Star Trek: Lower Decks (animated series)

Slydice

10: That was great!! I definitely want a season 2!

The titan turning up with Riker and Troi! Brilliant! Felt for the loss of Shaxs.

Jaden

Until:

He comes back from the Temple of the Prophets with Sisko in tow.

TheValeyard

Jaden wrote: »

Until:

He comes back from the Temple of the Prophets with Sisko in tow.

I'm okay with this.

Goodshape

Give me warp to the factor of 5, 6, 7, 8...

*Facepalm from the Mrs.*

TheValeyard

Think this is my favourite Trek at the moment. Fav since DS9.

GSPfan

I initially felt like it was all a bit meh, but the last two episodes were great.

Wolf 359 was an inside job.

Samuel T. Cogley

The only thing I wished theyed done is turn up with a fleet of identical Titans... :pac:

Stark

"songs of kahless" on Instagram did a "live action" rendition of the Titan from Lower decks. https://www.instagram.com/p/CGIX7P6lmnB/?igshid=1ho4h2d1649os

TheValeyard

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

The only thing I wished theyed done is turn up with a fleet of identical Titans... :pac:

They really handled a Riker appearance with a ship so much better than the Picard show.

TheValeyard

GSPfan wrote: »

I initially felt like it was all a bit meh, but the last two episodes were great.

Wolf 359 was an inside job.

The Dominion War never happened

santana75

Ok I'll be honest I knew nothing about this, but I just watched the trailer and it looks pretty awesome. Where can I see this?

Samuel T. Cogley

santana75 wrote: »

Ok I'll be honest I knew nothing about this, but I just watched the trailer and it looks pretty awesome. Where can I see this?

It would be unethical to download using bit torrent. You also risk getting malware and viruses.

ilovesmybrick

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

It would be unethical to download using bit torrent. You also risk getting malware and viruses.

AMKC

Such a brilliant last episode of the 1st season. Roll any many more seasons. I loved all the references to other series in this episode and season. Here is to many more seasons of Lower Decks the best Star Trek in years

AMKC

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

It would be unethical to download using bit torrent. You also risk getting malware and viruses.

No need to do that. Just get it at the usual places there is a couple. I have never had a problem using them.

MarkR

Hang in there, Baby Bear!

😭

santana75

Watched 3 episodes today alone......love it. Its hilarious but still respectful which is a very hard balance to pull off. And its 100% trek. Honestly I prefer this to Picard.

_Kaiser_

Stark wrote: »

Ah that was fantastic.

Was just watching Archer's Enterprise on the Holodeck. Lol
Boimler got his promotion, good for him. Will be cool to see more of the Titan next season. Was sort of hoping Mariner would get a promotion to chief of security at the end.

I think that

Season 2 will open with him back on the Cerritos having done something stupid on the Titan. No way they'll have Frakes and Sirtis doing the show on a regular basis

One other thing I noticed... why were the crew uniforms different between the ships? Still prefer the classic late DS9 uniforms myself.

TheValeyard

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I think that

Season 2 will open with him back on the Cerritos having done something stupid on the Titan. No way they'll have Frakes and Sirtis doing the show on a regular basis

One other thing I noticed... why were the crew uniforms different between the ships? Still prefer the classic late DS9 uniforms myself.

Never know,
he has already signed on for season two

https://www.denofgeek.com/tv/star-trek-lower-decks-season-2-cast-jonathan-frakes-riker/

Rawr

Wondering if one of my earlier theories about Bajor is true:

Shax's funeral (Following his epic demise) featured the Federation flag on his coffin, suggesting that Bajor is now a member world. It would also feed into my theory that Shax was in The Resistance and then Bajoran Militia until being moved over to Starfleet. I think non-Federation fleet officers usually get the Starfleet flag on their coffin, which was shown once in Voyager when they had a funeral for an Earth astronaut they found.

Rawr

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

One other thing I noticed... why were the crew uniforms different between the ships? Still prefer the classic late DS9 uniforms myself.

I wonder if they are going back to function-based uniforms that we saw as various points in Trek history.

DS9 for example had the mostly black uniform that became the Generations / Voyager uniform when the new comm badge came in. However, that uniform existed in parallel with the regular TNG uniform for at least 2 years before becoming a standard.

