya beans.

The most valuable component of crushed soya beans - oil, is primarily used for human consumption, although the proportion used for biodiesel production is growing rapidly, especially in the U.S. Soybean oil, extracted from the seeds of soybean, is one of the most widely consumed cooking oil across the world. See:
https://www.spendedge.com/blogs/top-ten-manufacturers-soybean-oil-market

That waste product of the oil extraction process ie the meal is used to make animal feed. (For any given amount of soybean processed the Oil extracted accounts for approx 20% by volume whilst the remainder - waste product makes up 80%*).

* note this is where your '80%' figure comes from.

It would appear that most but not all of the waste 'meal' is diverted into animal and pet foods.

Of the 15% not used to make soya oil - "approximately 6% is used directly as human food, mostly in Asia. Other uses such as additives and derivatives for various industries account the remaining 9%.
"
So the majority of soya meal is being used to feed animals is in fact a waste product of soya oil production for human consumption. So all those acres in the Brazilian rain forest are not been cut down to fuel animal feed rather to produce soya oil for human consumption.

Happy now?

No need to make personal comments btw - remember the lowest form of argument which you tried previously? It didn't work then did it?

0cp71eyxkb94qf

This post has been deleted.

Ken.

Seen a sign in a shop the other week that I should have taken a pic of.

"I did not rise to the top of the food chain to become a vegan"

gozunda

*There's a thread about vegans or going vegan here at least once a month. These threads are full of preachiness about how a vegan based diet is better.

Why the fuck it matters to anyone that someone chooses to eat meat is beyond me.

There's about as many foreign ingredients in processed vegan food as there is in processed meat the way. Practically all of them even use soya and other ****e as a filling ingredient. If you want to eat vegetables because you enjoy them that's understandable but this shit about caring for the planet more than those that eat a normal mixed diet is ridiculous.

*fixed that for you

You did take time to read the title of this thread Irish Guitarist yeah? And guess who's doing the preaching? Yup the vegans...go figure

You vegan by any chance :pac:

Irish Guitarist

gozunda wrote: »

*fixed that for you

You did take time to read the title of this thread Irish Guitarist yeah? And guess who's doing the preaching? Yup the vegans...go figure

You vegan by any chance :pac:

You didn't fix anything for me. I said exactly what I meant to say. Thanks for trying though.

Dakota Dan

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Where did her nickname come out of?

Is it that she resembles the Toytown character or is it becomes she nods her head excessively?

The second one.

Dakota Dan

Duffy the Vampire Slayer wrote: »

The thread is an example of why boards is becoming such a joke. She made a perfectly valid point, the same point climate scientists have been making, and the first page of the thread is nothing but a race to attack her. Boards.ie is full of the opposite of virtue signaling- people rushing to show off how reactionary and hate filled they are.

Are you ok Mary?

Dakota Dan

Eathrin wrote: »

Sorry to break it to you but you can't murder something you love. This is not the same as putting down a sick dog, we're talking about raising animals for the sole purpose of slaughter and doing so when they are effectively children.



Cool nickname. A lot of vegans are anti natalist already. No one trick ponies.



I hope you're aware of the amount of methane produced by animal agriculture? Do you know how much more lethal methane is to the environment than even Co2?

Did you not read earlier in the thread that methane disappears from the atmosphere after 12 years whereas co2 takes way longer? Take off them blinkers you are wearing.

gozunda

Irish Guitarist wrote: »

You didn't fix anything for me. I said exactly what I meant to say. Thanks for trying though.

The point stands.

wakka12

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

Poor Mary is a wee bit behind the times, again.
https://twitter.com/SBakerMD/status/1049696517177503745
The third graph there is the interesting one, agricultural emissions dropping but the rest of the emissions on a huge upward surge. People may have to look a bit closer to home than is comfortable to reduce emissions.


But, yeah, beef is the cause:rolleyes:

Greenhouse gasses are not just the only problem, beef production causes mass deforestation and habitat extinction, run off of chemincals into local water reserves, huge water usage, among many other problems

Eathrin

gozunda wrote: »

*fixed that for you

You did take time to read the title of this thread Irish Guitarist yeah? And guess who's doing the preaching? Yup the vegans...go figure

You vegan by any chance :pac:

How does it work in a discussion that one side is preachy and the other is not? You absolutely love that word but it is totally illogical to use here.

gozunda

Eathrin wrote: »

How does it work in a discussion that one side is preachy and the other is not? You absolutely love that word but it is totally illogical to use here.

Easy to spot tbh. When veganistas turn up and start spouting rubbish about meat being evil and destroying the planet via GHGs and the rainforests blah blah - no mention of fossil fuels or anything else. It's the same ****e again and again.

Posters who then hold this type of stuff up to scrutiny arn't preaching they're pointing out the absurdities - Simples

As you may have observed already I wasnt the one who at first pointd out the preachyness . I quoted and paraphrased the poster above and the poster who referred to you in their post....

¯\_(ツ)_/ ¯

Take a read of this - it might help you to understand a little ...

