Sisters wanting sites

Icelandicseige

Sheep breeder wrote: »

A lot of farmers children all worked on the farm when they were younger and put in as much work.
A local farmer who gave the farm to the son and a small amount of money to his two daughters, the farmer died soon after and the son got married and the new wife would not live in the same house as his mother and she had to move out of home and in with the daughter in Dublin after a life time on the farm. Two years later the son split from the wife and now she wants the farm sold for her share and now none of the family will have none of the farm.

Yep, see it all before. Moral of the story, be very very VERY careful who you marry.

Panch18

A lot of people not having a clue commenting here

What we did here was buy the sister a site - could be an option

august12

mayota wrote:

The sites should be gifted by the parents before transfer.

Would agree here, and ensure when selecting the site location, corner sites and as far away as possible from the farming sheds, parlour, milking block etc. And of course not in line of sight of your own house, there is the chance these sites might be sold later on, so take that into consideration and work out the possible implications this might have, so select site locations carefully. I do feel they are entitled to this given the size of farm but hubbie shouldn't have to pay the legal costs for transfer. There is a site gift tax exemption but there is certain criteria to avail of this.

J.O. Farmer

littelady wrote: »

I agree he is inheriting allot of land and machinery but also inheriting the debts and he is expected to keep it for the next generation. He will never see the millions. His dad will give up the sites.

Is it 3 acres in 200 or 3 acres in 20.

If it's 3 acres in 200 there's no real difference in inheriting 197 acres v 200 acres. Those 3 acres won't make him or break him regardless of debts or whether he sells it or not.
It's 1.5% of the area and depending on how he farms, the weather, natural disasters, animal disease breaksdowns etc. multiples of that percentage can be made or lost on current profits in any given year.

Families are complex though so it would appear if he's that pissed off he maybe doesn't get on with them but it's hard to have sympathy with a man getting 197 acres for only 30k after all's paid for complaining about not getting the last 3 acres.

BuboBubo

I think the minimum size for a residential site is 0.6 of an acre, just a little over the half acre suggested by previous posters.

I would leave this in your parents hands to sort out, presumably the farm still belongs to them on paper. Don't know where you are situated, I know sites around my area (Co. Wexford) are fetching approx 60k. Even if your sisters and their spouses are working - it's a huge outlay, and understandably they want their "share" to build on.

Let your parents decide, if they don't want to give them sites, fair enough. If they do - you'll have to live with it, unfortunately.

shenanagans

littelady wrote: »

My hubby is in the process of taking over the family farm. Now three of his sisters are looking for sites with intent to start building as soon as possible. My hubby is raging to the point he doesn't want to talk about it. How would you feel.

Do you have kids??

In 30 years time..... your son is getting the farm..... your daughter turns to you both and say that's OK, give the farm to him but I'd like a site...... You're giving him everything, all I ask is a site to have a home so I'm not lumbered with an enormous mortgage.

Would you give all to your son and tell your daughter to take a hike!??!?

Odelay

littelady wrote: »

Are you a male farmer?

Genitals have nothing to do with the issue.

Wildly Boaring

shenanagans wrote: »

Do you have kids??

In 30 years time..... your son is getting the farm..... your daughter turns to you both and say that's OK, give the farm to him but I'd like a site...... You're giving him everything, all I ask is a site to have a home so I'm not lumbered with an enormous mortgage.

Would you give all to your son and tell your daughter to take a hike!??!?

Fully agree with this.

salmocab

shenanagans wrote: »

Do you have kids??

In 30 years time..... your son is getting the farm..... your daughter turns to you both and say that's OK, give the farm to him but I'd like a site...... You're giving him everything, all I ask is a site to have a home so I'm not lumbered with an enormous mortgage.

Would you give all to your son and tell your daughter to take a hike!??!?

And in another few generations it’s no longer a farm it’s a housing estate with a pile of relatives living in it. I’m being flippant but land can’t be cut up continually eventually it has to stop.

Tell me how

OP, this seems like a no brainer, yet, your husband is annoyed to the point of not wanting to talk about it.