I get the feeling that the regular TNG uniform represented the "Inner Fleet", while the DS9 uniform represented outposts and other "Outer Fleet" operations. "Paradise Lost" underlines this with Sisco wearing a Classic TNG uniform during his assignment on Earth. Once we get to the Dominion War, most people are essentially in a "Combat Grey" uniform designed specifically for battle (a lot less visible). The entire Federation was at risk, so there was no separation of uniform design.

Then after the Dominion War I guess you got a new separation between Low Risk and High Risk assignment. The Cerritos and other similar vessels on similar assignments would get a brighter, friendlier TNG style uniform, while combat and deep-space vessels would retain the Combat Grey.

This is all head-cannon, but it's what I'm guessing.

AMKC

Stark wrote: »

Ah that was fantastic.

Was just watching Archer's Enterprise on the Holodeck. Lol
Boimler got his promotion, good for him. Will be cool to see more of the Titan next season. Was sort of hoping Mariner would get a promotion to chief of security at the end.

That was brilliant loved seeing it. Its canon now. I have it already from Eaglemoss.

Slydice wrote: »

10: That was great!! I definitely want a season 2!

The titan turning up with Riker and Troi! Brilliant! Felt for the loss of Shaxs.

Such a cool ship. I have a model of it from Eaglemoss. It is going to be in demand now I would say. They might need to redo the magazine to it do. Roll on season's 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 and 10 at least.

Stark

Rawr wrote: »

I wonder if they are going back to function-based uniforms that we saw as various points in Trek history.

DS9 for example had the mostly black uniform that became the Generations / Voyager uniform when the new comm badge came in. However, that uniform existed in parallel with the regular TNG uniform for at least 2 years before becoming a standard.

I get the feeling that the regular TNG uniform represented the "Inner Fleet", while the DS9 uniform represented outposts and other "Outer Fleet" operations. "Paradise Lost" underlines this with Sisco wearing a Classic TNG uniform during his assignment on Earth. Once we get to the Dominion War, most people are essentially in a "Combat Grey" uniform designed specifically for battle (a lot less visible). The entire Federation was at risk, so there was no separation of uniform design.

Then after the Dominion War I guess you got a new separation between Low Risk and High Risk assignment. The Cerritos and other similar vessels on similar assignments would get a brighter, friendlier TNG style uniform, while combat and deep-space vessels would retain the Combat Grey.

This is all head-cannon, but it's what I'm guessing.

On the live action shows, a lot can be explained by them simply not being able to afford to replace all the uniforms for all the actors when a new uniform is introduced. You see this especially in "Generations", where there was a mismatch between DS9 and TNG style uniforms, with some characters changing uniform mid way through the movie. Behind the scenes explanation being the TNG style uniforms becoming worn out during filming and them having more of the DS9 style to replace them with.

For an animated show, it's a puzzler.

I guess Discovery also established that new uniform designs were rolled out on a ship by ship basis rather than an immediate fleet wide basis. Despite it being easy for each ship to replicate new uniforms as soon as the design was updated.

Goodshape

Must be awful for them, having to produce and sell all that extra merchandise.

Rawr

Goodshape wrote: »

Must be awful for them, having to produce and sell all that extra merchandise.

Beyond that very good point, I kind of guessed one of the reasons DS9 didn't just use the TNG uniform was to make it easier to tell which show you were watching at a glance. Especially back when you had both DS9 and TNG churning out new episodes at the same time.

I kind of wonder if that was also the reason why Voyager retained the pre First Contact uniform, even after they were in regular communications with Starfleet and probably had access to the new design. Given that they could replicate new shuttles, torpedoes and Delta Flyers at will, they probably had the power budget for 100-odd new uniforms.

Although you did have about 2 years where both shows had the same uniform...so I'm not sure...

Stark

"I'm sorry, the Hirogen communications network cut out before we could deliver the letters from Harry's mother but we did get to send over the latest in Alpha quadrant fashion"

Mollyb60

Now that's proper Trek! I'd take ten seasons of this over Discovery or (sadly) Picard. I actually squealed out loud when the Titan showed up with Riker and Troi (didn't do that when they showed up in Picard).

How can Disco and Picard get it so wrong and Lower Decks get it so right? Baffled.

Rawr

Mollyb60 wrote: »

Now that's proper Trek! I'd take ten seasons of this over Discovery or (sadly) Picard. I actually squealed out loud when the Titan showed up with Riker and Troi (didn't do that when they showed up in Picard).

How can Disco and Picard get it so wrong and Lower Decks get it so right? Baffled.

