Are foreign women more approachable than Irish girls?

EdgeCase

It’s more a question of being abroad I think. Irish people tend to be more willing to be direct when they’re abroad too. You’re in a different environment without all the baggage of home.

EdgeCase

It’s more a question of being abroad I think. Irish people tend to be more willing to be direct when they’re abroad too. You’re in a different environment without all the baggage of home.

Fourier

Shenshen wrote: »

There's very few things in life I hate more than dancing... as I said, this is outside my area of personal experience, I couldn't say if there's a difference between how people here or abroad behave in nightclubs.

A disco isn't the same thing as a nightclub. It's fine to hate dancing, but when 18th century ball room social etiquette makes the comeback it's destined to you'll be left in the dust.

Shenshen

Fourier wrote: »

A disco isn't the same thing as a nightclub. It's fine to hate dancing, but when 18th century ball room social etiquette makes the comeback it's destined to you'll be left in the dust.

Well, neither are places that offer anything to someone who's not keen on loud music and dislikes dancing.

My parents did in fact make me take ballroom dancing lessons when I was 13. I hope to never, ever have to return to that :eek::(

Wheres Me Jumper?

the problem with these foreigners, especially the eastern europeans & africans, is they are probably riddled with all sorts of diseases.
i wouldn't touch them with yours on the end of a very long barge pole(no pun intended).

Gimme A Pound

Shenshen wrote: »

They are when it comes to male-female interaction.
As I said before, back home having friends of both genders is the norm. Going out with a group means talking to and interacting with all members of the group, not just the ones that share your gender.

Here, my observations are that any "mixed" group separates into its male and female components at the first given opportunity on a night out, with the women talking to the women and the men talking to the men.
Anyone trying to cross that will be perceived as "trying to flirt" and expressing a sexual interest.

That's certainly not the norm in Germany at least, or at least not in my personal experience.

True. Also here there is this scoffing attitude (obviously not from all men) towards the idea of having female friends. Women are for ridin' or not, and that's it.

Zorya

Shenshen wrote: »

There's very few things in life I hate more than dancing... .

This is the most insane thing I have ever read on boards!!!! :eek:

One eyed Jack

Shenshen wrote: »

They are when it comes to male-female interaction.
As I said before, back home having friends of both genders is the norm. Going out with a group means talking to and interacting with all members of the group, not just the ones that share your gender.

Here, my observations are that any "mixed" group separates into its male and female components at the first given opportunity on a night out, with the women talking to the women and the men talking to the men.
Anyone trying to cross that will be perceived as "trying to flirt" and expressing a sexual interest.

That's certainly not the norm in Germany at least, or at least not in my personal experience.

I think it’s probably more accurate to say it’s not the norm in your personal experience than to suggest your personal experience is representative of a whole country

Having friends of both genders is also the norm here and has been throughout our history, in spite of the blinkered perception that some people have of this idea of any kind of separation between the sexes or that we’re a country of sexually repressed sorts. We’re far from it.

Back home you would have your groups of friends and of course you’re going to be more familiar with how your groups of friends interact with each other, but the idea that Irish people tend to gravitate towards people of the same sex when they’re out in groups and don’t mix with the opposite sex? I really don’t know where that’s coming from.

I think it depends on the group dynamics too. Like for example I was out the other night with a group of men and women from the office as one of them were leaving, and I can’t dance to save my life so while they were all up on the floor dancing I got chatting to the group of women next to me. The work group came back from dancing and saw me chatting with the other group, and their reactions ranged from “you’re in there”, to “they’re travellers”, and that was just the women! :pac:

To be honest it just felt like they thought I was being ‘disloyal’ to the group by not sticking with my own group, but they saw nothing wrong with fecking off when it suited them and expecting me to still be there waiting for them when they came back. They either assumed I was flirting with the other group of women, or they assumed the women were flirting with me, when we were all actually having an interesting conversation as opposed to anyone getting any ideas. The only people getting ideas were the outside observers based upon their own attitudes and perceptions towards other people.

I don’t think the attitudes of my work colleagues could be put down to one single factor like their sex, or the fact that they’re all half my age, or that they’re particularly snobby (that kinda came as a surprise to me as I didn’t think they were like that*), but I would say that their reservations weren’t solely based upon their sex, or their age, but rather on their own perception of their social status in comparison to others.


EDIT: I should probably explain that the reason I didn’t think they were like that is because they would often present themselves as socially aware progressive types whereas I’d be inclined to be more conservative and reserved.

Zorya

.....

