O'Neill Gone - Next Rep Ireland Manager?

yabadabado

The 1.2m in wages would suggest there should be plenty of people interested. That's a large wage by international standards .
Rumours seem to be that a manager has to be in place for the Euro draw on December 2nd.Draw in Dublin so want to be able to have their man in place to meet and greet the bigwigs.

Paully D

AGC wrote: »

So tapping lads up?

Virtually every managerial vacancy is filled this way.

Do you really think clubs wait until they sack their manager before proceeding with finding his replacement? 99% of them will have a successor all but ready to go. The FAI will have sounded McCarthy out weeks ago.

Ironically, the only club operating at a high level I can think of off the top of my head who clearly didn’t have anyone lined up when they sacked their manager was McCarthy’s Wolves a number of years ago.

Zico !

Why is McCarthy getting 1.2 million seems a lot when you see Giggs getting 300k
FAI paying way over the odds here again

Delaney out

yabadabado

Paully D wrote: »

Virtually every managerial vacancy is filled this way.

Do you really think clubs wait until they sack their manager before proceeding with finding his replacement? 99% of them will have a successor all but ready to go. The FAI will have sounded McCarthy out weeks ago.

Ironically, the only club operating at a high level I can think of off the top of my head who clearly didn’t have anyone lined up when they sacked their manager was McCarthy’s Wolves a number of years ago.

I have no problem with tapping up,its the way it usually works.
It's strange that there seems to have been no real alternative to Mick.Kenny supposed to have only met with an entermeditary,which seem likes a courtesy call more than anything.


I suppose Mick was unattached so that makes it all that much easier but the wage is excessive.

The sacking happened a year too late imo,they could have put out nets further and longer this time last year.

nice_guy80

I think Koeman is on 300k in Holland

Martinez is on 800k with Belgium

Fr Tod Umptious

yabadabado wrote: »

No one is saying there is some magic wand that will solve all the problems in Irish football but you can be sure as **** that the current set up in the FAI aren't going to bring us in the right direction.


Has anyone here said there said that getting rid of JD will solve all the problems?

People do seem to think that getting rid of Delaney will solve things.

People point to his wages, but if you are looking for someone that will 'clean things up' they will demand the same if not higher wages.

If you want to get someone cheaper then you are getting a lesser quality of candidate.

Mary that does the accounts for Ballyhack Utd will be cheaper, she is a great supporter and cares more about the game than Delaney, but she ain't CEO material.

And Delaneys replacement will likely be an FAI insider so how much does that help ?

The FAI have a real financial balancing act to preform all the time, and here is why, I alluded to this last week on another thread.

Rugby has money because it's core base are traditionally wealthy and bring a lot of money to the game.
They have a small club footprint so the spread of distribution is less
They have private schools that basically run their academy for them.

The GAA has money because it is a very local organisation and has a huge local fan base.
The money from that that local fan base pays for equipment, facilities etc etc.
Plus it has no international element.

The FAI on the other hand does not have the core wealth that rugby has and even though the fan base for soccer is huge the money that fan base has is not spent locally like in the GAA. It's spent on Sky subs, EPL jerseys, trip to the UK.
Plus the FAI have to field an international setup and pay for it.

So who ever came in to replace Delaney would have their work cut out.

OldMrBrennan83

Stephen Kenny is absolutely mental if he takes that U21 job unless it's a good pay rise.

lawred2

nice_guy80 wrote: »

I think Koeman is on 300k in Holland

Martinez is on 800k with Belgium

Both paid for in the majority by Everton if I remember correctly.

AGC

Presume it’s 1.2 for the full contract and not annually?

AGC

Paully D wrote: »

Virtually every managerial vacancy is filled this way.

Do you really think clubs wait until they sack their manager before proceeding with finding his replacement? 99% of them will have a successor all but ready to go. The FAI will have sounded McCarthy out weeks ago.

Ironically, the only club operating at a high level I can think of off the top of my head who clearly didn’t have anyone lined up when they sacked their manager was McCarthy’s Wolves a number of years ago.

No doubt Club’s do and I’m sure the same with international but not when there is no game for 4 months.

