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Whistleblower: Maurice McCabe

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    #722
    orourkeda1977
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,628 ✭✭✭orourkeda1977


    Next time you have the bad luck to have to deal with a member of An Garda Siochana, just bear in mind that you are now dealing with Ireland's premier law enforcement professional.

    Or in reality bear in mind that this could be a narrow minded juvenile culchie on a power trip who'll destroy a colleague of their for doing the right thing.


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    #723
    orourkeda1977
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,628 ✭✭✭orourkeda1977


    The thing I love about Irish people (people in general for that matter) is how, when a person needs a friend the most you're on your own, but when you are exonerated people will be all lovey dovey to your face.

    Makes me vomit.


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    #724
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,686 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    orourkeda1977 wrote: »
    The thing I love about Irish people (people in general for that matter) is how, when a person needs a friend the most you're on your own, but when you are exonerated people will be all lovey dovey to your face.

    Makes me vomit.

    The vast vast majority of people are sound.
    There is no difference in people now than there has ever been.
    There will always be bad apples in every walk of life but the nice people make life worthwhile.


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    #725
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,489 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    orourkeda1977 wrote: »
    Or in reality bear in mind that this could be a narrow minded juvenile culchie on a power trip who'll destroy a colleague of their for doing the right thing.
    So its only "culchies" who did the wrong thing? When thinking your response, bear in mind that Calinan is from Dublin.
    Also, I doubt any of them were in any way juvenile!


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    #726
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    orourkeda1977 wrote: »
    Next time you have the bad luck to have to deal with a member of An Garda Siochana, just bear in mind that you are now dealing with Ireland's premier law enforcement professional.

    Or in reality bear in mind that this could be a narrow minded juvenile culchie on a power trip who'll destroy a colleague of their for doing the right thing.

    Or maybe, Just consider that it's just an ordinary garda trying to do his job, without smart arse comments about mccabe etc etc
    Why is it that the whole country thinks every garda was involved in some kind of campaign against mccabe. There are thousands of gardai doing their job, correctly.


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    #727
    Alf Veedersane
    Registered Users Posts: 24,587 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    orourkeda1977 wrote: »
    Next time you have the bad luck to have to deal with a member of An Garda Siochana, just bear in mind that you are now dealing with Ireland's premier law enforcement professional.

    Or in reality bear in mind that this could be a narrow minded juvenile culchie on a power trip who'll destroy a colleague of their for doing the right thing.

    There are 13,000 gardaí in Ireland. The vast majority going a thankless job well. A thankless job most of us wouldn't do.

    So less generalisation. I'm all for weeding out the unsavoury elements of the rank and file and at the top but sweeping generalisations do no one any favours.


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    #728
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users Posts: 17,797 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    tayto lover wrote: »
    The vast vast majority of people are sound.
    There is no difference in people now than there has ever been.
    There will always be bad apples in every walk of life but the nice people make life worthwhile.

    The vast majority of people are sound. The vast majority of people in power tend not to be. It's like Douglas Adams famously said - the kind of people who want power and are most capable of being appointed to it, are the last people you actually want to have doing those jobs.

    Our society is still structured in a way that being a complete asshole can be an asset in rising to the top. We need to restructure that if we want to break this cycle - IE, we need to introduce legislation making this kind of conspiracy a no-nonsense criminal offence, put people on trial and send them to jail for a few years if they get convicted. The message from all this is that even when you're found by an enquiry to have committed the most egregious wrongdoing, nothing actually happens to you except for everyone calling you a dick. People need to be punished for behaving like dicks. It's that simple. People should lose something or suffer some kind of negative consequence when they behave like this, beyond just having everyone say "that guy is a dick". Callinan would, in a society which deals with these things properly, be facing financial ruin due to punitive damages payouts, or prosecution and jail time as a result of this tribunal's findings. And I mean him personally. This whole "it's the office who is held responsible" thing is like Corporate Personhood - it allows individual scumbags to shield themselves from justice.