Olivia Pope

Maybe the Irish women don’t like being called girls? Look at your thread subject.

WillieMason

Wheres Me Jumper? wrote: »

the problem with these foreigners, especially the eastern europeans & africans, is they are probably riddled with all sorts of diseases.
i wouldn't touch them with yours on the end of a very long barge pole(no pun intended).

I feel a ban coming lol

con___manx1

Out of my friends 4 are with foreign girls and two are with irish women.
I find irish women will find faults very quick and are quick to judge.
Every irish girl is not the same obviously but thats my observstion. Iv had a long term relationship with an irish girl and also have been with some foreign european girls also american canadian and australian none of those long term.
Im currently seeing a belgian girl at the moment.
Id actually prefer to be with an irish girl but its so hard to find one i like ðŸ˜

Redneck Culchie

Olivia Pope wrote: »

Maybe the Irish women don’t like being called girls? Look at your thread subject.

:rolleyes:
Plenty of women call men boys too, it's just the way people talk. Stop looking for offense everywhere.

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

I've hapes of friends who are Irish men, most of them straight, some of them we're friends for 25 years at this point, some of them I only know a couple of years. Going out, on holiday, to festivals and so on in a co-ed group is very standard for me.

Frankly I think it's all thanks to drugs. Most of my social circle would have been formed on or adjacent to the sesh, which tends to be a highly unsexual environment and hence a fertile plot for platonic relationships. It'd be really unusual to find any part of that scene that's all women or all men. Ye all need to get a few yokes down ye and calm the fcuk down about all the mean ugly stupid girls/boys.

Mind you, I probably am one of those mean ugly stupid meanies because if I'm out in a pub or club and a man starts talking to me I am pretty defensive at least initially. It's not like it's for the sheer fcuking thrill of it though, it's a reaction formed from experience, hell hath no fury like someone who thinks they're entitled to your attention being told no. My plans for a fun night out, would as a rule, not feature half an hour of this :pac:

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

The Xterminator wrote: »

I thought yokes made girls real slutty? And do you really think if you were to offer it up to any of your male 'friends' that they'd turn it down?

Oh I highly doubt it, I'm an absolute ride.

suicide_circus

The Xterminator wrote: »

I thought yokes made girls real slutty?

yeah but good luck trying to come

bodice ripper

The Xterminator wrote: »

I thought yokes made girls real slutty? And do you really think if you were to offer it up to any of your male 'friends' that they'd turn it down?

Real life is totally like this. I mean, if you are 19 max.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Anna Chilly Sediment wrote: »

I've hapes of friends who are Irish men, most of them straight, some of them we're friends for 25 years at this point, some of them I only know a couple of years. Going out, on holiday, to festivals and so on in a co-ed group is very standard for me.

Frankly I think it's all thanks to drugs. Most of my social circle would have been formed on or adjacent to the sesh, which tends to be a highly unsexual environment and hence a fertile plot for platonic relationships. It'd be really unusual to find any part of that scene that's all women or all men. Ye all need to get a few yokes down ye and calm the fcuk down about all the mean ugly stupid girls/boys.

Mind you, I probably am one of those mean ugly stupid meanies because if I'm out in a pub or club and a man starts talking to me I am pretty defensive at least initially. It's not like it's for the sheer fcuking thrill of it though, it's a reaction formed from experience, hell hath no fury like someone who thinks they're entitled to your attention being told no. My plans for a fun night out, would as a rule, not feature half an hour of this :pac:

That photo is brilliant.

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

You could have asked like five of your friends for the ride probably in the time it took to re-reg there.

bodice ripper

Count Wallace wrote: »

Yeah cos a guy is going to say to no to sex because 'i dont want to ruin our friendship' haha.

Or, you know, because they don't actually want to **** you.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

The re-regs on this thread are actually giving me life right now. When will they pop up next? What will they say?

Zorya

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

The re-regs on this thread are actually giving me life right now. When will they pop up next? What will they say?

Me too. So much to learn, so little time.

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

Based and Red Pilled wrote: »

We are only saying the truth.

Lol, you fcuking wish mate.

Or are we using the royal we?

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

Based and Red Pilled wrote: »

Did i touch a nerve?

No, you raised a smile with your chicanery! I appreciate that a woman interacting with you for any other reason than you've just pissed her off might be very new territory but you'll have to muddle through it.

Redneck Culchie

I don't think class is as big a thing here as it is in Britain but maybe I'm wrong. I knew plenty of posh girls in college. Some of them were stuck up some of them weren't. No more or less than working class girls or girls from the back arse of nowhere in the countryside. But then again maybe it's different for marriage. Some other posters may know more about this than me.

