Madeleine McCann

limnam

Kate said


“We now bitterly regret it and will do so until the end of our days.”


Because it's a balanced and normal thing to do, right?


:rolleyes:

gozunda

Something Else

splinter65 wrote: »

You can’t accuse someone who doesn’t agree with you of being a bad parent or being stupid. It is merely your opinion that leaving the children in their bedrooms to be checked on every half hour was neglect. Just your opinion. It doesn’t make you right and it doesn’t make you a good parent, or bright for that matter.

Nope. Incorrect.

This from the NSPCC

Advice on leaving a child at home

Babies, toddlers and very young children should never be left alone

Children under the age of 12 are rarely mature enough to cope in an emergency and should not be left at home alone for a long period of time

Children under the age of 16 should not be left alone overnight

Parents and carers can be prosecuted for neglect if it is judged that they placed a child at risk by leaving them at home alone

A child should never be left at home alone if they do not feel comfortable with this, regardless of their age

https://www.nspcc.org.uk/preventing-abuse/keeping-children-safe/leaving-child-home-alone/

splinter65

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

limnam wrote: »

I think Gerry is an agreement anyway


Gerry McCann told yesterday of his terrible regret at leaving his children alone on the night Madeleine disappeared.


He admitted: 'We made a mistake, but we are paying more for it than anyone could ever possibly imagine.'



If it was the right thing to do. It wouldn't be a mistake.

But this is what all these Madeleine arguments boil down too.
On one hand you have parents who are happy to admit that they’ve made human mistakes over the years and that but for the Grace of God there were no long lasting consequences. Parents who can see that ordering a meal and some wine near the pool while 1/2 hour checks on the kids were carried out might have seemed harmless and safe.
Then you have the pitch forking Lynch mob who in their own minds have never ever put a foot wrong as a parent. They live to condemn and finger point and splitter and spit bile whenever they got the opportunity and for them the McCanns just set themselves up to be the accused, forever and a day, with no right of reply. Lots of them on this thread you all know who you are.
Then you have the conspiracy nuts. There’s one or two here. I can’t call them conspiracy theorists because they simply don’t have a plausible theory for how the McCanns killed or disposed of Maddie. They just “know” that they did. And they can repeat this ad nauseum forever and a day without being challenged. Well, one woman was challenged, but she killed herself.

Plumbthedepths

splinter65 wrote:

But this is what all these Madeleine arguments boil down too. On one hand you have parents who are happy to admit that they’ve made human mistakes over the years and that but for the Grace of God there were no long lasting consequences. Parents who can see that ordering a meal and some wine near the pool while 1/2 hour checks on the kids were carried out might have seemed harmless and safe. Then you have the pitch forking Lynch mob who in their own minds have never ever put a foot wrong as a parent. They live to condemn and finger point and splitter and spit bile whenever they got the opportunity and for them the McCanns just set themselves up to be the accused, forever and a day, with no right of reply. Lots of them on this thread you all know who you are. Then you have the conspiracy nuts. There’s one or two here. I can’t call them conspiracy theorists because they simply don’t have a plausible theory for how the McCanns killed or disposed of Maddie. They just “know†that they did. And they can repeat this ad nauseum forever and a day without being challenged. Well, one woman was challenged, but she killed herself.

Reading your post leads me to believe unless you see the McCanns blameless in their daughter's disappearance you are 'a nut' member of a mob etc etc.

limnam

splinter65 wrote: »

But this is what all these Madeleine arguments boil down too.
On one hand you have parents who are happy to admit that they’ve made human mistakes over the years and that but for the Grace of God there were no long lasting consequences. Parents who can see that ordering a meal and some wine near the pool while 1/2 hour checks on the kids were carried out might have seemed harmless and safe.





Then you have the pitch forking Lynch mob who in their own minds have never ever put a foot wrong as a parent. They live to condemn and finger point and splitter and spit bile whenever they got the opportunity and for them the McCanns just set themselves up to be the accused, forever and a day, with no right of reply. Lots of them on this thread you all know who you are.
Then you have the conspiracy nuts. There’s one or two here. I can’t call them conspiracy theorists because they simply don’t have a plausible theory for how the McCanns killed or disposed of Maddie. They just “know” that they did. And they can repeat this ad nauseum forever and a day without being challenged. Well, one woman was challenged, but she killed herself.