I would say plenty of Club’s have parted with managers at seasons end with no one lined up.

OldMrBrennan83

sugarman wrote: »

€1.2 over 2 years is what I read. Highly doubt it's per year.

That's some pay cut for the position if so.

mugsymugsy

Patww79 wrote: »

That's some pay cut for the position if so.

On newstalk they said it's 1.2m per year.

Would love to see the recruitment process and salary negotiations Delaney and his crew went through.

Any deal for a manager should have been performance related based on results via qualification / fifa ranking etc

AGC

mugsymugsy wrote: »

On newstalk they said it's 1.2m per year.

Would love to see the recruitment process and salary negotiations Delaney and his crew went through.

Any deal for a manager should have been performance related based on results via qualification / fifa ranking etc

RTÉ reporting 1.2 a year as well. Mad money.

NIMAN

We love a crazy wage in Ireland, don't we!

I wonder did Mick demand 1.2m annually, or was he offered it?

I'd say if the FAI said "the job pays 300k Mick", he'd still have taken it.

topmanamillion

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

People do seem to think that getting rid of Delaney will solve things.


Rugby has money because it's core base are traditionally wealthy and bring a lot of money to the game.
They have a small club footprint so the spread of distribution is less
They have private schools that basically run their academy for them.

The GAA has money because it is a very local organisation and has a huge local fan base.
The money from that that local fan base pays for equipment, facilities etc etc.
Plus it has no international element.

The FAI on the other hand does not have the core wealth that rugby has and even though the fan base for soccer is huge the money that fan base has is not spent locally like in the GAA. It's spent on Sky subs, EPL jerseys, trip to the UK.
Plus the FAI have to field an international setup and pay for it.

So who ever came in to replace Delaney would have their work cut out.

That point about the IRFU being wealthy because its supporters are wealthy is nonsense.
Matt Cooper mentioned on the radio last week that 8 years ago, the IRFU was making about €3m per year more than FAI. It is now €35m a year more than the FAI.

The difference between the IRFU, GAA and FAI is the former two are well run organisations while the latter is not.
The IRFU and GAA are constantly growing their games in the country while the FAI turns its nose up at the League of Ireland, which should be the flagship of football in this country.
You only have to go back about 20 years ago and Munster v Leinster was played in front of a couple of hundred people.
With a modest TV deal/sponsorship and modest increases in attendance the LOI could be profitable and at least part fund infrastructural improvements but the FAI are devoid of the forward thinking it would take to achieve that.

Ferris_Bueller

I think the criticism of McCarthy is going way, way over the top. I'm surprised how negative people are being on social media about the appointment and part of me wonders are people getting carried away about a fantasy of the Irish team playing possession based attacking football in March. There is also a lot of negativity and frustration directed towards Delaney and the FAI, but I don't think this negativity should spill over to McCarthy getting the job.

Qualifying for Euro 2020 is going to be worth millions to the FAI, so qualifying for that is probably the most important thing to football in this country right now. We all want investment in grassroots, infrastructure, LoI, etc. but that money has to come from somewhere, I think we can all agree that we will have more money to do that if we qualify for the Euros. So I think it makes sense to appoint the manager who is most likely to get us there who IMO is Mick McCarthy.

I love Stephen Kenny and I think he would have been a brilliant appointment but the time to give him the job was 12 months ago and allow him all of the games in 2018 to bed in. It would be a very difficult task for Kenny to hit the ground running in March going straight into competitive games, at least McCarthy has international experience both as a player and a manager, there will hopefully as a result be less of a bedding in period.

Do I think McCarthy is the long term solution? No, but he is the means to an end and he is a good man to come in and steady the ship. Hopefully after his reign we can pass the baton over to Kenny and have a more long term view. You'd swear we were after reappointing Steve Staunton the way some people are reacting. The U.21s role is hugely important now too as it seems to be an exciting group of players coming through the 17s and 19s at the minute, ideally Carsley will get that and he could be another contender for the top job down the line. People want to see long term change but I feel they are almost being short sighted about it, there is a lot riding on Euro 2020 and if I was to pick a man to get us there of the available candidates I would choose Mick.

championc

And if anyone could talk Damien Rice around, McCarthy could.