The Titan turning up to the tune of the TNG theme-tune no less

As for the differences between Lower Decks and new live action stuff: My only guess at the moment is that Kurtzman isn't actually the showrunner for this show, despite having an Executive Producer credit. They could be going for a movie-style Executive Producer where he's involved in name-only.

But it really does feel like that the usual Secret Hideout staff are not actually involved. Can only speculate if this is due to Discovery eating up their time...or if it's due to CBS micro-managing this show to ensure that they get at least one decent Trek show out of them.

What is clear is that whoever is making Lower Decks are actually Trekkies, and are very well versed in pre-Kelvin Star Trek. Nothing about Lower Decks would feel out of place if put beside DS9, or Voyager, or ST VI: The Undiscovered Country. It feels like it belongs, which is something that is alas hard to say about Discovery or Picard.

pixelburp

I had a peep at the sludge that is User Reviews on metacritic and ... it's at 4.1 However, the devil is in the details. While only 17 of the 40 "negative" reviews left comments, all bar one were left in or around the 2nd episode. Suggesting some simply bailed early over those more hyperactive early episodes, mixed with reactive dismissal (one calling it "anti Trek", which seems ironic)

Lord knows why or when the other 23 "negative" scores were left but as always with these aggregators there's usually a significant "whining fan boy" cabal who'll vote something down out of nervous reaction, or whatever passes for their principcal (Captain Marvel; black stormtroopers; Amazon releasing "The Boys" weekly instead of in one go [yes, that was a thing]).

The positive reviews circle around the same line of thinking: give this a chance, it's far better than at first glance.

Stark

Yeah the IMDB average rating is low, but most of the ratings came in early so it was unfairly tarnished.

Spear

Given the overall arc of character development, it's quite plausible the irritating tone of Mariner in the first few episodes was a conscious decision. Which now leads to a scenario where people gave up early, giving it bad reviews, and it's effectively being punished for actually doing the right thing.

JayRoc

Spear wrote: »

Given the overall arc of character development, it's quite plausible the irritating tone of Mariner in the first few episodes was a conscious decision. Which now leads to a scenario where people gave up early, giving it bad reviews, and it's effectively being punished for actually doing the right thing.

That's a really good point.

pixelburp

Spear wrote: »

Given the overall arc of character development, it's quite plausible the irritating tone of Mariner in the first few episodes was a conscious decision. Which now leads to a scenario where people gave up early, giving it bad reviews, and it's effectively being punished for actually doing the right thing.

Oh I'd say it was a creative choice all right: Mariner was introduced at her lowest ebb; completely off the chain and acting out against her mother with a "no f*cks given" approach. One that in retrospect was only going to ostracise those ready to hate on the show - myself included TBH. That first scene with her was a terrible introduction IMO, while the initial trailers focused on that early material, the tone then coming off poorly.

Rawr

Spear wrote: »

Given the overall arc of character development, it's quite plausible the irritating tone of Mariner in the first few episodes was a conscious decision. Which now leads to a scenario where people gave up early, giving it bad reviews, and it's effectively being punished for actually doing the right thing.

Based on what we learn later on (and might end up learning later), Mariner's attitude appears to make perfect sense.

She acts horribly to actively avoid promotion to a higher rank that she may have held before. Which in turn explains why a Lower Decks Ensign is surprisingly knowledgeable.
So, in my head, she's a haunted ex-Lieutenant who can't stand to prospect of command but also cannot bear to be away from Starfleet. So she hides in the Lower Decks on a generally event-free starship that her parents put her on so that her Captain mother can keep her safe.

Makes for a rather additive character that I went from hating initially, to a character I actually give a damn about. As one Youtuber once put it; *this* is what Micheal Burnham should have been.

Evade

Rawr wrote: »

Beyond that very good point, I kind of guessed one of the reasons DS9 didn't just use the TNG uniform was to make it easier to tell which show you were watching at a glance. Especially back when you had both DS9 and TNG churning out new episodes at the same time.

I read somewhere, but I can't find it now, the high collared TNG style uniforms were very expensive and difficult to maintain which probably contributed to the change.

Stark

Rawr wrote: »

Based on what we learn later on (and might end up learning later), Mariner's attitude appears to make perfect sense.

She acts horribly to actively avoid promotion to a higher rank that she may have held before. Which in turn explains why a Lower Decks Ensign is surprisingly knowledgeable.
So, in my head, she's a haunted ex-Lieutenant who can't stand to prospect of command but also cannot bear to be away from Starfleet. So she hides in the Lower Decks on a generally event-free starship that her parents put her on so that her Captain mother can keep her safe.