Made plenty of parental mistakes, I'll make many more.


What I won't do is leave toddlers in an unlocked apartment in a foreign country while i go out drinking.


It's disgusting.
It's reckless.
There's no excuse for it. none. Zero. Never will be.

splinter65

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

gozunda wrote: »

Nope. Incorrect.

This from the NSPCC



https://www.nspcc.org.uk/preventing-abuse/keeping-children-safe/leaving-child-home-alone/

But the McCanns didn’t leave their children at home alone. If the NSPCC think the McCann twins are in danger then can you explain why they haven’t been taken into care?

limnam

splinter65 wrote: »

But the McCanns didn’t leave their children at home alone.

Yes, They did.

splinter65

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

limnam wrote: »

Made plenty of parental mistakes, I'll make many more.


What I won't do is leave toddlers in an unlocked apparently in a foreign country while i go out drinking.


It's disgusting.
It's reckless.
There's no excuse for it. none. Zero. Never will be.

Just your opinion. Your opinion is not worth any more then mine. You can splutter and spit as much as you like but that’s an absolute fact.

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

splinter65 wrote: »

But this is what all these Madeleine arguments boil down too.
On one hand you have parents who are happy to admit that they’ve made human mistakes over the years and that but for the Grace of God there were no long lasting consequences. Parents who can see that ordering a meal and some wine near the pool while 1/2 hour checks on the kids were carried out might have seemed harmless and safe.
Then you have the pitch forking Lynch mob who in their own minds have never ever put a foot wrong as a parent. They live to condemn and finger point and splitter and spit bile whenever they got the opportunity and for them the McCanns just set themselves up to be the accused, forever and a day, with no right of reply. Lots of them on this thread you all know who you ar.

Yep because some of us know it was wrong and will reply if another insists it wasn't .
Hands up here I was not perfect and made mistakes but never once did I put my kids to bed and walk away and leave them alone while I dined in a restaurant .
I don't think the parents harmed her but I do think they made it very easy for someone else to spot an opportunity and used it

splinter65

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

limnam wrote: »

Yes, They did.

No they didn’t.

limnam

splinter65 wrote: »

No they didn’t.

Who was in the apartment minding the kids?

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

splinter65 wrote: »

But the McCanns didn’t leave their children at home alone. If the NSPCC think the McCann twins are in danger then can you explain why they haven’t been taken into care?

Yes they most certainly left them home alone .. In fact so alone that someone could take one without them even noticing

the_pen_turner

Something Else

splinter65 wrote: »

But this is what all these Madeleine arguments boil down too.
On one hand you have parents who are happy to admit that they’ve made human mistakes over the years and that but for the Grace of God there were no long lasting consequences. Parents who can see that ordering a meal and some wine near the pool while 1/2 hour checks on the kids were carried out might have seemed harmless and safe.
Then you have the pitch forking Lynch mob who in their own minds have never ever put a foot wrong as a parent. They live to condemn and finger point and splitter and spit bile whenever they got the opportunity and for them the McCanns just set themselves up to be the accused, forever and a day, with no right of reply. Lots of them on this thread you all know who you are.
Then you have the conspiracy nuts. There’s one or two here. I can’t call them conspiracy theorists because they simply don’t have a plausible theory for how the McCanns killed or disposed of Maddie. They just “know” that they did. And they can repeat this ad nauseum forever and a day without being challenged. Well, one woman was challenged, but she killed herself.

You forgot the side that blindly believes their version of events despite numerous time being shown to be lies or plainly suspicious.

Also nobody is stopping them from replying . They are more than welcome

splinter65

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Reading your post leads me to believe unless you see the McCanns blameless in their daughter's disappearance you are 'a nut' member of a mob etc etc.

If you can’t explain how where why and when the McCanns killed and disposed of their daughter, but you still insist that they did it then, yes, you are a nut job member of a lynch mob. What else would you be?

limnam

splinter65 wrote: »

Just your opinion. Your opinion is not worth any more then mine. You can splutter and spit as much as you like but that’s an absolute fact.

and of the National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children.


