Storage heater replacement

neerb

Hello - I have an old storage heater from the 1980s and I am looking to replace it as it is very expensive and poor heat from it . It is for my living room .

Looking at replacing it with the new storage heater or an electric heater .

Any recommendations for which one is better and more economical .

Regards

coylemj

With electric heating, all of the energy you pay for is converted into heat, there simply is nowhere else for the energy to go. So there is no such thing as a more efficient electric heater, it's probably the one technology where it isn't possible to design a more efficient appliance.

How do you figure that the heat from your existing heater is 'poor'? You're not going to get more heat for less cost, all you can do is switch to a heater with more capacity (to churn out heater for longer) and that will cost you more in electricity.

neerb

coylemj wrote: »

With electric heating, all of the energy you pay for is converted into heat, there simply is nowhere else for the energy to go. So there is no such thing as a more efficient electric heater, it's probably the one technology where it isn't possible to design a more efficient appliance.

How do you figure that the heat from your existing heater is 'poor'? You're not going to get more heat for less cost, all you can do is switch to a heater with more capacity and that will cost you more in electricity.

It is very expensive on electricity at the minute . Is it more efficient to move to a more modern storage heater and not an ellectric one . The house is newly renovated with insulation and new windows

Risteard81

Be aware that old storage heaters may contain Asbestos.

colm_mcm

Risteard81 wrote: »

Be aware that old storage heaters may contain Asbestos.

Ones from the 70s, but if the OPs is from the 1980s then it won’t.


OP, do you have a nightsaver meter?

Risteard81

colm_mcm wrote: »

if the OPs is from the 1980s then it won’t.

I think that's an assumption on your part. Depends on the make and model if and when ACMs were used with it. Asbestos was used in construction up until around the year 2000.

coylemj

Asbestos is only dangerous when it crumbles into dust, gets into the air and you breath it in. As a chemically inert substance it does not decay and it will only crumble into dust if you physically attack it. Left undisturbed in an appliance, it is completely harmless.

Risteard81

coylemj wrote: »

Asbestos is only dangerous when it crumbles into dust, gets into the air and you breath it in. As a chemically inert substance it does not decay and it will only crumble into dust if you physically attack it. Left undisturbed in an appliance, it is completely harmless.

Removing storage bricks from a storage heater to aid removal and replacement absolutely risks disturbing any ACMs and can present substantial risk.

coylemj

Risteard81 wrote: »

Removing storage bricks from a storage heater to aid removal and replacement absolutely risks disturbing any ACMs and can present substantial risk.

Assuming it is asbestos, you would need to take out the bricks and hit one of them with a hammer. The danger with asbestos principally arises in building work when walls or ceilings are being pulled apart and asbestos dust gets into the air. Asbestos is only harmful when you inhale the dust into your lungs, it is not a poisonous or toxic substance.

Risteard81

coylemj wrote: »

Assuming it is asbestos, you would need to take out the bricks and hit one of them with a hammer. The danger with asbestos principally arises in building work when walls or ceilings are being pulled apart and asbestos dust gets into the air. Asbestos is only harmful when you inhale the dust into your lungs, it is not a poisonous or toxic substance.

The Asbestos is not contained within the bricks. It is the covering in the heater surrounding them which can be in poor condition in old heaters. I wouldn't advise opening a storage heater which contains ACMs.

Thomyokk

You might make a saving on heat retention with newer models

You can output heat later in the day if you're out 9-5

ercork

A newer storage heater might give you somewhat better control of the heat but I don't know if it would be a massive improvement on your current one. As an earlier poster said, electric heating is usually 100% efficient so there isn't much scope for improvement there.

There are two other options:

You could use on demand electric heaters. These use standard rate electricity so are quite expensive to operate. However if you are out during the daytime you would use them less often and they might work out cheaper overall. It depends on your use pattern.

The other option is an air to air heat pump. These are much cheaper to run than electric heaters due to their efficiency levels (up to 500%) and are easy to retrofit to existing properties. You would need access to the outside though (garden or balcony) so may not be possible in an apartment.

Thomyokk

ercork wrote: »

A newer storage heater might give you somewhat better control of the heat but I don't know if it would be a massive improvement on your current one. As an earlier poster said, electric heating is usually 100% efficient so there isn't much scope for improvement there.

There are two other options:

You could use on demand electric heaters. These use standard rate electricity so are quite expensive to operate. However if you are out during the daytime you would use them less often and they might work out cheaper overall. It depends on your use pattern.

The other option is an air to air heat pump. These are much cheaper to run than electric heaters due to their efficiency levels (up to 500%) and are easy to retrofit to existing properties. You would need access to the outside though (garden or balcony) so may not be possible in an apartment.

500% efficiency?

2011

ercork wrote: »

The other option is an air to air heat pump. These are much cheaper to run than electric heaters due to their efficiency levels (up to 500%)

I think you mean Coefficient of Performance, not efficiency.

are easy to retrofit to existing properties.

Not that easy. It is not just a case of replacing your boiler with a heat pump.

2011

For clarity I think it is important to point out that any heater can be connected so that it can be used on and off peak. Although the principle behind storage heaters is that they are only used during off peak times it is possible to wire them to come on at any time.

Efficiency always causes confusion too. For electrical heaters this formula can be used:
(output power / input power) x 100 = % Efficiency
An efficiency exceeding 100% is not possible.


When we consider air source heat pumps the input energy is not just from electricity, it also uses the temperature of the air. This is why heat pumps are not described in terms of efficiency, they are described in terms of COP.

ercork

Thanks to 2011 for the clarification. You are, of course, completely correct. It is impossible to get more energy out of a system than is put into the system. What I should have said is that for every euro spent on electricity working the pump, 2 or 3 euros worth of heat will be extracted from the air making the cost effectiveness better (not the efficiency).

Regarding retrofitting I was referring to properties that do not have boilers or radiators or any sort of wet heating system currently installed (like the OP's). In this instance an air to air heat pump can be installed quickly without the need for any boiler, tank, radiators, etc.

2011

ercork wrote: »

Regarding retrofitting I was referring to properties that do not have boilers or radiators or any sort of wet heating system currently installed (like the OP's). In this instance an air to air heat pump can be installed quickly without the need for any boiler, tank, radiators, etc.

But then you would need ducting to each room?

Thomyokk

2011 wrote: »

But then you would need ducting to each room?

Dunno anything about them

Presumably the heat circulates naturally

ercork

There are different options. If you have a large house then yes, you would need ducting going to multiple units in multiple rooms. In my own small two bed terraced house I got just got a single unit installed in the living room downstairs. The entire downstairs is more or less open plan so it gets heated pretty well by the heat pump/. For the two upstairs bedrooms I left the electric panel heaters on the walls but so far the rising heat from downstairs has been enough to keep the upstairs at a nice temperature so I haven't needed the panel heaters. I've only had it installed since May so we'll see what Jan and Feb bring!

2011

ercork wrote: »

If you have a large house then yes, you would need ducting going to multiple units in multiple rooms.

I would expact that just because the sitting room of the average 3 bed semi detached house is heated by any means it does not necessarily follow that the kitchen and bathroom will be warm enough.

In my own small two bed terraced house I got just got a single unit installed in the living room downstairs. The entire downstairs is more or less open plan so it gets heated pretty well by the heat pump

I could see that working alright.