Makes for a rather additive character that I went from hating initially, to a character I actually give a damn about. As one Youtuber once put it; *this* is what Micheal Burnham should have been.

There were a few throwaway comments from early episodes that I can't really remember now but Memory Alpha seems to confirm what I thought that she once held Lieutenant rank: https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Beckett_Mariner#USS_Quito

There was a throwaway comment in one episode from her about being court martialed but no confirmation on whether that was actually true or not.

santana75

Mollyb60 wrote: »

Now that's proper Trek! I'd take ten seasons of this over Discovery or (sadly) Picard. I actually squealed out loud when the Titan showed up with Riker and Troi (didn't do that when they showed up in Picard).

How can Disco and Picard get it so wrong and Lower Decks get it so right? Baffled.

I was thinking the same thing myself. And I really wanted to like "Picard" and Discovery but they just dont feel like Trek. I think the reason why lower decks has that Trek feel in spades is because Mike McMahan is a bona fide, 100% fan of the original shows. He's also a great writer, so if you put those two things together you end up with something thats the real deal. Im only on episode 8 myself so maybe this has happened already, but I would love if they introduced a story arc and not just stand alone episodes. Thats not a complaint btw, I just think it would be an even better show if there was a season long arc the way they had on DS9.

Justin Credible Darts

Stark wrote: »

Yeah the IMDB average rating is low, but most of the ratings came in early so it was unfairly tarnished.

or maybe its low because it deserves that low rating ?

pixelburp

The curse of aggregators on a TV show is that if a user rates something low off the back of watching 1, 2 episodes - that's hardly a fair reflection of the overall season. Should a user's score count if they've only watched < 20% of the entire run? Hardly. That's an inherently flawed system 'cos eveyone knows of a show that starts poor but gets better. It's practically a rite of passage TBH and rare enough a show starts off amazing.

Does Lower Decks deserve the rating? No, not remotely. It's not a perfect show - it's actually not that funny in places and the jokes are half-hearted - but it's solid and "very Trek" for those who speak of those things. Starts off rough but its main characters are personable and I've fond myself rooting for them.

Goodshape

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

or maybe its low because it deserves that low rating ?

or... maybe it doesn't.

Justin Credible Darts

Goodshape wrote: »

or... maybe it doesn't.

really , then if it was so good then surely the rating would be higher ?



I can never get over how trek fans get so protective over a show.


Just because you like it, does not mean everyone does.

Justin Credible Darts

pixelburp wrote: »

The curse of aggregators on a TV show is that if a user rates something low off the back of watching 1, 2 episodes - that's hardly a fair reflection of the overall season. Should a user's score count if they've only watched < 20% of the entire run? Hardly. That's an inherently flawed system 'cos eveyone knows of a show that starts poor but gets better. It's practically a rite of passage TBH and rare enough a show starts off amazing.

Does Lower Decks deserve the rating? No, not remotely. It's not a perfect show - it's actually not that funny in places and the jokes are half-hearted - but it's solid and "very Trek" for those who speak of those things. Starts off rough but its main characters are personable and I've fond myself rooting for them.

What you must factor in is that any show, be it star trek or not, if the first couple of episodes are rubbish, the viewer will not tune in again if they did not like it., so the only people rating the latter shows are those that are biased in to giving it a good report since they are still watching.



Those that quit after the first couple are not watching.

pixelburp

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

really , then if it was so good then surely the rating would be higher ?

I can never get over how trek fans get so protective over a show.

Just because you like it, does not mean everyone does.

In fairness, I pointed out the flaw in the ratings, given many were clearly made around the broadcast of episode 2 - which accounts for < 20% of the entire season. That can't be said to be reflective of the overall season if people are just dropping off.

The consensus across thread has been broadly positive; starting from a ropey premiere with Mariner being the main point of contention. And again, after episode 2 she settles down and shows distinct depth.

Justin Credible Darts

pixelburp wrote: »

In fairness, I pointed out the flaw in the ratings, given many were clearly made around the broadcast of episode 2 - which accounts for < 20% of the entire season. That can't be said to be reflective of the overall season if people are just dropping off.

The consensus across thread has been broadly positive; starting from a ropey premiere with Mariner being the main point of contention. And again, after episode 2 she settles down and shows distinct depth.

again the point you are missing, is the people who like the show are obviously still watching., and good for them they are enjoying it.