But what would they know.

splinter65

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

the_pen_turner wrote: »

You forgot the side that blindly believes their version of events despite numerous time being shown to be lies or plainly suspicious.

Also nobody is stopping them from replying . They are more than welcome

If the McCanns have been proven liars then why have they not been arrested?

splinter65

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

limnam wrote: »

and of the National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children.


But what would they know.

The NSPCC have never said that the McCanns are or were neglectful parents. Unless you have proof that they did?

limnam

splinter65 wrote: »

The NSPCC have never said that the McCanns are or were neglectful parents. Unless you have proof that they did?

Never said they did. But their guidelines state that toddlers should _never_ be left home alone.



Who was minding the children if they were not alone?

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

splinter65 wrote: »

The NSPCC have never said that the McCanns are or were neglectful parents. Unless you have proof that they did?

Once again you twist words ! Its glaringly obvious now !

splinter65

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Yes they most certainly left them home alone .. In fact so alone that someone could take one without them even noticing

But they weren’t at home. They were in a hotel being checked every 1/2 hour. Has it ever occurred to you that this satisfies the NSPCCs standard of care. It may not suit you but then your not in charge of any of these things, your just another Joe Soap with an opinion, same as everyone else....

the_pen_turner

Something Else

splinter65 wrote: »

If the McCanns have been proven liars then why have they not been arrested?

I don't know. But their story has some serious holes

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Once again you twist words ! Its glaringly obvious now !

The posters opinion is that children should not be left alone as is the opinion and recommendation of the NSPCC .

the_pen_turner

Something Else

splinter65 wrote: »

But they weren’t at home. They were in a hotel being checked every 1/2 hour. Has it ever occurred to you that this satisfies the NSPCCs standard of care. It may not suit you but then your not in charge of any of these things, your just another Joe Soap with an opinion, same as everyone else....

She was not left in a hotel. It was an apartment . The sliding door was left unlocked where any number of people could walk in off the street.
It was not a home , there could be any number of potential dangers in there that parents were un aware of.

As for the half hourly checks. That doesn't ring true either

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

splinter65 wrote: »

But they weren’t at home. They were in a hotel being checked every 1/2 hour. Has it ever occurred to you that this satisfies the NSPCCs standard of care. It may not suit you but then your not in charge of any of these things, your just another Joe Soap with an opinion, same as everyone else....

You know quite well that they were not in a hotel . They were in an apartment that was on a public road . It was part of an apartment building with some private and some rented by Mark Warner
It was not an enclosed complex never mind a hotel . But you do know that

limnam

splinter65 wrote: »

But they weren’t at home. They were in a hotel being checked every 1/2 hour. Has it ever occurred to you that this satisfies the NSPCCs standard of care. It may not suit you but then your not in charge of any of these things, your just another Joe Soap with an opinion, same as everyone else....

"Babies, toddlers and very young children should never be left alone"


Where does it say unless your only going to the pub drinking and popping back every half an hour?


They were left in an apartment. Toddlers. on thier _OWN_. while there parents drank.


Disgusting.

splinter65

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Once again you twist words ! Its glaringly obvious now !

I’m not twisting anything. Far from it. I’m untangling the mess that’s been made of confusing what’s just an opinion and what’s a fact. If the NSPCC are happy with the McCanns then I can’t see how your opinion of their parenting skills can make any difference to anyone.

splinter65

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

limnam wrote: »

"Babies, toddlers and very young children should never be left alone"


Where does it say unless your only going to the pub drinking and popping back every half an hour?


They were left in an apartment. Toddlers. on thier _OWN_. while there parents drank.


Disgusting.

You keep saying “disgusting”. It's as if you imagine that the more often you say that the more chance it will become an irrefutable fact.
That’s not how opinions vs facts work though. It’s still just your opinion and even if you say it 50 times it won’t make it a fact.
The McCanns didn’t go to a pub. And they weren’t at home either. Fact.

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

splinter65 wrote: »

I’m not twisting anything. Far from it. I’m untangling the mess that’s been made of confusing what’s just an opinion and what’s a fact. If the NSPCC are happy with the McCanns then I can’t see how your opinion of their parenting skills can make any difference to anyone.

Nor does yours for that matter . But its a discussion forum for discussing opinions

And the NSPCC are quite clear on there recommendations . At no stage did they say they were happy with the decision the Mc Canns made .