Let him know what he is inheriting versus what he is being asked to give up. I think it's worth discussing beyond just making the decisions on the sites. What type of relationship does he want with his sisters in to the future? Is he happy to have 3 acres more and for his children to not know their aunts and cousins maybe? How about you? Would you like the idea of being able to call over to them without having to plan it as a visit or them to you? As someone who is close to his siblings, the idea of living near them and maintaining some sort of the relationship we had growing up is appealing to me.

He may have worked on it and they may have never gone near it, but, so what. Any family that ever fell out over land was never in the better for it.

kurtainsider

On the face of it I think that your husbands parents would be absolutely stupid to sign over the farm to your husband at all. Never mind giving the sisters a site to build a house.

As they become older and infirm having their daughters next door would be a huge help to them. Your husband, the son, sounds like a spoiled, entitled brat who inherits 98% of the entire lot plus stock, machinery, sheds and goodness knows what else and his reaction is that he's beside himself with resentment at his sisters getting 1% each. Are they actually expecting him or indeed you to look after them in their old age?

To summarise: Sites for the sisters - Grow old at home with their daughters to look in on them and help them.
No sites for the sisters - The county home before the year is out.

littelady

If my son decides to take on the farm that's ok he should be given a site too. My daughter will have the option to farm too if she does not want this we will pay for her education and a deposit not a site.

shenanagans

salmocab wrote: »

And in another few generations it’s no longer a farm it’s a housing estate with a pile of relatives living in it. I’m being flippant but land can’t be cut up continually eventually it has to stop.

Sell it then. Split cash between all siblings.

J.O. Farmer

Tell me how wrote: »

Would you like the idea of being able to call over to them without having to plan it as a visit or them to you?

Maybe this is the problem. Maybe he's waited his entire life to get away from them.

littelady

My husband won't declare war on his sisters. This won't cause a situation were he will never talk to them again.

shenanagans

littelady wrote: »

If my son decides to take on the farm that's ok he should be given a site too. My daughter will have the option to farm too if she does not want this we will pay for her education and a deposit not a site.

Have your in laws given the sisters a deposit??

littelady

shenanagans wrote: »

Sell it then. Split cash between all siblings.

Your obviously not from a farming background

9935452

littelady wrote: »

rovertom wrote: »

If it was 20 acres, handing over portions of it with site potential might be a pain but at 200 acres, your husband is taking the piss.
He is inheriting 1 million euro worth of land minimum possibly double that plus no doubt stock machinery, buildings, entitlements etc and he won't give a sites to his sisters. The sad thing here is that he is possibly backed up by father with similar mindset.

I agree he is inheriting allot of land and machinery but also inheriting the debts and he is expected to keep it for the next generation. He will never see the millions. His dad will give up the sites.

Is the farm dairy beef or tillage
Does your husband work off farm.
Does he want to go farming?
I dont want to sound nosey but are yhe debts big?

First reading of this your husband sounds unreasonable not to give his sisters a site .
But thinking about it in more detail it can make sense.
He might not want to go farming.
The debts could be 200 or 300k or more and he might not want to take that on.
His sisters get a free site he gets a load of debt and a tax bill to inherit it .
Maybe needs money invested in it too.
Lastly the one that hits me is in a lot of cases here when a son takes over a farm his parents still draw a wage or wage of sorts from it. Be it esb and heating paid for them or similar. The farm might not be able to sustain this.
Even further down the line he might be seen to be responsible for nursing home bills and so on .

shenanagans

littelady wrote: »

My husband won't declare war on his sisters. This won't cause a situation were he will never talk to them again.

It might if he refuses to give them a site.

They will surely feel he is being selfish and GREEDY.

littelady

J.O. Farmer wrote: »

Maybe this is the problem. Maybe he's waited his entire life to get away from them.

shenanagans wrote: »

Have your in laws given the sisters a deposit??

In 2 cases yes. But the sites are more valuable

Tell me how

littelady wrote: »

My husband won't declare war on his sisters. This won't cause a situation were he will never talk to them again.