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    #729
    givyjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 3,287 ✭✭✭givyjoe


    bubblypop wrote: »
    Or maybe, Just consider that it's just an ordinary garda trying to do his job, without smart arse comments about mccabe etc etc
    Why is it that the whole country thinks every garda was involved in some kind of campaign against mccabe. There are thousands of gardai doing their job, correctly.

    Not if your attitude to McCabe is anything to go by.


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    #730
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    givyjoe wrote: »
    Not if your attitude to McCabe is anything to go by.

    You don't know me, or anything about me nor my work.
    I think it's funny the whole country backs mccabe, then treats every other Garda the same.
    If one man could be right & correct, then why presume all the other 12/13 thousand are wrong ones? & automatically treat them like they are?
    Remember there are plenty just trying to do their job.


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    #731
    Alf Veedersane
    Registered Users Posts: 24,587 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    bubblypop wrote: »
    If one man could be right & correct, then why presume all the other 12/13 thousand are wrong ones? & automatically treat them like they are?
    Remember there are plenty just trying to do their job.

    What Maurice McCabe brought to the surface was something that needs to be addressed. From the bottom up.

    That doesn't mean every guard should be considered to be of dubious character from the off.

    But this whole sorry situation has shone a light o something that needs to be weeded out of AGS.


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    #732
    Mrsmum
    Registered Users Posts: 1,860 ✭✭✭Mrsmum


    bubblypop wrote: »
    Or maybe, Just consider that it's just an ordinary garda trying to do his job, without smart arse comments about mccabe etc etc
    Why is it that the whole country thinks every garda was involved in some kind of campaign against mccabe. There are thousands of gardai doing their job, correctly.

    I don't think anyone, well not most people anyway, believe that all guards are corrupt and up to no good but the whole Maurice McCabe debacle is a big deal and people all over the country have had a bit of an eyeopener. You seem to want to sweep the dirt under the carpet but if you do that you can pretend all you like that the dirt isn't there but it just is. The whole Maurice McCabe sorry story exposed some awful behaviours within AGS and furthermore that the culture within AGS is not to deal with the wrongdoing but to deal with the person who reveals the wrongdoing. You speak of good gardaí of which I'm sure there are thousands but McCabe was also one of the good gardaí. Funny I get the impression he isn't though in the minds of the boys and girls in blue. Why is he not ? That's the problem. It would be refreshing to hear a guard on here saying they were shocked and horrified about what happened to McCabe as well as the exposed wrongdoings. When they don't, indeed try to defend and minimise what happened, one kinda wonders if they are untroubled by misconduct among their ranks and perhaps think themselves a bit above the law.


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    #733
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    No, the issue now is that Gardai feel they are all being tarnished with the one brush.
    IMO most gardai joined the force to do good, it's nearly a running joke now.... Yea they joined to make a difference & then realised after a few years that they don't & won't.
    No-one I know has any issue with mccabe highlighting the wrongs. Majority of members so this all the time.
    Hopefully, what this whole saga will do, is give individual members somewhere to go to bring these issues up, without having to go the route of talking to individual TDs.
    There should be mechanisms in place for this to happen outside the rank structure, & hopefully this will happen.


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    #734
    archer22
    Registered Users Posts: 2,116 ✭✭✭archer22


    bubblypop wrote: »
    No, the issue now is that Gardai feel they are all being tarnished with the one brush.
    IMO most gardai joined the force to do good, it's nearly a running joke now.... Yea they joined to make a difference & then realised after a few years that they don't & won't.
    No-one I know has any issue with mccabe highlighting the wrongs. Majority of members so this all the time.
    Hopefully, what this whole saga will do, is give individual members somewhere to go to bring these issues up, without having to go the route of talking to individual TDs.
    There should be mechanisms in place for this to happen outside the rank structure, & hopefully this will happen.

    Nice words...but why didn't the Garda organisations give support to McCabe.

    Indeed why weren't all those so called good Guards out protesting about the treatment he was getting.

    They have no problem protesting when its for more pay.


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    #735
    Alf Veedersane
    Registered Users Posts: 24,587 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    archer22 wrote: »
    Nice words...but why didn't the Garda organisations give support to McCabe.

    Indeed why weren't all those so called good Guards out protesting about the treatment he was getting.

    They have no problem protesting when its for more pay.