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/pop-psych/201311/curious-case-vegan-moral-hypocrisy

Eathrin

gozunda wrote: »

Easy to spot tbh. When veganistas turn up and start spouting rubbish about meat being evil and destroying the planet via GHGs and the rainforests blah blah. It's the same ****e again and again.

Posters who then hold this type of stuff up to scrutiny arn't preaching they're pointing out the absurdities - Simples

As you may have observed already I certainly wasnt the one who at first pointd out the preachyness . I simply quoted the poster above and the poster who referred to you in their post....

¯\_(ツ)_/ ¯

Take a read of this - it might help you to understand a little ...

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/pop-psych/201311/curious-case-vegan-moral-hypocrisy

Put it in italics to really drive it home! Absolutely savage.

That article is bizarre. Trying to call vegans hypocrites because of the actions of one person? Comparing lions to humans? And the notion that because a person stands for reducing suffering but ultimately falls a little short of their ideal is worthy of ridicule is just mad.

gozunda

Eathrin wrote: »

Put it in italics to really drive it home! Absolutely savage.

That article is bizarre. Trying to call vegans hypocrites because of the actions of one person? Comparing lions to humans? And the notion that because a person stands for reducing suffering but ultimately falls a little short of their ideal is worthy of ridicule is just mad.

He's a psychologist so I reckon he'd probably be able to spot 'mad' fairly well tbh ...

Gimme A Pound

Woke Hogan wrote: »

No there aren't. This dying planet and the impending extinction of our species are the most important concerns facing us at the moment.

The permanently outraged meat eaters in this thread should reflect on their robbing of their grandchildren's future as they choke down each rancid bite of their steaks. The price they're paying for a burger and chips is the eventual annihilation of their lineal descendency, doomed to eventual societal collapse and premature deaths and the blackened promise of the human race.

I was referring to people acting as though Mary Robinson is forcing them to go vegan.

whisky_galore

wakka12 wrote: »

Greenhouse gasses are not just the only problem, beef production causes mass deforestation and habitat extinction, run off of chemincals into local water reserves, huge water usage, among many other problems

Which growing acres and acres of veg doesn't of course. You can grow veg in a rain forest.:rolleyes:

Cienciano

whisky_galore wrote: »

Which growing acres and acres of veg doesn't of course. You can grow veg in a rain forest.:rolleyes:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edible_protein_per_unit_area_of_land

I'm no vegan or vegetarian, but no doubt it's better all round. No system is perfect.

Dakota Dan

wakka12 wrote: »

Greenhouse gasses are not just the only problem, beef production causes mass deforestation and habitat extinction, run off of chemincals into local water reserves, huge water usage, among many other problems

Huge water usage? That has been proven wrong many times. Polluting rivers with chemicals and deforestation doesn’t happen in Europe.

gozunda

Cienciano wrote: »

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edible_protein_per_unit_area_of_land

I'm no vegan or vegetarian, but no doubt it's better all round. No system is perfect.

Nope ...

Amongst the two worst offenders for environmental degradation and greenhouse gas emissions are at the top of that list. These are Soya production - destruction of rainforest, habitat removal & spcies extinction and Rice production - water pollution, euthrophication including toxic metal pollution and major Methane emitter for greenhouse gases ...

That's the thing. Claims that so something is 'better all round' just doesn't wash.

Buford T. Justice XIX

wakka12 wrote: »

Greenhouse gasses are not just the only problem, beef production causes mass deforestation and habitat extinction, run off of chemincals into local water reserves, huge water usage, among many other problems

Huge water usage is a typical fallacy being propagated as fact, typically from US sites where a large proportion of agricultural crops are dependent on water taken from underground reservoirs like the Ogallala reservoir in the US. US agriculture is in no way comparable to European agriculture or Asian agriculture for that matter.


In Ireland we live in a temperate, maritime climate, where there is, for the most part, plenty of rain water for growth of crops. Indeed, the biggest problem is the more frequent excess of water for growth and harvesting of crops.


As for mass deforestation, take that up with those causing it mainly in Brazil. In Ireland, the tertiary managed ecosystem is grassland which the Irish climatic conditions is near perfect for and the soil types prevalent in Ireland is much more suited to than other staple cropping types like grains or vegetable production.



Certainly, you can grow grains or vegetables where ever you want to in Ireland, but you cannot grow a breakeven crop never mind a profitable crop in the majority of Irish soil types even if you could get it as far as harvesting said crop.


As far as habitat extinction goes, take a look at where you live. What happened to the once thriving habitat that was present there before you decided to park up there and build/buy a house in that site? Have you native Irish plants growing and providing food and shelter for native animal species or have you a plethora of imported plants and a green desert without any habitat for the flora and fauna that should be thriving there?



We have a large area of native hedging and habitat on our lands and have increased that habitat in recent years as our needs changed and funding has become available. Habitats change according as our needs change and we have a large and varied wildlife selection living within a few feet of our doors.


As to runoff of chemicals, perhaps again one might be better off looking much closer to ones own output than blaming others before their own deficiencies are sorted. I'll leave this for your further perusal, at your convenience.
https://www.independent.ie/news/environment/raw-sewage-still-being-discharged-into-waters-in-38-areas-37448297.html