So why do you think he is so aggrieved by this? Is it to do with the time spent working on the farm?

If it was a traditional farming household, I expect they did their share in terms of supporting the business of the farm, preparing food, laundry etc.

shenanagans

littelady wrote: »

In 2 cases yes. But the sites are more valuable

If they got a substantial deposit then perhaps that's sufficient. But ask yourself was it substantial???

Why are they coming back for more??

Alrigghtythen

littelady wrote: »

I agree he is inheriting allot of land and machinery but also inheriting the debts and he is expected to keep it for the next generation. He will never see the millions. His dad will give up the sites.

He gets his site for free
He begrudges giving them a site
He gets the land for free
He gets a wage
You can 100% be sure his sisters helped on farm at some points
Are you planning on caring for his parents if/when they need it?

The next generation mightn't want to farm it

littelady

It's also a case of the sisters and their partners can object to my husband should he expand the farm. Ie more traffic on the road, working late In the fields behind them etc.

highspeed

Are the 2 sisters planning on living on these sites or is there a big possibility that they will sell the sites?

I have 2 sisters who both got sites when farm was transferred to me. Both are now married to farmers and as they did not need the sites for themselves, the sites were transferred back to me. This was agreed between my sisters & parents when they transferred. My brother got a site and had built on it and is happily married there.

littelady

shenanagans wrote: »

If they got a substantial deposit then perhaps that's sufficient. But ask yourself was it substantial???

Why are they coming back for more??

2 other sisters got deposits for houses in the town. The three remaining sisters want to live on the sites. They never worked on the farm.

kingdom fan

It's been a very long time since I posted here.
A relation of mine was gifted a site on the main road . About 400 yards in front of my house . I live on the farm. An absolute disaster. They claimed a right of way on my road , the only way into my house. They don't need to use my road to access their house. They routinely burn rubbish on my road. Will typically do it on a bank holiday Monday. About 5 years ago we invited them to our child's birthday. Said call up around 2. They started burning carpet and lino on my roadway in front of my house at 2 with lots of neighbours calling up. The excuse was the son started the fire. He didnt do it. The area in front of my house ( behind their house) is a tip, an actual rubbish tip with all sorts from an old transit, drums, pallets, household rubbish and coffee cups etc emotied from cars.etc etc. Had to pick up household rubbish from a silage field one day. Have occasionally blocked the road by parking the car across the road. Then come out all nice nice saying they didn't know they blocked the road, or what ape left the rubbish there . They Told a person who recent my moved to the area that they owned the road and he could park a lorry on the road. I came home to see an artic parked on d grass margin.September 2017. The land was saturated. The road destroyed with dirt. No attempt to clean it or fill the hole at d side of the road. I could easily go on and on.
Basically they are mad as I bought the farm from a relation who wanted nothing to do with them.i was not gifted it, despite working the place all my life. Then bought the neighbouring farm. Me and the said relation get along fine.
In short, I would be totally against letting anyone build on the farm. Its only trouble for another day.I offered to buy a site for my sister rather than let her build on my farm.
I know plenty that would agree with me.

fergus1001

if the siblings are not seen to be looked after in their will or whatever it could be court time and the only people winning there are the legal eagles

Tell me how

littelady wrote: »

It's also a case of the sisters and their partners can object to my husband should he expand the farm. Ie more traffic on the road, working late In the fields behind them etc.

How likely is this to happen? I know it's not straightforward, and often its not the siblings but the partners they ultimately end up with who could be the source of discomfort.

No one can predict the future but it's best to be positively inclined than negative.

littelady

highspeed wrote: »

Are the 2 sisters planning on living on these sites or is there a big possibility that they will sell the sites?

I have 2 sisters who both got sites when farm was transferred to me. Both are now married to farmers and as they did not need the sites for themselves, the sites were transferred back to me. This was agreed between my sisters & parents when they transferred. My brother got a site and had built on it and is happily married there.

One sister could potentially build and sell after the 5 years is up ( planning stipulation) they would want full market price