I quit after 2 episodes, not watched any more of it, I thought it was atrocious, and I wanted to enjoy it.


So the majority of those that did not like the show tend to avoid the thread on Lower Decks so its hardly a shock the feedback would be positive

pixelburp

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

again the point you are missing, is the people who like the show are obviously still watching., and good for them they are enjoying it.

I quit after 2 episodes, not watched any more of it, I thought it was atrocious, and I wanted to enjoy it.

So the majority of those that did not like the show tend to avoid the thread on Lower Decks so its hardly a shock the feedback would be positive

Wish I lived where you live. If what you said was true, then the internet would be a much quieter place from all the disgruntled Trek, Star Wars or Dr. Who fans NOT sledging their passions online. Or, to use an example specific to aggregators, the slew of MCU "fans" review-bombing Captain Marvel before it had even been released, dropping the score (to the extent of it requiring the sites changing their rules).

Hell, the Television forum on this site is full of people shítting on RTÉ on a consistent basis and I doubt half of them even watch the content; so no, I don't agree with your logic based on the simple evidence of the internet. :pac:

Media consumption isn't a zero-sum game, those remaining merely being the fanboys. Hell, you're here, disproving your own theory. While my own opinion is on record here as being "mixed". The actual comedy is perfunctory at best, often hitting very obvious punchlines. But the character moments and very TNG era plotting is solid and keeps me going. But yes, you need to watch past episode 2 to get to the good stuff.

Justin Credible Darts

its not rocket science to grasp.

the people STILL watching the show are obviously going to praise the show.
Why else would they be watching it.
They must like it surely, why watch it otherwise....


The people who did not like it, have stopped watching it, are hardly turning up to praise it.....I thought you might have comprehended that.

As for RTE, I spent years seeing the absolute muck they made.
It stands to reason if they make muck for years, the same people making said muck are not going to overnight make quality programs.

The point about LD was the rating was supposedly undeserving low.
The fact its low is because people think the show deserves it, and it seems to upset people.

why do people have to make excuses for the rating ?
Surely once you enjoy it that should be all that matters to you ?

pixelburp

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

its not rocket science to grasp.

the people STILL watching the show are obviously going to praise the show.
Why else would they be watching it.
They must like it surely, why watch it otherwise....

Your point is not rocket science, it just doesn't track with the observable reality of life on the internet. Just to be clear, what I'm describing is literally in the dictionary as a thing:

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/hate-watch

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/hate-watch

edited to add... and wikipedia FWIW: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate-watching

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

The point about LD was the rating was supposedly undeserving low.
The fact its low is because people think the show deserves it, and it seems to upset people.

why do people have to make excuses for the rating ?
Surely once you enjoy it that should be all that matters to you ?

Nobody's upset, nobody's making excuses. I started the aggregator point so the curiosity is merely that aggregators can't tell the whole story because rating "1" based off of 20% of a season is like rating a movie after watching 30 minutes. It's valid insofar as anyone's opinion is valid - but its context is not off the back of a "fair" amount of the show watched.

TV pilots & second episodes, hell entire first seasons, are usually poor and take a while to find its feet. Don't think that needs explaining on a Trek forum of all places.

Justin Credible Darts

the point you are missing, its not just casual viewers that voiced their dislike for lower decks but plenty of hardcore trek fans also.

When trek fans are saying...no thanks and no longer watching, is it really a surprise the rating is low ?
As I said earlier, its low because its not that good. The only people praising it still are those still watching obviously

this nonsense the rating is wrong is always spun by people try to deflect. I did not like it...therefore I stopped watching.

I did not like discovery and it gradually got better.
Discovery was bad....but gave it a chance

Lowers Decks was just atrocious, and I was will to over look it was a cartoon. I wanted to enjoy it.
I saw enough in what I saw to realize why it got low ratings...the people still watching obviously like it, so hardly a shock they think the rating is wrong, dont mean they are right.

pixelburp

Whoosh. I give up

Goodshape

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

I saw enough in what I saw to realize why it got low ratings...the people still watching obviously like it, so hardly a shock they think the rating is wrong, dont mean they are right.

I at least 50% hated it until around episode three or four.

Now that I've seen all of it, I've seen enough to realize why someone might give it such a low rating if they'd only seen the first few episodes.

I don't know that anyone elses opinion would change, but mine did.