Do also think the deal was largely done last Feb when it looked like O'Neill would depart

OldMrBrennan83

championc wrote: »

And if anyone could talk Damien Rice around, McCarthy could

Maybe if he gives him 1.1 of the 1.2 a year.

martingriff

Ferris_Bueller wrote: »

I think the criticism of McCarthy is going way, way over the top. I'm surprised how negative people are being on social media about the appointment and part of me wonders are people getting carried away about a fantasy of the Irish team playing possession based attacking football in March. There is also a lot of negativity and frustration directed towards Delaney and the FAI, but I don't think this negativity should spill over to McCarthy getting the job.

Qualifying for Euro 2020 is going to be worth millions to the FAI, so qualifying for that is probably the most important thing to football in this country right now. We all want investment in grassroots, infrastructure, LoI, etc. but that money has to come from somewhere, I think we can all agree that we will have more money to do that if we qualify for the Euros. So I think it makes sense to appoint the manager who is most likely to get us there who IMO is Mick McCarthy.

I love Stephen Kenny and I think he would have been a brilliant appointment but the time to give him the job was 12 months ago and allow him all of the games in 2018 to bed in. It would be a very difficult task for Kenny to hit the ground running in March going straight into competitive games, at least McCarthy has international experience both as a player and a manager, there will hopefully as a result be less of a bedding in period.

Do I think McCarthy is the long term solution? No, but he is the means to an end and he is a good man to come in and steady the ship. Hopefully after his reign we can pass the baton over to Kenny and have a more long term view. You'd swear we were after reappointing Steve Staunton the way some people are reacting. The U.21s role is hugely important now too as it seems to be an exciting group of players coming through the 17s and 19s at the minute, ideally Carsley will get that and he could be another contender for the top job down the line. People want to see long term change but I feel they are almost being short sighted about it, there is a lot riding on Euro 2020 and if I was to pick a man to get us there of the available candidates I would choose Mick.

I agree with you here that McCarthy is a short term post to get to the Euro. I say giving Kenny the U21 job was him to bed into international football and then in 2 years to be promoted

OldMrBrennan83

martingriff wrote: »

I agree with you here that McCarthy is a short term post to get to the Euro. I say giving Kenny the U21 job was him to bed into international football and then in 2 years to be promoted

Would Kenny give up Dundalk for a token job like the U21 one though? Couldn't see it.

AGC

Patww79 wrote: »

Would Kenny give up Dundalk for a token job like the U21 one though? Couldn't see it.

Can’t see it either. Any decent young lad is bypassing U-21.

Would expect if they were to get him he would be U-21 manager and director of underage football or something like that

yabadabado

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

People do seem to think that getting rid of Delaney will solve things.

People point to his wages, but if you are looking for someone that will 'clean things up' they will demand the same if not higher wages.

If you want to get someone cheaper then you are getting a lesser quality of candidate.

Mary that does the accounts for Ballyhack Utd will be cheaper, she is a great supporter and cares more about the game than Delaney, but she ain't CEO material.

And Delaneys replacement will likely be an FAI insider so how much does that help ?

The FAI have a real financial balancing act to preform all the time, and here is why, I alluded to this last week on another thread.

Rugby has money because it's core base are traditionally wealthy and bring a lot of money to the game.
They have a small club footprint so the spread of distribution is less
They have private schools that basically run their academy for them.

The GAA has money because it is a very local organisation and has a huge local fan base.
The money from that that local fan base pays for equipment, facilities etc etc.
Plus it has no international element.

The FAI on the other hand does not have the core wealth that rugby has and even though the fan base for soccer is huge the money that fan base has is not spent locally like in the GAA. It's spent on Sky subs, EPL jerseys, trip to the UK.
Plus the FAI have to field an international setup and pay for it.

So who ever came in to replace Delaney would have their work cut out.

The above is mostly nonsense but I think you know that already.

OldMrBrennan83

AGC wrote: »

Can’t see it either. Any decent young lad is bypassing U-21.