    To be fair, maybe they didn't know what had happened any more than most of the rest of us


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    #736
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    orourkeda1977 wrote: »
    Or in reality bear in mind that this could be a narrow minded juvenile culchie on a power trip who'll destroy a colleague of their for doing the right thing.

    So the problem is culchie's and people like Martin Callinan and Nóirín O'Sullivan from Dublin play no part and are of a completely different mindset?


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    #737
    archer22
    Registered Users Posts: 2,116 ✭✭✭archer22


    Alf Veedersane wrote: »
    To be fair, maybe they didn't know what had happened any more than most of the rest of us

    They knew enough to blank him and isolate him.


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    #738
    Mrsmum
    Registered Users Posts: 1,860 ✭✭✭Mrsmum


    bubblypop wrote: »
    No, the issue now is that Gardai feel they are all being tarnished with the one brush.
    IMO most gardai joined the force to do good, it's nearly a running joke now.... Yea they joined to make a difference & then realised after a few years that they don't & won't.
    No-one I know has any issue with mccabe highlighting the wrongs. Majority of members so this all the time.
    Hopefully, what this whole saga will do, is give individual members somewhere to go to bring these issues up, without having to go the route of talking to individual TDs.
    There should be mechanisms in place for this to happen outside the rank structure, & hopefully this will happen.

    If it's any consolation good guards make a massive positive difference.


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    #739
    givyjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 3,287 ✭✭✭givyjoe


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    I don't think anyone, well not most people anyway, believe that all guards are corrupt and up to no good but the whole Maurice McCabe debacle is a big deal and people all over the country have had a bit of an eyeopener. You seem to want to sweep the dirt under the carpet but if you do that you can pretend all you like that the dirt isn't there but it just is. The whole Maurice McCabe sorry story exposed some awful behaviours within AGS and furthermore that the culture within AGS is not to deal with the wrongdoing but to deal with the person who reveals the wrongdoing. You speak of good gardaí of which I'm sure there are thousands but McCabe was also one of the good gardaí. Funny I get the impression he isn't though in the minds of the boys and girls in blue. Why is he not ? That's the problem. It would be refreshing to hear a guard on here saying they were shocked and horrified about what happened to McCabe as well as the exposed wrongdoings. When they don't, indeed try to defend and minimise what happened, one kinda wonders if they are untroubled by misconduct among their ranks and perhaps think themselves a bit above the law.

    You won't hear any guard say that though will you, which says a whole lot about their toxic culture.


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    #740
    givyjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 3,287 ✭✭✭givyjoe


    bubblypop wrote: »
    You don't know me, or anything about me nor my work.
    I think it's funny the whole country backs mccabe, then treats every other Garda the same.
    If one man could be right & correct, then why presume all the other 12/13 thousand are wrong ones? & automatically treat them like they are?
    Remember there are plenty just trying to do their job.

    I've seen enough of your comments on McCabe to be fair. They don't flatter you.


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    #741
    AllForIt
    Registered Users Posts: 8,364 ✭✭✭AllForIt


    bubblypop wrote: »
    No, the issue now is that Gardai feel they are all being tarnished with the one brush.

    The worlds most popular worst argument against anything ever.


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    #742
    mattser
    Registered Users Posts: 2,218 ✭✭✭mattser


    AllForIt wrote: »
    bubblypop wrote: »
    No, the issue now is that Gardai feel they are all being tarnished with the one brush.

    The worlds most popular worst argument against anything ever.

    Any chance you can enlighten us about what you are saying ?


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    #743
    Edward M
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,837 ✭✭✭Edward M


    5 million is the figure being bandied about this morning that McCabe is to be offered.
    Would be a good settlement now.


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    #744
    Edward M
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,837 ✭✭✭Edward M


    bubblypop wrote: »
    No, the issue now is that Gardai feel they are all being tarnished with the one brush.
    IMO most gardai joined the force to do good, it's nearly a running joke now.... Yea they joined to make a difference & then realised after a few years that they don't & won't.
    No-one I know has any issue with mccabe highlighting the wrongs. Majority of members so this all the time.
    Hopefully, what this whole saga will do, is give individual members somewhere to go to bring these issues up, without having to go the route of talking to individual TDs.
    There should be mechanisms in place for this to happen outside the rank structure, & hopefully this will happen.