XsApollo

I dunno if I will watch this, it’s frightening the thought of what happened.
But I spent a long time reading and watching everything about this after it happened.
Parental mistakes are parental mistakes.
Leaving your kids alone for that length of time in a foreign country and the location to make it worse isn’t a parental mistake, it’s downright selfish and not giving a ****.
Wasn’t the first night they were left alone either.

The child was crying for an hour or 2 the night before, while they were out also, and I think if I remember correctly she wasn’t a great sleeper and did wake a lot.
But I can imagine her trying to sleep the second night after waking the night before and nobody there , she would of been ****ting herself or it definatley would of been on her mind and they still did it.

Heartless is what I say.
Anybody with kids that age as I do myself , would understand what it takes to do that.

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

splinter65 wrote: »

You keep saying “disgusting”. It's as if you imagine that the more often you say that the more chance it will become an irrefutable fact.
That’s not how opinions vs facts work though. It’s still just your opinion and even if you say it 50 times it won’t make it a fact.
The McCanns didn’t go to a pub. And they weren’t at home either. Fact.

You do know that leaving kids alone doesn't simply apply to the childrens own home don't you ?
But the word twisting is your MO isn't it

juno10353

Something Else

iamwhoiam wrote: »

You know quite well that they were not in a hotel . They were in an apartment that was on a public road . It was part of an apartment building with some private and some rented by Mark Warner
It was not an enclosed complex never mind a hotel . But you do know that

Also little gate on public road leading to balcony with door left unlocked. I wouldn't leave my handbag or jewellery unattended in apartment with door unlocked

limnam

splinter65 wrote: »

You keep saying “disgusting”. It's as if you imagine that the more often you say that the more chance it will become an irrefutable fact.
That’s not how opinions vs facts work though. It’s still just your opinion and even if you say it 50 times it won’t make it a fact.
The McCanns didn’t go to a pub. And they weren’t at home either. Fact.

While they were on holidays. That apartment was their "home".


According to the NSPCC toddlers and young childer should _never_ be left _alone_. Fact.


They left young kids alone in that apartment _alone_ to go and eat and drink in a restaurant. Fact.


Both parents regret that decision. Fact.


Why regret it if it was the right thing to do?

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

juno10353 wrote: »

Also little gate on public road leading to balcony with door left unlocked. I wouldn't leave my handbag or jewellery unattended in apartment with door unlocked

I would bet my last Euro that they didn't leave their credit cards or cameras or laptops in that vulnerable position .

splinter65

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Nor does yours for that matter . But its a discussion forum for discussing opinions

And the NSPCC are quite clear on there recommendations . At no stage did they say they were happy with the decision the Mc Canns made .

But they never said they were unhappy with the McCanns either. So mention of the NSPCC has no merit one way or the other.

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Yes they most certainly left them home alone .. In fact so alone that someone could take one without them even noticing

I've not been to Praia de Luz, but my family used to holiday 22km east of there from when I was about 2 til I was about 12. My parents would occasionally go out to dinner just the two of them but they always got a baby sitter. Possibly one of my first crushes when I was 10 or 11 was on one of them. They were usually waitresses who wanted to make some money on the side, and from what I remember finding a babysitter was never difficult. My parents were not well off, but they still managed to spring for a babysitter if they wanted a date night. In a two week holiday they maybe did it once maybe twice. All other nights we had dinner with them even when I was 2. My Dad still has the pictures.

Hindsight is 20/20 but it would have been so easy to hire one or two babysitters, to go around continually checking on all the kids - thats if each set of couples didnt want to hire dedicated sitters for each set of kids.

According to reports the parents took it in turns to go checking on the kids every 30 minutes. If it was every 30 minutes like clock work then:
- Would you not just hire a sitter so you can enjoy your meal?
- Was it really every 30 minutes, did it sometimes become more like an hour?
- If it was 30 minutes, like clock work, every single night, plenty of time for someone to establish the routine. After a parent checking the last set of kids, a predator knows he has at least 30 minutes to do whatever.

limnam

Deleted User wrote: »

Hindsight is 20/20 but it would have been so easy to hire one or two babysitters, to go around continually checking on all the kids - thats if each set of couples didnt want to hire dedicated sitters for each set of kids.