Would expect if they were to get him he would be U-21 manager and director of underage football or something like that

Maybe if there's a good pay bump but you can't get much lower profile than an international underage manager. Hopefully he's in the position to turn it down, would rather see him in the league.

Fr Tod Umptious

yabadabado wrote: »

The above is mostly nonsense but I think you know that already.

Why is it nonsense

It's clear that the FAI cannot generate the same revenue from the interest in soccer that the others generate from the interest in their sports.

That's because the money from the interest in soccer in Ireland is mainly spent on the British game.

Now how they can afford Mick McCarthy for a total of 2.4m I've no idea.

Fr Tod Umptious

topmanamillion wrote: »

That point about the IRFU being wealthy because its supporters are wealthy is nonsense.
Matt Cooper mentioned on the radio last week that 8 years ago, the IRFU was making about €3m per year more than FAI. It is now €35m a year more than the FAI.

The difference between the IRFU, GAA and FAI is the former two are well run organisations while the latter is not.
The IRFU and GAA are constantly growing their games in the country while the FAI turns its nose up at the League of Ireland, which should be the flagship of football in this country.
You only have to go back about 20 years ago and Munster v Leinster was played in front of a couple of hundred people.
With a modest TV deal/sponsorship and modest increases in attendance the LOI could be profitable and at least part fund infrastructural improvements but the FAI are devoid of the forward thinking it would take to achieve that.

In 2004 when rugby hat not yet taken off an the Republic of Ireland team were still decent t a covered stand ticket in Lansdowne Rd for rugby cost between e60 and e70

The same ticket for a competitive soccer game was somewhere between e30 and e40.

That alone tells you the difference between the two, and I'm guessing that rugby gets at least if not more home games than soccer each year.

And of course the IRFU are making more now v soccer than they were 8 years ago.

Their sport has absolutely ballooned in popularity
It's a huge bandwagon, were as the soccer team is the pits

I'm not saying this to absolve the FAI from blame, I'm just pointing out that it's very difficult for the FAI to generate revenue.

yabadabado

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Why is it nonsense

It's clear that the FAI cannot generate the same revenue from the interest in soccer that the others generate from the interest in their sports.

That's because the money from the interest in soccer in Ireland is mainly spent on the British game.

Starting with some bull **** about Mary from Ballyhack or we will only get a lesser CEO if we cut the current salary.

That's just stupid **** and I think you know that.

Because people spend money on British football ,we are doomed to failure?
How about thinking long term and develop a plan to rise the standard of the football from the grassroots up.
That's the job of the FAI but sure we can't compete according to you so why even bother.

Who said we are going to generate the same as rugby or GAA? That doesn't mean we can improve on what's there.



That post is nonsense but you have been spouting similar for the last few days.

OldMrBrennan83

https://twitter.com/danpope/status/1066104601877913600

Fr Tod Umptious

yabadabado wrote: »

Starting with some bull **** about Mary from Ballyhack or we will only get a lesser CEO if we cut the current salary.

That's just stupid **** and I think you know that.

Because people spend money on British football ,we are doomed to failure?
How about thinking long term and develop a plan to rise the standard of the football from the grassroots up.
That's the job of the FAI but sure we can't compete according to you so why even bother.

Who said we are going to generate the same as rugby or GAA? That doesn't mean we can improve on what's there.



That post is nonsense but you have been spouting similar for the last few days.

If people want a new brush to sweep the FAI clean then it will not come cheap.

A new CEO to do that will cost Delaney money at least.

And if you get someone from the current cabal to replace him then it's not going to change much.

So people are going to be disappointed that
A. Delaney's replacement is just as expensive as him

Or

B. His replacement is but from the same cloth.

championc

championc wrote: »

And if anyone could talk Damien Rice around, McCarthy could.

Don't want him anywhere near the side. Can't stand them boring moany singer songwriters crying about unrequited love and being unpopular at school, maybe if they washed their hair and didn't wear brown jumpers it would have helped.

Fr Tod Umptious

Deleted User wrote: »

Don't want him anywhere near the side. Can't stand them boring moany singer songwriters crying about unrequited love and being unpopular at school, maybe if they washed their hair and didn't wear brown jumpers it would have helped.