    I remember the words of Bob Geldoffs song, "banana Republic", check out the chorus.
    I remember the cc after the sex abuse scandal broke too, they didn't want all priests tarnished with the one brush either, but there turned out to be quite a few, trust went downhill big time there and for good reason.
    Ironic in a way too as to what was used to try to tarnish McCabe?


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    #745
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,939 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Alf Veedersane wrote: »
    There are 13,000 gardaí in Ireland. The vast majority going a thankless job well. A thankless job most of us wouldn't do.

    So less generalisation. I'm all for weeding out the unsavoury elements of the rank and file and at the top but sweeping generalisations do no one any favours.
    The penalty points and breath testing scandals indicate that the problem is more than just a few bad apples.


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    #746
    Sycamore Tree
    Closed Accounts Posts: 796 ✭✭✭Sycamore Tree


    Edward M wrote: »
    I remember the words of Bob Geldoffs song, "banana Republic", check out the chorus.
    I remember the cc after the sex abuse scandal broke too, they didn't want all priests tarnished with the one brush either, but there turned out to be quite a few, trust went downhill big time there and for good reason.
    Ironic in a way too as to what was used to try to tarnish McCabe?

    The few bad apples in relation to the priests raping children was even more disgusting when you consider all the other "good" priests and bishops that facilitated that child abuse by silence, cover-up and/or moving the predators to new parishes. The same has happened in the Gardaí in relation to the culture of silence and cover-up and destroying the messenger. Can you imagine the number of documents shredded and emails deleted in addition to the hidden mobile phones.


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    #747
    Mrsmum
    Registered Users Posts: 1,860 ✭✭✭Mrsmum


    bubblypop wrote: »
    No, the issue now is that Gardai feel they are all being tarnished with the one brush.
    IMO most gardai joined the force to do good, it's nearly a running joke now.... Yea they joined to make a difference & then realised after a few years that they don't & won't.
    No-one I know has any issue with mccabe highlighting the wrongs. Majority of members so this all the time.
    Hopefully, what this whole saga will do, is give individual members somewhere to go to bring these issues up, without having to go the route of talking to individual TDs.
    There should be mechanisms in place for this to happen outside the rank structure, & hopefully this will happen.

    Do you not think though some of this taring all with the same brush above is down to the mentality the guards have about themselves that you condemn one guard, you condemn us all which imho means the good will cover for the bad. Isn't that what tribunals have found again and again that allegiance to the force comes before all else. There seems to be a blind devotion to the position of being a member as opposed to a civvy and I would imagine that is why McCabe is hated so much, that he broke the this so called code of honour. This is also what happens in dysfunctional families where co dependency allows denial and cover up of wrongdoing and an unhealthy atmosphere where people do not thrive. Loyalty is a good trait but not at all costs and not when the good are supposed to implicate themselves in the bad under a one for all and all for one umbrella. I'm not so sure it's the public that treats you all as one so much as yourselves doing it. Most people imo show great respect for the guard in front of them doing a good job.


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    #748
    Graces7
    Registered Users Posts: 32,634 ✭✭✭✭Graces7


    Just seen this

    https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/exclusive-maurice-mccabe-receive-5million-13607343

    apologies if this is old news... new to me


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    #749
    AmberGold
    Registered Users Posts: 1,285 ✭✭✭AmberGold


    Well deserved.


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    #750
    sligojoek
    Registered Users Posts: 25,420 ✭✭✭✭sligojoek


    Graces7 wrote: »
    Just seen this

    https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/exclusive-maurice-mccabe-receive-5million-13607343

    apologies if this is old news... new to me

    Legal sources revealed.
    The Mirror understands.

    Pinch of salt.


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    #751
    davidmarsh
    Registered Users Posts: 70 ✭✭davidmarsh


    Add up what they've paid Callinan and O'Sullivan so far, add in what they're likely to pay them in retirement. Then double it.

    Then you're close to what he should be getting.


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