Services were offered to them but they didn't take them.

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

splinter65 wrote: »

But they never said they were unhappy with the McCanns either. So mention of the NSPCC has no merit one way or the other.

Nobody said they did . We simply posted the NSPCC recommendations which is very similar to most parents thinking anyway . Thankfully its only a rare few who wouldn't apply those recommendations to their own lives without the need of a prompt from the NSPCC .

limnam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

limnam wrote: »

Services were offered to them but they didn't take them.

I know. If they didn't want to use the night creche, I'm saying they still could have hired a sitter or two to keep an eye on things.

One thing I find unusual: Was the food in the tapas restaurant so good, that they wanted to dine there practically every night?

chicorytip

Something Else

limnam wrote:

Both parents regret that decision. Fact.

limnam wrote:

Why regret it if it was the right thing to do?

I would have a small amount of sympathy for the parents with regard to this particular aspect of the entire story. Yes, ultimately, they did leave the child unattended but did make regular trips back from the very nearby restaurant situated in the same complex to check on her welfare. I think their actions could be described as careless and irresponsible but not reckless or neglectful. I am quite sure many loving and caring parents have left children unattended for short periods of time in similar circumstances on foreign holidays. Let's remember, the McCann's felt safe staying in the Praya De Luiz resort which they had visited many times previously and they did not set out that evening with the intention of having an all night piss up. They could not have ever imagined, even in their worst nightmares, that there happened to be child abductors at large in the immediate vicinity at that fateful time.
The child is dead and her remains are unlikely to be ever recovered. Her parents had absolutely no part in her disappearance or death.

limnam

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Nobody said they did . We simply posted the NSPCC recommendations which is very similar to most parents thinking anyway . Thankfully its only a rare few who wouldn't apply those recommendations to their own lives without the need of a prompt from the NSPCC .

tbh I can't believe it has to be pointed out.


It's like nurses in paternity hospitals will have to remind parents leaving with newborns


"Don't forget now! don't leave the baby alone at home and go out eating and drinking!"

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I've not been to Praia de Luz, but my family used to holiday 22km east of there from when I was about 2 til I was about 12. My parents would occasionally go out to dinner just the two of them but they always got a baby sitter. Possibly one of my first crushes when I was 10 or 11 was on one of them. They were usually waitresses who wanted to make some money on the side, and from what I remember finding a babysitter was never difficult. My parents were not well off, but they still managed to spring for a babysitter if they wanted a date night. In a two week holiday they maybe did it once maybe twice. All other nights we had dinner with them even when I was 2. My Dad still has the pictures.

Hindsight is 20/20 but it would have been so easy to hire one or two babysitters, to go around continually checking on all the kids - thats if each set of couples didnt want to hire dedicated sitters for each set of kids.

According to reports the parents took it in turns to go checking on the kids every 30 minutes. If it was every 30 minutes like clock work then:
- Would you not just hire a sitter so you can enjoy your meal?
- Was it really every 30 minutes, did it sometimes become more like an hour?
- If it was 30 minutes, like clock work, every single night, plenty of time for someone to establish the routine. After a parent checking the last set of kids, a predator knows he has at least 30 minutes to do whatever.

And Mark Warner creche staff were available to baby sit for a fee .
In P da Luz because of the layout of the apartments not even Mark Warner offered walk around babysitters as it was considered not safe

I have been to P da L and seeing where they left the kids made me and my husband gasp as we passed that apartment .

My own opinion is that it was either an opportunist who saw the gaps in checks or an inside job who knew the routine and passed it on
It would be easy to park at the front , ( the entrance facing away from the Tapas ) . Take a child into the car and gone out of the village and into rural Algarve before anyone even missed her

limnam

chicorytip wrote: »

I think their actions could be described as careless and irresponsible but not reckless or neglectful.

Leaving 3 kids alone at home while you eat and drink?


It's careless, irresponible, reckless and neglectful. Which led to them losing thier daughter who could have been used as a sex slave for years.


Fairly neglectful.

chicorytip wrote: »

I am quite sure many loving and caring parents have left children unattended for short periods of time in similar circumstances on foreign holidays.