Can someone please add a multiple thank function to boards.ie

yabadabado

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

If people want a new brush to sweep the FAI clean then it will not come cheap.

A new CEO to do that will cost Delaney money at least.

And if you get someone from the current cabal to replace him then it's not going to change much.

So people are going to be disappointed that
A. Delaney's replacement is just as expensive as him

Or

B. His replacement is but from the same cloth.

Why will it cost the same money for JD replacement?

You do know that he is overpaid compared to most heads of FA's ?

If a new person came in and cleaned up the FAI and Irish football Id have no problem if he got JD's wage ,at least he would be earning it.JD is now in charge over 13 years and he has done nothing to justify his income ,thats the main reason people cry foul over his pay imo.

Its fairly obvious that the whole structure of the FAI needs a rethink.This will take time but longterm it would be of benefit(although not to the people currently with their noses in the trough).We need reform and not just the ousting of certain indididuals but I feel one wont happen without the other.

The passage below was emailed to me during the week and to me it makes sense.

The biggest problem with the FAI is the structure rather than the individuals. Just removing JD is not enough.
Any organisation worth its salt has proper governance structures in place.Time limits on people in certain roles is a good idea and if it is operated in the proper spirit these people are not just rotated around over the years to other role's.

The FAI should have an executive and a non executive board. The executive board should be running the organisation and should be professionals in their area, hired rather than elected. The non executive board should be the holding them responsible. The non execs should be some one from sports council, representatives from LOI, Amateur game, Schoolboy game, Supporters group and a couple of others from professional game.

weldoninhio

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Has anyone contemplated that the FAI may have been doing a bit of work on this before Tuesday morning?

100% this. When O’Neill was fannying about Stoke the FAI were looking at alternatives. Mick was spoken to back then.

weldoninhio

LowOdour wrote: »

Can't say McCarthy returning as manager excites me, but it is what is it.

A couple of things. He is bringing Terry Connor as his assistant. He is well regarded in the UK, and has been doing work with England U21s (think its part of getting BAME coaches involved with England teams).

Unlike Roy or Tardelli, Connor has a history as a coach with the manager so that can only be a good thing.

As for Robbie, again not sure about that. No qualifications and has played with a few of this team...not a great combo. I hope he can give something to our attacking approach.

Qualifications?? The UEFA A badge is a qualification!

weldoninhio

Patww79 wrote: »

Would Kenny give up Dundalk for a token job like the U21 one though? Couldn't see it.

In 5 years no one will know who Stephen Kenny is. He’s had no more success than Pat Fenlon and no one is clamouring to give him the job.

OldMrBrennan83

weldoninhio wrote: »

In 5 years no one will know who Stephen Kenny is. He’s had no more success than Pat Fenlon and no one is clamouring to give him the job.

They certainly won't if he takes a job with the anonymity of international underage manager anyway. If he has another good run with Dundalk in Europe and he will get another chance in the UK, but hey we can all cross our fingers and hope he fails can't we?

weldoninhio

Patww79 wrote: »

They certainly won't if he takes a job with the anonymity of international underage manager anyway. If he has another good run with Dundalk in Europe and he will get another chance in the UK, but hey we can all cross our fingers and hope he fails can't we?

“Another good run”?? He got one win and one draw out of six games??

OldMrBrennan83

weldoninhio wrote: »

“Another good run”?? He got one win and one draw out of six games??

He wasn't managing Real Madrid.

weldoninhio

Patww79 wrote: »

He wasn't managing Real Madrid.

Hahaha. There was no “good run”. FFS.

OldMrBrennan83

weldoninhio wrote: »

Hahaha. There was no “good run”. FFS.

Getting to the group stages with a League of Ireland club was a good European run. Getting any result in the group was even better, especially when you watched them play.

Do you just judge everything off livescore?

weldoninhio

Patww79 wrote: »

Getting to the group stages with a League of Ireland club was a good European run. Getting any result in the group was even better, especially when you watched them play.

Do you just judge everything off livescore?