Wibbs

Oh get her... Important eh?



While there's something to the marry across or up tendency in women™, outside of some limited social enclaves a large proportion of Ireland is basically in one "class". After London upped sticks and buggered off, we didn't really have much time to reinvent our own set of rigid classes. A fairly large chunk of Irish people went from pigs in the kitchen to urban areas and education. I know a surgeon whose grandparents were brought up in one room cottages in the West of Ireland.

Never mind that if you frequent nightclub A it's likely to attract the same social strata, so snobbishness would be a lesser factor. Plus a fair number of the easy going foreign women come from cultures with quite rigid social classes.

Pug160

Social standing is undoubtedly important in the grand scheme of things. But remember that people can only take you at face value when they've just met you. Some women, especially well educated ones, would probably be impressed by a man's perceived intelligence and wit first and foremost. At least intially.

As for mixed sex groups: I've only really experiened it as a single person in a group where the rest were coupled up. I did get the impression that the women in the group preferred the couples only routine. Although I was still made to feel welcome.

Redneck Culchie

In fairness, the plumbers and carpenters I know are making big money at the moment. Much more than many more glamorous jobs. But I get your point.

Pug160

Wibbs wrote: »

Oh get her... Important eh?



While there's something to the marry across or up tendency in women™, outside of some limited social enclaves a large proportion of Ireland is basically in one "class". After London upped sticks and buggered off, we didn't really have much time to reinvent our own set of rigid classes. A fairly large chunk of Irish people went from pigs in the kitchen to urban areas and education. I know a surgeon whose grandparents were brought up in one room cottages in the West of Ireland.

Never mind that if you frequent nightclub A it's likely to attract the same social strata, so snobbishness would be a lesser factor. Plus a fair number of the easy going foreign women come from cultures with quite rigid social classes.

I think it depends on exactly what we're talking about here. I was just thinking more along the lines of how much someone earns and the type of job they have, and how those things in and of themselves can provide status. There would certainly be a hierarchy of some sort. I think a lot of the time, one thing goes with another anyway. To be frank, someone who is less intelligent is probably not going to be in a high paying job, with everything that goes with that.

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

Wouldn't agree that there are no classes in Ireland, though they're probably less rigidly defined and separated than a lot of other countries, and there's less of a spread (i.e. we don't have an aristocracy so it kind of just goes working class, middle class, upper-middle class, Denis O Brien). I've a few acquaintances and family friends who come from wealthy backgrounds and there is a vast gulf between them and working class people. In fact, and more to the point, a few of them are married to foreigners of a similar socio-economic background and not a single one married to an Irish person of a working or lower-middle class background.

The majority of our politicians, civil servants, broadcasters are from wealthy backgrounds (most of our government ministers went to private school, in fact), the majority of the prison population from poor backgrounds. We're not as finicky about it as the brits, it's not as tied up with race as it is in the States but we're no way a classless utopia.

That said, the idea that women are stand-offish because they can't be certain of your class is rubbish. You "signal your class" by speaking, wearing clothes, being wherever you are. Not exactly hard to figure out where to slot people after 30 seconds talking to them like.

professore

Shenshen wrote: »

They are when it comes to male-female interaction.
As I said before, back home having friends of both genders is the norm. Going out with a group means talking to and interacting with all members of the group, not just the ones that share your gender.

Here, my observations are that any "mixed" group separates into its male and female components at the first given opportunity on a night out, with the women talking to the women and the men talking to the men.
Anyone trying to cross that will be perceived as "trying to flirt" and expressing a sexual interest.

That's certainly not the norm in Germany at least, or at least not in my personal experience.

This is true. Hadn't really thought of that before. In secondary school this was true for me as I went to an all boys school and knew very few girls. However in college we went out in mixed groups all the time. When I came back "home" it was "the lads" again. Still is many years later. I socialise in mixed groups now mostly.

professore

Anna Chilly Sediment wrote: »

My plans for a fun night out, would as a rule, not feature half an hour of this :pac:

Me neither. I HATE places where the music is so loud you have to shout into someones ear to have a conversation. Whatever about nightclubs, where you can lep around a bit at least, what sort of bull**** is this to do in a pub?

professore

Redneck Culchie wrote: »

In fairness, the plumbers and carpenters I know are making big money at the moment. Much more than many more glamorous jobs. But I get your point.