Never came across anyone in my life who did this or think it's normal. Just on boards.

chicorytip wrote: »

Let's remember, the McCann's felt safe staying in the Praya De Luiz resort which they had visited many times previously and they did not set out that evening with the intention of having an all night piss up. They could not have ever imagined, even in their worst nightmares, that there happened to be child abductors at large in the immediate vicinity at that fateful time.
The child is dead and her remains are unlikely to be ever recovered. Her parents had absolutely no part in her disappearance or death.

They should have imagined it.


That's what parents are there to protect against.


Not leaving them alone and heading out eating and drinking

iamwhoiam

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

chicorytip wrote: »

I would have a small amount of sympathy for the parents with regard to this particular aspect of the entire story. Yes, ultimately, they did leave the child unattended but did make regular trips back from the very nearby restaurant situated in the same complex to check on her welfare. I think their actions could be described as careless and irresponsible but not reckless or neglectful. I am quite sure many loving and caring parents have left children unattended for short periods of time in similar circumstances on foreign holidays. Let's remember, the McCann's felt safe staying in the Praya De Luiz resort which they had visited many times previously and they did not set out that evening with the intention of having an all night piss up. They could not have ever imagined, even in their worst nightmares, that there happened to be child abductors at large in the immediate vicinity at that fateful time.
The child is dead and her remains are unlikely to be ever recovered. Her parents had absolutely no part in her disappearance or death.

The Mc Canns had never been to P da L before
The apartment was not in a complex , it was outside on a public road
I don't know a single parent who would leave a child in that situation and think it was right .

goat2

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

foxyladyxx wrote: »

Two doctors would be struck off the medical register if any trace of sedation was found in the body. The body was disposed of for some reason.

Injuries to the body would also result in similar action being taken,

how do you know there is a body, and it has injuries, they have not found a body

splinter65

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Nobody said they did . We simply posted the NSPCC recommendations which is very similar to most parents thinking anyway . Thankfully its only a rare few who wouldn't apply those recommendations to their own lives without the need of a prompt from the NSPCC .

Well I don’t know who “we” is (must be a collection of like minded individuals of the type I mentioned in another post) but I myself don’t see now why you mentioned the NSPCC if you agree that they have never referenced the McCanns, good bad or indifferent. But we’ll let that pass.

Plumbthedepths

splinter65 wrote:

If you can’t explain how where why and when the McCanns killed and disposed of their daughter, but you still insist that they did it then, yes, you are a nut job member of a lynch mob. What else would you be?

Have I said the McCanns killed their daughter? I firmly believe they are responsible for their daughter's disappearance by their negligence. I believe that she is dead, that is my opinion. Lastly I suggest you drop the name calling it would be best if you read people's comments instead of replying to stuff no one said.

splinter65

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

iamwhoiam wrote: »

You do know that leaving kids alone doesn't simply apply to the childrens own home don't you ?
But the word twisting is your MO isn't it

No I’m not the poster who mentioned twisting first. As the NSPCC have never made any reference to this, the most famous child disappeance in history, you or I have absolutely no idea what that organizations opinion is of the parenting skills of G and K McCann. None whatsoever.

Plumbthedepths

chicorytip wrote:

The child is dead and her remains are unlikely to be ever recovered. Her parents had absolutely no part in her disappearance or death.

...no part in her disappearance except their actions or lack thereof contributing to, Madeline's disappearance.

limnam

splinter65 wrote: »

No I’m not the poster who mentioned twisting first. As the NSPCC have never made any reference to this, the most famous child disappeance in history, you or I have absolutely no idea what that organizations opinion is of the parenting skills of G and K McCann. None whatsoever.

What we do know is the McCanns went against their advice and recommendations.

splinter65

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Have I said the McCanns killed their daughter? I firmly believe they are responsible for their daughter's disappearance by their negligence. I believe that she is dead, that is my opinion. Lastly I suggest you drop the name calling it would be best if you read people's comments instead of replying to stuff no one said.

Once again, it was your good self that suggested that I would probably consider those who insist that the folk who insist that the McCanns murdered their daughter but cannot put forward a how where when or why are “nut” members of a mob ( your very words, check your post) and I agreed with you. Because that’s what you are when you hold a very strong position on something but can’t even remotely back it up. A nut job.