LiveScore? One win and one draw out of 6 games is not a good run. It’s not even a run. Well, maybe a run of losses.

topmanamillion

yabadabado wrote: »

Why will it cost the same money for JD replacement?

You do know that he is overpaid compared to most heads of FA's ?

If a new person came in and cleaned up the FAI and Irish football Id have no problem if he got JD's wage ,at least he would be earning it.JD is now in charge over 13 years and he has done nothing to justify his income ,thats the main reason people cry foul over his pay imo.

Its fairly obvious that the whole structure of the FAI needs a rethink.This will take time but longterm it would be of benefit(although not to the people currently with their noses in the trough).We need reform and not just the ousting of certain indididuals but I feel one wont happen without the other.

The passage below was emailed to me during the week and to me it makes sense.

Delaney is paid about E250,000 more than his Italian and Spanish counterpart. Just let that sink in. The heads of the FAs of Italy (4 time world champions and a European Champion) and Spain (One world cup and 3 time European champions), two of European Footballs traditional powerhouses are paid a quarter of a million euro less than John Delaney.

Also, Delaney is the very one championing the new term limits in UEFA of 3 terms at 4 years each or a maximum 12 years in total, yet he's now in his 13th year as head of the FAI.

Delaney was a couple of months in the job in 2005 when Brian Kerr was sacked. A 10 man Board of management made that call, and 13 years later, six of them are still there.
The ones that are gone had to leave because of an age limit but even that age limit was tweaked to allow senior board members stay on beyond the age of 75.

Of the FAI`s E35 Million turnover, E10 Million of that is spent on wages with the majority of that accounted for by senior management and the FAI board.
Making Euro 2016 just about covered that wage bill and that's the primary motivation for the FAI in wanting to make them again.
Contrast that with Iceland who pumped their prize money back into their domestic game. That's no benefit for the League of Ireland or Grass roots football here in the senior team playing at a major tournament and that's sickening.

Liam Brady put it best recently: "We’ve had 15 years of John and I think the only progress is that John’s career is gone up and up.”

Utopia Parkway

Short termism is a huge problem in FAI circles. Qualifying for tournaments is so important financially to the organisation (€11M earned from Euro 2016) that they never look beyond the next tournament cycle. The question is always what manager can we get in to qualify us for the next tournament? Never what structures can we put in place to develop players to qualify us for tournaments in 10 to 15 years time.

OldMrBrennan83

weldoninhio wrote: »

LiveScore? One win and one draw out of 6 games is not a good run. It’s not even a run. Well, maybe a run of losses.

You obviously watched none of it then, it was an excellent achievement with a domestic club. Not a clue.

weldoninhio

Patww79 wrote: »

You obviously watched none of it then, it was an excellent achievement with a domestic club. Not a clue.

I watched it. He beat a very poor Israeli side and drew with an off colour Dutch team, AZ Allkmaar.

OldMrBrennan83

weldoninhio wrote: »

I watched it. He beat a very poor Israeli side and drew with an off colour Dutch team, AZ Allkmaar.

With Dundalk.

weldoninhio

Patww79 wrote: »

With Dundalk.

You do know freak results happen in football. Wigan beat Man City in an FA Cup final.

major bill

weldoninhio wrote: »

You do know freak results happen in football. Wigan beat Man City in an FA Cup final.

Seriously have a day off if you think Dundalk got anything of s freak result In that campaign then ya didn’t watch them properly!!

topmanamillion

weldoninhio wrote: »

You do know freak results happen in football. Wigan beat Man City in an FA Cup final.

Thumping a Champions League group stage regular in Dublin while absolutely playing them off the park must have been a freak result too.

weldoninhio

topmanamillion wrote: »

Thumping a Champions League group stage regular in Dublin while absolutely playing them off the park must have been a freak result too.

Group stage regular?? Last time they got to the group stages was 2007/8. If your gonna lie, make it convincing.

topmanamillion

weldoninhio wrote: »

Group stage regular?? Last time they got to the group stages was 2007/8. If your gonna lie, make it convincing.

I`m clearly talking about Bate Borisov. If you`re going to comment on football at least make it convincing you watch a game every so often.