At the moment, wait for the next crash.

professore

Anna Chilly Sediment wrote: »

That said, the idea that women are stand-offish because they can't be certain of your class is rubbish. You "signal your class" by speaking, wearing clothes, being wherever you are. Not exactly hard to figure out where to slot people after 30 seconds talking to them like.

For some reason your comment made me think of this:



Lots of guys in particular are very good at faking this while others might be socially awkward types in tech with an old t-shirt and jeans making 5 times what the "business mogul" who is actually a minimum wage telesales "exec" bull****ter is making. And "intelligent conversation" is a surefire way of not getting anywhere with most women on a night out. What is meant by "intelligent conversation" is being witty. Not talking about the best bubble sorting algorithms or the pros and cons of the gold standard.

I learned early on the best way to get a shift back in the day was to dumb down your conversation and have some craic.

Mister Vain

One eyed Jack wrote: »

the idea that Irish people tend to gravitate towards people of the same sex when they’re out in groups and don’t mix with the opposite sex? I really don’t know where that’s coming from.

That's generally the way it goes from my experience, at least in the early stages of a night out anyway. They only mix later on when everyone is pissed and the girls start dragging the lads onto the dance floor. It's like the night is not complete without the obligatory dance. I have terrible duck feet though and usually end up stamping on everyone's toes.

One eyed Jack

Mister Vain wrote: »

That's generally the way it goes from my experience, at least in the early stages of a night out anyway. They only mix later on when everyone is pissed and the girls start dragging the lads onto the dance floor. It's like the night is not complete without the obligatory dance. I have terrible duck feet though and usually end up stamping on everyone's toes.

I absolutely haaaate it when girls try to do that! I’m not one for being rude to people, but there’s been a few times alright when a simple ‘nope, I don’t dance, thanks’ is ever going to be good enough for some girls :pac:

Pug160

Anna Chilly Sediment wrote: »

Wouldn't agree that there are no classes in Ireland, though they're probably less rigidly defined and separated than a lot of other countries, and there's less of a spread (i.e. we don't have an aristocracy so it kind of just goes working class, middle class, upper-middle class, Denis O Brien). I've a few acquaintances and family friends who come from wealthy backgrounds and there is a vast gulf between them and working class people. In fact, and more to the point, a few of them are married to foreigners of a similar socio-economic background and not a single one married to an Irish person of a working or lower-middle class background.

The majority of our politicians, civil servants, broadcasters are from wealthy backgrounds (most of our government ministers went to private school, in fact), the majority of the prison population from poor backgrounds. We're not as finicky about it as the brits, it's not as tied up with race as it is in the States but we're no way a classless utopia.

That said, the idea that women are stand-offish because they can't be certain of your class is rubbish. You "signal your class" by speaking, wearing clothes, being wherever you are. Not exactly hard to figure out where to slot people after 30 seconds talking to them like.

There are always plenty of exceptions, but I think a lot of the time like attracts like. It's a continuous cycle which presumably won't change to a large degree. The one thing I would say is that we all live in a society where we at least have the ability to climb the socio-economic ladder. Family support and good fortune play into it but the one, almost essential ingredient is innate ability. I have seen this first hand with my sister who was blessed academically and was then able to make a much better life for herself and also marry a top 5% earner. It's a kind of genetic lottery, and if you win it and you're conscientious you have a decent shot at climbing the ladder.

I'm certainly no fan of elitism and think everyone should be given an equal opportunity. But I do think it's only fair to point out that intelligent parents are probably more likely to have intelligent kids, with the added benefit that the kids will have access to the best education and nutrition and everything else. There certainly seems to be preferential treatment given to people higher up the socio-economic ladder when it comes to custodial sentences. Although part of me wonders if at least part of the reason is that some people are clever enough to avoid being caught, and that those types are less likely to be poor. Money and influence probably play bigger parts in it though.

Spear Chucker

professore wrote: »

And "intelligent conversation" is a surefire way of not getting anywhere with most women on a night out. What is meant by "intelligent conversation" is being witty. Not talking about the best bubble sorting algorithms or the pros and cons of the gold standard.

I learned early on the best way to get a shift back in the day was to dumb down your conversation and have some craic.

This 100%. Even worse is talking about heavy topics like politics or religion. Guaranteed way to kill the vibe. I cringe when I see men do it.

Redneck Culchie

Spear Chucker wrote: »

This 100%. Even worse is talking about heavy topics like politics or religion. Guaranteed way to kill the vibe. I cringe when I see men do it.

Talking politics or religion is not a good idea on nights out unless with friends in a pub. Talking about it while trying to chat someone up would not be a good idea either.

The no politics/religion rule applies x10 on nights out in Belfast or most places up North.

Spear Chucker

Redneck Culchie wrote: »

Talking politics or religion is not a good idea on nights out unless with friends in a pub. Talking about it while trying to chat someone up would not be a good idea either.

The no politics/religion rule applies x10 on nights out in Belfast or most places up North.

I avoid talking politics with women even when in relationships since most women seem to be left wing by default.

Shenshen

professore wrote: »

Lots of guys in particular are very good at faking this while others might be socially awkward types in tech with an old t-shirt and jeans making 5 times what the "business mogul" who is actually a minimum wage telesales "exec" bull****ter is making. And "intelligent conversation" is a surefire way of not getting anywhere with most women on a night out. What is meant by "intelligent conversation" is being witty. Not talking about the best bubble sorting algorithms or the pros and cons of the gold standard.

I learned early on the best way to get a shift back in the day was to dumb down your conversation and have some craic.

I suppose your conversation would really depend on your target.
Personally, I would find someone telling me about bubble sorting algorithms rather fascinating, but then I tend to be on the more quiet, geeky side. Someone trying to be witty for the sake of it would bore me to tears.
But if you're interested in the orange girl with the blonde hair extensions and the Freddie Krueger fake nails, you may indeed want to dumb it down quite a bit

professore

Shenshen wrote: »

I suppose your conversation would really depend on your target.
Personally, I would find someone telling me about bubble sorting algorithms rather fascinating, but then I tend to be on the more quiet, geeky side. Someone trying to be witty for the sake of it would bore me to tears.
But if you're interested in the orange girl with the blonde hair extensions and the Freddie Krueger fake nails, you may indeed want to dumb it down quite a bit

How you doin? Wanna come back to mine and I'll sort your bubbles baby (in the most sleazy voice possible)

I'm willing to bet you wouldn't be in a pub with Nicky Minaj blasting in the foreground. Let's face it after 9PM on a weekend it's impossible to have a conversation in most Irish pubs due to the noise. Unless you smoke. The smoking area is my favourite place even though I don't smoke, at least you can talk to people

Anna Chilly Sediment

Anna Chilly Sediment wrote: »

That said, the idea that women are stand-offish because they can't be certain of your class is rubbish. You "signal your class" by speaking, wearing clothes, being wherever you are. Not exactly hard to figure out where to slot people after 30 seconds talking to them like.

What about... that... girl... whose... daddy... works... for...

Mister Vain

One eyed Jack wrote: »

I absolutely haaaate it when girls try to do that! I’m not one for being rude to people, but there’s been a few times alright when a simple ‘nope, I don’t dance, thanks’ is ever going to be good enough for some girls :pac:

But but... if you don't dance then you're as dry as an African footpath. Actually some people would argue that if you don't dance then you may as well be sitting at home. I just never enjoyed it. I can still have a good night without dancing.

suicide_circus

I only do the kind of dancing you see in period dramas

Church on Tuesday

Mister Vain wrote: »

But but... if you don't dance then you're as dry as an African footpath. Actually some people would argue that if you don't dance then you may as well be sitting at home. I just never enjoyed it. I can still have a good night without dancing.

Just get some drinks into you and you'll be a dancing queen in no time!

Mister Vain

Church on Tuesday wrote: »

Just get some drinks into you and you'll be a dancing queen in no time!

No. Even when I'm pissed it still feels wrong. I usually just copy what other people are doing because I haven't a fecking clue. :pac:

Church on Tuesday

Mister Vain wrote: »

No. Even when I'm pissed it still feels wrong. I usually just copy what other people are doing because I haven't a fecking clue. :pac:

Works for me, although I'm not entirely sure you could classify my moves as "dancing" per se...

tylercheribini

I think single sex schooling here has a lot to answer for, being cloistered in an all boys school during my formative years has done irreparable damage to my social skills with the opposite gender anyway.

One eyed Jack

tylercheribini wrote: »

I think single sex schooling here has a lot to answer for, being cloistered in an all boys school during my formative years has done irreparable damage to my social skills with the opposite gender anyway.

When you say cloistered, do you mean educated in an all boys boarding school or something? The average child spends only 20% of the time in a calendar year in the school environment, and 80% outside of the school environment, and study after study shows that parents are their children’s primary influencers, not their school environment, so whatever social skills people think they have as a hangover from their school days, it’s not their education is responsible for that, but other factors outside of their educational environment in childhood.